News Article: 2017 Training Camp & Pre-Season Discussion
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Machinehead
Fox Mafia Consigliere
Machinehead
Fox Mafia Consigliere
If they were gonna do that, Letteri was better than anything on waivers. There were other options.
They chose to keep Desjardins because AV.
Staal, Deangelo is a good pair w Holden filling in
I'd guess Kampfer is around as the practice d man and will go down unless Holden is dealt . Then they still have Pionk and Graves to call up if 2 guys go down
Give it Time more waivers are coming and a surprise or two may pop up
But yea AV likes his tough guys
AlternateSideParking
Registered User
- Dec 11, 2005
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They replaced Girardi, Klein, Stepan and Lindberg with Shattenkirk, DeAngelo, Chytil and Desharnais. Yay.
Desjardins is the new Glass. Thirteenth forward. Boo.
Staal-DeAngelo will be an adventure. Playing Staal 14-15 mins a night at ES and on PK2 while DeAngelo gets 15-17 with PP1 or PP2 is not bad for a bottom pairing. They can always shuttle in Pionk for DeAngelo if the latter is a nightmare.
Trade Holden for a pick -- any pick. He has value, whereas Staal is immovable. A second buyout will crush them and getting Staal to waive his NMC will be way worse since trading him likely involves adding a 2018 1st (I'll friggin riot if they did that) and possibly retaining 50% anyway.
Squeeze two more years out of Staal as a 6th defenseman to lessen the buyout blow. Buy him out in 2020 when Zucc and McDonagh are UFA.
Desjardins is the new Glass. Thirteenth forward. Boo.
Staal-DeAngelo will be an adventure. Playing Staal 14-15 mins a night at ES and on PK2 while DeAngelo gets 15-17 with PP1 or PP2 is not bad for a bottom pairing. They can always shuttle in Pionk for DeAngelo if the latter is a nightmare.
Trade Holden for a pick -- any pick. He has value, whereas Staal is immovable. A second buyout will crush them and getting Staal to waive his NMC will be way worse since trading him likely involves adding a 2018 1st (I'll friggin riot if they did that) and possibly retaining 50% anyway.
Squeeze two more years out of Staal as a 6th defenseman to lessen the buyout blow. Buy him out in 2020 when Zucc and McDonagh are UFA.
- Jul 20, 2005
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I'm good with the moves. I think Chytil is here to stay unless he sucks in his first 9 games. I think if he's just okay he still sticks.
Good to send Andersson back. He was just all over the place all summer. Let him get re-situated in Sweden and do big things for Frolunda. I'm still very happy with him. I think he could have stayed on the roster and been adequate--there's just no need to do that with him.
Also, need Fast back.
Good to send Andersson back. He was just all over the place all summer. Let him get re-situated in Sweden and do big things for Frolunda. I'm still very happy with him. I think he could have stayed on the roster and been adequate--there's just no need to do that with him.
Also, need Fast back.
Revel
Dark Sky Enthusiast
AlternateSideParking
Registered User
- Dec 11, 2005
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Glad Andersson is going back to Sweden, and Gorton said exactly what I said here a few months ago -- better to be a 2C in the SHL than a 3c in Hartford or a 4C in New York. This kid needs to develop into a star and not get pigeonholed as a checker.
Frolunda is a top-heavy team and their current 2C Christoffer Ehn -- a Red Wings prospect -- has looked terrible. I don't think the Rangers would send him back to Frolunda if they knew Andersson would be back to a depth role. Put him on the second line with the Sabres prospect Victor Olofsson and they should make money. Olofsson is a PP specialist and Andersson is a good 2C option on the PP because he can win draws, win puck battles and complete cross-ice passes.
Frolunda is a top-heavy team and their current 2C Christoffer Ehn -- a Red Wings prospect -- has looked terrible. I don't think the Rangers would send him back to Frolunda if they knew Andersson would be back to a depth role. Put him on the second line with the Sabres prospect Victor Olofsson and they should make money. Olofsson is a PP specialist and Andersson is a good 2C option on the PP because he can win draws, win puck battles and complete cross-ice passes.
Looks like the lines were changed around a little bit from what was posted earlier...just Zucc and Buch swapped
https://www.nhl.com/rangers/news/ch...angers-roster-is-reduced-by-seven/c-291430742
https://www.nhl.com/rangers/news/ch...angers-roster-is-reduced-by-seven/c-291430742
Holden is just an insurance policy. Las Vegas hasn't moved their glut of dmen yet, so the market is temporarily frozen.
I'm really excited to see what Chytil can do in real games. We have a prospect other teams want for once, what even is this. Good job to the scouts.
But insurance against what? Steal should be the #7 with Graves playing over him (and thus insurance), and Pionk and anyone else in Hartford becomes the 'break glass in case of emergency' response.
IMO the team doesn't benefit at all from having both Holden and Staal on the roster, even if we are just waiting for the Knights to do what they do so we can move Holden for a 4th rounder.
But I also understand that this is hockey, where having vets making the same mistakes in a game over and over again is ok, but having a rookie make the same mistake once while learning and developing is a big no-no...
Holden is insurance for both an injury on defense (vet who can both the left and right side) and for Chytil/Derharnais. Rangers could very much end needing to find a 3C/4C if things don't work out and Holden could be an imporant piece for that to happen. Trading him for a low draft pick at this time does the Rangers nothing.
You are going to be hard pressed to find anyone on this board who wants Staal in the top 6, but fingers crossed Lindy Ruff sees what everyone else does and he is out of the starting lineup shortly.
Holden is worth more than a 4th... you just have to wait it out.
IMO the Rangers kept Carey due to ties with Kreider, Hayes, and Vesey... maybe he acts as a good glue guy for three of the inconsistent forwards that the Rangers need to step up... They've been doing it year over year with former BC guys that Chris and Hayes played with.
Carey was good, not the best skater... so I don't know how long it will last, but he plays a complete smart game and gives it his all every shift... that's a good barometer for a locker room presence. I don't have anything against him.
LA to Frolunda... that was not fully expected, I would have liked to see him get some time in HFD... but hey them's the breaks. It will be good for Lias... maybe the Rangers give him the Willie Nylander treatment and bring him over to NA after the WJC... it really helped Willy get fast tracked.
Chyts- He deserves it, and if he can play to the level of a top 6 talent in that 3rd line center role... that really helps the Rangers run a deeper skilled group. I would caution this however... it is a very rare occurrence that a late first makes the NHL right away... even Pastarnak had time in the AHL. You want to think long term here.
Letteri- I thought he was awful the first game, but got better along the way. Love the spunk and shot he's got. Fast, and hustles hard. Good character guy that would be a PP specialist at this stage... Legit NHL prospect.
Fontaine- Cupboard is not so bare if he can make an impact. The hockey sense, and defensive awareness and skating tells me he's got an NHL future. I liked him a lot, and think he's closer to the NHL than he's given credit for.
Boo- Size, and speed are there... but decision making with the puck... he's got to reinvent himself as a 4th liner and embrace that role. Otherwise I don't see an NHLer.
Desjardins is probably just an insurance marker at this stage. I don't think he's got much left outside of the Darrol Powe special.. but I also don't hold it against him. Guy gave a good effort, and delivered a hell of an old school hit. He's a corsi bad player... so if he's on the roster... you all know what you'll have to hear over and over again.
Pionk- Game 1 was his best.. he needs to get his reads down to a tee.. he's close.. but still a little undersized were he's got to be a little more proactive in avoiding hits. I saw him take a hit live from an angle that made me think his chest caved in. It was avoidable. Rangers need to show him tapes of Ryan Ellis. Lots to like however. 40-50 games in a A and he should be pushing for a spot.
ADA- He's the new Tony D. Love everything he brings to the table, the trash talking, the fights, the swagger. I'd like to see a little more crazy out of him. Defensively he was very good. I said it back in December, a guy like him would thrive in this market but would be maladjusted in others. I don't think I'm wrong about that.
Graves- Closer to the NHL than last year... IMO the Rangers are doing him and themselves good by letting him cook a little more until Holden and Staal are gone. Gravesy made some great passes, and some awful ones... moved his feet well and delivered some punishment on the walls, but also got caught on a few turnovers... these things are fixable. Upside maybe that of a 3rd pair guy, but he's another one where the NHL looks to be a reality for him.
Tambo- I wouldn't extend him.
Pumps- Glad he's gotten waived. He'll play out the year on his one-way before going to Switzerland and settling down in comfort over there. Nice guy, but a classic case of a player using his hockey skills as a personal profession, instead of doing anything he can to win. He'll be a front line player in the Swiss league, and not have to pay a price physically. High quality of life, nice checks. Good for Pumps. He should be thanking the heavens for expansion, he got 2 years of NHL money (this year on a one way) as a result.
Farnham- I liked him, he was entertaining. Special shout out for being a pest out there. Maybe he gets an AHL deal. You need guys like that down in the A.
IMO the Rangers kept Carey due to ties with Kreider, Hayes, and Vesey... maybe he acts as a good glue guy for three of the inconsistent forwards that the Rangers need to step up... They've been doing it year over year with former BC guys that Chris and Hayes played with.
Carey was good, not the best skater... so I don't know how long it will last, but he plays a complete smart game and gives it his all every shift... that's a good barometer for a locker room presence. I don't have anything against him.
LA to Frolunda... that was not fully expected, I would have liked to see him get some time in HFD... but hey them's the breaks. It will be good for Lias... maybe the Rangers give him the Willie Nylander treatment and bring him over to NA after the WJC... it really helped Willy get fast tracked.
Chyts- He deserves it, and if he can play to the level of a top 6 talent in that 3rd line center role... that really helps the Rangers run a deeper skilled group. I would caution this however... it is a very rare occurrence that a late first makes the NHL right away... even Pastarnak had time in the AHL. You want to think long term here.
Letteri- I thought he was awful the first game, but got better along the way. Love the spunk and shot he's got. Fast, and hustles hard. Good character guy that would be a PP specialist at this stage... Legit NHL prospect.
Fontaine- Cupboard is not so bare if he can make an impact. The hockey sense, and defensive awareness and skating tells me he's got an NHL future. I liked him a lot, and think he's closer to the NHL than he's given credit for.
Boo- Size, and speed are there... but decision making with the puck... he's got to reinvent himself as a 4th liner and embrace that role. Otherwise I don't see an NHLer.
Desjardins is probably just an insurance marker at this stage. I don't think he's got much left outside of the Darrol Powe special.. but I also don't hold it against him. Guy gave a good effort, and delivered a hell of an old school hit. He's a corsi bad player... so if he's on the roster... you all know what you'll have to hear over and over again.
Pionk- Game 1 was his best.. he needs to get his reads down to a tee.. he's close.. but still a little undersized were he's got to be a little more proactive in avoiding hits. I saw him take a hit live from an angle that made me think his chest caved in. It was avoidable. Rangers need to show him tapes of Ryan Ellis. Lots to like however. 40-50 games in a A and he should be pushing for a spot.
ADA- He's the new Tony D. Love everything he brings to the table, the trash talking, the fights, the swagger. I'd like to see a little more crazy out of him. Defensively he was very good. I said it back in December, a guy like him would thrive in this market but would be maladjusted in others. I don't think I'm wrong about that.
Graves- Closer to the NHL than last year... IMO the Rangers are doing him and themselves good by letting him cook a little more until Holden and Staal are gone. Gravesy made some great passes, and some awful ones... moved his feet well and delivered some punishment on the walls, but also got caught on a few turnovers... these things are fixable. Upside maybe that of a 3rd pair guy, but he's another one where the NHL looks to be a reality for him.
Tambo- I wouldn't extend him.
Pumps- Glad he's gotten waived. He'll play out the year on his one-way before going to Switzerland and settling down in comfort over there. Nice guy, but a classic case of a player using his hockey skills as a personal profession, instead of doing anything he can to win. He'll be a front line player in the Swiss league, and not have to pay a price physically. High quality of life, nice checks. Good for Pumps. He should be thanking the heavens for expansion, he got 2 years of NHL money (this year on a one way) as a result.
Farnham- I liked him, he was entertaining. Special shout out for being a pest out there. Maybe he gets an AHL deal. You need guys like that down in the A.
Regards Kampfer- They don't want to lose him on waivers. There are a number of teams that are short on defense, and are all waiting to claim one off of Vegas... GMGM he should have taken more goalies... that would have worked out better. It's understandable why he's here. Plus he's a character guy, and given the level on inconsistency and low effort you see from the following:
Nash
Staal
Zibanejad
Kreider
Hayes
Vesey
You need guys in the room that can off-set that, or keep the motors running. Otherwise they'll sag.
Nash
Staal
Zibanejad
Kreider
Hayes
Vesey
You need guys in the room that can off-set that, or keep the motors running. Otherwise they'll sag.
- Sep 17, 2007
- 25,014
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It's really not that complicated. There are a lot of reasons why Holden made the team over Graves and Pionk:
- Holden requires waivers while Graves and Pionk do not
- Holden provides experienced depth
- The trade market for dmen is fuzzy right now with Vegas having so many dmen
- We've already got 2 young dmen in ADA and Skjei who are both going to play a lot
- Neither Graves nor Pionk are likely to get a lot of games with the Rangers, so they are better off playing top minutes in Hartford
- Holden can play both sides
eco's bones
Registered User
I think the Rangers would like Kampfer to be a mentor for their young D in Hartford. He's signed cheap for two years. If they're afraid they'll lose him it makes sense to keep him up and try to deal him for something.
Big fan of Graves after this training camp---thought he was really good. Pionk as well. We have an inexperienced defensive group in Hartford if Kampfer isn't there but there's a lot more talent than in previous years.
Big fan of Graves after this training camp---thought he was really good. Pionk as well. We have an inexperienced defensive group in Hartford if Kampfer isn't there but there's a lot more talent than in previous years.
To add to Gagline's point... a player like Holden at the trade deadline will return a very nice bounty. Especially if he fills a top 4 role for team making a playoff run.
That's a 2nd & 3rd round pick from historical value... or 2 2nd rounders depending on the bidding price. That's a very high return from what was once a 4th round pick, while also getting 1.75 good seasons out of him.
There will be teams that pony that up. You just have to wait for things to unfold. The Rangers are in a good position with their defense.
That's a 2nd & 3rd round pick from historical value... or 2 2nd rounders depending on the bidding price. That's a very high return from what was once a 4th round pick, while also getting 1.75 good seasons out of him.
There will be teams that pony that up. You just have to wait for things to unfold. The Rangers are in a good position with their defense.
Machinehead
Fox Mafia Consigliere
Holden requiring waivers is an enormous reason to keep him. Despite his shortcomings he's still an asset that has some legitimate value. If you waive him you lose him for nothing, and that would be ridiculous. Pionk spending a year in Hartford would be fine. He's a good prospect but he can still mature down there. Graves has less to gain from more time in Hartford, but it's preferable to him serving as a spare defenseman, in my estimation.
Staal is the real impediment here, but that's been beaten to death.
Staal is the real impediment here, but that's been beaten to death.
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