World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team Canada (Part III)

[Btown]

what worry me about team Canada is the fact they only have 2 natural wingers on the team, Marchand and Perry. Sure Stamkos and Duchene spent some times on the wings but this is not their natural position.. With Jamie Benn in the line-up I would be much more confident, but he isnt there, so I think my point is a legitimate concern.

These pros are the best hockey players in the world. They have the ability to play different positions because they utilize these positions in the NHL from the centre position.
They understand the roles and style the wings play and most if not all at one time during there career have played wing.

 

[t0nedeff]

Because Taylor Hall is not a committed defensive hockey player.

Team Canada already has more offensive talent than they know what to do with. They need players who can be trusted to dot their i's and cross their t's defensively, and play a smart, controlled game.

That's not who Taylor Hall is. That's never who Taylor Hall has been. Who cares if he scores a bunch of goals playing with Crosby at the World Championships.

Ryan O'Reilly is a FAR superior choice.

No you're right its not like the team has Toews and Bergeron on the team or anything. Why add a potential game breaker when/if the team is down by 1 in the 3rd of a future game when you can add ANOTHER center who is a slightly worse version of the two above players. It's not like Hall had a great World Championship on a line with Crosby this year or anything.

 

[t0nedeff]

And they need him why? great immature logic, instead of continuously fighting for a spot (we'll just pretend like a young player doesn't enjoy going to the world championships with his buddies in another continent for free, and considering Hall's situation, actually win for once) you should throw a hissy fit with no pedigree to back it up? hahah they'll just leave him off forever regardless of the regime. Oh and btw they changed GM's this year.

It does get your foot in the door, see: Duchene (5 world championships in the past 6 years) and ROR (4 WC's in the past 5 years), oh but Hall went to the last 2 right?

What about Carter? My WC comment was in regards to the original make up of the team. The comment about the players is because Hall is vastly superior to all the players I listed. Yeah everybody loves traveling overseas to play hockey thats why every top Canadian player plays in it every year if/when their team is eliminated except not really not really, at all. Was Babcock not apart of the Olympic team? You really don't think he has a significant say in which players are invited and aren't? So since he was a part of the olympics and he's apart of this World Cup is there anything incorrect in my original comment or did you just blindly started bashing your keyboard?

 

[Saskatoon]

I don't have a big problem with this per se...cause many guys have no problem playing wing...and some guys, can play all 3 forward positions no problem. But some guys, guys like Getzlaf and Thornton don't belong on the wing. Getzlaf belongs on the team, and nobody's taking his spot ( barring injury ). But I thought we had better options at center, at the time of his selecton, than a 37 year old Thornton who I labelled one dimensional. I just didn't see the logic of that pick, and wanted them to take Hall and give him a chance to play alongside Crosby as he did so effectively at the 2015 WC.

But as things stand, the top line of Marchand, Crosby and Bergeron looks set, so its, arguably, a little late in the day, so to speak, to be bringing in a guy like Hall, who ideally would get pp minutes, who may be ( again ideally ) suited to the top line, or top six bare minimum, but who's locked into left wing, and who most wouldn't dream of putting in a bottom six role ( not that we have to pattern our team that way ).

I still wouldn't mind bringing in Hall, I'd make it work, cause the tourney ( albeit a short one, with little margin for error ) hasn't started yet. Still I can see the logic of bringing in a much more versatile guy like ROR, again at this late hour, to replace Seguin --- although its not lost on me that the latter is a righthand and the former is a lefthanded shot, again some guys are comfortable on the off wing, others not so much...so who knows how this will all shake out, when all's said and done*...

Bottom line: JUST WIN BAByyyyyyyyy!!!!

*Presumably, the plan is for Giroux to take Seguin's spot alongside Duchene and Thornton. But my understanding is that Giroux skipped practice and was originally not gonna play vs Russia. He took a wicked shot in the back in game one vs Yanks, so maybe he's still nursing a hurt?

Top line looks etched in stone. And Getzlaf and Perry oft seem joined at the hip, But again who knows how things will all shake out, in the end?

Thornton lines up at centre a lot because he is great in the face off circle but positionally he plays a lot of wing with both Team Canada and the Sharks

 

[Barrie22]

No you're right its not like the team has Toews and Bergeron on the team or anything. Why add a potential game breaker when/if the team is down by 1 in the 3rd of a future game when you can add ANOTHER center who is a slightly worse version of the two above players. It's not like Hall had a great World Championship on a line with Crosby this year or anything.

Because hall would need to be baby sat for the other 15-20 minutes of games defensively.

O'reilly is just as good offensively and better defensively. The defensive part is the key in the selection. Every one of the forwards on team canada are good to great defensively. And or have shown babcock in the olympics they are able to change there game to be defensively responsible.

It is the main reason why stamkos was left off the team in 2010 in the midst of a 50 goal season. With babcock and the team canada brain trust if you are not willing to show them you can play a 2 way game you will not be selected. No matter how good you are offensively.

 

[SullivanT]

Personally I think it's funny that in the two games Canada played against USA they looked like they needed a player like Hall to back USA out of the neutral zone a bit. That being said I still think time will prove that Chia in fact won the trade.

 

[Scotty B]

No you're right its not like the team has Toews and Bergeron on the team or anything. Why add a potential game breaker when/if the team is down by 1 in the 3rd of a future game when you can add ANOTHER center who is a slightly worse version of the two above players. It's not like Hall had a great World Championship on a line with Crosby this year or anything.

They were together Last year/2015 WC actually...but yeah...not a big fan of Babcock's conservative approach...won't be sad when Hockey Canada et al puts that guy out to pasture...alas, that requires a TC loss/failure to win at a major tourney...meaning this tourney...which may well be in the cards...

 

[Barrie22]

They were together Last year/2015 WC actually...but yeah...not a big fan of Babcock's conservative approach...won't be sad when Hockey Canada et al puts that guy out to pasture...alas, that requires a TC loss/failure to win at a major tourney...meaning this tourney...which may well be in the cards...

Yes because a coach that is 13-1 as head coach has to be wrong right? A coach who is also only the 2nd coach to ever win back to back olympic golds.

 

[bert]

he also only has 2 seasons under his belt. Canada isnt going with an inexperienced guy like that unless he is a mcdavid level talent

Cue the leaf fan blind homerism with any situation where a leaf player, management, owner, trainer, etc.

Lol ok man because Orielly and Simmonds have so much more experience. Stone was better on the world stage at the WJC and the WC than both of them. If you look at Stone's effect on his linemates it puts a larger exclamation mark on how poor the selection process has been. The entire team has been put together like a joke the biggest ommision being Letang. You take the best players and he is also 24 years old its not like he is a 19 year old.

When he finishes top 10 in Canadian scoring again this year potentially top 5 because he wont be playing with third line players then maybe maybe someone will pay attention.

track record kinda speaks for itself no?

guy has been pretty successful internationally

Real tough job coaching team Canada.... He thinks he is too smart for his own good. The entire RHD LHD is the most ridiculous of all his theories. The irony that he wont pick the best D men because of the hand they shoot then pick all centermen having players play out of position is ludicris.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Should have picked Stone this is getting ridiculous. He is younger a natural right winger and has been better than O'Rielly the last two seasons. Simmonds over Stone is also mind blowing to me, Stone has been simply much better. His affect on whoever he plays with is phenomenal and all the advanced stats back it up. He was unreal at the World Championships, leads the league in steals by a mile, highest scoring canadian right winger. What else does he have to do here?

Love Stone. I's go ROR for versatility on mixing / matching lines. Both are worthy.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Personally I think it's funny that in the two games Canada played against USA they looked like they needed a player like Hall to back USA out of the neutral zone a bit. That being said I still think time will prove that Chia in fact won the trade.

Hall has all the physical tools for sure. I question the mental part of his game at this level.

 

[bert]

Love Stone. I's go ROR for versatility on mixing / matching lines. Both are worthy.

Stone is a better defensive right wingers than O'Rielly there is really no argument. Seguin is a right handed shot playing right wing.... The rest of the team is also made up of lefties and centermen it doesnt make sense. Stone has been a better player the last two seasons. There isnt a single statistic that doesnt back it up. Terrible job by team canada managment filling this roster, its not a tough thing to do.

 

[CrypTic]

Cue the leaf fan blind homerism with any situation where a leaf player, management, owner, trainer, etc.

Lol ok man because Orielly and Simmonds have so much more experience. Stone was better on the world stage at the WJC and the WC than both of them. If you look at Stone's effect on his linemates it puts a larger exclamation mark on how poor the selection process has been. The entire team has been put together like a joke the biggest ommision being Letang. You take the best players and he is also 24 years old its not like he is a 19 year old.

When he finishes top 10 in Canadian scoring again this year potentially top 5 because he wont be playing with third line players then maybe maybe someone will pay attention.

Real tough job coaching team Canada.... He thinks he is too smart for his own good. The entire RHD LHD is the most ridiculous of all his theories. The irony that he wont pick the best D men because of the hand they shoot then pick all centermen having players play out of position is ludicris.

I wanted Stone (or Toffoli) instead of Reilly too but, ironically, it was bc they are right handed. TC now has only 5 RH Fs: Getz, Perry, Bergeron, Stamkos, and Giroux. Giroux was injured so they may have only four and I don't think they should break up Getz and Perry to give every line a RH shot. But that hurts the bottom line if they only have lefties bc Giroux is injured. It's one consideration out of many.

Many RH D-men have problems playing on their left side. Look at Pietrangelo, especially in the first game. He kind of proved Babcock correct about that. It's not the only consideration but it is a consideration.

Centers often play out of position. It's not unusual at all. It doesn't mean that they can all do it well but most can.

 

[bert]

I wanted Stone (or Toffoli) instead of Reilly too but, ironically, it was bc they are right handed. TC now has only 5 RH Fs: Getz, Perry, Bergeron, Stamkos, and Giroux. Giroux was injured so they may have only four and I don't think they should break up Getz and Perry to give every line a RH shot. But that hurts the bottom line if they only have lefties. It's one consideration out of many.

Many RH D-men have problems playing on their left side. Look at Pietrangelo, especially in the first game. He kind of proved Babcock correct about that. It's not the only consideration but it is a consideration.

Yes Stone and Toffoli shoot right which is the same hand that Seguin shoots so naturaly those selections make sense. Nope pick a lefty that doesnt play right wing the position of the player you are replacing.

Kris Letang plays left consistently but shoots right. He was also the best D man in the playoffs and easily could have won the conn Smyth. Where is he? Nope lets pick Pietrangelo a player that simply isnt as good and force him on to his wrong side.

 

[86Habs]

I wanted Stone (or Toffoli) instead of Reilly too but, ironically, it was bc they are right handed. TC now has only 5 RH Fs: Getz, Perry, Bergeron, Stamkos, and Giroux. Giroux was injured so they may have only four and I don't think they should break up Getz and Perry to give every line a RH shot. But that hurts the bottom line if they only have lefties bc Giroux is injured. It's one consideration out of many.

Many RH D-men have problems playing on their left side. Look at Pietrangelo, especially in the first game. He kind of proved Babcock correct about that. It's not the only consideration but it is a consideration.

Centers often play out of position. It's not unusual at all. It doesn't mean that they can all do it well but most can.

Duchene plays RW from time to time in Colorado and also played RW exclusively at the World Championships. And Thornton was lined up at RW for the first exhibition game against the U.S. Given how much Babcock cares about the handedness of his defencemen, if he doesn't care about bringing in another LHed shot in O'Reilly then I assume they've thought about it as a coaching staff and probably determined that it's not an issue

 

[jj cale]

Terrible losses for Team Canada.

Seguin,Carter,Keith, Benn.

The most handicapped team in this tournament, have to figure out how to make it happen regardless.

 

[LastWordArmy]

Group Preview

http://lastwordonhockey.com/2016/09/13/world-cup-of-hockey-group-a-preview/

 

[CrypTic]

Duchene plays RW from time to time in Colorado and also played RW exclusively at the World Championships. And Thornton was lined up at RW for the first exhibition game against the U.S. Given how much Babcock cares about the handedness of his defencemen, if he doesn't care about bringing in another LHed shot in O'Reilly then I assume they've thought about it as a coaching staff and probably determined that it's not an issue

I assume that they thought about it, realized that it was an issue, but decided that other factors were more important. Thornton didn't look good at RW IMO. It wasn't surprising since he doesn't play that position, was playing RW instead of LW, and hadn't played with his linemates before. Being a Sharks' fan, I can assure you that having a RH shot on his line is an issue for Thornton. He does much better with RH shots than LH shots. He can play well with two other lefties but it's a disadvantage. The Sharks have many natural centers so most play at wing at some point but they almost always have at least one rightie (and one leftie) on each line, in part bc it's easier for a leftie to pass to a rightie (or vice versa) and in part bc each line has someone to take faceoffs to the left and someone to take faceoffs to the right. As I said, it's one consideration.

I'm not complaining about ROR's selection. I think he was a good choice. But handedness is an issue for many forwards.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Terrible losses for Team Canada.

Seguin,Carter,Keith, Benn.

The most handicapped team in this tournament, have to figure out how to make it happen regardless.

Keith is the biggest loss IMO. Depth + at forward

 

[86Habs]

I assume that they thought about it, realized that it was an issue, but decided that other factors were more important. Thornton didn't look good at RW IMO. It wasn't surprising since he doesn't play that position and hadn't played with his linemates before. Being a Sharks' fan, I can assure you that having a RH shot on his line is an issue for Thornton. He does much better with RH shots than LH shots. He can play well with two other lefties but it's a disadvantage. The Sharks have many natural centers so most play at wing at some point but they almost always have at least one rightie (and one leftie) on each line, in part bc it's easier for a leftie to pass to a rightie (or vice versa) and in part bc each line has someone to take faceoffs to the left circle and someone to take faceoffs to the right. As I said, it's one consideration.

I'm not complaining about ROR's selection. I think he was a good choice. But handedness is an issue for many forwards.

Yeah, no doubt and not all forwards can switch over to their wrong side. It will be interesting to see where ROR lines up but I suspect he'll end up as the 13th forward, which is fine. The line combo for tonight's game (per Chris Johnston) is Thornton - O'Reilly - Giroux, so it seems like Thornton is getting a look on the left side. Duchene apparently has a minor injury and is sitting out tonight.

 

[jj cale]

Keith is the biggest loss IMO. Depth + at forward

He is and I think we have already seen his absence on the defensive pairs in the two exhibition games.

Benn was a major loss too, can't really replace a player like that.

We have depth to cover but you can only cover so much, we are handicapped in terms of having our best team compared to everyone else now. Losing seguin has put the losses over the top.


Heres hoping we will come through despite clearly not having our best team.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

dunno why they didnt pick someone like Stone, he would have been a great bottom 6 RW choice. hes a great 2 way/possession player..

They did pick someone like Stone. ROR possess all the characteristics you just listed and has been doing them a lot longer than Stone has.

 

[Max Power]

I'm happy with the replacement but Mark Stone is being overlooked if he's not picked next. The guy with almost double the takeaways then the next player last year would have a brought some real tangible skills. He just has a great all around game.

 

[bert]

They did pick someone like Stone. ROR possess all the characteristics you just listed and has been doing them a lot longer than Stone has.

But not as well. Nor does he play the correct positions like Stone does. Not alot longer either there is only 1 year in age difference in the players. Stone isnt all of a sudden going to get worse he is improving.

 

[bert]

He is and I think we have already seen his absence on the defensive pairs in the two exhibition games.

Benn was a major loss too, can't really replace a player like that.

We have depth to cover but you can only cover so much, we are handicapped in terms of having our best team compared to everyone else now. Losing seguin has put the losses over the top.


Heres hoping we will come through despite clearly not having our best team.

Letang plays exactly like him, why he wasnt picked in the first place I still cant understand but to not get the call after his injury is absurd. He is a righty but plays naturally on the left side too unlike Pietrangelo.