Speculation: 2014 Trade Deadline Discussion - Part IX - The Buffalo Syndrome

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Michael8771*

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First line, third line...Kesler might just want to go to a work environment where he isn't treated like garbage.

In Vancouver, he's been subjected to Crawford, Vigneault, and now Tortorella. Apart from Vigneault (who Kesler apparently despises), the other two aren't just not player coaches; they're completely unreasonable a holes. Tortorella's guys probably leave the game with Stockholm Syndrome and Crawford is whispered to be playing blackjack with a deck full of jokers. Bark at the moon, throw a tea party for his 5 imaginary friends bonkers.

I mean, I don't like this Get Along Gang **** any more than anyone else, but if I were a player, which Kesler is, I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't jump at the chance to trade Torts' work environment for DB's.

Go from a place where, when a buddy asks for a trade, he gets traded where he wants to go, instead of jerked around for a year only to have the owner show up unannounced at his house during his vacation to tell him he isn't getting that transfer he was promised.

Pittsburgh's in Kesler's native country. Pittsburgh's going to win its division and Vancouver is starting a rebuild. Pittsburgh's a safer city than Vancouver. Pennsylvania, US has lower taxes than BC Canada...

He'll waive. They could tell him they'd use him on left D and he'd still waive.

It's not worth talking about him not waiving his NTC for this reason or that reason because he'll waive (unless he's dead set on Michigan or bust or wifey hates Pitt for some reason).

Whether Vancouver is going to like our offer as much as other teams...where he should theoretically be used...whether this should be done at all...

All that stuff's worth discussing.

Whether he'll waive is not.

He'll waive.
He may wave his NTC, However that doesn't guarantee DB will use him properly. His role would likely not be well defined and that could lead to a lot of chaos and unrest. I'd prefer a guy who comes in and knows exactly where he's playing and why. I don't think initially that would be the case with Kesler.
 

KIRK

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https://twitter.com/H_P_Hockey/status/439565435294724096

Scouts from St. Louis, Montreal, Columbus, Vancouver and Edmonton in the house for tonight's #WBSPens game in Syracuse. #TradeWatch

I don't think Shero offered Sutter and Pouliot. I think he offered Sutter and Despres. I think Vancouver wants Sutter and Pouliot. That they are in WBS suggests to me that maybe the add is a WBS guy of Harrington is in play. Tough to tell. I just think if Pouliot really were on the table, then this deal is done already.
 

Ugene Magic

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You want to mess with the best PP unit in the league? Yeah, I just think we're asking for trouble trying to change things up like that. The PK sure, not the top PP.

Guys do get tired, and there are times when certain players are on the ice that drawl the PP, tired.

Point is, you're not messing with the PP, you're adding depth to it.
 

billybudd

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I don't think Shero offered Sutter and Pouliot. I think he offered Sutter and Despres. I think Vancouver wants Sutter and Pouliot. That they are in WBS suggests to me that maybe the add is a WBS guy of Harrington is in play. Tough to tell. I just think if Pouliot really were on the table, then this deal is done already.

That would be a total Rossi move. Call the Vancouver GM and allow himself to be used as leverage to try and get the offer changed..
 

mpp9

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I don't think Shero offered Sutter and Pouliot. I think he offered Sutter and Despres. I think Vancouver wants Sutter and Pouliot. That they are in WBS suggests to me that maybe the add is a WBS guy of Harrington is in play. Tough to tell. I just think if Pouliot really were on the table, then this deal is done already.

Yeah I could see that. Sutter is a must for Vancouver. Shero is willing to deal Despres. Vancouver wants DP.

If DB would play Despres, I'd rather keep him and whatever else it took to get Kesler. DP is our top prospect, but we have plenty of options on defense. His greatest asset is his PP QB ability, and as far as I can tell, we're #1 in the league with any of Letang, Nisky or Martin manning point.

Maatta coming into his own so soon really changed things I think.
 

Michael8771*

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Guys do get tired, and there are times when certain players are on the ice that drawl the PP, tired.

Point is, you're not messing with the PP, you're adding depth to it.
Listen, I'm all for getting Kesler IF his role is clearly defined, he accepts it and we aren't giving up a silly amount of assets.

As Kirk mentioned, maybe the Canucks are looking at players beyond DP because we won't part with him. I sure hope so anyhow.
 

KIRK

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That would be a total Rossi move. Call the Vancouver GM and allow himself to be used as leverage to try and get the offer changed..

Well, think about it. Vancouver guy says he heard the offer was Sutter and Despres. Makes sense, especially where Despres fits on the totem pole here.

Shero doesn't trade prospects he loves. Pouliot, he loves. But, Pouliot is the caliber of prospect who, IMO, moves a Sutter as your young NHL guy based offer from the garbage heap to the top of the list.

Now, you see Vancouver scouting WBS. Maybe it means someone they like better than Despres but not as much as Pouliot is in play. IMO, that would be Harrington . . . Sutter, Harrington, 1st perhaps?
 

Michael8771*

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I'd give Sutter, anyone down in WB (except Harrington) and a number one this year.
 

KIRK

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Yeah I could see that. Sutter is a must for Vancouver. Shero is willing to deal Despres. Vancouver wants DP.

If DB would play Despres, I'd rather keep him and whatever else it took to get Kesler. DP is our top prospect, but we have plenty of options on defense. His greatest asset is his PP QB ability, and as far as I can tell, we're #1 in the league with any of Letang, Nisky or Martin manning point.

Maatta coming into his own so soon really changed things I think.

Gonna say this:

1. I am all in favor of getting Kesler, all things being equal. He could be what the Pens hoped Staal would be if he had any PP talent and a better attitude towards sliding up to Sid's or Geno's wing on occasion.

2. It better be Kesler in, Kunitz out on the top PP. Kesler is a RHS but, more important, is a true net front presence, unlike Kunitz.

3. Getting Kesler will lead to a further marginalization of sorts of Malkin as long as Bylsma remains coach. That also entails a further under-utilization of Neal. So, just know that unanticipated downside will come to fruition.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Well, think about it. Vancouver guy says he heard the offer was Sutter and Despres. Makes sense, especially where Despres fits on the totem pole here.

Shero doesn't trade prospects he loves. Pouliot, he loves. But, Pouliot is the caliber of prospect who, IMO, moves a Sutter as your young NHL guy based offer from the garbage heap to the top of the list.

Now, you see Vancouver scouting WBS. Maybe it means someone they like better than Despres but not as much as Pouliot is in play. IMO, that would be Harrington . . . Sutter, Harrington, 1st perhaps?

If this is a huge bidding war like it's being reported, I can't see that package getting it done.

Maybe if they add Glass? Nucks must regret letting him go...
 

Ugene Magic

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I don't think Shero offered Sutter and Pouliot. I think he offered Sutter and Despres. I think Vancouver wants Sutter and Pouliot. That they are in WBS suggests to me that maybe the add is a WBS guy of Harrington is in play. Tough to tell. I just think if Pouliot really were on the table, then this deal is done already.

Kesler still has term. I'd say the deal should be more like the Staal trade.

That's.... Sutter, One of the top D-prospects, 1st

Difference is, Kesler is signed for two years past this season where Staal was only one when he was traded(shorten lockout season), but the age difference (Kesler is 5 years older) should come into play washing that out. The last thing is the 5.0 discount for two seasons, and our 1st won't equal that 8th overall we got from the, Canes. That will add a small piece.
 

canadianguy77

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I want nothing to do with Kesler if it involves parting with DP. Sutter and DP would be a massive overpayment IMO. And if Shero made that deal, we basically have 2 legit scoring lines and the worst bottom 6 in the league. It doesn't get us a cup this year, and we give up our best prospect. It doesn't make sense unless we're active in free agency and gunning for a cup next year.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Kesler still has term. I'd say the deal should be more like the Staal trade.

That's.... Sutter, One of the top D-prospects, 1st

Difference is, Kesler is signed for two years past this season where Staal was only one when he was traded(shorten lockout season), but the age difference (Kesler is 5 years older) should come into play washing that out. The last thing is the 5.0 discount for two seasons, and our 1st won't equal that 8th overall we got from the, Canes. That will add a small piece.

You are looking at the package wrong... The Pens package is better than the Canes if DP is involved:

Sutter=Sutter
DP 2 years developed > 8th overall
1st > Dumoulin
 

Michael8771*

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Only problem is that it will cost you Harrington if not Pouliot. ;)
DP might be a dealbreaker for me. Harrington would be pretty hard to part with as well but obviously I'd part with Harrington out of the two. I just hope it doesn't come to that.
 

mpp9

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If this is a huge bidding war like it's being reported, I can't see that package getting it done.

Maybe if they add Glass? Nucks must regret letting him go...

Friedman commented saying the Nucks are high on Sutter. Wanted him in the past and still like him. That gets the conversation going at the very least. And if they want a D-man as the second piece, then we're in as good a position as any team in the league to meet their demands.

DP is our top prospect. Despres is ready for legit NHL minutes. And we have a few guys in the minors that would serve as quality third pieces in a deal.
 

KIRK

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If this is a huge bidding war like it's being reported, I can't see that package getting it done.

Maybe if they add Glass? Nucks must regret letting him go...

As long as Adams isn't on the table . . . :naughty:

BTW, the more I think about it . . . I'll bet Shero offered Sutter, Despres, and a 1st. Think about it. The 1st, especially in this draft, means **** to him. Despres means less.

I'll bet Vancouver asked Sutter, Pouliot, and a 1st.

Just a gut feeling. Also trying to figure out who in the puck they'd be scouting in WBS for a deal. Maybe there's talk of expanding the deal? I wouldn't mind Kassian being added . . . :naughty:

You are looking at the package wrong... The Pens package is better than the Canes if DP is involved:

Sutter=Sutter
DP 2 years developed > 8th overall
1st > Dumoulin

That's why I opined about Harrington.

Sutter = Sutter
1st > Dumoulin
Harrington today v DP at 18 . . . only thing I don't know is how far apart that value is.
 

mpp9

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I want nothing to do with Kesler if it involves parting with DP. Sutter and DP would be a massive overpayment IMO. And if Shero made that deal, we basically have 2 legit scoring lines and the worst bottom 6 in the league. It doesn't get us a cup this year, and we give up our best prospect. It doesn't make sense unless we're active in free agency and gunning for a cup next year.

Letang goes on LTIR to make the deal. We'd have the space to find a top 9 forward as well.

Kunitz-Sid-Kesler
Jokinen-Malkin-Neal
Gibbons-Goc-Bennett

Kunitz-Sid-Hemsky/Stempniak
Jokinen-Malkin-Neal
Gibbons-Kesler-Bennett

What's the problem?
 

mpp9

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As long as Adams isn't on the table . . . :naughty:

BTW, the more I think about it . . . I'll bet Shero offered Sutter, Despres, and a 1st. Think about it. The 1st, especially in this draft, means **** to him. Despres means less.

I'll bet Vancouver asked Sutter, Pouliot, and a 1st.

Just a gut feeling. Also trying to figure out who in the puck they'd be scouting in WBS for a deal. Maybe there's talk of expanding the deal? I wouldn't mind Kassian being added . . . :naughty:

I wouldn't mind Hansen. Guy would be a great utility player with Dupes out.
 

KIRK

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Friedman commented saying the Nucks are high on Sutter. Wanted him in the past and still like him. That gets the conversation going at the very least. And if they want a D-man as the second piece, then we're in as good a position as any team in the league to meet their demands.

DP is our top prospect. Despres is ready for legit NHL minutes. And we have a few guys in the minors that would serve as quality third pieces in a deal.

What exactly is Harrington's value right now? Is he someone who might be valued more than Despres but less than Pouliot. Maybe he is seen like his old partner in juniors, as someone who fell down the chart further than he should've? Just spitballing. I honestly don't know.
 

KIRK

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I wouldn't mind Hansen. Guy would be a great utility player with Dupes out.

I'll be laughing my *** off when the playoffs come and Kesler/Hansen are logging more minutes than Geno/Neal. :laugh:
 

canadianguy77

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Letang goes on LTIR to make the deal. We'd have the space to find a top 9 forward as well.

Kunitz-Sid-Kesler
Jokinen-Malkin-Neal
Gibbons-Goc-Bennett

Kunitz-Sid-Hemsky/Stempniak
Jokinen-Malkin-Neal
Gibbons-Kesler-Bennett

What's the problem?

I guess that works, but we don't know about Letang and his future yet.
 

mpp9

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What exactly is Harrington's value right now? Is he someone who might be valued more than Despres but less than Pouliot. Maybe he is seen like his old partner in juniors, as someone who fell down the chart further than he should've? Just spitballing. I honestly don't know.

I think Despres is worth more than Harrington. NHL ready, with his size and transition game is tough to overlook. DP is our top prospect so he's definitely highest on the totem pole though.
 
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