Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread
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LaffyTaffyNYR
Registered User
- Feb 25, 2012
- 17,113
- 2,662
You cant win a championship in hockey without a top center... u can debate who is one or how to acquire one etc, but we won't win a cup with Stepan as the 1 regardless of how far we got this season.
OverTheCap
Registered User
- Jan 3, 2009
- 10,454
- 184
Some of the trade proposals I'm seeing won't result in much of an upgrade because we will improve in one area only to create holes in another area. Robbing Peter to pay Paul, so to speak. Then if the player we traded for underperforms, we are even more screwed. I think when many of us were advocating for a #1C, it didn't mean at the expense of making the rest of the team weaker.
How is that delusional? It's opportunity cost.
Is it possible for you to grasp the concept of a depreciating asset? Eventually, Staal's value will diminish. 29 y/o. And, here's the most important thing, he's not going to shine in this system.
He struggles at puck possession. The last two years have seen this team improve in holding the puck significantly.
We also play a transition style of hockey, which means faster, better decisions, and chipping in for defenders. Neither of which Staal is particularly good at.
He's a player you need when you're trying to hold the lead. Undeniable. He's a great locker room asset. Undeniable. But that's a position that you can realistically pay less for and get similar results to what Staal was bringing than a 2c.
Swept In Seven
Disciple of The Zook
- Apr 27, 2010
- 9,687
- 1
Fleury wasa success here until his drug issues came to the surface and even then he was still awesome, my favorite player growing up
n8
WAAAAAAA!!!
1. I'm not sold on me first ROR who I consider good but overrated. That said, there is a possible short term fit.
2 Instead of Staal, let's move Girardi + his contract.
How about
Girardi + J. Moore + Buchnevich
for
ROR + Siemens
McD Stralman
Staal Allen
Siemens McIlrath
EDIT follow up:
If you now have
ROR and Stepan /+
do you consider that a basis to flip
for
Zibby + Spezza /+ ?
Last edited:
Careful RB, speaking boldly about going after guys (presumably better guys) on ELC/less $. Careful. People might get you confused with someone else sayin that for a while now.
- Sep 17, 2007
- 24,928
- 22,849
Do we need a center? Yes. A high end center? Yes. But that doesn't mean we target the best one available and roll the dice.
We should be making deals for the right players and not simply settling for the best available. If that means waiting a year or even two, then that's what we do. In the meantime, you make due with what you have.
I'd prefer to target younger players that haven't broken out yet, but that our scouts believe has the ability to become at least a top 6 center in the near future. Who those players are, I don't know, but that's what I'd like to see.
We should be making deals for the right players and not simply settling for the best available. If that means waiting a year or even two, then that's what we do. In the meantime, you make due with what you have.
I'd prefer to target younger players that haven't broken out yet, but that our scouts believe has the ability to become at least a top 6 center in the near future. Who those players are, I don't know, but that's what I'd like to see.
NYRFAN218
King
Or he could just sign with them when he hits free agency and not let his new team give up a significant asset?
This is so ridiculous I don't even know where to begin.
The sharks are looking to see what they can get for Thornton and it seems he really only wants to go to the rangers, what would you guys give up? Ideally neither of brassard or stepan are in the deal for center depth but might have to move brassard. It's also tough without picks but I think he would be a good acquisition depending on price
pld459666
Registered User
No coke for Pepsi
Have to give to get
Think outside the box
did I get them all in?
haveandare
Registered User
Fooled me. I saw a team a few OT goals away from the cup with Stephan as the 1C.
They got outplayed by la for a couple reasons, but Stepan wasn't one of them IMO. Richards was a net negative and Girardi had some of his worst games in a long, long time. Plus the kings were just built incredibly.
I think major changes here would be a huge, huge mistake. Talk all we want about what is necessary to win in theory, we just saw what is necessary to win in reality and it's not far from where they are now.
Inferno
Registered User
i think if you get Thornton straight up for Staal for example, with the Sharks retaining some salary (can they do it for just 1 year?)
and you could replace Staal with say Boyle on a super cheap 1 year bonus filled contract, and bring back stralman.
all magically working under the cap...and can go into next year with this as your lineup...
Kreider - Thornton - Nash
Hagelin - Stepan - MSL
Pouliot - Brassard - MZA
Fasth - Moore - Miller
Boyle - McD
Girardi - Stralman
Klein - Moore
Id move McD to his offside because he seemed just fine at the olympics there.
to me, thats a cup team right there.
our 3rd line, which was our best line all season is brought back. you have Thornton to set up Kreider and Nash, a true playmaker to get them the puck.
You have Stepan playing with MSL and Hagelin, 2 guys he's had a ton of chemistry with in the past, and you have a 4th line of kids that you pretty much have no choice of going with considering the salary cap.
Here's the cap numbers to try to make it work.
CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($2.250m) / Joe Thornton ($4.725m—30.00%) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Benoit Pouliot ($1.700m) / Derick Brassard ($4.000m) / Mats Zuccarello ($3.950m)
Jesper Fast ($0.805m) / Dominic Moore ($1.500m) / J.T. Miller ($0.894m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Dan Boyle ($3.000m) / Kevin Klein ($2.900m)
John Moore ($1.200m) / Anton Stralman ($3.950m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.225m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,111,667; BONUSES: $445,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $988,333
You can reduce Boyles salary even more by having more of it roll over to next season...
and you could replace Staal with say Boyle on a super cheap 1 year bonus filled contract, and bring back stralman.
all magically working under the cap...and can go into next year with this as your lineup...
Kreider - Thornton - Nash
Hagelin - Stepan - MSL
Pouliot - Brassard - MZA
Fasth - Moore - Miller
Boyle - McD
Girardi - Stralman
Klein - Moore
Id move McD to his offside because he seemed just fine at the olympics there.
to me, thats a cup team right there.
our 3rd line, which was our best line all season is brought back. you have Thornton to set up Kreider and Nash, a true playmaker to get them the puck.
You have Stepan playing with MSL and Hagelin, 2 guys he's had a ton of chemistry with in the past, and you have a 4th line of kids that you pretty much have no choice of going with considering the salary cap.
Here's the cap numbers to try to make it work.
CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($2.250m) / Joe Thornton ($4.725m—30.00%) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Benoit Pouliot ($1.700m) / Derick Brassard ($4.000m) / Mats Zuccarello ($3.950m)
Jesper Fast ($0.805m) / Dominic Moore ($1.500m) / J.T. Miller ($0.894m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Dan Boyle ($3.000m) / Kevin Klein ($2.900m)
John Moore ($1.200m) / Anton Stralman ($3.950m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.225m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,111,667; BONUSES: $445,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $988,333
You can reduce Boyles salary even more by having more of it roll over to next season...
A Center equal to Stepan would suffice. We aren't drafting a superstar 1C and we can't trade for one without paying a ransom.
Stay young.
No 30+ yr olds breaking down.
Stay young.
No 30+ yr olds breaking down.
Gardner McKay
RIP, Jimmy.
Careful RB, speaking boldly about going after guys (presumably better guys) on ELC/less $. Careful. People might get you confused with someone else sayin that for a while now.
There is a difference. Your trades bern deserve a
icon after every one. Your targets either make no sense or you drastically overpay for no reason.
pld459666
Registered User
We really need to get off this myth that Pouliot needs to be resigned.
For all this talk of great chemistry he had with Brass and Zuccs, all he did was produce to his averages, maybe slightly above his career average.
I would bet dollars to donuts that either JT Miller or Jesper Fast playing the LW on that line would post the same totals.
He takes 1.5 per for 3 years, keep him, but anything more than that, save the sheckels and spend the extra coin somewhere else.
For all this talk of great chemistry he had with Brass and Zuccs, all he did was produce to his averages, maybe slightly above his career average.
I would bet dollars to donuts that either JT Miller or Jesper Fast playing the LW on that line would post the same totals.
He takes 1.5 per for 3 years, keep him, but anything more than that, save the sheckels and spend the extra coin somewhere else.
BlueshirtBlitz
Foolish Samurai
Stepan continues to get criminally underrated.
but we're ready to break the bank for ROR who is...incredibly similar.
but we're ready to break the bank for ROR who is...incredibly similar.
So you suggest that we target a guy who will be 35 and another guy who will be 38 by the start of the regular season?
The thing that is scary is that if we get ROR and give him lets say 6 years for 36 mill... what would stop Stepan for asking for the same exact thing?
We've been hardballing our home grown players the entire time and ROR is gonna command his way out of a team and have our GM give into his demands?
I don't think so. Which is why I think a trade of Staal for ROR straight up could actually be pertinent. They have no certainty of retaining Staal after next year, at the time of the trade. We have no certainty of retaining ROR after 2 years, if his demands don't lower.
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