What D are we trading for Vanek?
The Sabres will ask for 4 high end assets, just like what the Blue Jackets received in the Nash deal.
Anisimov - Closest Comparision is Brassard
Dubinsky - Del Zotto?
Erixon - Miller
1rst - 1rst
Is it worth it?
Speculation: 2013 Off-Season Speculation/Be the GM Thread
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What D are we trading for Vanek?
The Sabres will ask for 4 high end assets, just like what the Blue Jackets received in the Nash deal.
Anisimov - Closest Comparision is Brassard
Dubinsky - Del Zotto?
Erixon - Miller
1rst - 1rst
Is it worth it?
Thumpz
Registered User
A couple things I'd like to see happen in conjunction;
Resign our RFA's to the deals they're worth. 4m for McDonagh, 3.5m for Stepan, 1.75-2m for Hagelin.
Resign Clowe if he's interested in a shorter term deal, In the area of 4.25 for 2 years.
Speak with certain UFA's before the Free Agency date, ascertain whether we can sign them to good deals. (Horton, Raymond, Gordon, Weiss, Nystrom are targets I'd look at).
If we have the opportunity to make an impact through Free Agency, buyout Richards.
If it looks as though we don't have anything to spend the cap space on, Richards gets another year here.
If Richards is bought out, Entertain the idea of trading MDZ at the draft for top 6 scoring, or something like the Burmi + 1st deal.
If MDZ is traded, look at a supplemental deal around McBain. Perhaps qualifying Zuccarello and sending him to Carolina gets that done.
Look at available cap space and Sauer's health, I'd love to see him make a comeback from his concussion with us.
Try to offload any or all of Pyatt/Asham/Powe at the draft for later round picks if we pick up any of the aforementioned free agents.
Ultimately roll a lineup something like this if all goes well, the turnover isn't really too terrible, and I think the playstyle/identity Torts is looking for will come out with this type of team;
FORWARDS
Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Derek Stepan ($3.500m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Ryane Clowe ($4.250m) / Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / Nathan Horton ($4.500m)
Mason Raymond ($2.775m) / Alexander Burmistrov ($1.500m) / Carl Hagelin ($1.750m)
Darroll Powe ($1.067m) / Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Ryan McDonagh ($4.000m) / Jamie McBain ($1.800m)
John Moore ($0.965m) / Anton Stralman ($1.700m)
Dylan McIlrath ($1.295m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Martin Biron ($1.300m)
OTHER
Buyout: Brad Richards ($0.000m)
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CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,785,000; BONUSES: $1,012,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,527,500
A top 6 full of tough hard to play against players interjected with a lot of skill. A third line that's defensively reliable, with great two way play (I honestly feel Torts can do a LOT with Burmistrov) and a 4th line that when it's on it's game can pin opposing top lines in their zone for a long time, something we've been dying to have all of this season.
Start Kreider in the AHL, next season's Whale team ought to be interesting with Kreider, Lindberg, Miller, Fasth, McIlrath and Allen all playing together. I think it would be a good thing for them to play well and get some confidence. We have McIlrath and Bickel as 7th D-men and callups. Haley would be the 13th forward, with Kreider/Miller/Fasth/Lindberg being callups for top 9 injuries. I'd love to see more youth in the lineup, but I just don't think any of them are going to be ready by the start of the season. I think it's far more likely we have someone come up as an injury callup and work their way into a permanent spot like McDonagh and Hagelin have.
Also truly hoping that Staal's vision is not a lasting injury and he returns to his normal playing ability early in the season.
Resign our RFA's to the deals they're worth. 4m for McDonagh, 3.5m for Stepan, 1.75-2m for Hagelin.
Resign Clowe if he's interested in a shorter term deal, In the area of 4.25 for 2 years.
Speak with certain UFA's before the Free Agency date, ascertain whether we can sign them to good deals. (Horton, Raymond, Gordon, Weiss, Nystrom are targets I'd look at).
If we have the opportunity to make an impact through Free Agency, buyout Richards.
If it looks as though we don't have anything to spend the cap space on, Richards gets another year here.
If Richards is bought out, Entertain the idea of trading MDZ at the draft for top 6 scoring, or something like the Burmi + 1st deal.
If MDZ is traded, look at a supplemental deal around McBain. Perhaps qualifying Zuccarello and sending him to Carolina gets that done.
Look at available cap space and Sauer's health, I'd love to see him make a comeback from his concussion with us.
Try to offload any or all of Pyatt/Asham/Powe at the draft for later round picks if we pick up any of the aforementioned free agents.
Ultimately roll a lineup something like this if all goes well, the turnover isn't really too terrible, and I think the playstyle/identity Torts is looking for will come out with this type of team;
FORWARDS
Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Derek Stepan ($3.500m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Ryane Clowe ($4.250m) / Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / Nathan Horton ($4.500m)
Mason Raymond ($2.775m) / Alexander Burmistrov ($1.500m) / Carl Hagelin ($1.750m)
Darroll Powe ($1.067m) / Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Ryan McDonagh ($4.000m) / Jamie McBain ($1.800m)
John Moore ($0.965m) / Anton Stralman ($1.700m)
Dylan McIlrath ($1.295m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Martin Biron ($1.300m)
OTHER
Buyout: Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,785,000; BONUSES: $1,012,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,527,500
A top 6 full of tough hard to play against players interjected with a lot of skill. A third line that's defensively reliable, with great two way play (I honestly feel Torts can do a LOT with Burmistrov) and a 4th line that when it's on it's game can pin opposing top lines in their zone for a long time, something we've been dying to have all of this season.
Start Kreider in the AHL, next season's Whale team ought to be interesting with Kreider, Lindberg, Miller, Fasth, McIlrath and Allen all playing together. I think it would be a good thing for them to play well and get some confidence. We have McIlrath and Bickel as 7th D-men and callups. Haley would be the 13th forward, with Kreider/Miller/Fasth/Lindberg being callups for top 9 injuries. I'd love to see more youth in the lineup, but I just don't think any of them are going to be ready by the start of the season. I think it's far more likely we have someone come up as an injury callup and work their way into a permanent spot like McDonagh and Hagelin have.
Also truly hoping that Staal's vision is not a lasting injury and he returns to his normal playing ability early in the season.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,022
- 17,636
Used CapGeek, just a regular hypothetical:
Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Zuccarello-Brassard-Ryan
Hagelin-Zubrus-Callahan
Pyatt-Boyle-Dorsett
McDonagh-Stralman
Moore-Girardi
Scuderi-Del Zotto
Trade Marc Staal for Bobby Ryan.
Sign Zubrus, $2M AAV. Not sure how many years, 1 or 2 would be ideal. Would probably say no to anything higher.
Sign Scuderi, $3.5M AAV. Very good bottom-4 Dman. Adds a little nasty. Should be a 2 or 3 year deal.*
Re-signed McDonagh. $4.25M per, probably around 4 or 5 years. I'm hoping for $4.5M over 6 or 7 years, but I doubt that happens. The latter seems more realistic. Re-signed Stepan. $3.25M per, should be 3 years. Re-signed Hagelin. $1.95M per, nearly certain it'd be a 2 year deal. Re-signed Zuccarello, $1.25M per, for 1 or 2 years.
That would leave us around $3.5M in cap space, and that includes Asham/Powe. That's $2M in cap right there.
*Hopefully McIlrath is ready and Scuderi isn't necessary. I still think McIlrath could use a longer stint in the AHL. It's hard to get a read on what the org will do with the defense for next year. I'm expecting a move to be made including one of Del Zotto/Staal/Girardi. I wouldn't be surprised if they signed a free agent defenseman for the #5 spot. Scuderi/Streit make sense.
Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Zuccarello-Brassard-Ryan
Hagelin-Zubrus-Callahan
Pyatt-Boyle-Dorsett
McDonagh-Stralman
Moore-Girardi
Scuderi-Del Zotto
Trade Marc Staal for Bobby Ryan.
Sign Zubrus, $2M AAV. Not sure how many years, 1 or 2 would be ideal. Would probably say no to anything higher.
Sign Scuderi, $3.5M AAV. Very good bottom-4 Dman. Adds a little nasty. Should be a 2 or 3 year deal.*
Re-signed McDonagh. $4.25M per, probably around 4 or 5 years. I'm hoping for $4.5M over 6 or 7 years, but I doubt that happens. The latter seems more realistic. Re-signed Stepan. $3.25M per, should be 3 years. Re-signed Hagelin. $1.95M per, nearly certain it'd be a 2 year deal. Re-signed Zuccarello, $1.25M per, for 1 or 2 years.
That would leave us around $3.5M in cap space, and that includes Asham/Powe. That's $2M in cap right there.
*Hopefully McIlrath is ready and Scuderi isn't necessary. I still think McIlrath could use a longer stint in the AHL. It's hard to get a read on what the org will do with the defense for next year. I'm expecting a move to be made including one of Del Zotto/Staal/Girardi. I wouldn't be surprised if they signed a free agent defenseman for the #5 spot. Scuderi/Streit make sense.
bleedblue94
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2004
- 9,973
- 11,087
I will be in the vast minority but I think the team should seriously look at trading girardi for offensive help AND follow up by talking to staal to explore dealing him to the hurricanes. Rutherford already showed he will trade assets in the jordan staal deal despite him only having the one year left on his contract, I would suspect the same would be true with marc.
I love the battler girardi is and people around the league seem to value him but his transition game is awful, and he is a turnover machine when he doesn't just chip off the glass. People are commenting how it looks like his game has slipped this series, yet I think he is just being exposed bc he doesn't have mcd to support him. We saw similiar things in past years before mcd was here if girardi wasn't playing with staal.
Move forward with 4 of the main 6 d spots as:
Mcd
Moore
Stralman
Mdz
Bring in one more top 6 guy (murray?)and then let dylan mcl and eminger battle it out for the 6th spot in camp. Staal and girardi could be two huge trade chips in the right deals.
I love the battler girardi is and people around the league seem to value him but his transition game is awful, and he is a turnover machine when he doesn't just chip off the glass. People are commenting how it looks like his game has slipped this series, yet I think he is just being exposed bc he doesn't have mcd to support him. We saw similiar things in past years before mcd was here if girardi wasn't playing with staal.
Move forward with 4 of the main 6 d spots as:
Mcd
Moore
Stralman
Mdz
Bring in one more top 6 guy (murray?)and then let dylan mcl and eminger battle it out for the 6th spot in camp. Staal and girardi could be two huge trade chips in the right deals.
You couldn't resist, could you? Stralman over Girardi for top pair, really? I know how you feel about Girardi, but if you are going to put him on the second pair, might as well trade him for a younger RHD with a good shot.
Anyway, I like the 3rd line, the 2nd line needs a little more size.
I think that is a possibility for Miller. As far as Kreider, I would be delighted with a 40 point season from the 3rd line.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,022
- 17,636
I put him on the second pairing because I'd rather Moore be with Girardi because he can cover Moore's occasional gaffes, McDonagh and Stralman was a good pairing, and it spreads out the D.
That just means there's a lot of depth. Doesn't indicate anything about my opinion of Girardi, I don't know why you need to bring it up in every post you quote of mine, it's such a minor thing.
With his style of play and contract expiring next season, Girardi could provide some solid trade bait.
true, I do bring it up every chance i get. I just want everyone to like him
McD is a mobile Dman who likes to venture up ice, he needs a more stay at home D, that's why he works well with Girardi. Stralman is not that kind of Dman.
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,022
- 17,636
One of Girardi, Del Zotto, or Staal needs to be traded for a goal scoring forward.
It's a move so obvious it might as well be slapping you in the face.
Which one is moved, however, is the most interesting part. Girardi is the one I'm considering to be the safest. I doubt he's moved.
if staal makes it clear he wont resign summer 2015 u move him. if not then u move del zotto. i think del zotto gets a much bigger return than girardi when u factor in age and offensive upside.
Im pretty sure you gave me the business for making a line-up for next season and putting kreider in the top 6 about a month ago. Why the change of heart?
Kakko
Formerly Chytil
Now, there's obviously the Carolina factor with Staal, but assuming, he would resign with us, he's the only one that hasn't had issues in the past, and I'd much rather lock him up than the other 2
haveandare
Registered User
The team has been pretty solid in terms of GA/G the past few years. Sure, a lot of that is Hank, but the D works well IMO - I wouldn't trade 2 of the top 4 d-men. This time next year everyone would be talking about trading forwards for D depth. Moore and Stralman should not both be top 4 players based on what we've seen so far, not on a great defense at least, and Eminger should not be more than an extra, nor should McIlrath be rushed.
I'm not opposed to trading one d-man if the deal is right, but I wouldn't be so quick to make a massive turnover on the D. Massive turnover is becoming way, way too regular on NYR. Turning over the forwards and counting on young guys to step up is part of why the start of this season was so painful, they definitely shouldn't do the same to the D next year.
JimmyG89
Registered User
- May 1, 2010
- 10,130
- 9,000
Those are what was thought at that time. It did not work. Traded Gaborik and go get the depth back. Back to square one. This is a "lateral move" for the team this season. An extra year for these guys and both their first in pro hockey. Might be better equipped to make the trade a NOT give them up as assets. Trade a D (DZ, Staal, Girardi) for a forward. We traded Erixon as part of the deal, but the main parts were Dubi and Anisimov, top 9 forwards. Del Zotto could return quite a bit. Look at what PMD cost in trades in the past. Value is there in DZ.
cd211
Registered User
come on guys.. this again.. trading girardi?
hes a RHD, top 4 dman and a warrior whos a block shotting machine, and the only top 4rd we have on our team..
staal
mcd
dz
moore... all leftys...
Girardi.. that is all we have.. now lets think about this we trade girardi our only proven top 4 rhdman and replace him with.... its the hardest position to fill besides a 1c.. lets be real here...
dz is the only one i see getting traded..
and some of you want Vanek.. ew... bobby ryan is noway happening... so many more teams will out bid us its not even funny what wed have to give..
i want to resign clowe, sign horton only if MZA doesnt plan on resigning here.. and of course buyout richards.. go into next season using miller/lingberg as 3c and go into 14' FA, ready to pitch Malkin... but even if we cant get him so mcuh better of a class to go after players... pavelski, kessel, Stasny, Malkin etc..
hes a RHD, top 4 dman and a warrior whos a block shotting machine, and the only top 4rd we have on our team..
staal
mcd
dz
moore... all leftys...
Girardi.. that is all we have.. now lets think about this we trade girardi our only proven top 4 rhdman and replace him with.... its the hardest position to fill besides a 1c.. lets be real here...
dz is the only one i see getting traded..
and some of you want Vanek.. ew... bobby ryan is noway happening... so many more teams will out bid us its not even funny what wed have to give..
i want to resign clowe, sign horton only if MZA doesnt plan on resigning here.. and of course buyout richards.. go into next season using miller/lingberg as 3c and go into 14' FA, ready to pitch Malkin... but even if we cant get him so mcuh better of a class to go after players... pavelski, kessel, Stasny, Malkin etc..
bleedblue94
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2004
- 9,973
- 11,087
quite honestly i find it hard to accept when trading staal is mentioned that people keep acting like it would be some sudden great loss. the poor guy has been injured allot lately and the team has been forced to move on without him. saying that trading both he and girardi would be two huge losses to me is true on paper but staal has been a loss for this year for the vast majority of two seasons now (unfortunately). the team has been forced to learn how to function without him
eminger has been playing in the six spot for the majority of the season and has done a solid job. im not proposing going into next season with eminger and mci as the 5 and 6, im saying let them fight it out for the 6 spot and bring in another d man whether thats murray or a mcbain or something else to fill out the 6.
there is a very stupid and painful myth out there that this team is good defensively. there is a difference between being good defensively versus laying on the ice blocking shots (and subsequently rarely being in position for an effective transition game) and having a world class goalie who regularly covers up for horrific turnovers and chances against. youre not a good defensive team when almost everyone who watches the team regularly believes that the team has no chance of even making the playoffs if it has anyone else in net.
great defensive teams support their goalie, they do not rely on the goalie.
(example: devils in the past when broduer would be injured and clemenson and hedberg would step right in, those were great defensive teams)
HFsNumber1Heel
FKA Roo Returns...Still A Contrarian Apparently
I think MZA will want to come back. He's played well. And he deserves a two year deal.
Not that much needs to be done up front, quality over quantity.
Assuming Kreider is a lock and with Lindberg, Miller, and if Fasth is ready, you can actually have four lines that have scoring, grit, and a defensive presence.
And a fourth line doesn't have to be a true fourth line. They can determine which line or players are going, and use two more than the others, but not be afraid to use all four.
Find a DMan too.
Something like;
Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Hagelin-Brassard-Callahan
Boyle-Miller-MZA
Dorsett-Lindberg-Fasth
Extras; Powe and either Pyatt or Asham with the other traded.
A UFA like Bozak, Antro, someone young cheap with upside can center the third line and then they can figure out if one of Lindberg/Fasth/Miller needs more time.
On D resign Emminger as the 7th or 8th guy, and sign someone like a Babchuk, Lovejoy, Jordie Benn, O'Reily etc. for cheap to be a 6th Dman until either McLIrath is ready or insurance in case Staal isn't ready or Strahlman is still banged up. Depth at D is key.
Not that much needs to be done up front, quality over quantity.
Assuming Kreider is a lock and with Lindberg, Miller, and if Fasth is ready, you can actually have four lines that have scoring, grit, and a defensive presence.
And a fourth line doesn't have to be a true fourth line. They can determine which line or players are going, and use two more than the others, but not be afraid to use all four.
Find a DMan too.
Something like;
Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Hagelin-Brassard-Callahan
Boyle-Miller-MZA
Dorsett-Lindberg-Fasth
Extras; Powe and either Pyatt or Asham with the other traded.
A UFA like Bozak, Antro, someone young cheap with upside can center the third line and then they can figure out if one of Lindberg/Fasth/Miller needs more time.
On D resign Emminger as the 7th or 8th guy, and sign someone like a Babchuk, Lovejoy, Jordie Benn, O'Reily etc. for cheap to be a 6th Dman until either McLIrath is ready or insurance in case Staal isn't ready or Strahlman is still banged up. Depth at D is key.
bleedblue94
Registered User
- Jun 8, 2004
- 9,973
- 11,087
and the dillusional dreams continue that players like that will actually make it to ufa status. every season we hear people say just wait till they are ufa and we can get them for nothing, but rarely do hose quality of player make it to ufa bc professional teams arent stupid enough to loose assets like that for nothing (unless your the mets and reyes (im a mets fan)), especially now that the players can get an extra year if they "resign" with their team, you willl see players' rights being dealt to teams before the ufa period so they can offer up the extra year to the player as incentive to sign. any basketball fans out there saw the same type of thing happen with anthony when he was traded and he "resigned"" with them for the extra year/money. nhl free agency will start to follow the nba more and more, except rather than "sign and trades, "they will become "trade and sign"
how about a guy trading for a guy like Theo Peckham or Smid from Edmonton..
maybe something like Peckham 1st 2013 (7th overall) for Del Zotto??? solves two problems... get a top line young forward and rugged nasty dman.. 24 years old and signed to a cheap contract
maybe something like Peckham 1st 2013 (7th overall) for Del Zotto??? solves two problems... get a top line young forward and rugged nasty dman.. 24 years old and signed to a cheap contract
Kakko
Formerly Chytil
i would as well. but if the NYR can snag Peckham it can only help.. maybe trade them a mid prospect like Bourque or something like that. Peckham would be a good edition. imagine if NYR had a dman like him in this series. rangers lack toughness on defense and clearing the crease
Depends on who's available at 7th.
That trade doesn't really help this team in the long or short run in my opinion. DZ is a proven top 4 defender and is still one of the youngest players on the team. The draft pick depending on who it is, is probably 3-4 yrs away.
That trade doesn't really help this team in the long or short run in my opinion. DZ is a proven top 4 defender and is still one of the youngest players on the team. The draft pick depending on who it is, is probably 3-4 yrs away.
LeetchisGod
This is a bad hockey team.
I am for trading del zotto if we can get a good young goal scoring winger for him. Staal, McDonagh and Moore are more than good enough to go forward with on the left side if Staal's vision recovers. In my opinion the most important abilities for an offensive d-man are skating, shooting and running a powerplay. MDZ struggles in all those areas.
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