OT: 2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part XI: The "Please make it stop" edition.

[ltrangerfan]

Interesting tweet from a few hours ago by strickland:

Andy Strickland ‏@andystrickland
#NHL players will have a chance to vote on whatever offer exists at the deadline...players give me the impression they'll vote to play

Strickland was the one who broke the richards signing two summers ago. He covers the Blues. Not saying he is always right but he has some sources.

I hope the players do come back. I can understand them holding out a bit past December as they might have been trying to get a bit more while stopping themselves against a 48 game schedule.

I might be the only oddball... but if revenues continue to grow between now and the next CBA I fail to see another owners lockout in the future (i shouldn't have made it open ended).

In the meantime, I hope the players get at least a 50-50 split. LOL

 

[Bleedred]

As a Devils fan I don't know where Lou's head was with not forfeiting the draft pick. Considering the many first round busts we've had anyway. It's pretty indefensible at this point, and most of us feel that way.

I think you'll see a stop gap in net when Marty is done in 2014, and Kinkaid or one of the prospects as a backup. I'm hoping someone like Backstrom could be a possibility or even Kiprusoff, but I think he'll finish it up with Calgary. Hope it's not someone like Theodore or Nabokov or Vokoun, but I bet you guys hope it is!

 

[Beacon]

Sure, there are good goalie prospects every year...but it takes a few years to develop them, and Marty is looking at basically 1 more season. The Devils need their next #1 now, but I guess that's their problem. Let them enjoy Wedgewood, Clermont and Kinkaid.

It would be nice if they waited until 2014 and had to forfeit a top 10 pick after not passing on #29. More than nice actually. lol

It is a mistake to draft a goalie in the first round as far as i am concerned. There is a reason nobody used to draft goalies in the top-10, wth very rare exceptions until the mid-90s. They bust at increduble rates. Goalies have more than triple the chance of going bust.

And to say that they need a goalie in a year so they should draft one is particularly wrong. Goalies take forever to develop. If a good skater normally plays from the age of 21 to 34, a good goalie plays from 24 to 38. It takes your average successful netminder 6 years post-draft to make it.

The Devils need to trade for a goalie to replace Brodeur.

 

[Bleedred]

It is a mistake to draft a goalie in the first round as far as i am concerned. There is a reason nobody used to draft goalies in the top-10, wth very rare exceptions until the mid-90s. They bust at increduble rates. Goalies have more than triple the chance of going bust.

And to say that they need a goalie in a year so they should draft one is particularly wrong. Goalies take forever to develop. If a good skater normally plays from the age of 21 to 34, a good goalie plays from 24 to 38. It takes your average successful netminder 6 years post-draft to make it.

The Devils need to trade for a goalie to replace Brodeur.

Yup they are a crapshoot. We drafted Ari Ahonen in the first round in 99, and JF Damphousse in the first round in 97. Damphousse played a few games as a backup one year, but was traded to Anaheim after Brodeur signed an extension for 5 years. He never played another NHL game again.

The closest Ahonen got to the NHL was dressing as Scott Clemmensen's backup for 2 weeks when Brodeur was injured in 05/06. Left for overseas that year right after Brodeur was given an extension. He is doing well in the KHL with the Metallurg Magnitogorsk. Probably could have gotten an NHL job if drafted by another team who gave him a chance.

 

[Beacon]

Sure, there are good goalie prospects every year...but it takes a few years to develop them, and Marty is looking at basically 1 more season. The Devils need their next #1 now, but I guess that's their problem. Let them enjoy Wedgewood, Clermont and Kinkaid.

It would be nice if they waited until 2014 and had to forfeit a top 10 pick after not passing on #29. More than nice actually. lol

Lou was clearly looking out more for his own destiny than the team's best interest. The 2012 pick is lkely to be around while Lou is still here. At least he can claim the prospect pool isnt barren. The 2014 pick will be the next GM's problem. Lou can then leave and talk about how great he did, and how the team imploded after he retired.

 

[Beacon]

Yup they are a crapshoot. We drafted Ari Ahonen in the first round in 99, and JF Damphousse in the first round in 97. Damphousse played a few games as a backup one year, but was traded to Anaheim after Brodeur signed an extension for 5 years. He never played another NHL game again.

The closest Ahonen got to the NHL was dressing as Scott Clemmensen's backup for 2 weeks when Brodeur was injured in 05/06. Left for overseas that year right after Brodeur was given an extension. He is doing well in the KHL with the Metallurg Magnitogorsk. Probably could have gotten an NHL job if drafted by another team who gave him a chance.

I never understood those two draft picks. Why waste first rounders on goalies when Bro was 25/27 and the team constantly lacked offense?

 

[Bleedred]

I never understood those two draft picks. Why waste first rounders on goalies when Bro was 25/27 and the team constantly lacked offense?

I'm sure they were in the case Brodeur left. Brodeur is the only player aside from Scott Stevens that Lou signed a whole season before they hit free agency since the 94 lockout. It seemed once he got an extension those guys started going bye bye. I think Mike Dunham was sent out after Marty's extension in 97. After his extension in 01/02 they parted ways with Dampohousse, and then when he was extended in 06 Ahonen left for Europe.

I can't complain about the picks cause we stayed successful, but not a fan of too many of our picks the last decade. We've had some surprise success in the later rounds with Fayne, and Henrique. I still think Tedenby is a bust, and Bergfors we luckily got the hell out of there for Kovy before he busted.

 

[b0mBa]

ummm did this somehow get merged with a thread from the debbies board?

 

[Bleedred]

ummm did this somehow get merged with a thread from the debbies board?

Haha come on man I just come here to talk about the lockout! Saw some stuff about the Devils, and just gave my opinion cause I thought it was stupid we didn't forfeit the pick either. I usually stay out of the Rangers related topics, and stick to the lockout thread, and OT. I like the lockout thread on here cause it's more active than ours(Insert no fans joke) and I kinda like you guys too. After all we're all fans of the game, and we all want our teams back I'd say. It's what keeps us hating each other!

 

[b0mBa]

oh **** I didn't even read back a page to notice that hahaha I actually thought there was a mistake or glitch on the boards or something....we're all hockey fans here I welcome the conversation lol

 

[b0mBa]

I'm really just hoping Bettman doesn't table a ridiculous proposal as his final offer before drop dead knowing that the players may vote on it and the players want to play and get paid....therefore leading the players to accept a deal even worse than what has been tabled recently

 

[Bleedred]

I'm really just hoping Bettman doesn't table a ridiculous proposal as his final offer before drop dead knowing that the players may vote on it and the players want to play and get paid....therefore leading the players to accept a deal even worse than what has been tabled recently

I don't know what's gonna happen. I'm worried about them both. Still 55/45 we have a season in my opinion. That hasn't went up or down for me in the last week at all either. I expected another blowup. Not sure if you consider the last two days a blowup. They were still meeting with the mediator. However many people think Fehr's plan was to take this to court. I'm not sure, but it's in the back of my mind as a possibility.

This lockout to me is an anything goes for me. It's gotten stupider the further it's gone on.

 

[Doctyl]

so if the full season is lost bettman is likely losing his job right?

 

[Bleedred]

so if the full season is lost bettman is likely losing his job right?

With how weird this lockout has been I wouldn't be shocked to see him step down. The owners won't can him though, but I can see him stepping down. When I say I can see him stepping down I mean there's like a couple percent chance. Not likely, but this lockout is so weird who knows? I said there was a chance of this a few months ago if we lose a whole season again. Don't think it will happen though. I wouldn't faint in shock if it did though.

 

[Doctyl]

With how weird this lockout has been I wouldn't be shocked to see him step down. The owners won't can him though, but I can see him stepping down. When I say I can see him stepping down I mean there's like a couple percent chance. Not likely, but this lockout is so weird who knows? I said there was a chance of this a few months ago if we lose a whole season again. Don't think it will happen though. I wouldn't faint in shock if it did though.

if we lose the whole season the only potentially good thing to come out of it would be GB either stepping down or getting canned. its insane that this whole lockout is what 8 "poor" billionaires mad about losing money on their hockey team and want the teams which actually save their ***** to be punished for it. a 60 mill cap puts the majority of teams in cap hell, how is that good for the league at all, if anything its punishing the not so ****** owners who actually want to try and be a little competitive these meetings should have a balanced poor to rich team owner ratio.

 

[BBKers]

The difference is zero dollars. The revenue cut is set. 50%. $0 over 10 years. Divide by 30 is $0. The cap they are fighting over is for 1 season. Not ten. And still, $0 dollars difference.

They are in fact fighting over the ability of a team to have the right to spend an extra $5m, next season only, to help transition. Not an obligation to spend, and remember, if that extra cap takes too much from revenue, the players return anything over 50%. Hence, a $0 difference. The players want to stay in the city they signed in. Keep a team somewhat in tact. Big teams want to keep their well designed team together. Small markets want an unmolested crack at some top talent.

We are close, this wont stop a season. Unfollow that clown.

You are very right here. Especially on the bolded part. This I heard from an NHL guy a week ago that was quite irritated over this situation.

Unfollow? Hey - I follow all the freaks. Even Eklund. Provides comedy. How many official "twitterers" have not been off throughout this process? It is kind of amusing nonetheless.

Drop the puck...

 

[Oak]

No real news/surprise there.

Other tweets from today:

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger
Longtime NY Rangers season ticket holder stopped by 47th + 6th to chat. Says she will cancel on Monday without clear sign of agreement.

Lol I wonder how many people are actually going to do this. I bet 99% are bluffing.

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

Lol I wonder how many people are actually going to do this. I bet 99% are bluffing.

My 2 cousins are, they're really pissed.

 

[BBKers]

Bored...

Hmmm, getting real bored waiting for the next WJC game USA-Sweden.
Taste this one!

NEW CBA + 2013 season

• There is a 48 game 2013 season
• Say the 2013/2014 cap gets settled at $63,5M
• 2 compliance buyouts are allowed. One this year. One within the entire CBA.
• 7 year maximum UFA deal with 20% variance

• We resign MDZ ($2,5) as RFA
• We buyout Wade Redden
• We sign Vinny L (who is bought out by Tampa) as a one year FA - at whatever cost within the $70,2M cap
• The Anaheim "twins" have a rough final year out in California - mostly out of disparity...
• Playoffs are great - where Hank, Gaborik, Vinny L & Richards come up big to win The NYR The asterix tainted 2013 Cup

At the 2013 draft
M. Gaborik, T. Pyatt + NYRs 2nd (2013) and a 3rd rounder (2014) are traded to Anaheim for Beauchemin + one of the keepers D. Delauriers/J. Gibson and a 1st rounder (2014)
Anton Stralman is sent to Detroit for a 3rd/4th rounder (2013) + mid level prospect

UFA
Buyout Brad Richards
Sign Ryan Getzlaf + Corey Perry at cap hits at $6M each respectively for 7 years (front loaded)
Waive Arron Asham

We resign our RFAs in Stepan ($2,8 M), Hagelin ($2M) + McD ($3,8)
Sauer (unfortunately) retires
We promote Lindberg, Miller, Hrivik and McIllraith

• NOT TOTALLY A "DISMANTLED" NYR TEAM
• GETZLAF/PERRY > GABORIK/RICHARDS IMO - AT LEAST LONG TERM
• ADRESSES RFAs, SALARY CAP & PROSPECT WEAKNESSES (especially with an hypothetical Anaheim 1st in 2014)
• PROBABLY NOT TOTALLY A REALISTIC PROPOSAL EITHER....

FORWARDS
Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Ryan Getzlaff ($6.000m) / Corey Perry ($6.000m)
Chris Kreider ($1.325m) / Derek Stepan ($2.800m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.000m) / Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Marek Hrivik ($0.685m)
Mike Rupp ($1.500m) / Oscar Lindberg ($0.760m) / J.T. Miller ($1.244m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m)

DEFENSEMEN
Ryan McDonaugh ($3.800m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Francois Beauchemin ($3.500m)
Michael Del Zotto ($2.500m) / Dylan McIlrath ($1.295m)
Stu Bickel ($0.750m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Martin Biron ($1.300m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $63,500,000
CAP PAYROLL: $64,009,167
BONUSES: $1,117,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $608,333

Comments:

• Perry/Getzlaf will IMO most likely wind up in Toronto. Burke has been patiently waiting for this and has plenty of ca$h available.
• Not sure Anaheim touches that proposed deal either (They stand to lose Perry, Getzlaf AND Selänne all at once though so a 40 goal guy like Gaborik could come in handy for them...).
• Not really a fan of Beauchemin either, but we would likely have to take some salary back... If not - sign Douglas Murray as a UFA instead. Him & Big Mac both on the blueline in NYC = pain!
• We need a solid keeper in the pipeline...
• Hmmm, just drop the puck

FLAME AWAY...

 

[Lion Hound]

Lol I wonder how many people are actually going to do this. I bet 99% are bluffing.

Can't speak for others however...Im done, so is my brother. 22years at MSG.

Not saying I won't ever go to a game, or won't watch. Just won't spend my money there on seasons.

 

[Vitto79]

Woah fantasy land roster This lockout is killing me too but lets not get too crazy here. If the cap goes down to say 63 million the Rangers should be fine.

I figure they have a few options. Why not see what they can get for Gaborik? If its a ton then get a bunch of young cheaper players in. I also could see Gabby stay and they move Staal for a ton out of Carolina

 

[BBKers]

Woah fantasy land roster This lockout is killing me too but lets not get too crazy here. If the cap goes down to say 63 million the Rangers should be fine.

I figure they have a few options. Why not see what they can get for Gaborik? If its a ton then get a bunch of young cheaper players in. I also could see Gabby stay and they move Staal for a ton out of Carolina

Hey, its after 12 noon over here. Fermented grapes have made their appearance already

 

[RangerBoy]

Rangers will be operating with $7.5M in bad cap $ in 13. Redden and Drury. $5.875M for Redden. $1.667M for Drury. They still need to get DZ under contract. Close to $4M per in a long term deal. DZ is months away from arbitration with a one year deal. Carlson contract. Subban is also unsigned.

 

[BBKers]

Rangers will be operating with $7.5M in bad cap $ in 13. Redden and Drury. $5.875M for Redden. $1.667M for Drury. They still need to get DZ under contract. Close to $4M per in a long term deal. DZ is months away from arbitration with a one year deal. Carlson contract. Subban is also unsigned.

Don´t you think Sather gives MDZ around $2,5 for two years? The lowering of the cap next year - if it goes down between $7,5-$10M as expected - will mean he needs a transition to bridge over this big drop and MDZ is most likely part of that with a shorter contract. We will see...

 

[Tawnos]

Rangers will be operating with $7.5M in bad cap $ in 13. Redden and Drury. $5.875M for Redden. $1.667M for Drury. They still need to get DZ under contract. Close to $4M per in a long term deal. DZ is months away from arbitration with a one year deal. Carlson contract. Subban is also unsigned.

Del Zotto is not getting the Carlson contract. Not even in arbitration