OT: 113th Obsequious Banter Thread: 1 of 13, a baker's dozen

[Lindberg]

This is the reality. Obesity is a word we invented (like all the other words). It means something to us in the context of our present era of human civilization. Traits that evolved in our ancestors thousands, tens of thousands, years ago aren't as useful now as they were when those ancestors were hunting mammoths or migrating long distances in search of "greener pastures".

Sugary snacks use to be very difficult to come by.

My dad told me not too long ago that my neighbors across the street would routinely come home with two boxes of krispy kreme donuts. Apparently it didn't take longer than about two days for those boxes to be gone.

Both parents died around ~55ish.

People routinely make these bad choices. Let's not glorify or play up their bodies.

 

[Embiid]

Humans have always been predisposed to gaining weight. The difference is the environment in which we operate in has changed. For almost all of human history we've existed in an environment in which food wasn't readily available in such mass quantities. Our bodies haven't adapted to that so the ability to put on weight has always been there.

Basically agree. The definition of food has been warped like Lizzo's body too. We've got fake food with additives, processing, hormones, antibiotics etc etc. A paleo man would probably have such an adverse reaction if it ingested modern "food."

For perspective, back in the day Ben Franklin's corpulant bod was attractive because it signified wealth and abundance. Rubenesque nudes were glorified in art...etc etc

 

[Lindberg]

It's not worth arguing with you because your just quoting lazy opinions that aren't fact based. You aren't going to change your mind, even if you are wrong.

What are people stealing in a Panera? Are they stealing Baguettes? What is the average cost of a meal in Panera vs a Dollar Menu? If your working at minimum wage with raising rent, food costs, child care costs, single income home, dependent on government assistance, your likely going to go for the dollar menu every time. Panera/Trader Joes won't go into a community where they aren't going to make money. Lower income markets tend to be racially diverse communities.

Trader Joes is filled with wine, sugary snacks, and frozen food.

How much is a 10 pound bag of rice? How much is a pound of black beans? Rice and black beans is a significantly better diet than whatever crap is found on the dollar menu. Add some tortillas and you can have a cheap bean burrito.

I can make some black bean tacos in under 10 minutes.

I can make a nice breakfast sandwich cheaper than whatever garbage is found in 7/11.

Almost all raw ingredients aren't that expensive. Throw in just a bit of modern convenience (refrigerator, rice cooker) and it's not hard to make some decent meals if you plan things out. Most people just don't have any interest in doing so.

People love eating meat and that's the problem. Preparing and cooking meats takes a significantly longer time than a quick vegetarian meat. I certainly agree that a hamburger from McDonalds looks a lot more appetizing than a home made salad to most people.

 

[Embiid]

Back to Lizzo

Lizzo Record Sales, Streaming, Airplay Collapse in One Day After Harassment Scandal Breaks Wide: Career Crisis - Showbiz411

It’s been about 48 hours since news of pop star Lizzo’s scandals broke wide. She’s being sued by former dancers for misconduct and harassment. Others who worked with her are backing these people up and now more allegations are coming out. The result is a career collapse for Lizzo. In those two...

www.showbiz411.com

 

[Lindberg]

Basically agree. The definition of food has been warped like Lizzo's body too. We've got fake food with additives, processing, hormones, antibiotics etc etc. A paleo man would probably have such an adverse reaction if it ingested modern "food."

For perspective, back in the day Ben Franklin's corpulant bod was attractive because it signified wealth and abundance. Rubenesque nudes were glorified in art...etc etc

Ben Franklin today is about the size of the average beer gut man.

Now we have people rolling around in motorized scooters because they are too lazy to do anything about it.

 

[Embiid]

Ben Franklin today is about the size of the average beer gut man.

Now we have people rolling around in motorized scooters because they are too lazy to do anything about it.

Dunno...Franklin looked pretty large and in charge but he was still a ladies man. He was a nudist too so he liked to flaunt it..

 

[Danko]

Trader Joes is filled with wine, sugary snacks, and frozen food.

How much is a 10 pound bag of rice? How much is a pound of black beans? Rice and black beans is a significantly better diet than whatever crap is found on the dollar menu. Add some tortillas and you can have a cheap bean burrito.

I can make some black bean tacos in under 10 minutes.

I can make a nice breakfast sandwich cheaper than whatever garbage is found in 7/11.

Almost all raw ingredients aren't that expensive. Throw in just a bit of modern convenience (refrigerator, rice cooker) and it's not hard to make some decent meals if you plan things out. Most people just don't have any interest in doing so.

People love eating meat and that's the problem. Preparing and cooking meats takes a significantly longer time than a quick vegetarian meat. I certainly agree that a hamburger from McDonalds looks a lot more appetizing than a home made salad to most people.

A Dollar General isn't going to have anywhere close to the healthy food options as a whole foods, trader joes, or fresh grocer. That's my argument...How much is a bag of apples? How much is an already prepared warm cheeseburger from McDonalds. How far is the closest grocery store to me vs a chinese store/ dollar store/ mcdonalds on every other corner within walking distance to my home.

There is a whole science behind this (multiple actually) which was my original argument it's not as black and white as you think. The factors you mention, sure i agree with some of them like i said...you are right its not that hard to make a healthy meal, but how hard is it to get to a grocery store that may have healthier foods for someone who doesn't have the same advantages as you do. Especially folks that do shift work.

 

[Embiid]

Trader Joes is filled with wine, sugary snacks, and frozen food.

How much is a 10 pound bag of rice? How much is a pound of black beans? Rice and black beans is a significantly better diet than whatever crap is found on the dollar menu. Add some tortillas and you can have a cheap bean burrito.

I can make some black bean tacos in under 10 minutes.

I can make a nice breakfast sandwich cheaper than whatever garbage is found in 7/11.

Almost all raw ingredients aren't that expensive. Throw in just a bit of modern convenience (refrigerator, rice cooker) and it's not hard to make some decent meals if you plan things out. Most people just don't have any interest in doing so.

People love eating meat and that's the problem. Preparing and cooking meats takes a significantly longer time than a quick vegetarian meat. I certainly agree that a hamburger from McDonalds looks a lot more appetizing than a home made salad to most people.

I'm a TJ shopper but yeah they have loads of unhealthy products. Their frozen food section is a diabetic haven. Shit packed with tons of sodium and preservatives. Still love the place though....decent prices too. They do have a ton of snacks. I mean we'll never see our corporate foodstores sell products like seaweed as main staple items. Those Korean H Marts are good though for veggies etc.

 

[Danko]

I'm a TJ shopper but yeah they have loads of unhealthy products. Their frozen food section is a diabetic haven. Shit packed with tons of sodium and preservatives. Still love the place though....decent prices too. They do have a ton of snacks. I mean we'll never see our corporate foodstores sell products like seaweed as main staple items. Those Korean H Marts are good though for veggies etc.

They also have fresh organic fruit and veggies, and healthier food options then candy bars, chips, salsbury steak and frozen burritos at a dollar general. But then - low income families tend to focus on foods that won't go bad, satisfy taste and that they will eat with no waste. Also the cost of organic fruit and veggies.

 

[Lindberg]

A Dollar General isn't going to have anywhere close to the healthy food options as a whole foods, trader joes, or fresh grocer. That's my argument...How much is a bag of apples? How much is an already prepared warm cheeseburger from McDonalds. How far is the closest grocery store to me vs a chinese store/ dollar store/ mcdonalds on every other corner within walking distance to my home.

There is a whole science behind this (multiple actually) which was my original argument it's not as black and white as you think. The factors you mention, sure i agree with some of them like i said...you are right its not that hard to make a healthy meal, but how hard is it to get to a grocery store that may have healthier foods for someone who doesn't have the same advantages as you do. Especially folks that do shift work.

It's far easier for some researcher to look at income / food desert / and such to make those statements. It's more or less a death sentence publicly to shame people at this point by stating "you need to make better choices".

A warm cheeseburger is about 1.25 or so (after tax). I can't imagine all they are buying is just a cheeseburger though. A bag of apples is probably ~5 dollars, but you wouldn't and shouldn't just eat that bag. High frutose corn syrup increases insulin resistance which makes you think you are still hungry as well.

I find it extremely hard to believe that any poor person doesn't have any access to a car to go to the grocery store once a week.

The government gives people free money to buy food with. Often times they make the wrong choices with that money.

Lots of problems exist in society because people don't want to take accountability but that's not a narrative that is popular or one that'll make you money.

Hell here's a novel solution. Eat less. People throughout history you use to just not eat because food wasn't available. You really need less calories than you think to live.

 

[Embiid]

They also have fresh organic fruit and veggies, and healthier food options then candy bars, chips, salsbury steak and frozen burritos at a dollar general. But then - low income families tend to focus on foods that won't go bad, satisfy taste and that they will eat with no waste. Also the cost of organic fruit and veggies.

Agree but I think product share is dwarfed by the unhealthy stuff.

 

[Danko]

nevermind

 

[Embiid]

Back to Aliens..

UFOs had their day in Congress. One strange sighting came at this California launch site

A red square the size of a football field hovered over Vandenberg Air Force Base in 2003, a former Navy pilot testified last week in Congress.

www.latimes.com

 

[Cody Webster]

Damn, consider me extremely jealous. Worth every penny.

Right now I would say I am 50% excited and 50% feeling guilty. I'm sure that'll change in the next few weeks. Which way, I am not too sure lol

I did get the flight insurance just in case though

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Ben Franklin today is about the size of the average beer gut man.

Now we have people rolling around in motorized scooters because they are too lazy to do anything about it.

Yes because all fat people are lazy. GTFO

 

[Lindberg]

Yes because all fat people are lazy. GTFO

Did i say all ? Please point to where I said that.

I said most fat people are lazy and make poor choices. People want self justification for making those poor choices to feel good about themselves. (i.e. Lizzo)

 

[Danko]

Did i say all ? Please point to where I said that.

I said most fat people are lazy and make poor choices. People want self justification for making those poor choices to feel good about themselves. (i.e. Lizzo)

You can take out Fat and it would still be the same....most people are lazy and make poor choices. I know some skinny people who are far far unhealthier then any fat person i know.

 

[Lindberg]

You can take out Fat and it would still be the same....most people are lazy and make poor choices. I know some skinny people who are far far unhealthier then any fat person i know.

Small sample set and you need to dispose statistical outliers from any data set.

As a whole if you average out the population of healthy vs unhealthy people it'll be obvious of what their diet and exercise routines are. In reality exercising is of little importance if the diet is way out of whack.

 

[Embiid]

Small sample set and you need to dispose statistical outliers from any data set.

As a whole if you average out the population of healthy vs human people it'll be obvious of what their diet and exercise routines are. In reality exercising is of little importance if the diet is way out of whack.

Exercise especially after a certain age (middle age) has negligible impact in weight loss if your diet is poor for sure...still better to have an exercise regimen though. 30 mins of activity like walking is good..

 

[Lord Defect]

Not exactly true...40-70%

Obesity and Genetics: What Is The Connection?

Is obesity genetic? Do our genes determine if we’ll have a healthy body weight or not? Explore the role of genetics in the obesity epidemic.

obesitymedicine.org

That’s an insanely large variation of %’s

@Lindberg I wanted to address is that I disagree with your Food Deserts take that it is due to people in those communities stealing. Sure there is stealing occuring, but that happens everywhere. It also is directly tied to Systemic Racism, Low Income, Criminal Justice and a myriad of other problems that keep generations of people in communities that are less likely to have a Wholefoods, Trader Joes, Butcher Shop, Produce Stand, Salad Works/Panera then they are a McDonalds, Chinese Food, 7/11. It's not as black and white as your painting it to be at all. The system is designed to keep these people in those low income communities and no decent resteraunt is going to go to a place where they can't sell a $25 healthy well prepared dinner.

I agree with what you are saying about Big is Beautiful or Healthy or whatever, I agree it's not healthy and should not be presented as such. I just don't necessarily agree with several of the statements your making, blanket covering groups of people, or symptoms of the current state of the world. People are more stressed out, depressed, and have mental health issues then ever before, I know from experience...


Another thing that i forgot to mention in terms of genetics...you also have to consider that young people are growing up seeing this in generations of there families...they learn eating habits from parents, grandparents, siblings, friends in communities...it's almost not a choice when you are learning so young how to eat and develop these habits.

Eating habits are habits not genetics

 

[Appleyard]

Education is ultimately the key (having worked on several projects from the EU alongside the WHO etc focused on tackling the current health crisis).

So many people don't know anything about food, calories, what is healthy and what is not... heck, a lot of people who think they do don't either! And when people are educated they generally make better choices.

Food education and cooking classes should really be embedded in every school.

Still... there are serious issues once poverty rears its head in relation to being actually able to provide a healthy diet while also getting a calorie intake that will actually fuel you. Education and some good cooking skills can help that... BUT at the same time? You then have time constraints that come into view. So many families NEED to have both parents working (or the sole parent working) and taking 1 hour to prepare dinner is sometimes not an option even if you can.

And ofc food prices over the last few years have got ridiculous world-wide.

Even as someone who had a multiple year, free, education on an Olympic programme on diet etc and has cooked since I was maybe ~11 years old? And cooks probably ~680 of my 730 meals a year? And has a pretty good salary?

Some days I get ingredients for something that really should be semi-inexpensive and healthy, and just balk at the fact that unless have things in stock already it can be cheaper to go and get a takeaway!

And circling back... then? If a child has a poor diet by the time they hit teenage years (or even earlier in some studies)? Well bodies do adapt and store more fat etc... and then it is harder as an adult to be "healthier". Which is not impossible to overcome ofc, and many do, but makes things harder through really no fault of their own, but their parents choices and education.

It is a multi-faceted issue.

 

[Danko]

Eating habits are habits not genetics

Correct, what im saying is that regardless of genetics or not, if your parents/grandparents are all obese and eating certain foods, when you are a child and are eating those same foods thats informs and creates your primary food relationship and influences the foods you eat.

 

[Embiid]

That’s an insanely large variation of %’s


Eating habits are habits not genetics

Some measured perspective on genetic influence....

Obesity

Definition and Overview The World Health Organization (WHO) defines overweight and obesity as having “excessive fat accumulation that presents a risk to health.” There are various methods to calcul…

www.hsph.harvard.edu

 

[Danko]

My original thought that i wanted to pass along is that its not as simple as well most fat people are lazy and are just choosing to be fat and eat poorly...it is a more complex issue that has many causes and effects including sociological, and psychological. The statement in itself is lazy.

 

[Embiid]

Education is ultimately the key (having worked on several projects from the EU alongside the WHO etc focused on tackling the current health crisis).

So many people don't know anything about food, calories, what is healthy and what is not... heck, a lot of people who think they do don't either! And when people are educated they generally make better choices.

Food education and cooking classes should really be embedded in every school.

Still... there are serious issues once poverty rears its head in relation to being actually able to provide a healthy diet while also getting a calorie intake that will actually fuel you. Education and some good cooking skills can help that... BUT at the same time? You then have time constraints that come into view. So many families NEED to have both parents working (or the sole parent working) and taking 1 hour to prepare dinner is sometimes not an option even if you can.

And ofc food prices over the last few years have got ridiculous world-wide.

Even as someone who had a multiple year, free, education on an Olympic programme on diet etc and has cooked since I was maybe ~11 years old? And cooks probably ~680 of my 730 meals a year? And has a pretty good salary?

Some days I get ingredients for something that really should be semi-inexpensive and healthy, and just balk at the fact that unless have things in stock already it can be cheaper to go and get a takeaway!

And then? If a child has a poor diet by the time they hit teenage years (or even earlier in some studies)? Well bodies do adapt and store more fat etc... and then it is harder as an adult to be "healthier". Which is not impossible to overcome ofc, and many do, but makes things harder through really no fault of their own, but their parents choices and education.

It is a multi-faceted issue.

Good luck in this individualistic anti-intellectual, counter-enlightenment society approaching diet and nutrition in a societal way like Japan which is homogeneous. Look at the reaction of the usual suspects to legislation on promoting healthier diets in school lunches. Cries of the nanny state and don't tread on my kid eating cheeseburgers has been the predictable response. Same people though that want the nanny state to ban books and reproductive health education....

Idiocracy....