Confirmed with Link: Zibanejad, 2nd to NYR for Brassard, 7th

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Not the smallest that would be Winnipeg then Edmonton Buffalo Columbus.

Then Ottawa?

He said one of the smallest, and it clearly is.

 

[Canadian Time]

This was a good trade, I like it. This trade was about mixing up the culture and adding a piece that will have a big personality on and off the ice. I'm looking forward to seeing who Brass meshes with, there are many options and it could pay dividends in improving other players' performance.

Good luck Zib, wish you well but I do think the Sens have taken a step forward here.

 

[BloodRedArmy]

Zibby is young enough to make the switch to RW and unlike Fisher, isn't strong enough defensively to stop a coach from making the change.

The positive with our 3 small centers is that they have all had some pretty big postseason performances. Almost Briere-like performances in some cases.

Brassard is 6'1", 205 lbs. Not huge, but definitely not small.
Turris is 6'1", 190 lbs. Smaller, but still decently sized.

 

[Sens Vader]

I would say we have 4 small centers. But its whatever

 

[Langdon Alger]

I would say we have 4 small centers. But its whatever

3 of them are 6 feet or taller. We don't have anyone taller than 6'1, but that's ok.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I would say we have 4 small centers. But its whatever

They're not big, but they're not small. Besides, the biggest center they had last year played like the smallest.

 

[Super Cake]

Sucks that we had to give up a 2nd.

 

[Icelevel]

I would say we have 4 small centers. But its whatever

For now. Paul, brown, white are good sizes. We will a least have bigger options soon enough

 

[Do Make Say Think]

We are not small down the middle. Turris may not be large but he's tough, same with Brassard.

 

[Knave]

We have Pageau. I'm not worried about heart and toughness.

Brassard and Turris are big enough.

 

[Hale The Villain]

This deal looks so bad in the long term.

Brassard is 6 years older than Zibanejad. He's the same age as Ryan. While Zibanejad is young and still has plenty of developing to do, Brassard is what he is at this stage in his career. Assuming Brassard remains the 60 point threat he has been the past two seasons, and not the 40-50 point guy he was the rest of his career, he's still not that much better than Zibanejad is right now. Zib just broke the 50 point mark this season, having come close with 46 points last season. Anyone who watches him knows that he has the potential to be better. He still has not learned to use his size to his advantage, he is still not using his great shot enough, and he has yet to get in good enough shape to produce consistently throughout the season. There's definite room for improvement in his game, which is to be expected from a player drafted as basically a raw set of elite tools. While I think he got a bit lucky accruing points this season, there's no question he's a 40-50 point guy with the potential to become the 60 point threat that Brassard is now. And of course points aren't everything. Zibanejad is better defensively and bigger.

The main objection I have to this deal is that I don't think it's likely we re-sign both Turris and Brassard long-term. We're a budget team and probably can't afford to give them both 5-7M a season on long-term deals, especially considering the young depth we have at the center position. Given that Turris is younger and better than Brassard, it seems likely that he'd be the better choice to re-sign long-term.

Even if we re-sign Brassard when his contract is up, we're talking about giving a 32 year old offensive-minded center 5-6M a season on a long-term contract to center the team's 3rd line. With Turris, Brown, White and Pageau in the organization, a Derick Brassard entering his mid-30s probably isn't going to be a top 2 center on this hockey team. Zibanejad, as a young cost-controlled asset, was a safe bet to be on this team long-term at a stomach-able salary. As a 6-2, 220lb two-way center, he is also a better fit to center a 3rd line than the offensive-minded Brassard. While Brassard helps more in the short-term, Zibanejad would have helped the team in the short-term and more in the long-term.

So if we aren't going to re-sign Brassard (or even worse, Turris), the deal amounts to 3 years of Brassard in exchange for 5-10 years of Zibanejad and a 2nd round pick. That's absolutely horrid asset management. Just giving away assets in exchange for a minor improvement in the short-term, which is itself isn't worth much, given that we aren't going to win a cup in the next 3 seasons anyways.

Dorion has really crapped the bed in his first off-season. Not a great start for Murray's protege.

 

[RedWhiteBlackGold]

So if we aren't going to re-sign Brassard (or even worse, Turris), the deal amounts to 3 years of Brassard in exchange for 5-10 years of Zibanejad and a 2nd round pick. That's absolutely horrid asset management. Just giving away assets in exchange for a minor improvement in the short-term, which is itself isn't worth much, given that we aren't going to win a cup in the next 3 seasons anyways.

Dorion has really crapped the bed in his first off-season. Not a great start for Murray's protege.

Zibby might become better than Brassard, but the team wants to make the playoffs now, not in 5-10 years. I doubt Karlsson waits 5 more years for players to develop to be a consistent playoff contender. The 2nd pick sucks but that's on Melnyk trying to save anyway he can. It is a business afterall, money out needs to bring money in. Playoffs brings him money.

 

[trentmccleary]

This deal looks so bad in the long term.

Brassard is 6 years older than Zibanejad. He's the same age as Ryan. While Zibanejad is young and still has plenty of developing to do, Brassard is what he is at this stage in his career. Assuming Brassard remains the 60 point threat he has been the past two seasons, and not the 40-50 point guy he was the rest of his career, he's still not that much better than Zibanejad is right now. Zib just broke the 50 point mark this season, having come close with 46 points last season. Anyone who watches him knows that he has the potential to be better. He still has not learned to use his size to his advantage, he is still not using his great shot enough, and he has yet to get in good enough shape to produce consistently throughout the season. There's definite room for improvement in his game, which is to be expected from a player drafted as basically a raw set of elite tools. While I think he got a bit lucky accruing points this season, there's no question he's a 40-50 point guy with the potential to become the 60 point threat that Brassard is now. And of course points aren't everything. Zibanejad is better defensively and bigger.

The main objection I have to this deal is that I don't think it's likely we re-sign both Turris and Brassard long-term. We're a budget team and probably can't afford to give them both 5-7M a season on long-term deals, especially considering the young depth we have at the center position. Given that Turris is younger and better than Brassard, it seems likely that he'd be the better choice to re-sign long-term.

Even if we re-sign Brassard when his contract is up, we're talking about giving a 32 year old offensive-minded center 5-6M a season on a long-term contract to center the team's 3rd line. With Turris, Brown, White and Pageau in the organization, a Derick Brassard entering his mid-30s probably isn't going to be a top 2 center on this hockey team. Zibanejad, as a young cost-controlled asset, was a safe bet to be on this team long-term at a stomach-able salary. As a 6-2, 220lb two-way center, he is also a better fit to center a 3rd line than the offensive-minded Brassard. While Brassard helps more in the short-term, Zibanejad would have helped the team in the short-term and more in the long-term.

So if we aren't going to re-sign Brassard (or even worse, Turris), the deal amounts to 3 years of Brassard in exchange for 5-10 years of Zibanejad and a 2nd round pick. That's absolutely horrid asset management. Just giving away assets in exchange for a minor improvement in the short-term, which is itself isn't worth much, given that we aren't going to win a cup in the next 3 seasons anyways.

Dorion has really crapped the bed in his first off-season. Not a great start for Murray's protege.

Brassard will make $10M over the next 3 seasons and become a UFA.
Zibanejad will make $3.25 this season, become an RFA (possibly looking for $5M+ per year) and can became a UFA at the same time as Brassard.

So Zibanejad will probably cost $4M more over the next 3 seasons, Brassard will be the better player for most of it and then they both become UFA's at the same time.

 

[Philadelphia Collins]

Sucks that we had to give up a 2nd.

Really smart move by Gorton, though. Getting Dorion to agree to add a 2nd rounder to pay the $2mil signing bonus that Melnyk probably couldn't afford

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

We are not small down the middle. Turris may not be large but he's tough, same with Brassard.

Turris might be tough, but he's not a physical player. It's nice to have that element. Hopefully Brassard brings it a little bit. Pageau will, but we don't want him to break down young.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Brassard will make $10M over the next 3 seasons and become a UFA.
Zibanejad will make $3.25 this season, become an RFA (possibly looking for $5M+ per year) and can became a UFA at the same time as Brassard.

So Zibanejad will probably cost $4M more over the next 3 seasons, Brassard will be the better player for most of it and then they both become UFA's at the same time.

Zibanejad won't make 5M a season on his next deal. He's an RFA, not a UFA. He has very little negotiating power. If he has another 40-50 point season in 2016/17 he'll get a 4-6 year deal for around 4M per season, just like other comparable young centers like Kadri, Bjugstad, Henrique.

Sens would have given him a back-loaded contract like they have given every young RFA in the organization. While the average would be around 4M, the salary paid in 2017/18 and 2018/19 would be much less. Probably about the same or less than Brassard makes (3.5M) in those years.

Also why you think we'd sign Zibanejad to a 2 year deal and why we'd ever put ourselves in a situation to lose him to UFA without getting many years out of him, is beyond me. If we had kept Zibanejad we could have signed him for 5+ years, which is a lot more valuable than 3 years of Brassard.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Zibby might become better than Brassard, but the team wants to make the playoffs now, not in 5-10 years. I doubt Karlsson waits 5 more years for players to develop to be a consistent playoff contender. The 2nd pick sucks but that's on Melnyk trying to save anyway he can. It is a business afterall, money out needs to bring money in. Playoffs brings him money.

The difference between Brassard and Zibanejad is probably not the difference between playoffs and no-playoffs. If the team really is so close to the playoffs for a minor addition like that to matter, it would have been better to sign a player on free agency at the cost of zero assets, instead of trading away to valuable pieces in Zib and a 2nd.

Unless we win the cup in the next 3 seasons, with Brassard playing a major role in that win, this trade was a major loss. 5-10 years of Zibanejad + 2nd > 3 years of Brassard.

 

[Sens Vader]

We are not small down the middle. Turris may not be large but he's tough, same with Brassard.

I think the average NHL player is like 6'1 and 203lbs or something like that. Three of our centers are smaller than that average....like I said I dont think it matters much, especially since they are 'competitive'.

But I would classify our current center group as small, not midgets but below average weight/size.

The difference between Brassard and Zibanejad is probably not the difference between playoffs and no-playoffs. If the team really is so close to the playoffs for a minor addition like that to matter, it would have been better to sign a player on free agency at the cost of zero assets, instead of trading away to valuable pieces in Zib and a 2nd.

Unless we win the cup in the next 3 seasons, with Brassard playing a major role in that win, this trade was a major loss. 5-10 years of Zibanejad + 2nd > 3 years of Brassard.

I agree with this, imo this trade means we have to contend within the next three years. Dorion better roll up his sleeves cuz there is more work to get done.

 

[HSF]

The difference between Brassard and Zibanejad is probably not the difference between playoffs and no-playoffs. If the team really is so close to the playoffs for a minor addition like that to matter, it would have been better to sign a player on free agency at the cost of zero assets, instead of trading away to valuable pieces in Zib and a 2nd.

Unless we win the cup in the next 3 seasons, with Brassard playing a major role in that win, this trade was a major loss. 5-10 years of Zibanejad + 2nd > 3 years of Brassard.

I think its definitely an improvement (other things will have to fall into place ie coaching and two way play)

We got the best player in the deal though

 

[Hale The Villain]

I think its definitely an improvement

We got the best player in the deal too

Best player sure, but for how long?

Brassard is 29
Zibanejad is 23

Decent chance Zibanejad bridges the gap in the next 3 years. After that Brassard will be 32 and probably looking for another team on July 1st, while Zibanejad will be just entering his prime at 26, and likely signed long-term.

Again unless we win the cup in the next 3 years (can't see it), this trade will be absolute highway robbery for the Rangers.

 

[Super Cake]

The difference between Brassard and Zibanejad is probably not the difference between playoffs and no-playoffs. If the team really is so close to the playoffs for a minor addition like that to matter, it would have been better to sign a player on free agency at the cost of zero assets, instead of trading away to valuable pieces in Zib and a 2nd.

Unless we win the cup in the next 3 seasons, with Brassard playing a major role in that win, this trade was a major loss. 5-10 years of Zibanejad + 2nd > 3 years of Brassard.

Melnyk won't spend the amount of money it would take to sign one of the top free agents.

The only free agents this team can afford is those of the Chris Kelly type.

This is a move that budget teams make. It saves Melnyk money in the end.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Best player sure, but for how long?

Brassard is 29
Zibanejad is 23

Decent chance Zibanejad bridges the gap in the next 3 years. After that Brassard will be 32 and probably looking for another team on July 1st, while Zibanejad will be just entering his prime at 26, and likely signed long-term.

Again unless we win the cup in the next 3 years (can't see it), this trade will be absolute highway robbery for the Rangers.

What if the Rangers do sweet **** all and we get to the third round?

Still highway robbery then?

Step back from the ledge, you are talking nonsense.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Melnyk won't spend the amount of money it would take to sign one of the top free agents.

The only free agents this team can afford is those of the Chris Kelly type.

This is a move that budget teams make. It saves Melnyk money in the end.

We don't need one of the top free agents. Only needs going into free agency were for a good bottom pairing defenseman and a cheap 4th line center or 3rd line winger.

Dorion has been hyping up the 2M we saved from getting the Rangers to pay his bonus. Went out of his way to mention that it could be used in other ways to improve the roster.

Add that 2M in "savings" (which we would have gotten anyways if had we kept Zib and his 3.25M salary) to the money we could have saved from trading Smith, a player we probably won't re-sign at the end of this season, and you get almost 4.5M. That's a lot of coin. Enough to add one impact player to the roster, and that's at the cost of zero assets. Well to be more accurate we would have saved Zib and a 2nd, and Smith probably would have returned a 2nd at least at the deadline. That's what a smart asset management GM would have done. Unfortunately Murray and his protege Dorion have no clue how to properly manage the assets of this hockey club.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Unfortunately Murray and his protege Dorion have no clue how to properly manage the assets of this hockey club.

And you do?!

 

[Hale The Villain]

What if the Rangers do sweet **** all and we get to the third round?

Still highway robbery then?

Step back from the ledge, you are talking nonsense.

Rangers are being smart by re-tooling their roster. They realize their time as contenders is up, and they got amazing value trading Brassard for a slightly worse player who's 6 years younger and is still developing + a 2nd.

The difference between Brassard and Zibanejad won't be the reason we go far in post-season. If we get to the 3rd round it won't be because of this trade. More than likely the other 20 guys on the roster and the coaching staff will be the reason if this team goes far in the playoffs.