Rumor: Zach Werenski rejected trade to Dallas with NMC

[Fatass]

Columbus would want from Dallas one of Harley, Rantanen, Hintz, Johnston, Robertson in a Werenski deal.

Dallas is in no position to weaken their forward group. Even if (hypothetically) they moved Robertson for Werenski, they'd probably have to look at moving Harley or Lindell or Oettinger to bring in a forward.

Overall I think there were only ever 2 real options for Dallas... Harley (easy) or Robertson (complicated for Dallas and we have no evidence that Columbus was interested in doing this).

Columbus needs to get back a guy with term on their contract. It’s a no for Robertson.

 

[thebestnic]

You literally just said Moser was statistically the best 5v5 defensemen in the league who's on a sweetheart contract. Why are you trading that for 2 years of Werenski?

That’s the beauty of cherry picking between traditional stats or advanced stats :p

 

[sabremike]

Not at all. It's letting management know that at the end of the contract, right now he's planning on moving on. He never made/demanded a trade.

If management/CBJ doesn't want those two contracted years of service they can look into trading him at some point. That same management is the one who gave him the NMC, which he's exercising to not have to go to somewhere he doesn't want to play in.

Now if he's nice he'll let them know a few places that he wouldn't mind playing in, just to reduce negotiation time with places he doesn't want to go to. But the trade is on them. Telling the team that at the end of the contract he's moving on is neither de factor nor de jure a trade demand, it's just letting them know that in two years they will need to make other arrangements to cover his position.

Again with the smarting and clevering and using technicalities to obfuscate plain reality...

 

[IPS]

That’s the beauty of cherry picking between traditional stats or advanced stats :p

Truly is, isn't it?

 

[BigBoss614]

Then Dallas is dumb.


Heiskanen - Lundell is a pairing you don't break.

Werenski - Harley is incredible as well.

1 A - 1 B

You're not getting Werenski without one of

Harley, Robertson or Johnson, so who are you giving up in this scenario.

Also you aren't giving up one of your top 3 players to get the reigning Norris winner who wants 25+ minutes a night..to put him on the second pairing... that's how you would lose him to FA on 2 seasons lol

 

[ShootIt]

If Im the Jackets I take Knies over Nikishin 100 out of 100 times. Canes would need to add pieces to make it happen.

Agreed.
Contract wise, the value is heavily towards Knies.
Knies is actually signed long term, on a reasonable deal.
I get wanting to get a blueline player in return, but at the same time Knies is locked up till 2031 while Nikishin is a RFA who may want a deal that leads to his first year of UFA.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

Columbus needs to get back a guy with term on their contract. It’s a no for Robertson.

In a hypothetical world where Robertson was being traded to Columbus in a Werenski deal, Robertson is signing a 4 year extension or even longer to play in Columbus.

That might not line up with real life, but in the world of hypotheticals, it's one of the options.

 

[TheBigLetowski]

If Im the Jackets I take Knies over Nikishin 100 out of 100 times. Canes would need to add pieces to make it happen.

Yeah. I am not arguing that. I meant to elaborate on the Nikishin and whatever else to CBJ.

 

[molon labe]

People are really smarting and clevering here. If you tell a team you are out the door in two seasons when your contract ends you are defacto asking for a trade. Only an idiot wouldn't know that, any of this AKSHULLY stuff being pushed is nonsense.

Those teams are the ones asking the players though. It's the trend from the teams now.

Why would players want out of those teams in the first place?

The cap shooting up is probably the biggest reason players want to hit UFA now. Used to be that extra year meant everything - now it appears to mean nothing. This will absolutely be the era of big player movement until the cap settles. Might take 5-6 seasons to get there though.

Then again, these teams could still literally have these guys for two full seasons. They don't, of course, because they know they're not going to win with them - which speaks to the team constructions over the next two seasons as much as it speaks to the players wishing to join win-now teams.

 

[bov]

I don't know if Tampa can compete with some of these packages being speculated. I would imagine that Columbus' ask begins with Moser + O'Reilly and go from there.

If I'm Tampa I'd try it for something like Moser, Paul, Geekie and a 1st or something like that, which doesn't seem as strong as what Dallas or Toronto could offer.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Yeah. I am not arguing that. I meant to elaborate on the Nikishin and whatever else to CBJ.

I dont want that at all lol. The Canes are a pain in the ass already for every team in the league. Adding Knies to that forward group would be horrible for the rest of the league.

 

[Sypher04]

To SOME extent, sure I guess?

If Moser was on the Leafs or Habs or Vegas or Edmonton, he'd get the respect he deserves.

If Columbus can get Moser plus plus for Werenski, that's great for them. Since keeping Werenski long term is no longer an option.

No debate from me that he’s a good player.
It’s not a matter of him not getting the respect he deserved. It’s just about the comparison between the two players

Everything you said in the last paragraph also applied to Knies.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

You literally just said Moser was statistically the best 5v5 defensemen in the league who's on a sweetheart contract. Why are you trading that for 2 years of Werenski?

Werenski is "better".

Meaning that he's so much better at special teams (and still good at 5v5) that it outweighs the other guy being elite at 5v5.

That's the logic. Whether the numbers back that up, IDK. I haven't checked.

 

[TheBigLetowski]

I dont want that at all lol. The Canes are a pain in the ass already for every team in the league. Adding Knies to that forward group would be horrible for the rest of the league.

fair

 

[Roshi]

People are really smarting and clevering here. If you tell a team you are out the door in two seasons when your contract ends you are defacto asking for a trade. Only an idiot wouldn't know that, any of this AKSHULLY stuff being pushed is nonsense.

Looking at it that way you have very limited options to make it a working scenario.

Smartest for me what CBJ could do is to play out season 2026-27 and see what they can do with it. Invest on free agency and look for trades to strengthen your team. If you can make the playoffs, make even more TDL/summer additions. Maybe Werenski and Marchenko change their minds when they see you are making a push and getting better. If not, you still have next season to trade them out and more options to trade Werenski for, when his contract allows more teams in the mix.

At the same time you have your next core looking closely how all of this rounds up. You have Fantilli, Lindstrom etc there, starting to move towards building a good playoffs team is something they likely will want to be involved with. You can start doing that even knowing you'll have to trade Werenski and Marchenko at some point, but atleast you show others you are here to battle, and not just to instantly fold and start another rebuild when things get tough.

This is a moment that you can take as an opportunity to start building a certain culture. Getting stuck and forcing decisions over Werenskis comment what he might do after two seasons on the road is not the culture.

 

[sabremike]

Those teams are the ones asking the players though. It's the trend from the teams now.

Why would players want out of those teams in the first place?

The cap shooting up is probably the biggest reason players want to hit UFA now. Used to be that extra year meant everything - now it appears to mean nothing. This will absolutely be the era of big player movement until the cap settles. Might take 5-6 seasons to get there though.

Then again, these teams could still literally have these guys for two full seasons. They don't, of course, because they know they're not going to win with them - which speaks to the team constructions over the next two seasons as much as it speaks to the players wishing to join win-now teams.

And then the guy literally rejected a trade to a legit cup contender...

 

[HockeyVirus]

If Chayka lands Werenski we start the statue. I will miss Knies a lot he will be a fan favorite in CBJ but we haven't had a dman this good in over 50 years you gotta make those kind of moves.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

From Toronto Its likely Knies + Danford + Hildeby + 1st + two 2nds. Id still pay it everyday of the week to get werenski.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

No debate from me that he’s a good player.
It’s not a matter of him not getting the respect he deserved. It’s just about the comparison between the two players

Everything you said in the last paragraph also applied to Knies.

Knies is a big strong 1st line complimentary winger who needs playmakers and play drivers on his line to be truly effective.

Moser is a top pairing minute munching stud who isn't complimentary and doesn't need playmakers and play drivers on his pairing to be a great defenseman. If he's paired with a guy who creates offense, it's better yeah, but he doesn't need that to be extremely effective.

Additionally, it's well known that centers and defensemen are generally more valuable to a team than wingers are.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Knies is a big strong 1st line complimentary winger who needs playmakers and play drivers on his line to be truly effective.

Moser is a top pairing minute munching stud who isn't complimentary and doesn't need playmakers and play drivers on his pairing to be a great defenseman. If he's paired with a guy who creates offense, it's better yeah, but he doesn't need that to be extremely effective.

Additionally, it's well known that centers and defensemen are generally more valuable to a team than wingers are.

So B Tkachuk or TJ Brodie.

Lol.

 

[Fatass]

If Chayka lands Werenski we start the statue. I will miss Knies a lot he will be a fan favorite in CBJ but we haven't had a dman this good in over 50 years you gotta make those kind of moves.

Knies wouldn’t be enough. Not too sure if Toronto has the pieces?

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Knies is a big strong 1st line complimentary winger who needs playmakers and play drivers on his line to be truly effective.

Moser is a top pairing minute munching stud who isn't complimentary and doesn't need playmakers and play drivers on his pairing to be a great defenseman. If he's paired with a guy who creates offense, it's better yeah, but he doesn't need that to be extremely effective.

Additionally, it's well known that centers and defensemen are generally more valuable to a team than wingers are.

It comes down to what the Jackets prefer and what their timeline is moving forward. Knies and Moser are close enough in value that it'll come down to preference regarding the jackets and what else is offered in the deal.

 

[atlanticobserver]

also all of were

Moser isn't near knies. At all. Geekie may be more valuable? But 22 years old. 1 goal and can't crack Pontus holmberg spot? Come on.

It will depend on what they want. Toronto package is better there easily. But if they need a d man back then its different I guess.

Also probably losing Marchenko?

So maybe trade him for a D. And

Knies/fantilli core to build around m

You’re crazy. Moser is an elite defensive defenseman. If you think CBJ loses their top defenseman and replaces him with a winger who won’t even play 20 minutes a game, I think you’re just talking pure value and forgetting Columbus actually has to ice a team for 84 games. I don’t see how they make any sort of trade that doesn’t bring in a viable replacement for Werenski. If he really won’t waive to play for Dallas, Moser is really the only valid option left for CBJ. I think a lot of teams could dangle a winger that produces similar to Knies. I don’t think many teams could offer a first pair LD that plays a ton of minutes and handles the best competition at an elite level.

 

[sabremike]

Those teams are the ones asking the players though. It's the trend from the teams now.

Why would players want out of those teams in the first place?

The cap shooting up is probably the biggest reason players want to hit UFA now. Used to be that extra year meant everything - now it appears to mean nothing. This will absolutely be the era of big player movement until the cap settles. Might take 5-6 seasons to get there though.

Then again, these teams could still literally have these guys for two full seasons. They don't, of course, because they know they're not going to win with them - which speaks to the team constructions over the next two seasons as much as it speaks to the players wishing to join win-now teams.

When a team's franchise player is killed by a drunk driver that's pretty tough to recover from.

 

[amnesiac]

Washington swoops in.... for Cole Hutson + two 1sts