Value of: Your goaler to the Avs

[SmoggyTwinkles]

You want Dan Vladar? He is tall. Sometimes he's really good too.

Do you mean "the" Darth Vlader?

Always wanted this guy.

But he sucks? I'm terrible at predicting prospects, and I feel like he's aged beyond prospect.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

I'd say the best option the Avs have is getting Phillip Grubauer back.

 

[Linds]

I'd say the best option the Avs have is getting Phillip Grubauer back.

Problem is his term and it's a coin flip between him and 4Giev

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Problem is his term and it's a coin flip between him and 4Giev

Goalies are so hot and cold but I'd easily take him over George. Grubauer has gotten hot in the playoffs before.

 

[Linds]

Goalies are so hot and cold but I'd easily take him over George. Grubauer has gotten hot in the playoffs before.

You would take that risk for 3 years?

 

[a mangy Meowth]

you can certainly accept poor net minders for a bottom price if that is yr choice
I said that atm, Shesty is possibly available, but he is not available for cheap, b'c Rs can still go 12.25 ish x 4 and get it done if they have to, and there are gonna be 4-ish or so bidders w/high end offers.

So any bidder needs to recognize Shesty is elite, Vezina quality, entering prime, and offer accordingly.
In case of Avs, I don't expect there is any currency acceptable other than MacKinnon.

If you don't want to go there, fine, no prob.
But it is elite for elite and it is not an insulting premise

It's insulting Bern. Cut it out.

 

[Freaky Styley]

I've said it in other places but I think Gustavsson would be a good target.

He's off to a hot start though and he's on a division rival, AND it leaves the Wild with only 1 goalie next year, but he's probably the guy that checks the most boxes (track record/cap hit) that could be available. Maybe they take Georgiev back just to keep that insurance if you could pass him through waivers.

Not sure what the Wild would be after though.

After that, Fleury and Gibson would be my choices, but there's not too much in the way of clear upgrades right now. I just want a guy who has a bit of a track record and handles pressure well.

 

[pth2]

It's tough when a team has a clear need like this, since the pressure on anyone they acquire will be huge, so if it isn't a bargain-bin purchase, it needs to be someone ready to deal with the pressure.

 

[Freaky Styley]

Avs will just run with a tandem of Kahkonen and Husso like we all knew would happen after a mere 2 games

The scary part is that doesn't sound so bad right now

 

[HuGort]

Primeau and Habs 3rd for Georgiev and AVS first?

 

[f7ben]

The ask for Gustavsson would be fairly high. He’s looked every bit like 2022 Vezina Gus so far this year.

As a Wild fan I’d much prefer we run a Gus Wally tandem this year and send Flower anywhere but the crease.

But if it’s Flower and Wally I’m ok with it. This team isn’t going anywhere until next year anyways

 

[lanceuppercut75]

Grubauer 50% retained for Georgiev.

Seattle are probably looking to buyout Grubauer next summer and that trade saves the. $1.75m in real cash compared to a buyout.

I feel like Seattle would explore options to retain for only 1 year instead of 3, or retain way less than $2.95m.

Maybe something like :

Grubauer (12% retained) 3 yrs
Borgen 1 yr (expiring)

for

Georgiev 1 yr (expiring)
Manson 2 yrs

... and then if both teams agree that Manson is better than Borgen, or visa versa, then the team recieving the superior D adds a pick or something like that.

12% Grubauer retention / $0.7m makes the trade cap neutral. I think $0.7m retention for 3 years is much mor3 palatable for Seattle as compared to $2.95m for 3 years.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

If Blomqvist keeps playing well and Jarry isn't to your liking, what about Nedelkovic? Logjam has gotta play itself out one way or the other for the Pens. There's organizational depth so we don't need a goalie back.

Avs have 5 non-ELC goalies under contract now to play NHL and AHL, which should ideally be 4 goalies. Kuemper Annunen Kahkonen Mandolese Miner. I think you would be forced to take a goalie back, as 5 is already arguably too many and 6 is definitely too many. Perhaps Colorarado would demand Pittsburgh take Mandolese to play in Wilkes-Barre, or to be re-traded to a third team.

 

[Viqsi]

you can certainly accept poor net minders for a bottom price if that is yr choice
I said that atm, Shesty is possibly available, but he is not available for cheap, b'c Rs can still go 12.25 ish x 4 and get it done if they have to, and there are gonna be 4-ish or so bidders w/high end offers.

So any bidder needs to recognize Shesty is elite, Vezina quality, entering prime, and offer accordingly.
In case of Avs, I don't expect there is any currency acceptable other than MacKinnon.

If you don't want to go there, fine, no prob.
But it is elite for elite and it is not an insulting premise

It is one hundred thousand percent an insulting premise because you are going to them and saying "you can have our goalie but we demand MacKinnon." If you have an exceptionally high price for an exceptionally important player, that's fine, but you don't hawk them on the market for that price. And you sure as hell don't start coming up with demands for other people's foundational players and going out and insisting on them from those folks.

 

[cslebn]

Sure, we can send you Elvis.

I will drive from Utah back to Columbus and then drive Elvis to Denver.

(And that drive sucks from my experience)

 

[bernmeister]

Nope. MacKinnon signs his contract after the SC win then proceeds to put up a 111 pt season in 71 games (projects to almost 130) then follows it up with 140 and hardware. His contract is already team friendly based on the Matthews and Draisaitl deals.

Rantanen is also an elite level player and in a similar situation. Weird you go at MacKinnon.

As I said, you prefer to keep yr elite, fine and understood
And you don't need to trade for an elite G if you can get one now that Ulmark is signed.
You get what you pay for/what you don't ;pay for.

And I did not prop this in a separate thread in a vacuum
I responded to OP asking for almost anyone who could help

And no apologies
from NY perspective, no MacK, no Rags
no bad vibes to you if you prefer a different avenue
peace out

....
Regardless of how valuable you think he is, a goaltender would never return a top 3 player signed for like 8 years. Just an absolute joke to think he would

This is an elite vez quality guy locked in at 5.6 this yr and you get to negotiate extension immediately before.
I am not saying 1:1 but main pieces would have to be Igor + MacK
Shoe on the other foot, you want Shesty for bupkis
And I am the one who has to get real?
Look in the mirror, physician, heal thyself

It is one hundred thousand percent an insulting premise because you are going to them and saying "you can have our goalie but we demand MacKinnon." If you have an exceptionally high price for an exceptionally important player, that's fine, but you don't hawk them on the market for that price. And you sure as hell don't start coming up with demands for other people's foundational players and going out and insisting on them from those folks.

There is a disconnect betw the underline and the bold.

Regret you feel insulted but w/elite for elite as a base = logic proves it is not lopsided, ergo, not insulting.

I have an exceptionally high price for Shesty regardless of the trade partner

and I have a right, if not an obligation, to be clear in that regard

 

[Viqsi]

I have an exceptionally high price for Shesty regardless of the trade partner

and I have a right, if not an obligation, to be clear in that regard

The way to be not insulting in that case, then, is to not be marketing Shesterkin as though he's available. Because at that kind of absurd price, he effectively isn't.

 

[The Old Master]

Avs have 5 non-ELC goalies under contract now to play NHL and AHL, which should ideally be 4 goalies. Kuemper Annunen Kahkonen Mandolese Miner. I think you would be forced to take a goalie back, as 5 is already arguably too many and 6 is definitely too many. Perhaps Colorarado would demand Pittsburgh take Mandolese to play in Wilkes-Barre, or to be re-traded to a third team.

we are having a hard time getting the goalies we have playing time. so no thanks. unless we can get a 3rd team involved.

 

[bernmeister]

The way to be not insulting in that case, then, is to not be marketing Shesterkin as though he's available. Because at that kind of absurd price, he effectively isn't.

bold: Thank you for making this distinction.
underline: you are entitled to yr opinion, but he is gonna be available as either
-- Rs trade him now
-- sign him and trade him later
we are not gonna let him walk for nothing

Multiple suitors = price being driven UP not down
he obv IS elite
elite or as close as possible to elite will be required

for the record, I see Kings and Leafs as real suitors, not Avs

 

[Squirrel in the Hole]

Georgiev always has been like this
Good and Bad spurts
From a rangers fan

As for a replacement good luck
It would be meh for meh

Husso is available. Oh, wait, same issues. Never mind

 

[Viqsi]

bold: Thank you for making this distinction.
underline: you are entitled to yr opinion, but he is gonna be available as either
-- Rs trade him now
-- sign him and trade him later
we are not gonna let him walk for nothing

Multiple suitors = price being driven UP not down
he obv IS elite
elite or as close as possible to elite will be required

for the record, I see Kings and Leafs as real suitors, not Avs

Trading him now, though, does have a negative impact on his market value, particularly since for someone like him the receiving team is going to look at the risk of him not extending and moderate their returns accordingly - folks aren't going to want to pay premium prices to take on the Rangers' risk for them. So while "trade him now" is likely on the options list for the Rangers, it's arguably a bad choice since y'all wouldn't be getting anywhere near "elite goaltender" value back. Having multiple potential suitors prevents the return from going too far down, but 1) it still goes down and 2) if y'all continue to quote an exorbitant price, you can rapidly and easily end up without ANY suitors. NYR doesn't have to sell for less than something MacKinnon-level - but if you're insistent on that point, you're committed to signing him because in all probability you won't be trading him at all and "let him walk for nothing" is obviously a nonstarter if at all possible.

Also, I can't see the Leafs as suitors because of severe cap space issues and I don't think the Kings are close enough to contention to be willing to spend like that, but that's just me.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Some of these proposals are just silly. Like there's no world where the Avs are paying a 1st for an unproven or subpar goalie. And there's no world where they are trading one of their superstars for a goalie either. The Avs will take the Vegas approach and go for medium goaltending with a strong blue line

 

[BobRossColton]

Filip Gustavsson would be a nice grab, what would be the base of the trade though?

 

[bernmeister]

Trading him now, though, does have a negative impact on his market value, particularly since for someone like him the receiving team is going to look at the risk of him not extending and moderate their returns accordingly - folks aren't going to want to pay premium prices to take on the Rangers' risk for them. So while "trade him now" is likely on the options list for the Rangers, it's arguably a bad choice since y'all wouldn't be getting anywhere near "elite goaltender" value back. Having multiple potential suitors prevents the return from going too far down, but 1) it still goes down and 2) if y'all continue to quote an exorbitant price, you can rapidly and easily end up without ANY suitors. NYR doesn't have to sell for less than something MacKinnon-level - but if you're insistent on that point, you're committed to signing him because in all probability you won't be trading him at all and "let him walk for nothing" is obviously a nonstarter if at all possible.

Also, I can't see the Leafs as suitors because of severe cap space issues and I don't think the Kings are close enough to contention to be willing to spend like that, but that's just me.

Thanks for thoughtful reply
Have to get going even tho today is a holiday, so let me leave you w/following:

There is no negative impact on his value. Why?
IF a team took him as a rental at 5.6 and taking their chances, then yes, that would drive down the price. But there is no reason for Rs/trade partner to be stupid here.
Rs give suitor full access/permission to negotiate extension first.
Then, immediately before/after the deal, Igor is extended.
We have seen this happen in other deals.

For reason of the above, price does NOT go down.

As to MacK level return, elite return is dif, like I said, for dif suitors.

for LA, I can see Byfield + Anderson for extended Shesty + Zib

for TOR I can see
Nylander + Knies + Liljigren +
for
ext Shesty + Zib + Jones +

I think Zib sees we are committed to listening to bern and selling most vets for quality youth to extend the window, and sees bread + Trouba + Lindgren + Shesty gonna be dealt, he relents IF the relocation is a comfy fit.

Remember Shesty is only 5.6 this yr
he fits immediate deals incl TOR or LA

peace out

Some of these proposals are just silly. Like there's no world where the Avs are paying a 1st for an unproven or subpar goalie. And there's no world where they are trading one of their superstars for a goalie either. The Avs will take the Vegas approach and go for medium goaltending with a strong blue line

Agreed this makes most sense.
What I said was tendered as a courtesy to OP's ?

 

[Mrfenn92]

There was a published article says Kings want to go hard after Shesterkin if he does not extend w/Rs
If that is the case then
preference is Shesty + Zib for Byfield + Anderson = ballpark cap works + fits needs

If that is not the case then we an talk
Shesty + Zib for MacKinnon + __________________
or just something around Shesty for MacK if Zib doesn't waive or Avs do not want

Howev
No MacK
no deal
backup plan is Shesty + Zib ++ for Nylander +Knies + +

Colorado isn’t trading mackinnon.
The kings and leafs say no to those deals also.