Writer and actors on STRIKE. Most main stream TV and Movies come to a stand still

[93gilmour93]

Yeah, that's what I thought.

Let’s agree to disagree….

 

[Beau Knows]

Well if the very forward-thinking government of Saudi Arabia thinks Disney has gone too far with it's progressiveness, then I think it's clear they need to rethink their policy of letting gay characters exist in their movies.

Again, this supposed to be about the strikes right?

What does complaining about gay people and black people being in your movies have to do with whether or not the ultra-wealthy studio execs should have to share their profits with the thousands of people working for them?

 

[93gilmour93]

Well if the very forward-thinking government of Saudi Arabia thinks Disney has gone too far with it's progressiveness, then I think it's clear they need to rethink their policy of letting gay characters exist in their movies.

Again, this supposed to be about the strikes right?

What does complaining about gay people and black people being in your movies have to do with whether or not the ultra-wealthy studio execs should have to share their profits with the thousands of people working for them?

It’s not about comparing values to different countries but more showing that every country views the agenda differently and money is lost because of it. Disney can make whatever movie they want but it’s disingenuous to say it has zero credibility with it being a cause for lost revenue

 

[Tawnos]

Well if the very forward-thinking government of Saudi Arabia thinks Disney has gone too far with it's progressiveness, then I think it's clear they need to rethink their policy of letting gay characters exist in their movies.

Again, this supposed to be about the strikes right?

What does complaining about gay people and black people being in your movies have to do with whether or not the ultra-wealthy studio execs should have to share their profits with the thousands of people working for them?

Just to ground this in the thread topic... someone was trying to make the point that the public isn't with the writers and actors because of their outspoken political stances, which are by and large pro-diversity, pro-inclusivity, pro-LGBTQ, pro-choice, etc which some people like to group all together under the term "woke"

I don't think it's true that the public isn't with the writers/actors in this. Some of them certainly aren't, some certainly are. I haven't seen polling anywhere.

Edit: Here's a Yougov poll from a couple of weeks ago resulting in 60% support for the actors and 58% for the writers. Predictably, Democrats are hugely in support, but even Republicans were over 40% in support.

Most Americans support strikes by Hollywood writers and actors | YouGov

By 51% to 27%, Americans overall have a favorable opinion of labor unions. More believe unions have increased their influence in the last year (23%) than say their influence has become less strong (16%).

today.yougov.com

Here's another that has the support for the actors/writers more modest (39/45), but those numbers are much higher than the support for the studios/networks/streaming services (9/8/9).

Exclusive: Survey says movie and TV fans side with striking actors and writers

A new survey says the public is behind the striking writers and actors in the Hollywood labor battle, although most won't pay more to stream shows.

www.usatoday.com

Headlines for polls across the board seem to be saying the same thing. Seems a lot like support is much greater for the actors/writers than the anti-woke crowd in this thread wants you to believe.

 

[Beau Knows]

It’s not about comparing values to different countries but more showing that every country views the agenda differently and money is lost because of it. Disney can make whatever movie they want but it’s disingenuous to say it has zero credibility with it being a cause for lost revenue

It's really not so simple. Getting a movie banned in Saudi Arabia for instance probably isn't going to cost Disney a whole lot of money. But making movies that acknowledge that gay people/minorities/women/etc exist might bring in other customers, and improve Disney's image.

I also find the argument that Disney should bend to the will of backwards fascist countries to be a strange one. For some reason I think if Asian countries were banning movies because they had white actors in them, the reactions would be a lot different than "well we have to appease China"...

 

[Beau Knows]

Just to ground this in the thread topic... someone was trying to make the point that the public isn't with the writers and actors because of their outspoken political stances, which are by and large pro-diversity, pro-inclusivity, pro-LGBTQ, pro-choice, etc which some people like to group all together under the term "woke"

Yeah I tried to address that earlier, pointing out that the studio heads are the ones who are ultimately in control of what scripts get chosen and often who is cast. That if Bob Iger didn't want "woke" movies and actors, you can bet the movies being made would be a lot different. Surprisingly that point was ignored.

So why do the people trying to "cancel" Disney for being "woke" care if the writers and actors get a piece of the pie, rather than the studio heads (who are really in control) have it all? The answer, I think, is that they don't actually care at all about the welfare of the thousands of employees at these studios, wealth inequality in general, or the threat to film/art posed by AI and low wages for writers. For them this whole debate is just an excuse to "virtue signal" about culture war stuff, none of the actual issues here matter to them.

 

[Jovavic]

I thought canceling was bad? It's good now?

 

[93gilmour93]

It's really not so simple. Getting a movie banned in Saudi Arabia for instance probably isn't going to cost Disney a whole lot of money. But making movies that acknowledge that gay people/minorities/women/etc exist might bring in other customers, and improve Disney's image.

I also find the argument that Disney should bend to the will of backwards fascist countries to be a strange one. For some reason I think if Asian countries were banning movies because they had white actors in them, the reactions would be a lot different than "well we have to appease China"...

Here’s another example…

Although this movie was streamed a bunch for 2 1/2 weeks on Disney+, between lots of countries not showing it and with all the North American customers not wanting anything to do with it, this is an example of how that kind of script for a kids movie results in another flop…

 

[Beau Knows]

Here’s another example…

View attachment 736179View attachment 736180
Although this movie was streamed a bunch for 2 1/2 weeks on Disney+, between lots of countries not showing it and with all the North American customers not wanting anything to do with it, this is an example of how that kind of script for a kids movie results in another flop…

I've never even heard of this movie, seems like a marketing failure for one thing. Your own image even mentions it being a streaming hit, which kind of goes against your claim of customers "not wanting anything to do with it".

This also isn't the first movie that has ever been a flop, so I don't know what your point is. There will always be flops and smash hits (like "woke" Barbie).

 

[Tawnos]

Yeah I tried to address that earlier, pointing out that the studio heads are the ones who are ultimately in control of what scripts get chosen and often who is cast. That if Bob Iger didn't want "woke" movies and actors, you can bet the movies being made would be a lot different. Surprisingly that point was ignored.

So why do the people trying to "cancel" Disney for being "woke" care if the writers and actors get a piece of the pie, rather than the studio heads (who are really in control) have it all? The answer, I think, is that they don't actually care at all about the welfare of the thousands of employees at these studios, wealth inequality in general, or the threat to film/art posed by AI and low wages for writers. For them this whole debate is just an excuse to "virtue signal" about culture war stuff, none of the actual issues here matter to them.

Your first paragraph works to a limit. The people who run the daily operations of the NY Times, including the editorial board, are largely liberal leaning and have been for a while. The people above them in the company structure haven't always been the same, but they allow the newspaper people to be the newspaper people, by and large. It's implicit approval that's not about political positioning, but rather about making money.

I've never really understood why any working person sides with rich executives and ownership over workers, even if those workers make a lot of money. It happens in sports labor disputes too.

 

[93gilmour93]

I've never even heard of this movie, seems like a marketing failure for one thing. Your own image even mentions it being a streaming hit, which kind of goes against your claim of customers "not wanting anything to do with it".

This also isn't the first movie that has even been a flop, so I don't know what your point is. There will always be flops and smash hits (like "woke" Barbie).

I said it streamed well for a few weeks but only after it was available to check out after it popped up on the streaming service when it’s pretty much free to watch but when it came to making profit people just wouldn’t put money into it. The point is all that lost revenue is because of woke agenda in the film and money was lost because of it which is becoming the norm for big Disney movies the last few years with these scripts/writing.

 

[Beau Knows]

I said it streamed well for a few weeks

"Streamed well" meaning it was the number 1 movie on their platform for 19 days.

but only after it was available to check out after it popped up on the streaming service when it’s pretty much free to watch but when it came to making profit people just wouldn’t put money into it. The point is all that lost revenue is because of woke agenda in the film and money was lost because of it which is becoming the norm for big Disney movies the last few years.

This doesn't make very much sense. You claim nobody wants to watch the movie because there's a gay character in it, I guess? Yet when the movie was on Disney+ it became a hit.

There's a lot more going on in the movie industry than you seem to want to admit. Getting people to theatres in general is harder than ever with the rise of streaming, increased ticket/food costs, and ironically growing wealth inequality (which you don't seem to care about w/r/t writes/actors) leaving customers with less disposable income.

We also seem to be getting closer and closer to superhero fatigue finally being a big factor. That is no doubt a tough adjustment for studios to make, they have been able to just slap a Marvel character on a poster and expect to bring in hundred of millions. Soon they'll have to find another fad, or make more interesting movies (that will be harder will poorly paid writers).

 

[Peasy]

Crazy a same sex couple is considered woke

 

[CanesUltimate11]

Countries refusing to show the movies because of the Woke agenda in them

Lightyear could not be shown in 14 Middle Eastern and Asian countries because of its depiction of a same-sex relationship. That also had an impact on its global box office performance.

That’s not “wokeness”, that’s repressive regimes stomping on rights of minority’s.

 

[93gilmour93]

"Streamed well" meaning it was the number 1 movie on their platform for 19 days.



This doesn't make very much sense. You claim nobody wants to watch the movie because there's a gay character in it, I guess? Yet when the movie was on Disney+ it became a hit.

There's a lot more going on in the movie industry than you seem to want to admit. Getting people to theatres in general is harder than ever with the rise of streaming, increased ticket/food costs, and ironically growing wealth inequality (which you don't seem to care about w/r/t writes/actors) leaving customers with less disposable income.

We also seem to be getting closer and closer to superhero fatigue finally being a big factor. That is no doubt a tough adjustment for studios to make, they have been able to just slap a Marvel character on a poster and expect to bring in hundred of millions. Soon they'll have to find another fad, or make more interesting movies (that will be harder will poorly paid writers).

Never said nobody wants to watch it cause of a gay character but there will definitely be some parents that are uncomfortable with scripts pushing things they may not agree with. I’m not disagreeing with you that there are other reason for losses but I don’t see how anyone can deny certain topics in scripts don’t play a part in losses also

 

[Beau Knows]

Never said nobody wants to watch it cause of a gay character but there will definitely be some parents that are uncomfortable with scripts pushing things they may not agree with. I’m not disagreeing with you that there are other reason for losses but I don’t see how anyone can deny certain topics in scripts don’t play a part in losses also

Then what is your point about that movie being a flop at the theatres (but a hit on streaming)?

You've now discussed "woke" movies for many pages here, but I haven't seen you address the demands of the writers/actors at all. What is your point with all of this whinging about "wokeness"? Do you think that the writers and actors deserve a fair cut or not?

 

[93gilmour93]

Then what is your point about that movie being a flop at the theatres (but a hit on streaming)?

You've now discussed "woke" movies for many pages here, but I haven't seen you address the demands of the writers/actors at all. What is your point with all of this whinging about "wokeness"? Do you think that the writers and actors deserve a fair cut or not?

Why give a raise to people who suck at their jobs? Horrible writers/scripts that lose more money than they gain don’t deserve a raise. I’m the real world if someone sucks at their job or does a piss poor job and go ask for a raise they will be laughed out of the office. Why should Hollywood be different?

 

[Peasy]

Why give a raise to people who suck at their jobs? Horrible writers/scripts that lose more money than they gain don’t deserve a raise. I’m the real world if someone sucks at their job or does a piss poor job and go ask for a raise they will be laughed out of the office. Why should Hollywood be different?

You ever consider that the dramatic shift in how writer rooms work might have had a role in the decrease in quality scripts? Or maybe the complete oversaturation we're getting from all these streaming services just pumping out as much content as they can?

No...It's gotta be the wokeness causing it.

 

[93gilmour93]

You ever consider that the dramatic shift in how writer rooms work might have had a role in the decrease in quality scripts? Or maybe the complete oversaturation we're getting from all these streaming services just pumping out as much content as they can?

No...It's gotta be the wokeness causing it.

You deny that Woke scripts don’t play a factor? Just because of having many streaming services that means it’s an excuse for poor writing and being more worried about an agenda in a script more than writing good stuff?

 

[Beau Knows]

Why give a raise to people who suck at their jobs? Horrible writers/scripts that lose more money than they gain don’t deserve a raise. I’m the real world if someone sucks at their job or does a piss poor job and go ask for a raise they will be laughed out of the office. Why should Hollywood be different?

Who do you think is commissioning these scripts? Hint: it's the studios, and they are reaping all the rewards.

Do you really think writers don't want to write something other than another Marvel movie or a movie based on a toy? They aren't the ones calling the shots. But for some reason you're taking the side of the ultra wealthy who are making movies that make you angry, instead of writers and actors who make the movies they are told to make by the studios.

 

[Peasy]

You deny that Woke scripts don’t play a factor?

Way to ignore the rest of my post lmao.

I don't think "wokeness" impacts how good a script is or isnt, because idgaf what someone looks like, or their sexual orientation is. It clearly has an impact on people like you though.

 

[Tawnos]

Never said nobody wants to watch it cause of a gay character but there will definitely be some parents that are uncomfortable with scripts pushing things they may not agree with. I’m not disagreeing with you that there are other reason for losses but I don’t see how anyone can deny certain topics in scripts don’t play a part in losses also

This has literally always been true. I grew up not being allowed to watch certain movies or shows because they were too violent and that went against the values of my parents.

It’s just not simple enough to say that it’s causing losses. You’re projecting something you don’t like as a cause without evidence. The reason it isn’t simple is because there’s not clear evidence that any boycotts because of “woke” issues are large enough to outweigh the expanded audience brought in by broader representation and counter-boycott behavior.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I said it streamed well for a few weeks but only after it was available to check out after it popped up on the streaming service when it’s pretty much free to watch but when it came to making profit people just wouldn’t put money into it. The point is all that lost revenue is because of woke agenda in the film and money was lost because of it which is becoming the norm for big Disney movies the last few years with these scripts/writing.

How do you explain Barbie?

 

[93gilmour93]

Way to ignore the rest of my post lmao.

I don't think "wokeness" impacts how good a script is or isnt, because idgaf what someone looks like, or their sexual orientation is. It clearly has an impact on people like you though.

I don’t watch these movies so it doesn’t make me angry lol, but it’s very interesting to see how hard people defend Woke scripts

How do you explain Barbie?

I’ve already explained Barbie in this thread

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Why give a raise to people who suck at their jobs? Horrible writers/scripts that lose more money than they gain don’t deserve a raise. I’m the real world if someone sucks at their job or does a piss poor job and go ask for a raise they will be laughed out of the office. Why should Hollywood be different?

Are you seriously suggesting that writers just willy-nilly have their scripts approved without the content being green-lit/commissioned by the studio?

I don’t watch these movies so it doesn’t make me angry lol, but it’s very interesting to see how hard people defend Woke scripts


I’ve already explained Barbie in this thread

It seems like movies with 'woke' messages/themes can both flop and be hits. Have you ever considered the possibility that most (see, all?) movies will be a hit or a flop based on a multitude factors, most (see, all?) of which have nothing to do with your hunch. A hunch that hasn't substantiated by you even once?