Player Discussion: Winnipeg Jets Defense

[VictoriaJetsFan]

Yup, our defence is... um, questionable.

Hockey in this age is all about speed: how fast you retrieve and move the puck, how fast you transition from retrieval to offense, and most importantly, how fast you can process the play and make decisions.

Our defence is exposed whenever we are pressured, as we are not particularly good at any of these things. A system can take away some of the pressure of quick decision making, but this issue is by and large personnel related.

There were so many bad defensive zone passes in the Ottawa game due to forecheckers pressuring our defence. Pionk is the only player of ours I can think of who can read the play at speed. All others need vast amounts of space to buffer their decision making, else there is a good chance of a turnover.

I honestly have no idea what to do about this problem.

Heinola and Samberg would help greatly, but we still need to acquire one more d that can skate.
/handle the puck.

 

[ecolad]

If personnel changes were made, there is a good chance systemic changes would follow since there is less of a need for what you nicely described in your post.
The debate will be around whether or not we need to make changes now. The last thing I am concerned about now is how effective our D are in the offensive zone or in other words, offensively - and I believe Mo shares that view.
It comes back to: Do safer D systems make sense with the group we have now?

The systems we have in play in our end (defensive zone coverage and breakout) are reflective of this same low-risk approach that Maurice favors now everywhere. This has been discussed exhaustively here in past. There hasn`t really been a change in these systems since 2018/19 at all - except a noticeable tendency to revert to a m2m coverage in our end much more quickly than before . These systems have their own problems but I was trying to make the point that the problems and apparent chaos in our zone are magnified because the opponent now comes organized, at speed, and are allowed relatively easily into our zone, whether by dump, or by direct rush on net. This has little to do with personnel and everything to do with strategies/tactics.

 

[BoneDocUK]

JMo trending down, Pionk trending up. He's increasingly quick and decisive, can escape hits and dish them out, playing with an Ehlersian edge, can make a pass and get a shot on net, and works incredibly hard. In fact, I can't recall the last time Pionk skated slowly to anywhere. Very impressed by him this year.

 

[Upperdeckjet]

I was watching the Vegas game last night, man am I jealous of that defense. Big, fast and physical.

I do believe our defense could be built better, but I'm afraid we are going to have a hard time maximizing our performance as long as we are tied to that Morrissey contract. I could see what Chevy was going for, but I have zero confidence that Josh is going to be worth that money and time. 7 more years

Chevy has a tough call to make!

 

[sipowicz]

Heinola and Samberg would help greatly, but we still need to acquire one more d that can skate.
/handle the puck.

getting tired of this narrative, if these guys were better than what we have now they would be playing!

remember when it was; if only Niku was playing we'd have the Stanley Cup in the bag! Uh, no, wrong then wrong now!

 

[LowLefty]

The systems we have in play in our end (defensive zone coverage and breakout) are reflective of this same low-risk approach that Maurice favors now everywhere. This has been discussed exhaustively here in past. There hasn`t really been a change in these systems since 2018/19 at all - except a noticeable tendency to revert to a m2m coverage in our end much more quickly than before . These systems have their own problems but I was trying to make the point that the problems and apparent chaos in our zone are magnified because the opponent now comes organized, at speed, and are allowed relatively easily into our zone, whether by dump, or by direct rush on net. This has little to do with personnel and everything to do with strategies/tactics.

You're right - it has been discussed extensively.
Your point is valid and it might comes down to what is the best approach when you have a D group like this one.
Do they play with more gap and try to funnel things into the corners and take their chances on the cycle
Or do they try the riskier approach of getting beat at the blue line and potentially allow more access to the middle of the ice, in our end.
6 of one, half a dozen of the other -

My comments were based on the approach they have taken - it might be safer, lower risk, but it still costs us with the blue line we have.
A higher risk approach, based on other systems, is exactly that - especially with a lower skill d group.
I don't have an answer other than personnel.

 

[snowkiddin]

I disagree and see poolman, Stanley, forbort all better than beaulieu.

I think Stanley is already easily a #6-7 with the potential to be higher.

 

[OKR]

If he can't crack the Jets lineup, it's extremely unlikely he's an NHL player.

He's going into the bin with Petan, Klingberg, Machacek, Burmistrov, Dano, etc etc etc.

What exactly could he do differently? He has 0.7ppg in the AHL, was chosen the best defender in the AHL, All Rookie team in AHL, ffs he was given a one way deal and then Jets proceed not to play him, it’s just laughable to say it’s extremely unlikely that he will be a NHL’er when he has performed everywhere but Jets just wont play him, even tho they really need a puck moving defender.

 

[snowkiddin]

What exactly could he do differently? He has 0.7ppg in the AHL, was chosen the best defender in the AHL, All Rookie team in AHL, ffs he was given a one way deal and then Jets proceed not to play him, it’s just laughable to say it’s extremely unlikely that he will be a NHL’er when he has performed everywhere but Jets just wont play him, even tho they really need a puck moving defender.

Playing defense would be a good start.

 

[Daximus]

I disagree and see poolman, Stanley, forbort all better than beaulieu.

Boo is better when hes not used very much. They all are frankly more suited to bottom pairing roles. None of them are really overly good.

 

[Daximus]

I think Stanley is already easily a #6-7 with the potential to be higher.

I think we would notice a lot more warts in Stanley's game if he played 6/7 icetime and competition. Right now hes basically getting the easiest icetime and matchups possible. That's 7/8 level and nothing he has shown so far puts him above that.

 

[Jet]

JMo trending down, Pionk trending up. He's increasingly quick and decisive, can escape hits and dish them out, playing with an Ehlersian edge, can make a pass and get a shot on net, and works incredibly hard. In fact, I can't recall the last time Pionk skated slowly to anywhere. Very impressed by him this year.

I daresay he's emerging as the leader of this corps.

 

[Jet]

What exactly could he do differently? He has 0.7ppg in the AHL, was chosen the best defender in the AHL, All Rookie team in AHL, ffs he was given a one way deal and then Jets proceed not to play him, it’s just laughable to say it’s extremely unlikely that he will be a NHL’er when he has performed everywhere but Jets just wont play him, even tho they really need a puck moving defender.

He has never translated any of that into measurable, sustained success in the NHL. You know what you wrote about Niku above (in broad terms) could be said about thousands of AHL players over the years who never ended up doing anything in the NHL.

It's almost like theres a huge talent gap between the AHL and NHL, not to mention the mental aspect of it.

 

[DRW204]

Morrissey-Heniola
Forbort-Pionk
Stanley-Demelo

i think this would be our best D group

 

[Jet]

Morrissey-Heniola
Forbort-Pionk
Stanley-Demelo

i think this would be our best D group

You think Stanley is better than Poolman?

 

[Adam da bomb]

Boo is better when hes not used very much. They all are frankly more suited to bottom pairing roles. None of them are really overly good.

Still think he is the worst of the lot.

 

[DRW204]

You think Stanley is better than Poolman?

think it's close and a toss-up between the two, either or is fine. just went with the LD to pair with Demelo.

you'd do poolman-demelo?

 

[Adam da bomb]

I think Stanley is already easily a #6-7 with the potential to be higher.

I don't know I'm horrible at stating. I don't know how the numbers correlate I just know Beaulieu is the worst of the lot.

 

[sipowicz]

Playing defense would be a good start.

great player outside his own blue line, liability behind his own blue line, kinda a big problem in the NHL!

and damn has Poolman looked good since his return, maybe Booboo and Niku need Covid to improve their play!

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

DeMelo is good, but I can just tell he's going to turn into such an awful player in 2-3 seasons from now. Similar to how Mark Stuart was good in Winnipeg in his first 2 seasons then slowly became such a bad player.

He's who I hope Seattle takes from us, plus our young defense will likely fill the role and also gives room to sign Pionk an extension.

 

[snowkiddin]

I think we would notice a lot more warts in Stanley's game if he played 6/7 icetime and competition. Right now hes basically getting the easiest icetime and matchups possible. That's 7/8 level and nothing he has shown so far puts him above that.

I would disagree. He’s probably been our second best defenseman after Pionk.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Poolman is massively underrated. Ppl don't like him cuz he's 26 but what I see Is a guy who can move the puck and actually make a pass and 95 percent of the team can actually clear the D zone.. dude really did step up vs Calgary last play Ins and is actually a solid NHL d man.

Stanley been hella sheltered. Beaulieu sucks. Poolman is great value and a solid top 3 RHD.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

I would disagree. He’s probably been our second best defenseman after Pionk.

I disagree. He was hella sheltered. And I think at one point there was a huge underrating of Logan but after a handful of NHL games where he played an avg of like 8 minutes.. perhaps ppl are overrating him now.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I disagree. He was hella sheltered. And I think at one point there was a huge underrating of Logan but after a handful of NHL games where he played an avg of like 8 minutes.. perhaps ppl are overrating him now.

Saying he is being sheltered is like saying Samberg isn’t ready for the nhl decisions we may not agree with and are completely in Pmo’s hands.
But pmo knows the players and their abilities best, right?

 

[snowkiddin]

I disagree. He was hella sheltered. And I think at one point there was a huge underrating of Logan but after a handful of NHL games where he played an avg of like 8 minutes.. perhaps ppl are overrating him now.

You can only play the minutes you are given and he’s looked way better than everyone not named Pionk and occasionally Forbort.