Confirmed with Link: Wings out of the bidding for Lecavalier, according to Khan (post #743)

[Michael Brand Eggs]

There's no reason to play this game of musical chairs with a guy like Jagr. Better, younger players are available. Why risk being the team who finally gets retirement Jagr? There's just no reason.

 

[JmanWingsFan]

He is pretty much two years older now. That's the evidence. 42-year old is not a 40-year-old. Even super-human Lidström regressed most between those years.

Jagr is nothing but regular season mercenary at next season. Starts great, then disappears when the wear hits.

I think best fit for him would be bolt back in KHL and have that shorter schedule again.

His playing time indicates this is not the case. If he couldn't handle it, coaches wouldn't have given him the playing time he's been getting.

There's no reason to play this game of musical chairs with a guy like Jagr. Better, younger players are available. Why risk being the team who finally gets retirement Jagr? There's just no reason.

Because those younger guys will cost a lot more. And what risk? Jagr still wants to play hockey, and he still wants to win. The motivation is there, the stats indicate he's still there. I see this as a move that has little risk.

 

[SportsballChic]

His playing time indicates this is not the case. If he couldn't handle it, coaches wouldn't have given him the playing time he's been getting.

But isn't both Henkka and Guru Mediation's point valid? At some point; the music stops. If we don't have to, why take that risk?

Edit: nevermind, your answer wasn't there when I wrote this.

 

[FlashyG]

Sammy was injured all season and registered all of one assist. Jagr was on pace for 60 points. He had a shooting percentage of 0 in the playoffs for taking the fourth most shots on goal per game on the team. 10 points and seventh in scoring isn't that bad. Playoff stats aren't a very good judgement of worth, especially since they can drastically change from year to year.

I didn't say it would be like signing Sammy now.

I meant that signing or trading for this year's Jagr, would be like signing Sammy when we did.

He was coming off a season where he was on pace for about a 50 pt season, was a couple years younger than Jagr and was a million and a half cheaper.

As much as I was giving WingedWheel a hard time, I do agree with him when it comes to choosing younger players over guys on the wrong side of 40.

 

[JmanWingsFan]

I didn't say it would be like signing Sammy now.

I meant that signing or trading for this year's Jagr, would be like signing Sammy when we did.

He was coming off a season where he was on pace for about a 50 pt season, was a couple years younger than Jagr and was a million and a half cheaper.

As much as I was giving WingedWheel a hard time, I do agree with him when it comes to choosing younger players over guys on the wrong side of 40.

The big difference is that Jagr has shown more durability than Sammy and put up more points than he is. He is arguably much more skilled and useful as well. On a one year deal, I do it every day of the week and twice on Sunday without any hesitation.

 

[InjuredChoker]

Quick/Bernier was a heck of a lot better than whatever trash Tampa had in net on a given day. In fact, Lindback had a similar Save% as Quick did. So it all evens out anyways. Both Scuderi and Vinny are bad. It's not just the Goalie's fault. The defense has to do their job too.

LOL.

Watch them play.

Seriously.

One shortened season can do weird things for stats.

You say Scuderi is bad because he had high GAA this year?

Guess Jeff Schultz was damn awesome few years ago.

And is Brendan Smith better defensively than Beaucheamin, Subban, Gorges, Seidenberg, Hjalmarsson, Brodin, Keith, McDonagh, Chara and OEL to name a gew? Is Smith one of the best dman defensively in NHL? Because his GAA indicates so.

Scuderi has been for some reason the major shutdown player in two SC winning teams. If he was bad, how did they win those Cups with Scuder being their arguably most important shutdown player? He is older but it's not like it was ages ago, just won the cup last year with Kings and was GREAT in playoffs.

Scuderi's GAA numbers have been pretty good considering he is always there up against opponents top lines.

It's the forwards and D that create Corsi events. Forwards are also responsible for defense. Centers especially. This doesn't explain why Vinny keeps popping up as ONE OF THE WORST, if not THE WORST defenders among the forward corps

.

LOL.

Again watch him play. Vinny isn't even among the worst defenders on his own team. There is more to defense than GAA numbers.

And please explain how he is THE WORST defender among forwards. That's just ridiculous claim. You don't think most bottom 6ers like Emmerton, Tootoo, and Sammy and what have you, wouldn't have far, far, far worse numbers if put in the same role? Context pls.

He is up there against top lines mostly, with not so much support and scores almost much as he gets scored on. Somehow you have forgot to mention that. And again, he has been asked to do too much there, he wouldn't be doing the same carrying here, he would get easier assignments.

There is also the thing how good he has been in playoffs. Actually had second lowest GAA 2 years ago of all forwards in Tampa. Only linemate Gagne had better.

Also you don't think his GAA numbers would go down if he played with Datsyuk or Z and get coaching from Babcock and actually play in solid system?

Also Vinny in top6 would push players like Bert or Abby and Cleary out of the top 6. No need on big body of Abby for Datsyuk bc you can get VL4 there. Which player would be better option?

Nobody is saying Vinny is perfect but he certainly would help. Just saying 'well his GAA numbers are bad, don't want him', without even watching him play and thinking about how he could help the team.. that's something else. No one is confusing him for Selke winner but he could definitely improve this team. And I want him, depending on term.

Jagr would be a complementary piece, not an impact piece. So if he was on the Red Wings, he'd have someone like Datsyuk or Zetterberg on his side.

Vinny could have too.

That's a very poor indicator of a players worth, especially when the stats say otherwise. Not to mention, they're going to lose Horton, and could get rid of Seguin if rumors are correct. GMs can do stupid things. Player value shouldn't be affected by what a GM does. Holmgren didn't waste any time dealing VanRiemsdyk or Jeff Carter after he signed them to extensions. Penguins are gonna lose just about everyone they traded for. Plenty of examples of good players let go because there is no room for them.

OR maybe, possibly, the men making those moves think BEYOND few statistics. Like Jagr playing on line with one of the best possession player in the league. Or he's refusal to backcheck. Or he's puck hogging and then eventual giveaways. It's much easier to outshoot the opponent and look good in GA column when you come for a change immediately as the play goes to your own zone, too. Well, paraphrasing.

As Horton is walking, seems like they would have room for him, I think. Especially if they are trying to unload some more players.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

The Bruins picked up Wade Redden and Jaromir Jagr, neither of whom made any impact on their run to the finals. In fact both are the type of "Fossils" WingedWheel was claiming are blocking the path of kids to the NHL.

Delete

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Based on what?

Points last year
Montreal 63
Boston 62
Toronto 57
Ottawa 56
Detroit 56
Buffalo 48
Tampa 48
Florida 36

Detroit is in the middle of the pack
8 points from second worst. 6 points from second best.

 

[cupforwings09]

Points last year
Montreal 63
Boston 62
Toronto 57
Ottawa 56
Detroit 56
Buffalo 48
Tampa 48
Florida 36

Detroit is in the middle of the pack
8 points from second worst. 6 points from second best.

You are comparing a western conference team with eastern conference teams. This is apples and oranges.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Anywhere between second and 4th from the bottom. We aren't finishing lower than Buffalo, Tampa and Florida barring major injuries to Z,Pavs and Howard.

Believe what you want, but, IMO, unless the Wings address issues, we're going to be a playoff bubble team.

We're a 500 team'
Maybe some teams below us step up. Maybe some teams ahead of us fall.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

You are comparing a western conference team with eastern conference teams. This is apples and oranges.

LOL.
Compare to the BS apples to unicorns reasoning of Sporsbalchik and some of the others, apples to oranges is pretty damn good

 

[bullocks]

IMO we'll finish 1st or 2nd next year. Montreal isn't a first place tram over 82 games and Boston is losing a ton of depth. We would have also been better then a 7 seed if the season went longer.

 

[BF3]

Believe what you want, but, IMO, unless the Wings address issues, we're going to be a playoff bubble team.

We're a 500 team'
Maybe some teams below us step up. Maybe some teams ahead of us fall.

If Detroit had a seven game series against every team in the new division, the only one I would be worried about would be Boston. Not saying Detroit couldn't lose to the other teams, but Boston is the only one that is definitely better than the Wings. I could see a battle for the second spot in the division, but no lower than third.

 

[cupforwings09]

LOL.
Compare to the BS apples to unicorns reasoning of Sporsbalchik and some of the others, apples to oranges is pretty damn good

lol, gotcha.

 

[InjuredChoker]

I agree with RWN.

Battle for same spots as this year, different division, not that much better team. If at all.

Will evaluate again after offseason. But a lot of people are underrating some East teams here and/or overrating the Wings.

Montreal's D is better than ours, Galchenyuk will likely take the next step, same with Gallagher and possibly Eller. I think Price will also bounce back.

 

[SportsballChic]

lol, gotcha.

Who knows, maybe the unicorn can play 2nd line center?

 

[TKB]

Based upon what evidence? He played 71 the year before and got 50 points out of it. He played regular shifts lasting anywhere between 45-60 seconds. Averaged a decent amount of icetime. Nothing indicates he's wearing down.

I saw a number of very lazy changes that Jagr made in the SCF, including one that had a major affect on the the infamous Krug goal.

I didn't go back to check the on-ice stats for that play, but my guess is that he didn't get the"-" or the "corsi" event, as he jumped off the ice before the goal was scored.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

LOL.
Compare to the BS apples to unicorns reasoning of Sporsbalchik and some of the others, apples to oranges is pretty damn good

I think the problem is that you're comparing teams that didn't play against each other, which is exactly what determines how a team does within a division.

 

[Henkka]

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 25m

Lecavalier meeting with #Stars lasted about 1hr. It's believed he will shorten list next few days and pick one #NHL team early as next wk.

As regards this tweet, I think this Lecavalier-process goes in a new way. He will inform what team he has picked before the "real" free agency will start july 5th.

That eases teams like Red Wings to have a mutual agreement, and gives them time before the buyout period ends at july 4th to buy someone like Samuelsson out to make room for Vinny.

 

[Syckle78]

Believe what you want, but, IMO, unless the Wings address issues, we're going to be a playoff bubble team.

We're a 500 team'
Maybe some teams below us step up. Maybe some teams ahead of us fall.

Playoff bubble team is quite different from your assertion that we have a decent shot to be second to last with the likes of the bottom three in that division. Two of them are top three in the draft and third is looking about ready to hold a firesale.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

As regards this tweet, I think this Lecavalier-process goes in a new way. He will inform what team he has picked before the "real" free agency will start july 5th.

That eases teams like Red Wings to have a mutual agreement, and gives them time before the buyout period ends at july 4th to buy someone like Samuelsson out to make room for Vinny.

It's a pretty good move by him, too. It lets teams go after other targets instead of keeping everybody wrapped up in where he's going to sign. Very un-Lebron of him.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

It's a pretty good move by him, too. It lets teams go after other targets instead of keeping everybody wrapped up in where he's going to sign. Very un-Lebron of him.

Um... Lebron and the two players he wanted to play with decided where they were going to play basketball together. Seeing as how they now have two championships, I for the life of me cannot understand the cheap shots still being taken at him. He might have looked like a jerk doing it and being talked into that stupid Boys and Girls club (was for charity by the way people) press conference. But he did it took a little less than he could and those three brought Mike Miller with them.

Also have a feeling when the books wrote on this team down the road, everyone important, Wade, Bosh, Lebron, and the Miami Heat knew the outcome before the public.

For Vinny to pull a Lebron, he would have to have Iginla and Horton going with him to his destination.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

Um... Lebron and the two players he wanted to play with decided where they were going to play basketball together. Seeing as how they now have two championships, I for the life of me cannot understand the cheap shots still being taken at him. He might have looked like a jerk doing it and being talked into that stupid Boys and Girls club (was for charity by the way people) press conference. But he did it took a little less than he could and those three brought Mike Miller with them.

Also have a feeling when the books wrote on this team down the road, everyone important, Wade, Bosh, Lebron, and the Miami Heat knew the outcome before the public.

For Vinny to pull a Lebron, he would have to have Iginla and Horton going with him to his destination.

I meant the comment with regard to the amount of attention that Lebron put on the entire thing. Lecavalier is doing the opposite thing. If you're out of the running, he's going to let you know right away.

 

[8snake]

I guess the outright mediocrity Detroit displayed all season long never happened because we took the Hawks to game 7 huh? I guess those issues with a lack of talent and skill up front are over because we lost in the 2nd round. The youth and mistake prone defensive unit? No pronblem, we upset an overrated Ducks team. Let's be real here...Detroit as currently constructed will be fighting with the Leafs, Islanders, Flyers ect. just to make the playoffs. This talk of winning the division and dominating the East is based on nothing but arrogance and a confidence in a level of play Detroit hasn't measured up to in 2-3 years.This roster needs serious work to put itself in a position to compete for 1st in the division....serious work.

 

[FlashyG]

I guess the outright mediocrity Detroit displayed all season long never happened because we took the Hawks to game 7 huh? I guess those issues with a lack of talent and skill up front are over because we lost in the 2nd round. The youth and mistake prone defensive unit? No pronblem, we upset an overrated Ducks team. Let's be real here...Detroit as currently constructed will be fighting with the Leafs, Islanders, Flyers ect. just to make the playoffs. This talk of winning the division and dominating the East is based on nothing but arrogance and a confidence in a level of play Detroit hasn't measured up to in 2-3 years.This roster needs serious work to put itself in a position to compete for 1st in the division....serious work.

I think you're arguing against a position nobody has taken.

Someone said we would more likely finish 2nd than 2nd last in the division. Another said only Boston is clearly better than us, but I don't think anyone has claimed we'd dominate the east, or win the division.

Just the growth of our younger players should make us a better team this season, and that youthful mistake prone defence unit is less youthful and hopefully lest mistake prone, especially with an actual training camp under their belts.

Improvements are needed but things aren't as bleak as you make them seem.