Why isn't checking allowed in women's hockey?

[sandysan]

My guess is that you're talking thru you're hat. BUT, on the off chance you're right...Then rather than polling the Euro Women,poll the Euro Hockey Federations and ask them point blank: If body checking is allowed in Women's Hockey, will you significantly increase ur funding of the sport ? If the answer is yes, then let them put their money where their mouth is, and again, I'm sure USAHockey and Hockey Canada will happily, HAPPILY, Acquiesce to the majority's decision

***

As an aside, many males ( and females ) seem only too happy to TELL Women Hockey players whether the status quo should, or should NOT, be upheld, seemingly without bothering to ask the players themselves what they want. Then when others point this out, they trip over one another hurling UNFOUNDED allegations of SEXISM

Hypocrisy at it's FINEST...end/rant

I like this notion that the wishes of the principles should be given the most weight. If women don't want checking, then they should not have it.

Lets say that they do nothing to try and address the current disparity in talent, how many more olympics do you think where it goes canada-us or us-canada before some of these nations start to resent being the IIHF version of the washington generals and womens hockey gets dropped like baseball/softball ?

As there is no current viable pro league for women, representing your country internationally is likely the pinnacle of acheivement. If this opportunity goes away are you happy with essentially ending every women's hockey career after he college/university level ?

 

[Scotty B]

I like this notion that the wishes of the principles should be given the most weight. If women don't want checking, then they should not have it.

You’re agreeing with my position ...BUT then you seem to hedge ur bets

Lets say that they do nothing to try and address the current disparity in talent, how many more olympics do you think where it goes canada-us or us-canada before some of these nations start to resent being the IIHF version of the washington generals and womens hockey gets dropped like baseball/softball ?

If they ( the lesser lights of Women’s Hockey ) are feeling any sort of resentment, they need to be ( a ) looking at themselves, collectively , in the mirror OR ( b ) blaming their hockey federations, potential corporate sponsors etcetera, for their lack of support...

Seriously, how is that On ICE disparity the fault of North American Women Hockey players? Much less their federations? IT ISN’T !

****

I was suggesting that one either ( a ) let the Euro Women decide whether they want Body Checking, & Canada/USA will go allong with the consensus decision . OR ( b) allow the Euro Hockey Federations to make this decision — with the proviso that they significantly increase their funding — and Hockey Canada / USAHockey will go along with the consensus decision yet again. What could possibly be fairer than that?.

HockeyCanada, Canadian coaches , and Canadian Women players too, have given up their time trying to help Euro Women’s Hockey.Programs. Going overseas, inviting their Euro counterparts over here for clinics etc... BUT if those overseas don’t wanna help themselves, what more can those, on this side of the pond, possibly do???

As there is no current viable pro league for women, representing your country internationally is likely the pinnacle of acheivement. If this opportunity goes away are you happy with essentially ending every women's hockey career after he college/university level

Nobody will be happy, in North America especially, if Women’s Hockey disappears from the Olympics etc.. But if, IF that happens , Europeans, NOT North Americans, will be to blame.

Allowing Body checking is — in all likelihood — NOT THE PANACEA that some here are imagining it to be. If Euro Hockey federations are NOT gonna adequately fund their female hockey players, — again in all likelihood — the disparity problem will NEVER be solved.

 

[nikonsniper*]

They may not be able to check, but they have great fundamentals.

 

[sandysan]

You’re agreeing with my position ...BUT then you seem to hedge ur bets



If they ( the lesser lights of Women’s Hockey ) are feeling any sort of resentment, they need to be ( a ) looking at themselves, collectively , in the mirror OR ( b ) blaming their hockey federations, potential corporate sponsors etcetera, for their lack of support...

Seriously, how is that On ICE disparity the fault of North American Women Hockey players? Much less their federations? IT ISN’T !

****

I was suggesting that one either ( a ) let the Euro Women decide whether they want Body Checking, & Canada/USA will go allong with the consensus decision . OR ( b) allow the Euro Hockey Federations to make this decision — with the proviso that they significantly increase their funding — and Hockey Canada / USAHockey will go along with the consensus decision yet again. What could possibly be fairer than that?.

HockeyCanada, Canadian coaches , and Canadian Women players too, have given up their time trying to help Euro Women’s Hockey.Programs. Going overseas, inviting their Euro counterparts over here for clinics etc... BUT if those overseas don’t wanna help themselves, what more can those, on this side of the pond, possibly do???




Nobody will be happy, in North America especially, if Women’s Hockey disappears from the Olympics etc.. But if, IF that happens , Europeans, NOT North Americans, will be to blame.

Allowing Body checking is — in all likelihood — NOT THE PANACEA that some here are imagining it to be. If Euro Hockey federations are NOT gonna adequately fund their female hockey players, — again in all likelihood — the disparity problem will NEVER be solved.

the problem is that these things take time, I doubt i will live long enough to have the participation discrepancy cut in half, and I hope to live a long long time.

So in order to develop these other programs your presented with two options, tell them that every young girl right now has essentially ZERO chance of ever winning a gold, and that this likely extends to their daughters as well. That in mabey 10 olympics women from these programs might be able to aspire to something higher than third place.

or do something ( admittedly artificial) to try to reduce the discrepancy quickly so that they can hopefully be something other than also rans. It doesnt have to be checking but I think that the current physical advantage that the us and canada have over everyone else is not as great as the talent pool / skills advantage.


My guess is that if the US and canada continue to blow everyone but each other out, womens hockey has mabey 4 olympics left before it meets the same fate as softball. the purpose of these competitions are that they are competitive, right now they are not and its not likely to reverse itself organically anytime soon. If you rake the hands off approach, I think the writing is on the wall.

If I were smart enought to think of another possible way to make other teams more competitive, I'd throw my support behind that as well.

 

[HockeyMomx2]

For all the complaining that so many parents do and have done about USA Hockey and it's Canadian counterpart, they are the reason why our womens Olympic teams are what they are. That is the piece that these other countries need - support from their equivalent of USA Hockey starting at the youth level all the way up through the ranks.

 

[zombie kopitar]

Until there is some worldwide parity between the rest of the world and the two North American powerhouses, there seems to be a legit reason to not allow bodychecks. Now, for USA and Canada, they might as well just turn them loose against each other. You can see that the girls can get chippy and look for payback too.

Who knows, they might be more physical than the men. XD

Only read the first page. But I really agree with this. I do understand their reasoning to grow the game internationally....so for the time being I propose they change the rules to allow hitting only in the Gold Medal game; I would 100% tune in for all 60 minutes

For real though, I think the way to grow the game in North America is to allow checking between the 2 countries that are capable of it, and they should at least try to implement it into some sort of "exhibition" match (if it hasn't already been done).


edit:also, look at NA roller derby leagues and tell me there aren't woman out there who would love to play contact hockey.

 

[Luc Gretzky]

hello, yes I registered just for this.

I am a female person. I have played on both male and female teams (the former with checking) in middle and high school.

I vastly preferred hockey with checking. It helped that there was y'know more than one team in a fifty mile radius too,

Yes there was one female team anywhere near me. with probably 25 players ranging from age 12-50. Of the few players we had about 5 could barely skate at all. I can understand why there was no checking.

At the same time I was also playing in the club league, which has 4-6 teams depending on age group and year. I played with checking and I loved it. Now, I stopped growing at 5'3 so some of that whole physical disparity came into play, but, honestly, checking really wasn't the problem. One game in particular I remember I got hit by the biggest kid in the league (He was about 6 inches taller than anyone else and a foot taller than me) I saw him coming, still got quite flattened, and was on the ice for a second before I got back up and kept playing because somehow my magic ladybones did not disintegrate on contact. My problems were far more the fact that I was 5'3 with stubby legs and not particularly athletic, so I was not fast.

So with that said, why did I eventually stop playing Hockey with the boys team? Well, they decided to switch setups so that the hockey teams were through the public school, there was now one team I could be on. I went to the first practice, we did semi-tryouts and were then split into two groups. I actually did pretty, well not the best but firmly in the mid range. I got put with the group that had people who couldn't skate. Meanwhile, there were people I had definitely done better than in the other group. I actually went up and asked the assistant coach why I was in the group I was in, and he told me that I definitely could have been in the other group, but the coach wanted me to help the boys who couldn't skate... So yeah, I didn't join the team.

TL;DR Actual lady here, with boobs and everything, I think it's ******** that there's no checking in women's hockey

and seriously I live in Upstate New York, how are there not more women's rec league hockey teams, I just made myself really depressed

Thanks for your insight, definitely more valuable than a bunch of dudes throwing around uneducated opinions! Having played checking hockey in my teens, I'm annoyed that adult rec hockey isn't checking either, so I can understand where you're coming from.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

The same reason they wear full cages. Sexism. We can't stand to see a woman cut or hurt. When guys get a cut it is a badge of honor, but if a woman was to get a big cut across her face people would pass out and call for a ban on the sport.

It is not the women. You can tell they want to smack each other around. It is the cigar chomping men in control of those decisions that keep it out.

Women wear cages because they're smarter than men. The only reason to not wear a cage is male macho BS. And besides, plenty of (non pro) men wear cages too. There's nothing "cool" about getting your jaw smashed in by a puck and eating through a straw for a month.

 

[Shootmaster_44]

Now I didn't real the whole thread, so I appologize if this has been mentioned. But the 1990 Women's World Championship, which was the first, did feature bodychecking. As women's hockey in Europe was played without bodychecking, they were physically destroyed by Canada and the USA. They then petitioned the IIHF to eliminate it from the game. At the time the competitive imbalance was even wider than today, so the IIHF decided that was the best way to go.

I vaguely remember watching that tournament and it was somewhat sexist. Hockey Canada (or more correctly the CAHA) had Team Canada wear pink versions of the men's jerseys. I remember that I enjoyed the games, but that was likely because I was 8 and Canada was kicking butt. I still enjoy watching women's hockey, I even caught Team Canada against the AMHL Lloydminster Baker Hughes Bobcats game in November. Some of the players would be seriously hurt with bodychecking. You don't notice it on TV, but a few of the players on Team Canada barely cracked 5'0 tall. It is probably safer if they don't have bodychecking.

That said, even without bodychecking non-Olympic/World Championship games can get rough. Two of the Canada/USA pre-Olympic games featured linebrawls. They don't get as scrappy at official IIHF events for the same reason the men don't, it is an automatic 5, game and 1 game suspension for fighting.

 

[JeffP]

Hockey is hockey ..penalizing the women's version of what is acceptable in the main version of the sport is obnoxious.
I've tried a number of times to get into watching women's hockey. It's great until someone gets checked, then its like.. "wait, what?, a penalty?"

I get why, but just.. no.. I'd lose _significant_ interest if the men's version were played similarly.

 

[Doomsday Device]

Here are some of the sizes of players on the Japanese, German and Russian teams.

Shiori Koike - 5'2" 112
Sena Suzuki - 5'5" 125
Mika Hori - 5'4" 119
Haruna Yoneyama - 5'3" 121
Yurie Adachi - 5'1" 112
Moeko Fujimoto - 5'1" 116
Yuka Hirano - 5'2" 114
Nina Kamenik - 5'3" 121
Susanne Fellner - 5'3" 125
Alyona Khomich - 5'6" 116
Alexandra Vafina - 5'5" 127
Yekaterina Smolina - 5'5" 119
Yelena Dergachyona - 5'3" 125

The comparison to weight differences between NHLers is not particularly relevant. There's a big difference between taking a hit when you're 180 lbs and outweighed by 40+ lbs and when you're 110 lbs and outweighed by 40+ lbs.

 

[Step]

You think Canada and the US dominate too much now? Wait till you introduce checking - women's hockey would be completely destroyed.

Just picture Canada-Japan with checking

 

[1UP]

I am from Ottawa, Canada. I live within spitting distance of the Civic Center where the 67s play. In 1990 they held the first womens hockey IIHF tournament. I remember seeing one of the games and watching our Canadian Girls in their ridiculous Pink and White uniforms. Checking was allowed in this tournament for the first and last time. US and Canadian girls were just too aggressive as most of them had played with boys in their development with girls only leaques still in their formative years. This made the disparity between North American Teams and European teams even greater.

Simple as that. Can women play contact hockey. Absolutely. This thread is ridiculous.

This. Simply this. I remember that tournament, the european teams were squishtastic. Canada and US were horribly physically dominating them, there was just no counterplay. It wasn't funny to watch at that point, it was cringeworthy.

Okay... it was funny. Canada was winning.

Anyhow, the last CAN v US game, during the round robin stage, the girls were quite physical. I'm thinking the refs let more go when these 2 teams play. Personally I think it would be better with checking, but then we'd need stronger parity internationally to have meaningful tournaments. We're not there yet.

 

[jeangauthier]

Moops........it`s all about their Moops..........

 

[DethOfDragnz]

I have wondered this myself if it's women playing other women then I don't see why they can't have it. They have padding. Also physicality can enter a new dimension into a game. A physical team can sometime stop a faster or more skilled team with their checking. Saying women are too frail to take part in a physical game I think is nonsense as long as they are playing other women.

 

[93Ducks]

Was so confused when I saw someone lay a clean hit and get penalized for it the other day. Dunno what she was doing if its illegal, but it was a nice check nonetheless. Seems silly to me.

 

[jml87]

It's kind of like how people aren't as interested in the WNBA cause the ladies can't dunk. However, while that is just a physical impossibility for most women, there is nothing stopping women from checking besides the rules saying they can't.

I prefer playing with men because the physicality is there. It's frustrating that I can't do something that is commonplace in men's hockey against women. We are not frail or made of glass. If I can stand taking a check from a man, then I think I can stand the same from a woman.

 

[hockeygoon15]

To me it seems if you have two physically evenly matchet teams, that are not childredn, then they should be able to ckeck. It's a big part of the game. Imagine banning the slide tackle or headding the ball in the womens sport. Give what ever reason you have for takug it out, and it all bolis down to "women can't play that way." What a load of bull. They're slower, smaller, than the guys on the mens team. They'll be hitting slower, smaller opponents. I gaurentee after 2 years with checking allowed, you'll see a handful of of players drop the game, but you'll also see a super-woman coming out with Scott Stevens name tattooed on their forehead. I want tp see an old school battle of finesse vs. Brawn. No differernt than the boys play.

 

[Xokkeu]

Woman's hockey is pretty physical. I actually like the game without checking. You're still allowed to body people just not line them up and still try and detach their head from their body or hit them after they passed the puck.

The biggest issue with women's hockey is that Canada and the US are just too good.

 

[End on a Hinote]

There are actually accusations of sexism here. I hate 2018 already.

 

[Atas2000]

Not if its coming from another smaller framed women.

The reason is simple, Womens hockey as a sport was started by men, and rules written by men. Can't have those fragile dame's hurting eachother.

That is just how they mess with your head. No, it is not some male conspiracy. Relax.

 

[RandV]

To me it seems if you have two physically evenly matchet teams, that are not childredn, then they should be able to ckeck. It's a big part of the game. Imagine banning the slide tackle or headding the ball in the womens sport. Give what ever reason you have for takug it out, and it all bolis down to "women can't play that way." What a load of bull. They're slower, smaller, than the guys on the mens team. They'll be hitting slower, smaller opponents. I gaurentee after 2 years with checking allowed, you'll see a handful of of players drop the game, but you'll also see a super-woman coming out with Scott Stevens name tattooed on their forehead. I want tp see an old school battle of finesse vs. Brawn. No differernt than the boys play.

Hey I play hockey without checking and soccer without slide tackling!

...but that's just beer league

 

[Caroline]

They probably learned to play without it long enough to never have to rely upon it. They don't have to worry about fighting each other over sloppy or late hits, they don't have to run their mouths to draw bad penalties, they just play the game. The big hits would just add to the aggression that they don't want to get involved in. Not saying women can't be tough, just that they've never been coached to play that way and don't value it as much so it doesn't feel like it's "missing" from their games.

I’ve been playing ever since 1st grade and everything you said is totally 100% wrong. When I started I was the only girl in my whole town playing there wasn’t another girl until I was about 10 and then eventually a girls team. We had all been taught to check and hit and there was no problem. We HAVE ALWAYS been coached like the rest of the boys because there was no girls hockey. And now there are fights and hits just like any other boys team. We get hit, we chirp, we get cheated by late hits, and we deal with the same thing as all the boys. How on earth can you say we don’t want to get involved in in aggression and big hits when we already have it. The fight isn’t about if we should be able to hit... the fight is about when will we stop being thrown in the box over a hit.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Are there any feminists, who whine about lacking bodychecks in women's hockey? Would be interesting to see, what do they think about the problem overall.

 

[ThatSaid]

It's mostly sexism. There is nothing so unique about a woman's frame that makes them less capable of absorbing the hits of other similarly built players. It's just a laughable concept. I spent four years in the Army as a HUMINT collector, and we had lots of women in our unit who smoked PT tests and were just pound-for-pound incredible athletes. It's not like we trained any differently with them either.

We were doing combatives (Army hand-to-hand combat training) in Kuwait as a company to pass the time while waiting to fly into Iraq. I got paired up with our platoon sergeant, who happened to be a 6"1'' probably about 140 lbs female. I was about 5'11'' and 210 lbs. Me being a gentleman from the midwest, it was always very difficult for me to train at full speed, cause I was always told not to EVER hit a woman. Well, as I was paired up with the platoon sergeant, we were the demo pair. So she tells me to defend myself, and I was taking it only about half serious. She hit me with a stiff jab right on my chin that woke me up fast, and before I could react, boom, right hook to the body that literally put me on my ass in front of my entire company. Everyone laughed, and she just snaps "Oh, you think you could take that punch better? You're next!" Never underestimated the strength of a well-trained woman again.

It's a complete fallacy that women can't deal with the more physical aspects of hockey.