Speculation: Why are the Leafs so hesitant to change the main pieces?

[Bell Centre Hotdog]

Habs fan coming in peace. Not looking for drama, just a question since yesterday and this morning.

I look at the Bolts the last two days. They went to three Stanley cup finals and won 2 out of 3. They then lose two first rounds.

The team is not standing pat and riding with the same core after all their success.

Moving up a young dman who yes got injured in Sergachev. They cleaned up their mistake with Jeannot. Stamkos their captain coming off a 40 goal season is likely not to re-sign. They want to do what the fans of Toronto want with Marner to take a cap reduction with term. I know their ages and one is a UFA but they tend to want to move up unless getting the player for Pennie’s on the dollar over term.

But speaking of age the leafs then are trying to lock up 35 year old Tanev to term.

I just was wondering where I know Leafs fans are split on Marner and changes needed. Why is it the Lightning are willing to tear down a portion of their team to re-tool which they acknowledge they need to get better and this after 2 years removed from 3 consecutive years of Stanley cup appearances all the while keeping the same coach and such as well.

Again not looking for trouble just a honest question why the Leafs are hesitant to try something new to get over that potential hump.

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[Kazparov]

1. Confirmation bias. They actually think they are close. Changing the core would admit a mistake which would cost Shanny his job.

2. Actually difficult to do. You're going to lose a MM trade. Takes balls and vision.

3. MM holds the cards here. If he doesn't want to be traded he won't.

 

[Puckstuff]

It's not NHL 24, you can't just trade Marner for Robert Thomas or Kirill Kaprizov like it's a video game and we don't want to sell Marner for prospects. If there was a trade for Marner that made sense where we could get a 22-28 year old 75+ point forward in return, they would probably pull the trigger.

 

[BayStBullies]

The team doesn't do what we ever want as we are not happy with anything they ever do. It's a toxic relationship. The people in this fanbase love to be sour.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Kadri trade PTSD

 

[VanW27]

MLSE is a for profit business 1st, 2nd, 3rd...859th, etc.

Keeping the team together ensures they are consistently good and have marketable superstars. This is what's important when the goals are all money based and not actually about winning a cup.

 

[Roo]

Nmc’s

 

[Run705]

They all have No-Movement Clauses

 

[Bell Centre Hotdog]

1. Confirmation bias. They actually think they are close. Changing the core would admit a mistake which would cost Shanny his job.

2. Actually difficult to do. You're going to lose a MM trade. Takes balls and vision.

3. MM holds the cards here. If he doesn't want to be traded he won't.

1. Makes a lot of sense and I understand that. Look at Brisebois though acknowledging the mistake with Jeannot and did what he had to do.

2. I think there is multiple possibilities out there to trade say a Marner.

3. I feel like the team if they get out slow as an example on the season, and him not budging and will walk and bring nothing back to the organization, it could be a long season for him. Though on the other hand he could turn out to be a hero by staying if everything finally turns the tides.

 

[Buds17]

Although Tavares would be the best comparable to Stamkos, Tavares isn't a UFA just yet. Jeannot will be entering his walk year but isn't comparable to any main piece on the Leafs in any other way. Tampa may have had second thoughts about the Sergachev contract and did somewhat benefit from another team very much wanting to make a big splash. I'd also state that Tampa continues to retain much of its winning core (Vasilevskiy, Hedman, Kucherov, Point...Stamkos?).

 

[colchar]

MLSE is a for profit business 1st, 2nd, 3rd...859th, etc.

Keeping the team together ensures they are consistently good and have marketable superstars. This is what's important when the goals are all money based and not actually about winning a cup.

This is an idiotic position as it completely ignores the reality that they would make more money from winning a Cup.

Habs fan coming in peace. Not looking for drama, just a question since yesterday and this morning.

I look at the Bolts the last two days. They went to three Stanley cup finals and won 2 out of 3. They then lose two first rounds.

The team is not standing pat and riding with the same core after all their success.

Moving up a young dman who yes got injured in Sergachev. They cleaned up their mistake with Jeannot. Stamkos their captain coming off a 40 goal season is likely not to re-sign. They want to do what the fans of Toronto want with Marner to take a cap reduction with term. I know their ages and one is a UFA but they tend to want to move up unless getting the player for Pennie’s on the dollar over term.

But speaking of age the leafs then are trying to lock up 35 year old Tanev to term.

I just was wondering where I know Leafs fans are split on Marner and changes needed. Why is it the Lightning are willing to tear down a portion of their team to re-tool which they acknowledge they need to get better and this after 2 years removed from 3 consecutive years of Stanley cup appearances all the while keeping the same coach and such as well.

Again not looking for trouble just a honest question why the Leafs are hesitant to try something new to get over that potential hump.

No movement clauses.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Habs fan coming in peace. Not looking for drama, just a question since yesterday and this morning.

I look at the Bolts the last two days. They went to three Stanley cup finals and won 2 out of 3. They then lose two first rounds.

The team is not standing pat and riding with the same core after all their success.

Moving up a young dman who yes got injured in Sergachev. They cleaned up their mistake with Jeannot. Stamkos their captain coming off a 40 goal season is likely not to re-sign. They want to do what the fans of Toronto want with Marner to take a cap reduction with term. I know their ages and one is a UFA but they tend to want to move up unless getting the player for Pennie’s on the dollar over term.

But speaking of age the leafs then are trying to lock up 35 year old Tanev to term.

I just was wondering where I know Leafs fans are split on Marner and changes needed. Why is it the Lightning are willing to tear down a portion of their team to re-tool which they acknowledge they need to get better and this after 2 years removed from 3 consecutive years of Stanley cup appearances all the while keeping the same coach and such as well.

Again not looking for trouble just a honest question why the Leafs are hesitant to try something new to get over that potential hump.

Good question. A lot of Leafs' fans are asking the same thing.

To me it's simple. The arena's sold out every game, merch sales are strong, and Leafs' Management is afraid to rock the boat in the most Politically Correct city in North America.

Simply put, they're cowards.

 

[BraveCanadian]

Because their boy wonder GM gave them all big cap hits AND no movement clauses.. they may not be as hesitant as their hands are tied

 

[Martin Skoula]

MLSE is a for profit business 1st, 2nd, 3rd...859th, etc.

Keeping the team together ensures they are consistently good and have marketable superstars. This is what's important when the goals are all money based and not actually about winning a cup.

They’re owned by a company that directly profits from controversial trade coverage, lots of player movement means more merch sold, the core + bloated staff costs them a ton in up front bonuses. The money argument is so lazy it hurts, they’re just incompetent which is worse. It’s a bloated corporate mess that’s too slow to take decisive action on anything so the team ends up stuck in a pattern of stylistic overcorrection back and forth but never fully committing to them and just taking half measures, bleeding the asset pool dry without getting any longterm impact players.

 

[trellaine201]

They entertain and score goals/offense during the reg season and the arena is full every night. What more could the board want.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Habs fan coming in peace. Not looking for drama, just a question since yesterday and this morning.

I look at the Bolts the last two days. They went to three Stanley cup finals and won 2 out of 3. They then lose two first rounds.

The team is not standing pat and riding with the same core after all their success.

Moving up a young dman who yes got injured in Sergachev. They cleaned up their mistake with Jeannot. Stamkos their captain coming off a 40 goal season is likely not to re-sign. They want to do what the fans of Toronto want with Marner to take a cap reduction with term. I know their ages and one is a UFA but they tend to want to move up unless getting the player for Pennie’s on the dollar over term.

But speaking of age the leafs then are trying to lock up 35 year old Tanev to term.

I just was wondering where I know Leafs fans are split on Marner and changes needed. Why is it the Lightning are willing to tear down a portion of their team to re-tool which they acknowledge they need to get better and this after 2 years removed from 3 consecutive years of Stanley cup appearances all the while keeping the same coach and such as well.

Again not looking for trouble just a honest question why the Leafs are hesitant to try something new to get over that potential hump.

Let me ask You something do you think trading Serachev was a good idea? Even if they end up signing Jake to a new deal bringing in 1 impact player and losing 2 makes you worse, you can say Tampa isn't afraid to change the core but they are weaker.

Toronto isn't looking to get weaker they need to get better.

That's why they fired Keefe and hired Berube.

It's why they are adding Tanev.

They aren't going to make change just for the sake of change

 

[hamzarocks]

Let me ask You something do you think trading Serachev was a good idea? Even if they end up signing Jake to a new deal bringing in 1 impact player and losing 2 makes you worse, you can say Tampa isn't afraid to change the core but they are weaker.

Toronto isn't looking to get weaker they need to get better.

That's why they fired Keefe and hired Berube.

It's why they are adding Tanev.

They aren't going to make change just for the sake of change

What 2nd impact player is Tampa losing?

Stamkos was walking regardless. He wants to get paid

They added a top 25 prospect in the league in Geekie whose probably NHL ready next year

Moser is a good bottom pairing defenseman who has some growth potential left

They added a 2nd as currency at next years deadline to add another player if they want

Then guentzel if they get is the best player out of Stamkos, Sergachec and himself.

The lightning retool their forward core, keep their goaltending which has worked for most years and downgrade defense but did add Mcdonaugh who is similar to our expected tanev addition.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

I think this off season it is mostly a lack of ability to change them....if we wanted to make a substantial change to the core and get a legit return that could have shaken the group it was after 2021 when we blew it against Montreal. Now? They all have full trade protections. There is no trading Marner if Marner says no. It is really that simple.

 

[Moonman]

All toronto teams seem to be stuck in run-it-back mode.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

What 2nd impact player is Tampa losing?

Stamkos was walking regardless. He wants to get paid

They added a top 25 prospect in the league in Geekie whose probably NHL ready next year

Moser is a good bottom pairing defenseman who has some growth potential left

They added a 2nd as currency at next years deadline to add another player if they want

Then guentzel if they get is the best player out of Stamkos, Sergachec and himself.

The lightning retool their forward core, keep their goaltending which has worked for most years and downgrade defense but did add Mcdonaugh who is similar to our expected tanev addition.

If you bring in Guentzel, which I assume they are going to do because they gave up a 3rd so they must be confident he's going to sign, if you bring him in but you lose Stamkos and Sergachev you are worse, maybe not up front but on defense for sure.

I know Sergachev had an injury last year but I also know how good Sergachev is and make no mistake regardless of if they sign Guentzel or not they are worse.

Guentzel can replace Stamkos but he can't fill that giant gaping hole on their defense.

 

[sxvnert]

NMC & they're addicted to a guaranteed playoff spot each season.

 

[hamzarocks]

If you bring in Guentzel, which I assume they are going to do because they gave up a 3rd so they must be confident he's going to sign, if you bring him in but you lose Stamkos and Sergachev you are worse, maybe not up front but on defense for sure.

I know Sergachev had an injury last year but I also know how good Sergachev is and make no mistake regardless of if they sign Guentzel or not they are worse.

Guentzel can replace Stamkos but he can't fill that giant gaping hole on their defense.

McDonaugh & Moser replace Sergachev pretty fine imo

Hedman
Cernak
McDonaugh
Moser
Perbix

Is a better dcore than what tampa had in 2024 with injuries and down play from Sergachev

They also got better with Geekie being a 40-50 pt rookie on an ELC replacing Jeannots negative play

 

[thewave]

They all have No-Movement Clauses

And Merch money etc. Marner is kind of a big draw.

 

[TGB]

They can afford to run with the same team all the time. They're good enough that they can reasonably assume they're just one tweak away from hitting it big, and they make so much money anyway that going all the way isn't as big of a motivator as fans think it is. As someone mentioned, they will sell tons of merch regardless. You drop someone like, say, Marner, you're GUARANTEED to lose his merch sales. The cup? It's never guaranteed.

We all know bean counters run the Leafs, and this was proven pretty handily when the Leafs refused to rebuild the team until they started losing executive suite rentals. Surprised people keep forgetting that.

 

[ULF_55]

Nmc’s

NMC