Who was the Better Player at Their Peak Jeremy Roenick or Jonathan Toews

[treple13]

This is Toews. I think people forget how dominant he was because he lingered for a long time. At one point, I think you could at least argue that he was the best player in hockey. That was never true for Roenick.

 

[TruePowerSlave]

This is Toews. I think people forget how dominant he was because he lingered for a long time. At one point, I think you could at least argue that he was the best player in hockey. That was never true for Roenick.

He never really was though. The only argument at one point was that Toews played on teams that won everything. Of course he was a big part of those wins, but he never was better than Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin etc.

 

[geebster]

To me it was pretty clearly Toews. Roenick was more talented, had a longer career (by 300 games) and produced at a slightly higher rate 0.89 pts/game vs 0.83 pts/game. However, Toews was a true leader who won on every level. I am a Canucks fan so I hated the guy, but I will never forget when he guaranteed that the Blackhawks would come back from 0-3 down...and he ended up being the guy tying the game to go into OT in game 7.

Perhaps theres some Canadian bias at work where I saw him play for team Canada and despite not being one of the most skilled guys in that group he was a huge part of those teams. They are close enough in terms of on ice production over their whole careers that I think it is fair to bring in team success and intangibles and for those Toews takes the cake.

 

[BraveCanadian]

Before his knee injury, Roenick was the real deal - a 50 goal, 100pt, dynamic, gritty player.

Toews a dominating two way guy but he was in an ideal situation with Keith and Kane too. You gotta be something else to make up for the production difference.

Tough call for me.. I think Toews was more highly regarded at his peak but also that just happens for people on winning teams..

 

[amnesiac]

Toews 10-11 vs Roenick 91-92

Edge to Toews, runner up for Selke

 

[Sergei Bure]

Toews had better career because he played in a much weaker league, Roenick at his peak was a better player when the NHL was full of stars, i don't believe for a second that the Blackhawks of Kane, Keith & Toews would have won a Stanley Cup during Roenick's peak years in Chicago. I don't even believe that the Blackhawks that won 3 cups in the 2010's were better than the 1992 Blackhawks.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Interesting poll

First instinct would be to vote for Toews because of what he did for Chicago between 2010 and 2015, but I'm not sure

I will have to think about it

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Roenick and I don't think it super close.

Toews obviously alot more successful but if we are just going as players?

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Peak Toews was 2010 Vancouver Olympics.
Absolute beast. He played better than Crosby that tournament.


Roenick was nuts good at his peak though.

He scored 1 goal...that absolutely wasn't peak Toews

 

[Regal]

He scored 1 goal...that absolutely wasn't peak Toews

8 points and was named best forward of the tournament

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Toews was a key player on three Cup winners. That should be included in defining which had the better career.

He was top 1 or 2 for Team Canada which is even more impressive.

 

[Goatlender]

Roenick had a great three year peak, then compiled his way to 1,200 points as a good (but not elite) first line centre. (Fun fact - the four most recent players to score 100+ points three years in a row are McDavid, Draisaitl, Ovechkin - and Roenick). But I think Toews is the right answer unless you're really emphasizing regular season scoring stats.

Kucherov, Pastrnak, and MacKinnon screwed up that stat as of this season lol. Drai has done it 4 years in a row too

Edit - just saw your post was made last year, my bad. Really only Drai was missing at the time.

 

[geebster]

Better player is Roenick since there were times he was actually in the discussion as a top player in the league. Toews even in his prime wasnt that, but he was a great captain and got a lot out of his team when it mattered while being very clutch. The question of the thread is better player at their peak so I dont think this one is particularly close - its Roenick.

As for who I would want as my captain or in a playoff series? I probably go with Toews, and I'm saying that as a Canucks fan that really didnt like Toews. But that wasnt the question.

 

[authentic]

I voted for Toews, but it's a good comparison.

Offensively, Roenick had a much higher peak. Toews placed in the top 20 in scoring just once in his career (tied for 13th in 2013 - and that probably deserves an asterisk because it was based on clearly unsustainable underlying numbers, which is at least partly a result of it being a shortened season). Roenick placed in the top ten in scoring twice. He had six years in the top twenty, with five of those being in the top fifteen. (From 1991 to 1994, Roenick was 6th in scoring, and Gretzky was one of the players ahead of him).

I still went with Toews overall. Roenick was good defensively, but Toews was much better (four years as a Selke trophy finalist, including one win). Roenick was underrated as a playoff performer, but again Toews was better. And in terms of Hart voting - Toews had the higher peak (slightly), and more years in contention.

Roenick had a great three year peak, then compiled his way to 1,200 points as a good (but not elite) first line centre. (Fun fact - the four most recent players to score 100+ points three years in a row are McDavid, Draisaitl, Ovechkin - and Roenick). But I think Toews is the right answer unless you're really emphasizing regular season scoring stats.

Jagr never scored 100+ 3 years in a row? I suppose those 60 game seasons and the Washington years prevented that.

 

[authentic]

Better player is Roenick since there were times he was actually in the discussion as a top player in the league. Toews even in his prime wasnt that, but he was a great captain and got a lot out of his team when it mattered while being very clutch. The question of the thread is better player at their peak so I dont think this one is particularly close - its Roenick.

As for who I would want as my captain or in a playoff series? I probably go with Toews, and I'm saying that as a Canucks fan that really didnt like Toews. But that wasnt the question.

Toews in his prime absolutely was in discussion as a top player in the league

Roenick is better offensively and far more entertaining but give me Toews in the playoffs.

 

[authentic]

He reminded me of Neely at times, score goals left and right but not afraid to scrap it up either.

I think Toews was surrounded by a much deeper and more talented team for a longer period which definitely helps his "peak" as well

True, but Toews was like the best player on a Cup winning team on more than one occasion (arguably with Keith and Kane as well for one of them) and was also team Canadas best forward on a team that featured Crosby. That doesn’t really happen by accident, he was just that good in his prime and has become truly underrated.

 

[authentic]

Looking at his points simply misses a bunch of what Roenick was about those years in the early nineties. He also had to play a bunch of that time under Darryl Sutter who really loved a dump and chase game, Roenick was a great forechecker but it's almost all Sutter wanted him to do...

The lack of a top notch second line center (until Nicholls by which time Roenick was just not the same) also was something that put even more pressure on Roenick.

I know he has pretty close scoring placements in the dead puck era and all, but that just furthers the limitation of that approach (worse competition, a lot more scorers having their stats suppressed playing in systems whereas Chicago was one of the more defensive teams in the early nineties), and that wasn't close to Roenick at his best.

He just was racked by injuries. Yes, it's due in large part to the way he played in his peak, and the retaliatory cheapshots he'd get, but quite frankly, that's what made him so great in the early nineties.

Toews is underrated on HF because of many of the same reasons as Roenick, namely not the greatest stats. Toews is way better defensively, Roenick was not great individually, too much of a puck hound, too interested in forechecking and hitting in themselves rather than other aspects.

Toews himself had all those polls and lists having him second to Crosby for a brief period, but quite frankly, the star power pales in comparison to Roenick's and Roenick's era.

Had Roenick been lucky enough to get an early cup like Toews did, he'd be so highly regarded. Instead, he started off amazingly but has become more known for his broadcasting career nowadays it seems.

Roenick also has one of the best highlight reels ever. He had a lot of similarities to a young Ovechkin.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

Jagr never scored 100+ 3 years in a row? I suppose those 60 game seasons and the Washington years prevented that.

Believe it or not, Jagr only had back-to-back 100 point seasons once in his entire career. He scored at a 100 point pace 8 years in a row, but had bad luck. He was 1 point short in 1994, 1995 was the lockout (he was on pace for 120), then he missed exactly 19 games in both of 1997 and 2000. Then he had 123 points in New York, on the other side of his disappointing tenure in Washington.

 

[authentic]

Believe it or not, Jagr only had back-to-back 100 point seasons once in his entire career. He scored at a 100 point pace 8 years in a row, but had bad luck. He was 1 point short in 1994, 1995 was the lockout (he was on pace for 120), then he missed exactly 19 games in both of 1997 and 2000. Then he had 123 points in New York, on the other side of his disappointing tenure in Washington.

This is especially surprising considering he was not known to be injury prone either