Who does LA pick #2

[johnjm22]

Kopitar isn't really a playmaker in the traditional sense.

He's a fine passer, but he's at his best when he's trying to generate scoring chances for himself resulting defensive breakdowns and scraps for his teammates to cleanup.

 

[Rusty Batch]

Kopitar isn't really a playmaker in the traditional sense.

He's a fine passer, but he's at his best when he's trying to generate scoring chances for himself resulting defensive breakdowns and scraps for his teammates to cleanup.

What he does is he carries the puck into the zone and protects the puck at an elite level. He draws multiple opponents to him and then he finds the open man, forcing the defense to scramble and opening up space for everyone else. It looks like a simple thing but it is ruthlessly effective.

A guy like Kaliyev who is exceptional at finding open space on the ice, capable of making quick decisions, would flourish in those 4 on 3 situations that Kopi creates. As Wheeler puts it, "Kaliyev has one of the best shots on the planet. Not tomorrow, as he reaches his ceiling or proves it at the next level. Today. Right now." That type of player would do a lot of damage when someone else creates open ice for them.

 

[Rusty Batch]

I could see a Turcotte-Kopitar-Kaliyev line being an incredibly dangerous line. Where Kaliyev can find open ice, make quick decisions with the puck (including moving the puck to the right person), and finishing.

Turcotte can do it all at a high pace and be that hard working player that Kopi does well with, including setting up both Kopitar and Kaliyev, getting greasy goals in front of the net, and pushing the pace in transition.

Kopitar being the guy who opens up space for two High IQ players on his line as well as being a dangerous scoring threat with two players who likely would be able to find Kopi in dangerous spots once those scrambles occur.

 

[BigKing]

I think the point is that he isn't a play maker in the sense of, say Adam Oates or maybe Craig Janney. Backstrom would probably be a current 1C known more for his play making and passing.

Kopitar is a 70 point #1C so he is going to be getting raw assist totals but nobody would ever accuse him of being some passing wizard.

I'd argue that Allison is the best passing center the Kings have had since Gretzky left. Don't kill me on this one, but Stumpel might be a better passer/play maker as well. I think he has the most assists in a season for the Kings since he had 58 in 97-98. Had 55 the year before in Boston with both of these seasons coming during the Dead Puck Era. Kopitar's best assist total is 57 in his Hart Finalist season and he only got more than 50 one other time in 2012.

I think his shot is better than his passing, to be honest. That's why it is so frustrating that his best seasons are when his shot totals are up and his worst ones are when he becomes Perimitar and just skates around the boards and doesn't attack the net.

 

[KINGS17]

I think the point is that he isn't a play maker in the sense of, say Adam Oates or maybe Craig Janney. Backstrom would probably be a current 1C known more for his play making and passing.

Kopitar is a 70 point #1C so he is going to be getting raw assist totals but nobody would ever accuse him of being some passing wizard.

I'd argue that Allison is the best passing center the Kings have had since Gretzky left. Don't kill me on this one, but Stumpel might be a better passer/play maker as well. I think he has the most assists in a season for the Kings since he had 58 in 97-98. Had 55 the year before in Boston with both of these seasons coming during the Dead Puck Era. Kopitar's best assist total is 57 in his Hart Finalist season and he only got more than 50 one other time in 2012.

I think his shot is better than his passing, to be honest. That's why it is so frustrating that his best seasons are when his shot totals are up and his worst ones are when he becomes Perimitar and just skates around the boards and doesn't attack the net.

Kopitar gets a lot of secondary assists by protecting and cycling the puck, often getting it back to a teammate at the point. Shot goes on goal, rebound occurs and a goal, and wallah assist Kopitar. He is playing to his strength in a situation like that, which is fine.

 

[Sparky206]

Vilardi will be the go to center for Kaliyev, he has great vision and picks out the open player that nobody sees.

Have a look at the Frk goal from Vilardi against Florida, no look behind the back pass to the trigger man in the slot who puts it in before the goalie or defender even realize the pass has been made.

 

[King'sPawn]

Oh look, another thing Byfield has in common with Kopitar. Where he gets overly scouted and his skills get understated.

 

[KINGS17]

To sum it up for me, I am going to be disappointed if the Kings don't take Byfield. I think he has a higher ceiling, and much like Kopitar (but with a different style) could become a top-5 center in the NHL. It is so much easier to contend for a cup with one, than without one.

 

[Legionnaire]

Either Byfield or Lafreniere.

 

[KingsOfCali25]

Yes, they would be allowed to be called up. Just like the 2013 shortened season, players are allowed to be called up.

If the expectation that the NHL will start Dec 1. We could see a scenario where Byfield/Stutzle Come on the team, play until Dec 15 (about 5 games), then go to WJC for 2 weeks, and come back to play another set of games. This would give the team until ~Jan 10 to make a decision on the player.

The might be the plan if the pick is Byfield, but not for Stutzle. Byfield is NHL or CHL. For Stutzle it's NHL or AHL. LA is not gonna send him back to Germany. They will get him set up in LA, learn how to train at a professional level, and bond with the other prospects.

 

[regulate]

The might be the plan if the pick is Byfield, but not for Stutzle. Byfield is NHL or CHL. For Stutzle it's NHL or AHL. LA is not gonna send him back to Germany. They will get him set up in LA, learn how to train at a professional level, and bond with the other prospects.

This is incorrect. European players must sign an NHL contract by August 15th to be eligible to play in the NHL this season. That will NOT CHANGE this season per Bill Daley. This was all covered in an article by Corey Pronman of the Athletic in June. Since the draft will happen in October, that will not be possible. Players under contract in Europe like Stutzle, Raymond and Holtz will play in Europe this coming season. When their respective teams season is over, they are eligible to sign an NHL deal, and may join an NHL club. Since the NHL season is starting late, it's quite plausible they could join during the Spring. Whether or not that is after the roster freeze (playoff rosters freeze date) is another question.

 

[Token]

This is incorrect. European players must sign an NHL contract by August 15th to be eligible to play in the NHL this season. That will NOT CHANGE this season per Bill Daley. This was all covered in an article by Corey Pronman of the Athletic in June. Since the draft will happen in October, that will not be possible. Players under contract in Europe like Stutzle, Raymond and Holtz will play in Europe this coming season. When their respective teams season is over, they are eligible to sign an NHL deal, and may join an NHL club. Since the NHL season is starting late, it's quite plausible they could join during the Spring. Whether or not that is after the roster freeze (playoff rosters freeze date) is another question.

Is this just for imports that played their draft years in Europe?

Are CHL and USHL players able to sign after the draft and play in the NHL?

Marco Rossi is Austrian but played OHL, what would his situation look like, ignoring that he already said he would not return to the OHL?

 

[SwedeChristoffer]

Is this just for imports that played their draft years in Europe?

Are CHL and USHL players able to sign after the draft and play in the NHL?

Marco Rossi is Austrian but played OHL, what would his situation look like, ignoring that he already said he would not return to the OHL?

It's the contract that determines it.

Stützle, Raymond, Holtz and Lundell all have contracts with their European team over next season. If the player signs an ELC before 15th of August the NHL contract has priority.

Regarding Rossi it depends on if he has signed a contract with Zürich or not.
I don't think it's publicly known whether he has signed, or if he is waiting until after the draft. (He has said he won't be playing until after the draft, but not if he has signed a contract or not).

 

[Ray Martyniuk]

To sum it up for me, I am going to be disappointed if the Kings don't take Byfield. I think he has a higher ceiling, and much like Kopitar (but with a different style) could become a top-5 center in the NHL. It is so much easier to contend for a cup with one, than without one.

Amen

 

[bland]

Oh look, another thing Byfield has in common with Kopitar. Where he gets overly scouted and his skills get understated.

Spades are spades. Pretending all players are compatible doesn't do anyone any favors.

Kaliyev is not a well rounded player. He hides off of the puck, reads and jumps into lanes. He is going to need someone who creates those lanes otherwise he won't be as effective.

Kopitar carries the puck, draws in defenders, then dishes to linemates in close proximity who are cycling at the same pace. He is an option quarterback who would rather retain possession than risk 20 foot passes. He has been that player for his entire career - a hall of fame career at that. But he needs puck retrievers and cyclers on his wings - Kaliyev is neither. Gaborik was a highly skilled winger, but he was also a workhorse who supported play and didn't depend on someone else to make space for him. Everyone else who thrived with Anze were hard workers - Williams, Iafallo, Brown, Lucic - none of those guys played off of the puck, they cycled, recovered and supported - not Kaliyev's strengths.

Just like how he and Kovalchuk were incompatible, it will be the same with Kaliyev.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Kopitar also worked quite well with Patrick O’Sullivan, Mike Cammalleri, Ryan Smyth, Tyler Toffoli...

 

[Rusty Batch]

Spades are spades. Pretending all players are compatible doesn't do anyone any favors.

Kaliyev is not a well rounded player. He hides off of the puck, reads and jumps into lanes. He is going to need someone who creates those lanes otherwise he won't be as effective.

Kopitar carries the puck, draws in defenders, then dishes to linemates in close proximity who are cycling at the same pace. He is an option quarterback who would rather retain possession than risk 20 foot passes. He has been that player for his entire career - a hall of fame career at that. But he needs puck retrievers and cyclers on his wings - Kaliyev is neither. Gaborik was a highly skilled winger, but he was also a workhorse who supported play and didn't depend on someone else to make space for him. Everyone else who thrived with Anze were hard workers - Williams, Iafallo, Brown, Lucic - none of those guys played off of the puck, they cycled, recovered and supported - not Kaliyev's strengths.

Just like how he and Kovalchuk were incompatible, it will be the same with Kaliyev.

I think you are misremembering how Kovalchuk did with Kopitar. When Kovalchuk first got here Jon Stevens was the coach for the first 13 games of the season. Kovalchuk had 13 points in those games and was leading our team in scoring, then Stevens got fired... Willie Desjardins came in and buried Kovalchuk to send a message to the team or some nonsense. And that was that, he wasn't really playing with Kopitar after Willie got hired. That went to Brown and Iafallo and it's mostly stayed that way since.

 

[Token]

Kaliyev is not a well rounded player. He hides off of the puck, reads and jumps into lanes. He is going to need someone who creates those lanes otherwise he won't be as effective.

I don’t know about that.

For two seasons he lit up the OHL on a Bulldogs team with no-name centers and dragged Jan Jenik and Jan Mysak on his coattails to respectability.

There is more to him than the simplistic picture you paint.

 

[bland]

I don’t know about that.

For two seasons he lit up the OHL on a Bulldogs team with no-name centers and dragged Jan Jenik and Jan Mysak on his coattails to respectability.

There is more to him than the simplistic picture you paint.

There won't be in the NHL. He is going to be a specialist.

 

[King'sPawn]

Spades are spades. Pretending all players are compatible doesn't do anyone any favors.

Kaliyev is not a well rounded player. He hides off of the puck, reads and jumps into lanes. He is going to need someone who creates those lanes otherwise he won't be as effective.

Kopitar carries the puck, draws in defenders, then dishes to linemates in close proximity who are cycling at the same pace. He is an option quarterback who would rather retain possession than risk 20 foot passes. He has been that player for his entire career - a hall of fame career at that. But he needs puck retrievers and cyclers on his wings - Kaliyev is neither. Gaborik was a highly skilled winger, but he was also a workhorse who supported play and didn't depend on someone else to make space for him. Everyone else who thrived with Anze were hard workers - Williams, Iafallo, Brown, Lucic - none of those guys played off of the puck, they cycled, recovered and supported - not Kaliyev's strengths.

Just like how he and Kovalchuk were incompatible, it will be the same with Kaliyev.

I've never made a remark about compatibility, of which I also disagree.

I'm pointing out where the flaws of Kopitar get highlighted to the point that he gets underestimated for what he is - a gift of a top line center who has been one, without question, for 14 years.

It's just funny that Byfield's game gets dissected to the point that his skills get underappreciated. Compatibility discussions notwithstanding.

 

[bland]

I think you are misremembering how Kovalchuk did with Kopitar. When Kovalchuk first got here Jon Stevens was the coach for the first 13 games of the season. Kovalchuk had 13 points in those games and was leading our team in scoring, then Stevens got fired... Willie Desjardins came in and buried Kovalchuk to send a message to the team or some nonsense. And that was that, he wasn't really playing with Kopitar after Willie got hired. That went to Brown and Iafallo and it's mostly stayed that way since.

He had a great four game stretch but was also a big minus during that stretch then went scoreless in the next 10+ games BEFORE being dropped.

No, I remember it just fine.

 

[bland]

I've never made a remark about compatibility, of which I also disagree.

I'm pointing out where the flaws of Kopitar get highlighted to the point that he gets underestimated for what he is - a gift of a top line center who has been one, without question, for 14 years.

It's just funny that Byfield's game gets dissected to the point that his skills get underappreciated. Compatibility discussions notwithstanding.

Byfield has had one season under the microscope, its way, way too early to dissect his strengths and potential weaknesses. He had a hell of a year and projects to be a very, very good pro. That's his value right now, untapped potential on top of very successful available evidence. I don't see how anyone could be certain of anything about a kid with such little source material. Any criticisms or comparisons to Hall of Famers is just conjecture that doesn't do him any good. I would bet his D+1 year is going to be massive.

I am curious about your opinion of Kaliyev though. I think there is plenty of evidence at hand to get a good feeling of his pro potential.

 

[Rusty Batch]

He had a great four game stretch but was also a big minus during that stretch then went scoreless in the next 10+ games BEFORE being dropped.

No, I remember it just fine.

You're not, there are actually stats for this. You can go look it up. Kovalchuk only played on Kopitar line about 15% of the time that season. And let's not forget Kovalchuk was 35 and like 5 years removed from NHL hockey. So I'm not sure if using him as your main example when he was a ppg before Willie Desjardins came in and buried him is a great example.

 

[bland]

Kopitar also worked quite well with Patrick O’Sullivan, Mike Cammalleri, Ryan Smyth, Tyler Toffoli...

He hardly ever played with Cammalleri. Cammalleri put up 80 points predominantly with Frolov and Armstrong in 06-07, Anze's rookie year, then dropped off considerably the next year WITH Anze before being dealt.

I don't think Smyth or O'Sullivan cracked 55 points on Anze's wing.

Toffoli had one year on Anze's wing, but yes, it was his best year so I will definitely give you that.

 

[bland]

You're not, there are actually stats for this. You can go look it up. Kovalchuk only played on Kopitar line about 15% of the time that season. And let's not forget Kovalchuk was 35 and like 5 years removed from NHL hockey. So I'm not sure if using him as your main example when he was a ppg before Willie Desjardins came in and buried him is a great example.

This is an odd hill to bury yourself on. Kovalchuk was a "ppg" because he put up 9 points over four games, which included games coached by Desjardins. He put up 5 points and was a -5 in the first 10 games of that season, all coached by Stevens. After that 4 game stretch, he was pointless in the next 10.

Desjardins didn't bury Kovalchuk, he buried himself with constant turnovers, no forechecking, a lazy attention to detail and an inability to contribute to the cause unless he was being fed in one spot on the ice. And, there was nobody on the roster that could feed him the way he wanted.

He was incompatible with Kopitar and didn't put in the work to deserve a top spot. It was never going to work, and it was completely predictable.