Where do the Bruins go from here?

[b in vancouver]

Am i missing something? This is a 65 win team who've lost a great player. They're still going to contend.

No. You're not missing anything. Some fans have been (wishful thinking) prediciting The Bruins demise for a dozen years. It's a summertime passage.
Even if Bergeron hadn't retired there'd be a thread about them and how he's too old to be a #1 C and that they were doomed.
Rinse and repeat every summer.

 

[HFpapi]

Nope you do not

So it's possible to respond to people on a message board without it meaning they live rent free in their head?

 

[PB37]

You mean their franchise #1 center and team heartbeat?

And their #2 center and their 3rd best winger and two important deadline pick ups.

Acting like they are basically the same team is insane.

You think trading a 25 year old #1 RHD and a 27 year old who's already scored 300 goals for his career for prospects is a good idea. You've got no room to call someone else insane.

 

[HFpapi]

No. You're not missing anything. Some fans have been (wishful thinking) prediciting The Bruins demise for a dozen years. It's a summertime passage.
Even if Bergeron hadn't retired there'd be a thread about them and how he's too old to be a #1 C and that they were doomed.
Rinse and repeat every summer.

Name me a team that's ever lost 5 of it's 11 best players in one summer while getting absolutely nothing back in return?

Pasta
Mcavoy
Bergeron
Lindholm
Marchand
Ullmark
Orlov
Krejci
Hall
DeBrusk
Bertuzzi

 

[HFpapi]

You think trading a 25 year old #1 RHD and a 27 year old who's already scored 300 goals for his career for prospects is a good idea. You've got no room to call someone else insane.

When you are literally worst in the league at the center position, your 2nd best winger is on his last legs, and have the worst prospect pool in the league?

Yeah, it might be time to restock the cupboard and begin again.

 

[Ladyfan]

So it's possible to respond to people on a message board without it meaning they live rent free in their head?

for some.

 

[DuklaNation]

Bergeron was a key part of their success and replacing him isn't easy. Historically, this is when teams begin to falter.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

This thread seems like wishful thinking from a Leafs fan, not much else.

Very strong on the wings, very strong on D, very strong in net, and they absolutely still could land Lindholm/Scheifele

 

[HFpapi]

for some.

You have 58,000 posts to my 850. Let's pump the brakes on saying something lives rent free in my head because I'm engaging in a discussion that I started.

 

[Ladyfan]

You have 58,000 posts to my 850. Let's pump the brakes on saying something lives rent free in my head because I'm engaging in a discussion that I started.

 

[HFpapi]

This thread seems like wishful thinking from a Leafs fan, not much else.

Very strong on the wings, very strong on D, very strong in net, and they absolutely still could land Lindholm/Scheifele

Peoples entire argument against me seems predicated on penciling in players the Bruins don't actually have. They don't have Scheifele and they don't have Lindholm and frankly I don't think they have the assets to acquire either of them.

Their top 2 centers are Zacha and Coyle. Live in that reality.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Peoples entire argument against me seems predicated on penciling in players the Bruins don't actually have. They don't have Scheifele and they don't have Lindholm and frankly I don't think they have the assets to acquire either of them.

Their top 2 centers are Zacha and Coyle. Live in that reality.

No, that is literally the last part of my argument. How is that my entire argument? Did you just make my "entire" argument into the one thing you could refute because your initial argument is shit?

They have elite wingers, D, and goaltending. That is enough to compete, and your belief that they cant add anyone is irrelevant to that fact, even if you're right. If they can add at C, there is literally nothing to worry about.

 

[PB37]

When you are literally worst in the league at the center position, your 2nd best winger is on his last legs, and have the worst prospect pool in the league?

Yeah, it might be time to restock the cupboard and begin again.

McAvoy and Pasta are foundational building blocks of any core. They're both young, in their prime, among the best at their position. Trading that away to get a few extra dice rolls at developing prospects who will most likely not be as good is as dumb of a move as it gets. Bruins as is will still be a 100 point team this year barring massive injuries. Sorry but you're going to have to spend another year hating they're still good.

 

[HFpapi]

No, that is literally the last part of my argument. How is that my entire argument? Did you just make my "entire" argument into the one thing you could refute because your initial argument is shit?

They have elite wingers, D, and goaltending. That is enough to compete, and your belief that they cant add anyone is irrelevant to that fact, even if you're right. If they can add at C, there is literally nothing to worry about.

Wasn't directed at you exclusively. Read through the thread how many times the names Scheifele and Lindholm are being thrown out to refute the claim that they have the worst centers in the league. Someone even mentioned just signing Jack Eichel in 3 years.

 

[waitin425]

The Bruins have been so good for so long, it is hard to imagine them dropping off and entering lottery talk anytime soon. With Pasta they will always have a way to score goals.

That being said, I see them on the outside looking in at the playoffs. They may be able to quickly re-tool if they can acquire Schief or Lindholm as others have said, but their cupboard is extremely thin at this point.

 

[HFpapi]

McAvoy and Pasta are foundational building blocks of any core. They're both young, in their prime, among the best at their position. Trading that away to get a few extra dice rolls at developing prospects who will most likely not be as good is as dumb of a move as it gets. Bruins as is will still be a 100 point team this year barring massive injuries. Sorry but you're going to have to spend another year hating they're still good.

Yes, they would be a good foundation to build on top of. My point is you have nothing to build with. You're empty. They're everything you have. You have zero prospects, not many draft picks, zero foundational players under the age of 25 and for now no cap space to boot.

What exactly are you going to build around them with? How are you acquiring a #1 C and soon a top line W to replace Marchand?

Being a bubble team until Pasta and Mcavoy don't have any value either will be a disaster but as a Leafs fan I'm here for it.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Wasn't directed at you exclusively. Read through the thread how many times the names Scheifele and Lindholm are being thrown out to refute the claim that they have the worst centers in the league. Someone even mentioned just signing Jack Eichel in 3 years.

Well, the argument that the Bruins could add a centre is far more convincing than the one that they cant. Maybe it isn't likely, it might be hard, but its a possibility AND, if done, would pretty much cement them as a playoff contender, if not more, for the next few years.

Having McAvoy, Lindholm & Carlo under contract for $20mil for the next 4yrs - McAvoy & Lindholm for 7yrs - is almost enough on its own. The odds of them having a better top 3 in the next 10 years - maybe even 20 - is extremely low if they rebuild. The odds of getting a winger at Pasta's level is extremely low. All of those guys are under 30 and in their prime.

I don't think they should be tossing away picks like candy, but tearing it down makes very little sense imo.

McAvoy and Pasta are foundational building blocks of any core. They're both young, in their prime, among the best at their position. Trading that away to get a few extra dice rolls at developing prospects who will most likely not be as good is as dumb of a move as it gets. Bruins as is will still be a 100 point team this year barring massive injuries. Sorry but you're going to have to spend another year hating they're still good.

Also, while people say they dont have assets to trade... Swayman & Ullmark are probably two of the more valuable goalies in the league. And when you look at where the C's in the league are available from.. are also pretty unstable in nets moving forward.

 

[PB37]

Yes, they would be a good foundation to build on top of. My point is you have nothing to build with. You're empty. They're everything you have. You have zero prospects, not many draft picks, zero foundational players under the age of 25 and for now no cap space to boot.

What exactly are you going to build around them with? How are you acquiring a #1 C and soon a top line W to replace Marchand?

Being a bubble team until Pasta and Mcavoy don't have any value either will be a disaster but as a Leafs fan I'm here for it.

Saying that they have zero prospects over and over again isn't going to make it true. They don't have any franchise level players in the system but they certainly have solid prospects who have a good shot at being productive NHL players.

So when should we expect the value of McAvoy and Pasta to be diminished to zero? LMAO. You really are a hoot.

 

[Sigh]

Being a bubble team until Pasta and Mcavoy don't have any value either will be a disaster but as a Leafs fan I'm here for it.

It’s pretty obvious what you’re here for.

 

[Peat]

I get the OP's logic to a point. If you've got a hand with two aces but nothing else good, you fold and hope to build a better hand.

But beyond generally overegging the Bruins' weakness, it founders on setting a timeline of this summer on a process that'll take a few years to play out. The only move that is possibly time sensitive is deciding whether to extract value from Marchand rather than letting him see out his career as a Bruin - and even then, we're talking about a surprise cliff, so it probably isn't.

The Bruins will have multiple opportunities to try and patch up C. They will have multiple opportunities to try and move Pasta and McAvoy if they so choose. Frankly this summer would be an extraordinarily bad time to try and do so. It is clearly a very hostile market for moving big salaries.

It costs the Bruins nothing as of this moment to keep aiming for the top, and it costs them excellent players to go and start a rebuild. Very easy choice.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

First of all, as a Leafs fan and first class Bruins hater, happy trails to Bergeron. Absolute legend, classy human being, best defensive forward to ever do it. Sorry to see him go.

That said, I think the Bruins are screwed.

I have a long history of posts suggesting I think they should clean house, trade McAvoy & Pasta, end up with maybe two top 20 prospects, a few other good ones, and some 1st round picks and set a rebuild light years ahead.

Bruins fans think this is the dumbest idea ever and remain seemingly defiant to the notion that they won't be contenders forever. Fine.

Where do they go now then? Don't want a pissing fest, genuinely curious what people think they can do to remain afloat moving forward because I just really don't see it.

You lose Chara, you lose Rask, now Bergeron. Marchand looked very pedestrian down the stretch and at 35 isn't trending upwards. One of the worst prospect pools in the league. Lost their #1 & 2 centers in the same summer and don't have the cap space to replace even one much less both since they paid them 5.5 million combined and a good center costs upwards of 7.

Please don't tell me Zacha/Coyle as your 1/2 center punch is fine. Bruins don't have the assets or cap space to land Scheifele.

They lost Bergeron, Krejci, Hall, Bertuzzi, Orlov, from a roster that already was bounced in round 1.

Really, what the hell do they do?

Honestly take a step back this year, but still make the playoffs because They'd have to drop about 45 points not to.

and then sign Schifele or Lindholm and reload.

 

[wintersej]

Name me a team that's ever lost 5 of it's 11 best players in one summer while getting absolutely nothing back in return?

Pasta
Mcavoy
Bergeron
Lindholm
Marchand
Ullmark
Orlov
Krejci
Hall
DeBrusk
Bertuzzi

The Bruins were far and away the best team in the NHL and were on a record setting pace before Orlov and Bertuzzi joined the team.

And you are really selling DeBrusk short here. Most would have taken him over Krejci and Hall last year without much question.

Its more like:

Tier 1:
Pasta
Mcavoy
Bergeron
Lindholm
Marchand
Ullmark

Tier 2:
DeBrusk
Krejci
Swayman
Hall
Carlo
Gryz

On the tier 2 front, you are hoping that JVR can step in and approximate one of those guys impacts and come up with 40-50 points while playing with Zacha and Pasta. It's a different play style than Krejci by a great deal, but it's also probably a better fit. Bertuzzi/Zacha/Pasta were awesome as a line because Bertuzzi being down around the net opened up room and passing lanes for Pasta and Zacha. With Zacha/Krejci/Pasta there wasn't really a great down low presence and you were limited to beating the goalie from distance with your shot... something Pasta and Zacha were both capable of. But this is probably a better line, especially in the spring. On the third line you are really hoping Geekie, Boqvist, Merkulov or Lysell takes a leap. I'm sure Geekie and Boqvist think they have more to offer if given more of a role. Remains to be seen. Only an asshat would say they didn't downgrade in the middle six, but it wasn't going to be insurmountable if Bergeron came back.

But yeah, them losing a top tier player in Bergeron SUCKS and SUCKS HARD. But they are also in a position where if they can make moves to get a Lindholm in that spot, they will have taken some downgrades but would be younger and ultra competitive. Question is if and when they can pull off something like that. Might not happen with Calgary/WPG this offseason. Might have to wait until the next one where the cap is less weird.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

If there's one team that should earn the benefit of doubt it's The Bruins. People have been saying they were done for over a decade.
They rebuilt their whole defense on the fly. Going from Chara, Seidenberg, Boychuk, Hamilton, Ference to McAvoy, Lindholm, Carlo, Grz.
They transitioned from Thomas/Rask to Ullmark/Swayman.
They lost 1C Marc Savard and traded Joe Thornton for peanuts and survived.
They went through cap hell years ago and it gutted the roster and they survived.

Losing Bergeron is massive. But hopefully the culture that he and Chara instilled continues. If guys like McAvoy and DeBrusk, etc. continue that culture then the team will be fine.
Losing Hall, Nosek and possibly Krejci are big hits also. That kind of depth is what made them so dangerous last season.

But I'll believe they're bad when they're actually bad. Until then I just figure they'll somehow continue to be one of the top teams in the league.

Yeah they have made a nice transition but why should they be given the benefit of doubt?

They haven’t won in over a decade now. 1 cup in 50 years isn’t very much of an accomplishment to hang your hat on.

Unless the goal is to always be competitive but never good enough to win the cup, yeah I guess then you can not worry about their decisions.

 

[GOilers88]

I've had this argument for a decade. Tanking rarely works out. There's been a recent change with NJ, Carolina, Florida, Toronto, Edmonton, Colorado looking good but before the past season the only team able to pull it off properly since Chicago was Tampa. Colorado and Toronto improved on their second attempt.
Big reason why it doesn't work is that these teams have to be gutted to get high picks and you throw these young players to the wolves without support. They lose, get disgruntled and in three short years of losing are asking for top dollar making it hard to add depth. - and that's if you don't get a Yakupov.

How many years do we have to see teams wallow in the basement before fans start calling it out. Sure, if your team sucks, it sucks, NJ comes to mind, and you have to rebuild but don't purposefully go that route.

Couldn’t agree more. If professional franchises in all sports took the same logical route as a lot of fans, every league would be over half full of teams blowing hot ass year after year with only a select few trying to win. The whole “if you aren’t a contender then there’s no point in simply trying to make the playoffs because you can’t win” is just horrible logic, and flies in the face of what sports actually are.

Obviously winning a championship is always the ultimate goal, but being competitive and getting to the dance seems to be completely overrated by a ton of people and I don’t understand it. This coming from a fan of a team who won multiple lotteries and still has no championships to show for it. I’d happily trade McDavid if it meant the decade of darkness never happened, and the team was in the post season every year.

 

[Ianturnedbull]