When does the Yzerplan start getting criticized?

[Crunchy]

The Wings have a lot of good young players. Not a problem but a good thing. The problem is non of these guys are elite NHLers. And it’s highly unlikely they will be. Unless a guy is stuck in Europe because of his contract the truly elite players come to the nhl as young players and show they’re elite. It’s very rare they play in lower leagues to develop. They are so great they help their clubs win from an early age.

You're talking about forwards again

 

[Fatass]

You're talking about forwards again

Who are these elite D you’re alluding to?

 

[Bozo Nicholson]

This thread and it's entertainment value is the gift that keeps on giving...

Jelly of the Month Club

 

[Crunchy]

Yzerman has made 51 picks outside the 1st round over the last 6 years, and those players have played a total of 23 games. 2 by Albert Johansson and 21 by Elmer Soderblom.

That's not a very good track record.

Did you just cite the ~60th pick and ~150th pick from Yzerman's 1st draft in 2019 as being the late round picks to get games? What happened to the later picks in the 2020-2024 drafts?

 

[SirKillalot]

Yzerman has made 51 picks outside the 1st round over the last 6 years, and those players have played a total of 23 games. 2 by Albert Johansson and 21 by Elmer Soderblom.

That's not a very good track record.

Look at all teams and for the majority you will find the same.
For the most part because its too early, in some cases more players have played, but not exactly lit anything on fire there either.

For example Chicago
Alex Vlasic and Wyatt Kaiser
Isaak Phillips gotten a group of matches but currently not in the team.

Or the Rangers
Two guys got more than 30 matches.

 

[Hobnobs]

I think Yzerman might need to call on Hasek, Lidstrom, Bowman, Larionov, etc to get him over the "hump" like they did when he couldn't win a Stanley Cup without them.

Says the guy rooting for the Oilers and the effin Flyers Talk about projecting

 

[Hobnobs]

Yzerman has made 51 picks outside the 1st round over the last 6 years, and those players have played a total of 23 games. 2 by Albert Johansson and 21 by Elmer Soderblom.

That's not a very good track record.

Why? Compared to what?

 

[BB88]

It's a dangerous game to suggest you know the outcome of 20/21 year old Goalie and Defensive prospects.

The farm system includes:

• a 19 year old D prospect who is ppg in the SHL getting 20+ min on a defending champion
• 2x top 5 goalie prospects (one of which is a 6' 7" athletic freak)
• A 21 year old 6' 6" D prospect with freak athleticism who was compared to Hedman by folks around the SHL. He has around 30 games in the NHL and is logging 20+ mpg on the top pair
• 3x 1st round, great skating, highly competitive forechecking Forwards
• a 19 year old F prospect who's ppg in Liiga
• a 21 year old F prospect who's ppg in the KHL
• a 21 year old 6'4" D who skates like the wind and plays top minutes in the AHL
• And 10-15 more bullets in the U22 chamber after that

If if if if if if if if if, if that happens or if this happens or if that happens!!!!!!

Every single team has prospects, breaking news


Fact is Detroit has 0 superstar forwards on theri rosters or that you can fairly bet on becoming.

Larkin is already 28y and by the end of Detroit fans rebuild model he’s out of his prime and you need to find a new 1C. It’s a forever rebuild with very mid ceiling

 

[Dotter]

Yzerman has made 51 picks outside the 1st round over the last 6 years, and those players have played a total of 23 games. 2 by Albert Johansson and 21 by Elmer Soderblom.

That's not a very good track record.

Wait, so you are telling us that no 2024 or 2023 or 2022 drafted player outside the top pick has zero NHL games? Totalz BUSTtttttSSTTTzT!11!!!!! Amirite?

Then again, looking at ALL the drafted players by ALL the teams who drafted ANY of the 2nd round and LATER have ALSO played NO impact NHL games, yet this is somehow Yzerman's problem??? Really?!?

Wouldn't that just suggest, by your definition, that ALL every player drafted past the 1st are ALL busts?

 

[Dotter]

Fact is Detroit has 0 superstar forwards on theri rosters or that you can fairly bet on becoming.

What is your definition of a 'superstar', and how many NHL teams in the league have these elusive 'superstars'?

 

[sabremike]

I’m not sure what you think an elite player is

 

[Djp]

Yet to play in NHL:
2021 15th Overall - 21 yrs old
2023 9th Overall - 20 yrs old
2023 17th Overall - 19 yrs old
2024 15th Overall - 19 yrs old
+ a literal bounty of depth draft picks over the last 5 years, including 15+ more players with a legit shot at the NHL.

Meanwhile, 2021 6th Overall (21 yrs) has ~30 NHL games played and 2022 8th Overall (20 yrs) has ~5 NHL games played.

It's just beginning.

Couldn't you say that about many teams with 223 and 24 draft picks?

How is Detroit different?

 

[nbwingsfan]

Another Red Wings loss and to a very sub par team in Buffalo

Wings win 3 in a row:

*crickets*

Wings lose a game:

SEE I TOLD YOU THEY SUCKED!!!!

And on all those picks where is the truly elite talent teams win with? Yzerman built up a lot of good young players. But he is missing the elite guys.

Who knows. Some of these guys aren’t even playing in NA yet.

 

[Crunchy]

If if if if if if if if if, if that happens or if this happens or if that happens!!!!!!

Every single team has prospects, breaking news


Fact is Detroit has 0 superstar forwards on theri rosters or that you can fairly bet on becoming.

Larkin is already 28y and by the end of Detroit fans rebuild model he’s out of his prime and you need to find a new 1C. It’s a forever rebuild with very mid ceiling

Well yes, that's how the draft after the top 3 works. That's why Detroit has more quality "ifs" than almost any team in the league.

 

[nbwingsfan]

If if if if if if if if if, if that happens or if this happens or if that happens!!!!!!

Every single team has prospects, breaking news


Fact is Detroit has 0 superstar forwards on theri rosters or that you can fairly bet on becoming.

Larkin is already 28y and by the end of Detroit fans rebuild model he’s out of his prime and you need to find a new 1C. It’s a forever rebuild with very mid ceiling

You realize IF applies to… every single team ever… right?

IF the wings drafted Kakko in 2019 everyone would have been touting that they got their elite forward. Instead they drafted Seider, and everyone thought they were insane with that pick.

Guess what happened?

 

[Crunchy]

Who are these elite D you’re alluding to?

The wings have used the majority of their top 50 picks on D and G, that's the difference.

 

[Crunchy]

Couldn't you say that about many teams with 223 and 24 draft picks?

How is Detroit different?

Yes what you've quoted is a direct response to:

Rebuilding time is done. Yzerman is onto trying to win. It just ain’t happening.

The crux of it is that the wings have 4x top 17 picks who haven't even stepped into the NHL yet and 2x more top 10 picks with under 35 games played. Plus another 15x U22 players who have a good shot to play in the NHL as well. I'm not ready to declare Yzerman's rebuild a failure right when it's finally getting started.

 

[Fatass]

Yes what you've quoted is a direct response to:


The crux of it is that the wings have 4x top 17 picks who haven't even stepped into the NHL yet and 2x more top 10 picks with under 35 games played. Plus another 15x U22 players who are on track to play in the NHL as well. I'm not ready to declare Yzerman's rebuild a failure right when it's finally getting started.

I already acknowledged the Wings have good young players. What they are missing is the elite guys winning clubs have.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Who are these elite D you’re alluding to?

Seider and soon Edvinsson. ASP likely as well.

 

[Fatass]

Seider and soon Edvinsson. ASP likely as well.

Elite D. Seider and Edvinsson are good. ASP is in the SHL. Interesting prospect for sure, but we need to see him here.
So no elite players but lots of good younger ones. Is there an Eichel, Yzerman can trade for? Is the a coming UFA, like how Vegas got Pietrangelo? Imo that’s why Yzerman needs to do. And maybe that’s his plan on how to get the elite guys he knows he needs.

 

[Dotter]

Elite D. Seider and Edvinsson are good. ASP is in the SHL. Interesting prospect for sure, but we need to see him here.
So no elite players but lots of good younger ones. Is there an Eichel, Yzerman can trade for? Is the a coming UFA, like how Vegas got Pietrangelo? Imo that’s why Yzerman needs to do. And maybe that’s his plan on how to get the elite guys he knows he needs.

Eichel and Larkin have comparable numbers..... so, there's that?

Yzerman is nearing the tail end of the rebuild. Nobody knows who is going to become a superstar. You're betting no one, but that seems more hopeful on your part. Especially with Raymond, Seider and Edvinsson on their way up.

 

[Fatass]

Eichel and Larkin have comparable numbers..... so, there's that?

Yzerman is nearing the tail end of the rebuild. Nobody knows who is going to become a superstar. You're betting no one, but that seems more hopeful on your part. Especially with Raymond, Seider and Edvinsson on their way up.

I think Larkin is great. But he’s not in the elite group that Eichel is in. Larkin is more on the Horvat level. He’s good but certainly not elite.
Again, imo Yzerman will use some of his young talent to get guys he hopes will be the elite guys he’s missing. I don’t know who he will target though. Maybe Marner for a start?

 

[Bleedred]

The Red Wings shouldn't have been expected to be realistically competitive by 2024. Holland completely FUBAR'd them. It's just that Yzerman saddled them with a bunch of stupid contracts and did a patchwork job to try and make them competitive enough just to contend for a playoff spot. It's unclear whether that's what he really thought was best or if ownership put the heat on him because they were tired of how many years it's been since a playoff berth.

I feel like I've said this 10 times in this thread.

I don't think too many people aren't questioning the Yzerplan at this point.

A lot of terrible defensemen and bad deals. Chiarot has been a meme for years. I forget Petry is still an active player until I turn on one of their games. Holl ended almost as quickly as he started there.

 

[Albatros]

Elite D. Seider and Edvinsson are good. ASP is in the SHL. Interesting prospect for sure, but we need to see him here.
So no elite players but lots of good younger ones. Is there an Eichel, Yzerman can trade for? Is the a coming UFA, like how Vegas got Pietrangelo? Imo that’s why Yzerman needs to do. And maybe that’s his plan on how to get the elite guys he knows he needs.

Eh, Seider's been mastering the most difficult minutes in the league. Would they trade him 1:1 for Makar? Probably. But other than that he's as elite as they're ever going to need.

 

[Chainshot]

I was impressed again with a bunch of the Wings younger players today - Seider of course, Raymond (people seem to be sleeping on him), Evindsson and Kasper. They're getting there.

Not sure doing a lap whenever they lose one is really worthwhile.