What's Up With Verhaeghe?

[Goptor]

This isn't true. Nobody gets anything on the PP/PK. You need to look at how the stats work better.

edit - sorry, you CAN get a minus if you give up a shorthanded goal or a + if you score shorthanded goal. That's it. I'm not sure if that's what you were saying or not, but there aren't a million shorthanded goals anyway to really make much a difference on the +/-.

That is what I've been saying.

The shorthanded goals add up over a season and it doubles up for guys who play on one side and not the other. Florida have already given up 5 SHG and scored 5 SHG so it could be up to a 10+/- spread between the defensive guys and offensive guys.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Guaranteed he’ll get back on track. Tkachuk isn’t his usual self either and Bob hasn’t been “Bob” to the level he can be either.

It’s November. Guys aren’t looking their usual selves and we’re still in 2nd place in the Division, not concerned even a little. But y’all go on ahead.

The division is shit. Not disparaging the Panthers, but yes, they are lucky to be in the Atlantic right now. Detroit, Ottawa, MTL, all towards the bottom. Boston at 17, Buffalo 16th in the league. Wednesday against Toronto, let’s see how we both stack up.

 

[OrangePMD]

That is what I've been saying.

The shorthanded goals add up over a season and it doubles up for guys who play on one side and not the other. Florida have already given up 5 SHG and scored 5 SHG so it could be up to a 10+/- spread between the defensive guys and offensive guys.

Verhaeghe has 5 SHG against, on 9 SOG against, for SH oisv% of .444 (I don't know if that includes any ENG's, don't care). That's probably all his fault, just like the .853 5 on 5 oisv%.

 

[wetcoast]

So you needed to use another stat to explain +/-

No I pointed out the ESGF/ESGA in responding to your post where you said this,

2nd in ENG allowed

Teams With The Most Empty Net Goals Allowed 2024-2025 | StatMuse

The Colorado Avalanche have given up the most empty-net goals by a team this season, with 10 allowed.

www.statmuse.com

1st in SHG allowed

Which Team Has Given Up The Most Short Handed Goals | StatMuse

The Florida Panthers have allowed the most shorthanded goals by a team this season, with 5 allowed.

www.statmuse.com

1st in SHG scored

NHL Team Most Short Handed Goals 2024-2025 | StatMuse

The Florida Panthers have scored the most shorthanded goals by a team this season, with 5 scored.

www.statmuse.com

The other guys are out there racking up +s on the PK while Verhaeghe isn't. Do we really need a stat that gives a really poor view of player usage when we already have the exact TOI numbers doing the same thing?

Which kind of inferred that the primary reason for the low +/- wasn't relevant.

What I pointed out was that at ES a lot of goals against were going in when he was on the ice and sure maybe some of it was bad luck.

Either way I'll stand by my original foray into this discussion which was that he is a right time right place type of guy and those types of players often can drop off quicker that more skilled play drivers who peak earlier and are less reliant on linemates.

 

[WaitingForThatCab]

Sam Bennett is probably dealing with some kind of lower body issue... he's losing his skates far more often than usual. Think he got dinged up in Finland.

It's killing the Panthers' second line.

 

[Djp]

He has only five goals, but more alarmingly, he's -16.

Plus/minus is a stat that requires consideration of context to have any real meaning.

Well, he plays on a good team (that won the Cup last year) and has by far the worst rating on his team.

View attachment 935130


Other than bad luck, what's the problem?

I dont know who his linemates were last yr vs this yr and PP numbers last yr vs this yr

 

[FinlandPanther]

He's signed until he's 36 and is declining already. I'm not sure many teams would be happy with his pay and production.

This isn’t the Huberdeau thread.

 

[Pablo El Perro]

Verhaeghe has 5 SHG against, on 9 SOG against, for SH oisv% of .444 (I don't know if that includes any ENG's, don't care). That's probably all his fault, just like the .853 5 on 5 oisv%.

He's been on the ice for most of the empty net goals against.

 

[FinlandPanther]

The division is shit. Not disparaging the Panthers, but yes, they are lucky to be in the Atlantic right now. Detroit, Ottawa, MTL, all towards the bottom. Boston at 17, Buffalo 16th in the league. Wednesday against Toronto, let’s see how we both stack up.

Yes the Cup champions are lucky to be in the division they have destroyed the last 3 years. Lmao

 

[Laus723]

The division is shit. Not disparaging the Panthers, but yes, they are lucky to be in the Atlantic right now. Detroit, Ottawa, MTL, all towards the bottom. Boston at 17, Buffalo 16th in the league. Wednesday against Toronto, let’s see how we both stack up.

Definitely interested in seeing how they match up.

 

[OrangePMD]

He's been on the ice for most of the empty net goals against.

Were any of them also shorthanded goals ? Because that would at least partly explain why the saves% is so horribly low. Or it could be bad luck on a small sample size, which was kind of my point.

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

I mean he's no Huberdeau

No one's saying they'd be happy to have his production.

 

[Pablo El Perro]

Were any of them also shorthanded goals ? Because that would at least partly explain why the saves% is so horribly low. Or it could be bad luck on a small sample size, which was kind of my point.

He was on ice for at least 3 engs this week. I believe at least one was while the Cats were on the PP. One he made the horrible pass that led to it.

 

[FinlandPanther]

Amazing turnaround. Thanks kompon!

 

[ScottyMascotty]

He got scrutinized for a lot of things out of his control. However, he had a few poor games lately which coincided with team slump.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Sam Bennett is probably dealing with some kind of lower body issue... he's losing his skates far more often than usual. Think he got dinged up in Finland.

It's killing the Panthers' second line.

I noticed this too.

The division is shit. Not disparaging the Panthers, but yes, they are lucky to be in the Atlantic right now. Detroit, Ottawa, MTL, all towards the bottom. Boston at 17, Buffalo 16th in the league. Wednesday against Toronto, let’s see how we both stack up.

I'm not defending the Panthers' poor start, but they have played like the 5th or 6th toughest schedule in the league so far. Props to Tampa, who has played the hardest.

 

[ScottyMascotty]

He should've had 5 more goals already if his usually good finishing didn't tank for some reason (luck?).

His on-ice xGA/60 isn't high by any matter, it's just goalies allowing almost 2x more goals than expected? I wouldn't bet any money on it remaining as a long-term trend.

last year for example: