What should LA do at the deadline?

[No Name The Nameless]

He's had one good season, and hasn't been able to replicate it. He's not good defensively right now, and if you are known for offense you need to be a lot better. He put up 8 points in his last 5 games which brought him up to #69 in points for defensemen. I mean, until a few days ago he had the same amount of points as Durzi, who has played fewer games. #1 guys known for offense are way above that level.

If you take his average points per game and extrapolate that he's a 34 point per season defenseman. He rarely plays against the other teams best players, and with those deployments he's still the worst minus on his team by a large margin. He's a -23 while the next worse is a -6. Yeah, that stat ain't perfect but #1 Defense guys generally don't have those kinds of numbers this far into their careers. With his easy deployments, you would expect his possession metrics to be solid, but they aren't.

He's not a terrible defenseman by any means, but he's not a #1. He's eerily similar to Jack Johnson for me. Good offense, subpar defense. Despite good size only throws the occasional hit. Has a penchant for goals going in while he's on the ice. He's a solid #2, and a great #3. I'm fine with a 1st and a solid prospect for the guy, but not one of our blue-chippers.

JC was a lottery pick who immediately entered the NHL. Despite his youth he has had two pretty good seasons, one very good season and one great season. He absolutely did replicate his good season and has improved each year.

He hasn’t even entered his prime as a defenseman so to take the beginning of this year and judge him for it is judging a proven abnomormality.

Also, he didn’t all of a sudden forget how to defend. You are selling a Norris caliber player short without giving any benefit of doubt.

 

[kingsfan]

Chychrun's first 14 games: 0-1-1 -21
The 31 games since then: 5-13-18 -2

The Yotes stunk at the beginning and he probably paid for it more than most but the team is 16-23-3 since that awful start and he's been playing 23:24 a night on average. I think he gets undervalued around here due to his stats more than anything and it's really not fair given he's on a team doing the most obvious tank job ever and much of the bad side of his stats come from when the season started and the team was at its' worst.

 

[kilowatt]

I’m still not opposed to trading for Chychrun, but trading Byfield or Clarke is an absolute nonstarter.

An Eichel-like package probably means Iafallo, Turcotte, our 2022 first, and a 2023 second. If we could swap Iafallo for Walker and Turcotte for Kupari, I’d do it no problem. I’d even consider sending one of Anderson or Bjornfot instead of Walker. Just thinking out loud.

 

[bland]

No, the path is not short term.
Stop with the binary thinking.

Getting a legit 1LD at 23/24 is also longterm and midterm solution.

No, it isn't. Try thinking beyond video game lineups.

Adding a Chychrun at that ridiculous price changes the expectations of the roster. No longer are you building towards a future, you are selling short to perform NOW on the backs of what are really fading top liners and overperforming 2nd liners. Nothing is going to change until you have high level prospects becoming the high end performers. And when the middle ground is overly solid as the top fades, you are looking at either STILL waiting for the kids or being tempted to trade more of them to strike when your iron is just warm.

Adding Chychrun now changes the focus when in reality there is going to be a significant drop off in the next two years as Kopitar and Doughty are unlikely to produce at these clips. Then you are looking at a team with some very good prime vets in supporting roles with what will most likely be a lack of high end players to support. Byfield is a few years away.

Chychrun is a good player, but he is not good enough to risk losing multiple high end assets. If you think Vilardi, Kupari, Grans and next year's first gets in done, sure, those are largely disposable assets. But no way in hell would that be the best offer on their table.

Take this year for what it is, a last hurrah for the Cup core. It isn't the new normal. Let the Turcotte's, Faber's, Spence's and Clarke's mature at the same time as Byfield comes around. That's your best path back to the top, rushing it at the expense of those kids is your harms way.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Saw this in The Athletic, about prospects that could be traded....what? I would not think this could be true. Grans may have made good strides this year, but could not possibly be the most polished defenseman outside the NHL. He's more raw, than polished. May have good upside. He's really not that physical. If his growth rate continues, I think he'll be a good one.

"Meanwhile at the AHL level, Swedish-born blue line prospect Helge Grans is, by the estimation of some pro scouts, the most polished defenseman outside the NHL at the moment."

 

[Peter James Bond II]

This is what Rob said on February 24. Rules out selling or rentals.
“Anything we look at has to have both parts: has to improve the team now and later,” Blake said.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

 

[MBH]

I’m still not opposed to trading for Chychrun, but trading Byfield or Clarke is an absolute nonstarter.

An Eichel-like package probably means Iafallo, Turcotte, our 2022 first, and a 2023 second. If we could swap Iafallo for Walker and Turcotte for Kupari, I’d do it no problem. I’d even consider sending one of Anderson or Bjornfot instead of Walker. Just thinking out loud.

The chances of Clarke being as valuable as Chychrun seem so unlikely to me.
The old expression - I'll take a bird in hand over two in the bush - rings true. You draft guys hoping they're core plays you build around.
If a team like Arizona is dumb enough to trade one, you shake your bushes and take their bird.

 

[bouncesonly]

What does "QO of 7.4m" mean? qualified offier?

 

[MBH]

No, it isn't. Try thinking beyond video game lineups.

Adding a Chychrun at that ridiculous price changes the expectations of the roster. No longer are you building towards a future, you are selling short to perform NOW on the backs of what are really fading top liners and overperforming 2nd liners. Nothing is going to change until you have high level prospects becoming the high end performers. And when the middle ground is overly solid as the top fades, you are looking at either STILL waiting for the kids or being tempted to trade more of them to strike when your iron is just warm.

Adding Chychrun now changes the focus when in reality there is going to be a significant drop off in the next two years as Kopitar and Doughty are unlikely to produce at these clips. Then you are looking at a team with some very good prime vets in supporting roles with what will most likely be a lack of high end players to support. Byfield is a few years away.

Chychrun is a good player, but he is not good enough to risk losing multiple high end assets. If you think Vilardi, Kupari, Grans and next year's first gets in done, sure, those are largely disposable assets. But no way in hell would that be the best offer on their table.

Take this year for what it is, a last hurrah for the Cup core. It isn't the new normal. Let the Turcotte's, Faber's, Spence's and Clarke's mature at the same time as Byfield comes around. That's your best path back to the top, rushing it at the expense of those kids is your harms way.

Video game lineups?
WTF does that mean.

If you think Turcotte, Faber, Spence and Clarke are all going to be studs of Chychrun's level, I've got a bridge to sell you.

Wayne McBean. Craig Redmond. Aki Berg. Denis Grebeshkov. Jeff Tambellini. Konstantin Pushkarev. Lauri Tukonen. Colten Teubert. Derek Forbort. Valentin Zykov.

For every great pick you can list I can name a bust. You rely on your scouts to assess your prospects and tell you which one's are still on target and which aren't, and then you go get the STUD defenseman that all these prospects can only hope to become.


The Kings have SOOO many U23 players it's ridiculous. You can't possibly keep them all.
If you can turn a couple of those hopefuls into a sure thing? A bonafide, first pairing, Norris-level defenseman?

That doesn't even factor the cap bargain.
He's an $8-9M a year defenseman signed for 3 more years at $4.6,
You win cups when you have proven, high level players playing at value levels.

 

[Fishhead]

Chychrun is a good player, but he is not good enough to risk losing multiple high end assets. If you think Vilardi, Kupari, Grans and next year's first gets in done, sure, those are largely disposable assets. But no way in hell would that be the best offer on their table.

Take this year for what it is, a last hurrah for the Cup core. It isn't the new normal. Let the Turcotte's, Faber's, Spence's and Clarke's mature at the same time as Byfield comes around. That's your best path back to the top, rushing it at the expense of those kids is your harms way.

Absolutely this. I think another comparable is Muzzin, who was better than Chychrun when he was traded. He went for a first and a couple of prospects taken in the 2nd round. Chychrun will get more than that because of his age and RFA status, but not a ton more. Change the two prospects to non blue-chip first-rounders and that's where his true value is. If Arizona wants more, so be it and they should. They shouldn't be trading him right now anyways, they should wait to see if he can put up another killer season where his value would skyrocket. It's not like Arizona is paying him a ton of money which is perfect for them.

 

[Fishhead]

What does "QO of 7.4m" mean? qualified offier?

Yeah. That's a lot of green but I would at least consider it. He's a heck of a player at 25.

 

[AbsentMojo]

The Kings have SOOO many U23 players it's ridiculous. You can't possibly keep them all.
If you can turn a couple of those hopefuls into a sure thing? A bonafide, first pairing, Norris-level defenseman?

Thats my concern - with a salary cap you have to spread talent across age groups or you end up too top heavy..Kings have way too many good prospects around the same age.. Chychrun contract and age are very appealing for a deal - no one is 100% certain about what kind of player he is.. but if you can get a fair deal, i think its worth converting prospects into a player thats on a good contract that slots in for a big need (LD + offense). I would also be happy if they converted prospects into high draft picks for this year and next years draft. Anything to spread the talent across draft years.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Video game lineups?
WTF does that mean.

If you think Turcotte, Faber, Spence and Clarke are all going to be studs of Chychrun's level, I've got a bridge to sell you.

Wayne McBean. Craig Redmond. Aki Berg. Denis Grebeshkov. Jeff Tambellini. Konstantin Pushkarev. Lauri Tukonen. Colten Teubert. Derek Forbort. Valentin Zykov.

For every great pick you can list I can name a bust. You rely on your scouts to assess your prospects and tell you which one's are still on target and which aren't, and then you go get the STUD defenseman that all these prospects can only hope to become.


The Kings have SOOO many U23 players it's ridiculous. You can't possibly keep them all.
If you can turn a couple of those hopefuls into a sure thing? A bonafide, first pairing, Norris-level defenseman?

That doesn't even factor the cap bargain.
He's an $8-9M a year defenseman signed for 3 more years at $4.6,
You win cups when you have proven, high level players playing at value levels.

Chychrun is not a Norris level defenseman.
And Brandt Clarke sees the ice at an elite level and is doing things Chychrun was not doing at 18-19 or even now.
They are 2 very different players.

 

[Ollie Weeks]

Depending on the price, could totally live with Boeser. We don’t have many finishers.

I’m thinking completely unoriginally and building on what other people have been saying in this thread, our performance this year might warrant we trade our first and bring in somebody that will contribute for the better part of a decade.

And that is because if we DO step back slightly next year if Kopi and Doughty fade off, and the youth don’t arrive on time, we’ll want to hold that 2023 1st for sure.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

Absolutely this. I think another comparable is Muzzin, who was better than Chychrun when he was traded. He went for a first and a couple of prospects taken in the 2nd round. Chychrun will get more than that because of his age and RFA status, but not a ton more. Change the two prospects to non blue-chip first-rounders and that's where his true value is. If Arizona wants more, so be it and they should. They shouldn't be trading him right now anyways, they should wait to see if he can put up another killer season where his value would skyrocket. It's not like Arizona is paying him a ton of money which is perfect for them.

dude, Muzzin had one 10 goal season in his career. JC has already had 2. When did Muzzin get Norris votes? Never.
That trade is a terrible comp.

 

[kinghock]

Depending on the price, could totally live with Boeser. We don’t have many finishers.

I’m thinking completely unoriginally and building on what other people have been saying in this thread, our performance this year might warrant we trade our first and bring in somebody that will contribute for the better part of a decade.

And that is because if we DO step back slightly next year if Kopi and Doughty fade off, and the youth don’t arrive on time, we’ll want to hold that 2023 1st for sure.

LA need to sign their own free agents first (Kempe, etc.).
Kings do not have money for Boeser.
Check on John Hoven site how tight is our salary situation.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Video game lineups?
WTF does that mean.

If you think Turcotte, Faber, Spence and Clarke are all going to be studs of Chychrun's level, I've got a bridge to sell you.

I'm not buying a bridge and I would not sell Clarke for Chychrun and your Cholowski, for that matter.

Have you ever seen Clarke play? Sure, this is the OHL, but he is not just the best defenseman in the OHL, but player as well.
The Barrie Colts have very little talent. 100 points this year, would not be out of the question, on a better team.

 

[MBH]

I'm not buying a bridge and I would not sell Clarke for Chychrun and your Cholowski, for that matter.

Have you ever seen Clarke play? Sure, this is the OHL, but he is not just the best defenseman in the OHL, but player as well.
The Barrie Colts have very little talent. 100 points this year, would not be out of the question, on a better team.

Of course. Given where the Wings picked last year I spent a lot of time watching Clarke. I'm very happy Detroit drafted Edvinsson and not Clarke. Clarke's skating and defense make me a bit concerned about his overall game. But mostly, Detroit needed an LD with Seider and Hronek and several others on the right side.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

What does LA do at the deadline now?

 

[Lt Dan]

...

 

[Lt Dan]

I would love for us to trade for a physical psycho forward. Deadmarsh 2.0

 

[KingsHockey24]

Deadman was an all-time great.

 

[JeanBlanc]

Kings Should Make Flyers’ Sanheim Their Top Target - Austin Strand @ The Hockey Writers

He’s young, a great puck mover, is on a team-friendly deal through next season, and while his production isn’t amazing, there’s room for it to grow. He is an analytics darling, and whether you love or hate analytics, his numbers are very impressive.

Now, I won’t try to claim that Sanheim is a higher potential player than Chychrun. I’ve said in the past and I still believe that Chychrun has Norris Trophy potential; however, Sanheim brings greater security. With Chychrun, the team is hoping he rediscovers his game from last season and takes the next step to be a consistently elite defenseman. With Sanheim, they already know he is an elite defenseman and there’s no guesswork.

That being said, it’s still fair to say that Chychrun is the higher-value asset, as his potential is higher. That’s another reason to target Sanheim instead, though, the cost will be lower to acquire him instead of Chychrun

But yes, possibly an off-season move.

 

[JeanBlanc]

Red Wings & Kings Could Help Each Other at 2022 Trade Deadline - Devin Little @ The Hockey Writers

the Kings find themselves in second place in the Pacific Division this season while the Red Wings are slowly starting to fade away from the playoff conversation with just 24 games left on their schedule.

the Kings find themselves in second place in the Pacific Division this season while the Red Wings are slowly starting to fade away from the playoff conversation with just 24 games left on their schedule...

The Red Wings’ biggest need in their own pool of prospects is a good, young center that could feasibly develop into a player of Dylan Larkin’s caliber, or better.

Mentioned players:
Filip Zadina
Tyler Bertuzzi