CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
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What is wrong with the Jackets offense?
- Thread starter EspenK
- Start date
CBJfan4evr
Registered User
Agree with this whole line of thinking around lack of puck possession. So how do we fix it?
We need to improve a lot of things to get it right. I would start with focusing on better passes, short unimpressive passes if need be, but just keep moving it and don't lose it. It helps us maintain possession longer, and it helps get our team speed going when you can keep moving without the stop and start that bad passing causes. As Richards says - "No hand grenades."
TaketheCannoli
RIP
I believe the underlying problem with this team's scoring rests in a few areas:
The biggest reason for the offensive impotence is the defense. Last year with a relatively healthy blue line, they were able to move the puck quickly up the ice allowing the forwards to enter the offensive zone with more speed. This year with the injuries requiring defensemen to play up in the lineup notice how difficult it is to get the puck out of the defensive zone. Many times the defensemen are ragging the puck around the D zone trying to find a way out and going back behind the net in an attempt to reset the break out. This just kills an offense.When the forwards are stalled by the lack of back end puck movement they can't get the puck in deep quickly, turn the opposing defense around and aggressively forecheck.
Continuing this theme, the bottom 6 is a bit slower without Comeau and McKenzie and with Letestu, Calvert and Anisimov spending lots of time on IR. So the puck comes up ice much more slowly and the bottom 6 is also a bit slower to boot.
Due to injuries, many guys are playing higher in the lineup. Jack Skille is a very effective 4th liner. Artem Anisimov is a terrific 3rd line center. Matt Calvert is also a really good 3rd line guy. Hartnell should be playing on the 3rd line, 2nd at best. Foligno? He should be a 2nd line guy or even on the 3rd line. Due to all of this, the Jackets are a one line team. Opposing teams can send their top shutdown pair out with their best shutdown line against the Johansen line because of this.
And then, on the other end- What about Bob? Bob is playing with a splint on his finger. I don't believe he is 100%. Additionally, because puck movement is so weak many times opponents are able to knock a puck loose and get it on net quickly putting Bob or McBackup in a terrible position.
Getting the puck out of the D zone quickly is the hallmark of good teams. The Jackets had that for 1 1/2 seasons and that's why they had those streaks of success.
The biggest reason for the offensive impotence is the defense. Last year with a relatively healthy blue line, they were able to move the puck quickly up the ice allowing the forwards to enter the offensive zone with more speed. This year with the injuries requiring defensemen to play up in the lineup notice how difficult it is to get the puck out of the defensive zone. Many times the defensemen are ragging the puck around the D zone trying to find a way out and going back behind the net in an attempt to reset the break out. This just kills an offense.When the forwards are stalled by the lack of back end puck movement they can't get the puck in deep quickly, turn the opposing defense around and aggressively forecheck.
Continuing this theme, the bottom 6 is a bit slower without Comeau and McKenzie and with Letestu, Calvert and Anisimov spending lots of time on IR. So the puck comes up ice much more slowly and the bottom 6 is also a bit slower to boot.
Due to injuries, many guys are playing higher in the lineup. Jack Skille is a very effective 4th liner. Artem Anisimov is a terrific 3rd line center. Matt Calvert is also a really good 3rd line guy. Hartnell should be playing on the 3rd line, 2nd at best. Foligno? He should be a 2nd line guy or even on the 3rd line. Due to all of this, the Jackets are a one line team. Opposing teams can send their top shutdown pair out with their best shutdown line against the Johansen line because of this.
And then, on the other end- What about Bob? Bob is playing with a splint on his finger. I don't believe he is 100%. Additionally, because puck movement is so weak many times opponents are able to knock a puck loose and get it on net quickly putting Bob or McBackup in a terrible position.
Getting the puck out of the D zone quickly is the hallmark of good teams. The Jackets had that for 1 1/2 seasons and that's why they had those streaks of success.
WannabeFinn
Beloved One
I could understand saying this at the end of last season, but now? PPG pace and leads the team in goals despite our injuries and offensive woes? C'mon now.
edit: couple excerpts from a Fox Sports Ohio article (published before the Nashville game)
"For three seasons, Foligno has had the largest impact on Johansen's WOWY. This season, Johansen is at 51.4 percent Corsi for with Foligno, but only 44.8 percent without him. Last season, the impact was visible again when Johansen had a Corsi rating of 53.4 percent when on the ice with Foligno but one of 47.9 percent without."
"So far this season, Foligno has been on ice for just over 70 percent of Johansen's ice time at even strength and just over 72 percent of Johansen's power play time."
source: http://www.foxsports.com/ohio/story/columbus-blue-jackets-nhl-johansen-foligno-112914
Last edited:
TaketheCannoli
RIP
Foligno can play on the top line. On most top level teams he wouldn't fit there. Imagine how effective Nick would be if he was on a 2nd line with Dubinsky and opposing teams had to decide which line to play their top defensive pairing against?
Seriously though, the OP asked why this team can't score and I post several paragraphs explaining it and you want to hi-jack the thread to argue about what line Foligno should be on?
OK he's an All Star 1st line winger. Why do you think this team isn't scoring???
I like his WOWY numbers but he's not a true #1 winger, this season may be his absolute peak, in which it's unlikely he'll maintain a PPG pace. We need someone who can come close to if not break a PPG every season. If we can find at least one of those for Joey I have no problem leaving Foligno on his other wing.
ca5150
Registered User
I agree with the D. Offense starts with the D and we have zero talent offensively on D. Wiz isn't getting his shots through, not even really taking them much anymore. Makes me think he's still bothered by injury. Leopold has looked ok from an offensive standpoint. Savard isn't really talented offensively, he has got some shots through and lucked out. Like I said in the off season, we need to make a major move for a top 1-2 defensemen or we are going nowhere, ever.
ca5150
Registered User
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
You're just saying this. With absolutely no implication or inference whatsoever? There's no subsequent point you'd like to make using this fact? This is all there is?
Yeah, I mean playing up in the lineup with guys like Crosby and Malkin probably have NOTHING to do with that. Good grief.
EspenK
Registered User
- Sep 25, 2011
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Crede777
Deputized
- Dec 16, 2009
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I think it's a few things.
1. We scored at a surprising rate last season. I certainly wasn't expecting our roster to score as many goals as they did without Gaborik and Horton in the lineup. So I was expecting some regression.
2. A lack of confidence and chemistry caused by injuries and losing. Guys are looking for the perfect shots and as such aren't playing confidence. Many of our players haven't had time to develop chemistry with linemates which further complicates the problem.
3. Our defense isn't helping our offense. Possession starts from the back end. Sloppy breakouts and turnovers in our own end means a lack of possession, especially in the offensive zone. Our defensemen such as Wisniewski, Johnson, and Erixon haven't scored at the rate expected.
4. Our 4th lines aren't generating any threat. They are essentially warm bodies or placeholders that go out and TRY to prevent the other team from scoring while (essentially) Ryan Johansen is on the bench. This means it's really easy to key in on our few dangerous guys and try to shut them down. Further, because there isn't much trust in our 4th line, that shifts defensive responsibility back to our top-9 and making their shifts more difficult.
1. We scored at a surprising rate last season. I certainly wasn't expecting our roster to score as many goals as they did without Gaborik and Horton in the lineup. So I was expecting some regression.
2. A lack of confidence and chemistry caused by injuries and losing. Guys are looking for the perfect shots and as such aren't playing confidence. Many of our players haven't had time to develop chemistry with linemates which further complicates the problem.
3. Our defense isn't helping our offense. Possession starts from the back end. Sloppy breakouts and turnovers in our own end means a lack of possession, especially in the offensive zone. Our defensemen such as Wisniewski, Johnson, and Erixon haven't scored at the rate expected.
4. Our 4th lines aren't generating any threat. They are essentially warm bodies or placeholders that go out and TRY to prevent the other team from scoring while (essentially) Ryan Johansen is on the bench. This means it's really easy to key in on our few dangerous guys and try to shut them down. Further, because there isn't much trust in our 4th line, that shifts defensive responsibility back to our top-9 and making their shifts more difficult.
ca5150
Registered User
How many does Tropp have? I said at the time I would have sent Tropp packing and not Comeau. He ran over everything in site and had a scoring touch. And he wasn't afraid to push the pace in practice. Maybe if he's good enough to play with Crosby, he's good enough to flank Johansen? Or at least keep our 4th line in tact. That has really screwed up the chemistry and energy.
ca5150
Registered User
That's funny, that's the exact argument I had about Gaborik with every single one of you and now that it's Comeau, it doesn't apply...funny
LOL at the implication that BLAKE FREAKING COMEAU would have saved this team (or the offense as the thread states). Come on, man.
WannabeFinn
Beloved One
Pittsburgh has Kunitz, Hornqvist, and Dupuis as their top wingers. That's 3 of the 4 wingers you need for a top 6. Dupuis is now out for the season, so they've got 2 of the 4 wingers needed for their top 6.
Comeau isn't playing with Crosby or Malkin because he's good and earned the ice time over more capable wingers. He's getting that ice time because he's their only option until/unless they make a trade.
ca5150
Registered User
Never said he would have saved the team, but a 4th line of Comeau, DMac and Boll was very effective last year especially at killing penalties, one of our worst attributes. Also hitting has been almost non-existent, I think we would have 2-3 more wins if we had our 4th line in tact from last year.
Proceed to bash me and call me a fool now...
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
ca5150
Registered User
Is anyone ever "just sayin'?" We all obviously have something to spout off about or we wouldn't post...
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
During the Florida game, the almost compulsive needs to make "one more pass" to set up the perfect shot was really apparent. I counted at least five times last nite we beat the Panthers defense over the blue line into their zone only to have our guys pull up and look to make a pass rather than driving to the net or taking a shot and looking for a rebound. And in four of those five times, we never got a shot off after the pass.
Do any of those guys play defense or goalie? Didn't think so.
You'll also recall Boller was OUT most of last season and thus not on the 4th line. Letestu was a 4th line regular was was Tropp. So, good try.
It is not often that I agree with ca5150. But I do here. Last year the fourth line of DMac, Letestu and Comeau took regular shifts and gave the top lines more time to rest and focus on offense. Has anyone noticed how little ice time the current fourth line gets? That is probably a couple of extra minutes per game added to Joey and Nick's legs. Game after game I suspect that takes a toll on their bodies. Hockey is a team game and when you mess with the team chemistry as JK did this off-season, it has its affect.
And by the way, it is true that Boll played much less last season. But that is part of my point. The fact that Boll is getting so much of an opportunity for playing time this year is clear evidence of the inferiority of this 4th line to the one we had last year.
And by the way, it is true that Boll played much less last season. But that is part of my point. The fact that Boll is getting so much of an opportunity for playing time this year is clear evidence of the inferiority of this 4th line to the one we had last year.
