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Boxscore said:
That's why you lock up Marner, Nylander and Matthews before you spend on big ticket UFA's.
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Agreed 100% but if Marner can’t learn to produce in the playoffs having him locked up is still a waste of cap resources
 
egd27 said:
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I love Tavares. I used to go watch him with the Generals, followed his career on the Island and when I bought my Canada jersey, I got his.

However, he was a luxury that the Leafs could not afford and it has, and will continue to, handcuff the Leafs. It was a mistake that Dubas cannot recover from.
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The Tavares signing never made sense on any level.

Matthews/Tavarez/Kerfoot making $26.1m.
Kadri was a MUCH better fit as the #2C and it would have allowed them to get a #3C like JG Pageau.

Matthews/Kadri/Pageau would be $21.6m.
Saves $4.5m and it’s an INFINITELY stronger group.
 
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AllDay28 said:
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You were cheering for the losers too. You even thought he “got it”. Ahahahahahhahaha

least I cheer for my team and don’t flip flop.
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I'm not hiding. I was on board but its clear now this team is no good as they continue to fail.
Shanny and Dubas continue to back the core even after 4 straight playoff loses. This just shows they are also a bunch of losers.
You wouldn't know any better. Continue to cheer for a loser organization.
 
hamzarocks said:
You don't cheer for the team you cheer for Kyle Dubas, Brandon Shanahan and Sheldon Keefe

Calling out management/players once we have seen them fail to take advantage of the easiest playoff match-up they could get these past 2 years isn't switching your takes it a natural process of evaluating the team and seeing that it's not good enough to believe as capable of winning
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No kidding. Poor results deserve criticism and that's why 90% of this board is on Shanny and Dubas to wake up or have had enough and want them out.
This guy needs to get a clue
 
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justashadowof said:
The flat cap caused this messy situation? You do realize that Dubas and the Leafs have only missed one off season cap rise to date? I can't remember the specific number of the forecasted cap rise for the summer of 2020 before the empty stadium hockey but what could have been? $3M maximum? And this season the league has given the teams many tools to handle the flat cap so the effects of the flat cap was lessened. This was happening regardless.
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The defenders of the unprecedented dramatic overpayments (more and more of which seem to have disappeared from around here...) always used the argument of: "Yeah, the first two years will be tough. But then new tv contracts/Seattle will make the cap skyrocket." I was always skepitcal of that plan. In my opinion, it would have been smarter to just not dramatically overpay all of our players. But make no mistake... Dubas' plan ONLY worked based on the idea that the cap would skyrocket very very soon.

Covid and the flat cap ruined the entire foundation for what the plan was based on. Far more than every other team (based on the timing for when our contracts were given out). There should be no more defending it. They even have their excuse to break up the "core". Covid/flat cap CHANGED the reality of the situation. It's time to see if Dubas and co REACT to this new reality. The old plan at least had a chance to work. But not any longer.
 
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Throw More Waffles said:
The defenders of the unprecedented dramatic overpayments (more and more of which seem to have disappeared from around here...) always used the argument of: "Yeah, the first two years will be tough. But then new tv contracts/Seattle will make the cap skyrocket." I was always skepitcal of that plan. In my opinion, it would have been smarter to just not dramatically overpay all of our players. But make no mistake... Dubas' plan ONLY worked based on the idea that the cap would skyrocket very very soon.

Covid and the flat cap ruined the entire foundation for what the plan was based on. Far more than every other team (based on the timing for when our contracts were given out). There should be no more defending it. They even have their excuse to break up the "core". Covid/flat cap CHANGED the reality of the situation. It's time to see if Dubas and co REACT to this new reality. The old plan at least had a chance to work. But not any longer.
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Prepare for the best but plan for the worst.

I also don’t buy that smart businesses couldn’t see the possibilities. I’m not interested in political debate but for reference, 44th POTUS had a pandemic response unit assembled in the event of this... 45 disassembled and redistributed funds.

One had the foresight, the other didn’t. Kyle Dubas is 45 in this instance.
 
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Throw More Waffles said:
The defenders of the unprecedented dramatic overpayments (more and more of which seem to have disappeared from around here...) always used the argument of: "Yeah, the first two years will be tough. But then new tv contracts/Seattle will make the cap skyrocket." I was always skepitcal of that plan. In my opinion, it would have been smarter to just not dramatically overpay all of our players. But make no mistake... Dubas' plan ONLY worked based on the idea that the cap would skyrocket very very soon.

Covid and the flat cap ruined the entire foundation for what the plan was based on. Far more than every other team (based on the timing for when our contracts were given out). There should be no more defending it. They even have their excuse to break up the "core". Covid/flat cap CHANGED the reality of the situation. It's time to see if Dubas and co REACT to this new reality. The old plan at least had a chance to work. But not any longer.
Click to expand...
reminds me of a story, something about counting chickens.........
 
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Throw More Waffles said:
The defenders of the unprecedented dramatic overpayments (more and more of which seem to have disappeared from around here...) always used the argument of: "Yeah, the first two years will be tough. But then new tv contracts/Seattle will make the cap skyrocket." I was always skepitcal of that plan. In my opinion, it would have been smarter to just not dramatically overpay all of our players. But make no mistake... Dubas' plan ONLY worked based on the idea that the cap would skyrocket very very soon.

Covid and the flat cap ruined the entire foundation for what the plan was based on. Far more than every other team (based on the timing for when our contracts were given out). There should be no more defending it. They even have their excuse to break up the "core". Covid/flat cap CHANGED the reality of the situation. It's time to see if Dubas and co REACT to this new reality. The old plan at least had a chance to work. But not any longer.
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All the above is true but cap issues aside Marner just plain sucks in the playoffs. We have ample evidence to that effect and I see no evidence that is going to change anytime soon. It blew my mind when he said that he wasn’t going to change anything next year to better prepare for the playoffs. He basically then cam out and said that he felt they played well and had lots of good looks.
He is freaking delusional
 
Donnie740 said:
The Tavares signing never made sense on any level.

Matthews/Tavarez/Kerfoot making $26.1m.
Kadri was a MUCH better fit as the #2C and it would have allowed them to get a #3C like JG Pageau.

Matthews/Kadri/Pageau would be $21.6m.
Saves $4.5m and it’s an INFINITELY stronger group.
Click to expand...

the same kadri who gets suspended every playoffs? Bold to expect him to be in the lineup…

so once he’s gone it’s Matthews / Pageau and that’s absolutely brutal. Good Ted talk
 
Man Bear Pig said:
No GM is perfect by any means, but it's silly to think Lou somehow makes this team make it further. He probably makes the same moves that Dubas did near the trade deadline.
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I think the big argument for Lou is that he probably plays hardball with Marner and signs the rest of the core to cheaper deals.
 
Donnie740 said:
The Tavares signing never made sense on any level.

Matthews/Tavarez/Kerfoot making $26.1m.
Kadri was a MUCH better fit as the #2C and it would have allowed them to get a #3C like JG Pageau.

Matthews/Kadri/Pageau would be $21.6m.
Saves $4.5m and it’s an INFINITELY stronger group.
Click to expand...

Let's not pretend trading Kadri was something the Leafs (Dubas) really wanted to do. They had to move him by his own doing, and obviously he still hasn't learned. Kadri was a very good player for the Leafs, but I don't care who he is.......repeatedly hampering himself and his team (kill a penalty, plus suspension) by making the same boneheaded mistake was punching his own ticket out of town. Also....it turned into Brodie becoming a Leaf, which ends up being a great signing.
 
Donnie740 said:
The Tavares signing never made sense on any level.

Matthews/Tavarez/Kerfoot making $26.1m.
Kadri was a MUCH better fit as the #2C and it would have allowed them to get a #3C like JG Pageau.

Matthews/Kadri/Pageau would be $21.6m.
Saves $4.5m and it’s an INFINITELY stronger group.
Click to expand...


yes in theory. Kadri will kadri again, so not really solving anything for playoffs.
 
ottomaddox said:
Hindsight?

So many people questioned everything:

1. Letting Lou go

2. Having a top heavy salary structure

3. Babcock

4. Rookie: Prez, GM, and Coach

5. The powerplay

6. The defence

Etc.

Nothing has been unanimous. Everything has been debatable. There hasn't been one moment where someone hasn't stood up and said "hey the powerplay is alarming", "These contracts are screwing up TOR's ability to compete", "The defense needs major improvements", "Hey I think Galychenuck isn't very good and does a lot of risky things out there", etc.

I think the "told you so's" need to get a lot louder IMHO.
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Ths list ^^ we can agree on. All of the above.
 
Donnie740 said:
The Tavares signing never made sense on any level.

Matthews/Tavarez/Kerfoot making $26.1m.
Kadri was a MUCH better fit as the #2C and it would have allowed them to get a #3C like JG Pageau.

Matthews/Kadri/Pageau would be $21.6m.
Saves $4.5m and it’s an INFINITELY stronger group.
Click to expand...

Matthews = Matthews
Tavares >> Kadri
Kerfoot => Pageau ...they are both 3rd liners, both have a career high 43 points, Kerfoot is actually the bigger of the 2 and is 1.5 Million cheaper

INFINITELY Weaker maybe!
 
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