WCQF Gm#2: KINGS vs. BLUES - 5/2/13 - Another Heartbreaker...

[DaAnimal]

Can we stop about the ridiculous Richards trade, holy hell.

 

[Steve Zissou]

Trade Richards?

You guys never seem to disappoint.

It's baffling - how every year it's the same old **** being posted again and again and again...

 

[KingKopitar11*]

To be honest, Richards is on the downside of his career. He's won it all. He is very inconsistent. And his playing style has took a toll on him. He doesn't throw big hits and all. Not that vey can replace him. I just think getting a left winger right now would be better then Richards.

It's all speculation I just want to see what happens in the offseason with our players and possible acquisitions.

 

[Herby]

No...

The whole reason to get Mike was so Stoll didn't have to play 2nd line center....

And the fact it's Mike Richards....Who is going to replace him ?

Vey ?

Are you kidding me.

Herby....Come on man. You hate the fact that Lombardi left a gaping hole at LW and Second line Center...

I know Richards play pissed you off this season. But the guy did show up for a cup run....

The first one, in like 45 years.

So now address LW and create that gapping hole again ?

Jeff Carter is signed through 2019, that is your 2nd line center for the next 6 seasons.

The Kings system is built on strength down the middle, they can't play that way if MR plays as poorly going forward as he did this season.

Just using Pacioretty as an example. I think the Kings would be a better team with Kopitar, Carter and Stoll up the middle and Brown, Pacioretty, Williams, Toffoli, + more cap space this coming season and more flexibility going forward. A better team and a very balanced roster.

 

[bral]

There are a few things everyone needs to get in touch with here.

- Mike Richards is not getting traded nor should he. He means a lot more to this team than points (which he provides) and the ability to up his game when it matters (which he does). Stop.

- This is the series everyone expected to see last season. These teams are about as evenly matched as you get. We haven't gotten the bounces, STL has been a bit hungrier, and a bad gaffe in game one arguably COMPLETELY changed the course of this series.

- The biggest thing we had going for us this series was some kind of mental voodoo we had over the Blues. That's gone now. We're seeing the Blues at their absolute best and they're arguably just flat out better than us this year.

- It's shocking, SHOCKING, that we even made the playoffs with this limp dick corps of defenseman. Voynov had a hot February, Muzzin had a hot March, Ellerby was a typical dumpster diving Dean move to fill a hole, Regehr the same, and Scuderi is getting old. The only blueliner we have worth his salt right now is Doughty and that's been the case, over the long run, all season long. I will say this once and very clearly: Mitchell was a SPECIAL defenseman and there's a reason he touched the Cup second. Regehr on his best day, in his prime, is no Mitchell. That's plain to see and ****ing heartbreaking because I would have really loved to see what this team could have done, intact. STL's defense is alarmingly better than ours. Doughty has been the best player on the point in this series by a fair margin, but through and through, Doughty to Ellerby, Pietrangelo to Polak, St. Louis takes this by a country ****ing mile.

- This series is a formality at this point. You can call me a Duck fan, or tell me to go away, or whatever the hell else you choose, but this series is done. 0-2 is not insurmountable - you're right. But I don't see a 0-2 series. I see a team that has yet to score an even strength goal, a team with a revolving door of left wing fillers throughout its top six, a team with two rookies comprising an entire defensive pairing, a team that resorted to gooning it up in the first to gain an edge, and a team that has now, officially, gone 0-5-3 in its last 8 road games.

Say I'm a pessimist, say I'm a crappy fan, but I call it like I see it. The Kings have had no business playing in this series thus far. Show me a way in which that could conceivably change and I'll have some hope. Until then, night night.

And that's not a terrible thing, either. This team has its core and we have our Cup. A first round exit will accomplish just as much as the last three teams before us to win it all. I'm okay with that. It gives management a good cause to step back and honestly look at our lineup without championship tinted sunglasses. Is King a NHL player? Should Carter be a winger? Is Voynov a true number two behind Doughty? What do we move Bernier for? Etc. etc.

This team will be stronger and better next year and that's a good thing. Look at the Hawks. They won a championship, lost half of their team, went through some growing pains, and boom, President's trophy. Is our core any worse than the Hawks? I submit that, no, it is not.

I'm all for the boys winning a couple at home and getting my hopes up, but I just don't see that happening, not the way the series has gone so far. It is what it is.

I completely agree. This team knows what it takes to win the Cup and I don't think they really want to endure all that again. Not so soon anyways. We have a few guys who are showing up but that's obviously not going to get it done. We got our cup, lets enjoy is for another month, then back to the drawing board.


The two main reasons why the Kings won't go far this year for me are 1) Defense(Ellerby,Muzzin) 2) They don't want to.

 

[damacles1156]

Jeff Carter is signed through 2019, that is your 2nd line center for the next 6 seasons.

The Kings system is built on strength down the middle, they can't play that way if MR plays as poorly going forward as he did this season.

Just using Pacioretty as an example. I think the Kings would be a better team with Kopitar, Carter and Stoll up the middle and Brown, Pacioretty, Williams, Toffoli, + more cap space this coming season and more flexibility going forward. A better team and a very balanced roster.

Carter is a much better Winger , He can concentrate on what he does best...Score goals.

Carter has been a dud as a Center when the Kings have tried it.

 

[damacles1156]

To be honest, Richards is on the downside of his career. He's won it all. He is very inconsistent. And his playing style has took a toll on him. He doesn't throw big hits and all. Not that vey can replace him. I just think getting a left winger right now would be better then Richards.

It's all speculation I just want to see what happens in the offseason with our players and possible acquisitions.

That's what everyone said last year too....

Wow.

You know Mike Richards didn't luck his way into every single championship Hockey has to offer.

If your going to trade someone based of this years playoff performance.

You trade Kopitar, the Kings would get far more.

Like way more.

That sounds ridiculous right ? It should.....

 

[Herby]

The two main reasons why the Kings won't go far this year for me are 1) Defense(Ellerby,Muzzin) 2) They don't want to.

It amazes me, the team has scored 2 goals in 2 games, one of them on a 5 on 3 and people are blaming the two rookie d-man.

I'm not saying Ellerby is good, I think he has been below average, but has he even been on the ice for a goal against in this series?

 

[Herby]

Carter is a much better Winger , He can concentrate on what he does best...Score goals.

Carter has been a dud as a Center when the Kings have tried it.

Carter has played very little as a center for the Kings. Sutter only really tried it earlier in the year when MR was playing horrible, and recently when Kopitar was playing horrible. Even then it probably wasn't for more than 5 games.

And there are plenty of centers who are shoot first players.

 

[KingKopitar11*]

That's what everyone said last year too....

Wow.

You know Mike Richards didn't luck his way into every single championship Hockey has to offer.

If your going to trade someone based of this years playoff performance.

You trade Kopitar, the Kings would get far more.

Like way more.

Okay, first of all our cup run everyone was playing on a different level not only Richards, he didn't carry the team on his back. And yeah he didn't luck his way. But there is this thing called age, and going out their prime. I think Richards has passed his prime.

Kopitar just entered his prime. 25

 

[damacles1156]

Okay, first of all our cup run everyone was playing on a different level not only Richards, he didn't carry the team on his back. And yeah he didn't luck his way. But there is this thing called age, and going out their prime. I think Richards has passed his prime.

Kopitar just entered his prime. 25

Mike Richards is 28....

You sound like a Philly fan, So Richards was a passenger got it ...


People think Richards is 40 or what ?

 

[Steve Zissou]

Okay, first of all our cup run everyone was playing on a different level not only Richards, he didn't carry the team on his back. And yeah he didn't luck his way. But there is this thing called age, and going out their prime. I think Richards has passed his prime.

Kopitar just entered his prime. 25

I have no words.

 

[damacles1156]

I have no words.

Shocking isn't it.

It's like the twilight zone around here after a loss.

 

[Herby]

That's what everyone said last year too....

Wow.

You know Mike Richards didn't luck his way into every single championship Hockey has to offer.

If your going to trade someone based of this years playoff performance.

You trade Kopitar, the Kings would get far more.

Like way more.

That sounds ridiculous right ? It should.....

I am not calling Mike Richards a horrible player, but many of those things were won in past years. I guess what it comes down to is whether you think this season was an anomaly or a continued downward trend of a certain player. I have already said I don't expect a trade this summer, not Richards, not Kopitar, not anyone who is considered a key player. But when a player falls off so much from where he was 2-3 years ago it is fair to bring up a potential trade.

As for trading Kopi, well he has built up more equity with the franchise, is more well known and marketable to the market and is only signed through 2016. If Kopitar were to fall off the cliff his contract is far less of an issue. Plus, to be honest, Kopitar is a far better player and his offensive and defensive numbers have been more consistent than Richards, by a large margin.

 

[KingKopitar11*]

Mike Richards is 28....

You sound like a Philly fan, So Richards was a passenger got it ...


People think Richards is 40 or what ?

Dude, no one was a passenger. Everyone was playing great I didn't say he was a passenger, I said he didn't carry the team on his back.
Hockey player primes are 25-29. He's regressed, he may be coming off his prime or Has one year left but it looks like he's coming off it.

I just want to trade him while he has good value.

 

[damacles1156]

I am not calling Mike Richards a horrible player, but many of those things were won in past years. I guess what it comes down to is whether you think this season was an anomaly or a continued downward trend of a certain player. I have already said I don't expect a trade this summer, not Richards, not Kopitar, not anyone who is considered a key player. But when a player falls off so much from where he was 2-3 years ago it is fair to bring up a potential trade.

As for trading Kopi, well he has built up more equity with the franchise, is more well known and marketable to the market and is only signed through 2016. If Kopitar were to fall off the cliff his contract is far less of an issue. Plus, to be honest, Kopitar is a far better player and his offensive and defensive numbers have been more consistent than Richards, by a large margin.

Richards production is not even that big of a drop off.

He had one Elite 80 point season....ONE. Then has been about a 66 point player...

That is about his pace this year.

Herby do you know what Richards we are talking about ?

You seem to think Richards was Constant 80 point player...That never happened.

He had one year at 75 and one at 80. Other than that he is a 60 point player.

He would have hit 60 this year.

5on5 he stunk this year, but so has Kopitar....so

 

[KingKopitar11*]

I have no words.

Great. Just because we have different views doesn't mean anything. Pretty ignorant response. I'm not calling him out for one game. You probably like him alot. I like him but I'm neutral because I think we get a much more needed product by trading him because we need wingers.

Also, it's actually nice to have a little argument over hockey. It'd suck if we are all on the same page. Just because we see differently doesn't mean that something will happen. It's just my POV against someone elses. It'snot a big deal.

 

[TheSlovenian]

There's no way the Kings organisation trade Kopitar, unless he goes in full Gomez mode.

 

[damacles1156]

There's no way the Kings organisation trade Kopitar, unless he goes in full Gomez mode.

The point was it's ridiculous to suggest it, Just like Trading Richards.

Richards would most likely be the best player in any deal that was made.

Anyone miss Simmonds and Schenn ? If you say yes.....One has a Cup the others were golfing.

What did Luc say, "Mike Richards is the guy you trade for to win Cups"

 

[Herby]

Mike Richards is 28....

People think Richards is 40 or what ?

Some players age better, it's as simple as that.

Mike York and Mark Parrish went from all-star caliber players to out of the league by 30.

Mike Richards has played a style of hockey that is physically demanding, he has played a lot of games at this level. It wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that he could be on the downside of his career. A 5'11 player who plays like he did probably isn't going to be playing into his late 30's.

I just don't have much of a read on him, I will admit it. He is the most maddeningly inconsistent player I have ever seen for this team. I've never seen a guy who can be the best player on the ice one game and the worst the next, and that happened multiple times this season. I can think of multiple games where I said to myself

"Wow Richards is back, this looks like the Philly guy"

and then the next game he looks like the lovechild of Craig Johnson and Jozef Stumpel.

That is why I said in the earlier post it wouldn't shock me if next year he had 70 points and was an all-star or if he had 30 points and stunk. Even Sutter has mentioned this in some of his quotes. Richards is especially horrible away from Staples Center, where opposing coaches can exploit him in matchups. Something Sutter even mentioned before game 2.

I don't know, we will see. I agree there is no way he is being traded this summer, but I think next year is going to tell us quite a bit about what kind of player he will be going forward.

 

[damacles1156]

Some players age better, it's as simple as that.

Mike York and Mark Parrish went from all-star caliber players to out of the league by 30.

Mike Richards has played a style of hockey that is physically demanding, he has played a lot of games at this level. It wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that he could be on the downside of his career. A 5'11 player who plays like he did probably isn't going to be playing into his late 30's.

I just don't have much of a read on him, I will admit it. He is the most maddeningly inconsistent player I have ever seen for this team. I've never seen a guy who can be the best player on the ice one game and the worst the next, and that happened multiple times this season. I can think of multiple games where I said to myself

"Wow Richards is back, this looks like the Philly guy"

and then the next game he looks like the lovechild of Craig Johnson and Jozef Stumpel.

That is why I said in the earlier post it wouldn't shock me if next year he had 70 points and was an all-star or if he had 30 points and stunk. Even Sutter has mentioned this in some of his quotes. Richards is especially horrible away from Staples Center, where opposing coaches can exploit him in matchups. Something Sutter even mentioned before game 2.

I don't know, we will see. I agree there is no way he is being traded this summer, but I think next year is going to tell us quite a bit about what kind of player he will be going forward.

Kopitar must be really pissing you off this year then, He got owned this year by guys like Bolland.

Toews has made Kopitar his ***** every game they played. The Blues fourth line has made Kopitar look like a child. Backes ? are you serious ? Kopitar is getting out played by Backes....

So Richards has a lot of a games on his body and is old I guess and small.

Whats Kopitar's excuse ?

Kopitar has also had the two of the Kings best wingers on his line the whole year.....

 

[KingKopitar11*]

IE Temmu Selanne, always played a finesse game. Not a physical player. That's how he his still playing. Players like Richards have to be BIG to have more longevity. Jagr is huge in example and physical. Is MSL a physical guy, nope that's why he's still playing. Size and style are important to understand a player.

 

[damacles1156]

IE Temmu Selanne, always played a finesse game. Not a physical player. That's how he his still playing. Players like Richards have to be BIG to have more longevity. Jagr is huge in example and physical. Is MSL a physical guy, nope that's why he's still playing. Size and style are important to understand a player.

Ok again, What's Kopitar's excuse then ? isnt Kopitar in his prime.

Kopitar also has a distinct size advantage.

 

[KingKopitar11*]

Ok again, What's Kopitar's excuse then ?

Lazy as hell. not a confident player.

Also, If you notice. Brown doesn't hit big any more? Wonder why? He's getting older. It takes a toll on him. He made a smart choice. He's playing more of a finesse game, scoring goals and shooting. He adjusted his game to last longer. Age and style mean a lot. Brown is smart. He changed his style before it was too late.

Kopitar should be entering his prime right now, but he just won the cup so I'm not sure since he his young. But giving him a year or two wouldn't make it too late to trade him. You cant say the same for richards because of his age.

 

[Herby]

Jonathan Toews owned Kopitar? Really

Jonathan Toews was on the ice for 6 even strength goals against the Kings this season, you want to take a guess who the other center was for all 6 of those goals? Give you a hint, it wasn't Kopitar.