Player Discussion: Vesalainen Thread

[GJF]

About the Armia comparison: Vesalainen might be more physical than Joel but Joel has a lot better hands and is quite an intelligent player. Intelligence I haven't seen from Vesa to date to say the least. Not saying Vesa is a "dumb" hockey player but not as smart as Joel, IMO. But yeah, Joel Armia but being more about speed and physicality than a defensive game, awesome hands and smart plays is a good projection.

 

[Guido Borsato]

There are 23 players in league history that have played in exactly 35 games for their entire career, same number that KV has played to date in his career.

Of those 23 players he is 21st in points with a grand total of 3.

He has 1 goal and 2 assists for a total of 3 points in 35 games played.

He has never taken so much as a minor penalty in those 35 games and is good for about .6 shots per game which would extrapolate to 44 shots in 82 games.

What does he do out there exactly?

He was so cocky on draft day when we picked him and for this?

For those staunch Vesalainen supporters out there, please tell me why the Jets give him so much rope when Gus, Reichel, and Suess deserve fair shots in the bottom 6.

 

[snowkiddin]

I would hesitate to suggest the Jets have given him so much rope.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Does it matter how good a guy could be if he isn't given an opportunity to play more? I mean... 4 minutes a game? What do ppl expect? He's got more goals than Wheeler.

Put him in the top 6 for a few games.

Then you will see what u might actually have.

Opportunity

I'm not saying he's been good or bad... he just really hasn't been given an opportunity to play with skilled guys.

To be honest Paul should play the 4th line more because they look good in their 4 minutes a night

 

[irunthepeg]

Does it matter how good a guy could be if he isn't given an opportunity to play more? I mean... 4 minutes a game? What do ppl expect? He's got more goals than Wheeler.

Put him in the top 6 for a few games.

Then you will see what u might actually have.

Opportunity

I'm not saying he's been good or bad... he just really hasn't been given an opportunity to play with skilled guys.

To be honest Paul should play them more

People forget if not for an injury to Bryan Little, Mark Scheifele may never have busted out as a 1C for this team (disregarding his current status on the team). All about opportunity, sometimes. To be fair, I wouldn't say Vesalainen has shown much but he also has not been given much.

 

[surixon]

What I've seen from him despite low minutes:

He's been solid defensively and 9n the forecheck.

He's also starting to get into the spots to use that big shot of his more and he's showing more confidence with the puck down low.

It's been really slow with him but I still think he can develop into a Nichushkin type power middle 6 winger.

 

[gojetsgo]

5 games in 2018/2019 when he wasn't ready
12 games in 2020-2021 mostly spread out thru the entire season only get 2-4 mins a night so it's impossible to get into any sort of rhythm
18 games this year where he started up the lineup due to scheif/wheeler having covid and played pretty well but helle got sick and berdin needed to be called up he was the only waiver allegeable player to be sent down then when recalled he was stuck back on the 4th line hardly playing

he would benefit from a more balanced lineup where he actually gets decent minutes

the only player you listed that should get a shot in the bottom six would be gus but i still wouldn't take vesa out for him it would be someone else

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Ves Gus Toni would be a solid 4th line with 5 minutes a game while 26 plays 26

 

[Al Camino]

There are 23 players in league history that have played in exactly 35 games for their entire career, same number that KV has played to date in his career.

Of those 23 players he is 21st in points with a grand total of 3.

He has 1 goal and 2 assists for a total of 3 points in 35 games played.

He has never taken so much as a minor penalty in those 35 games and is good for about .6 shots per game which would extrapolate to 44 shots in 82 games.

What does he do out there exactly?

He was so cocky on draft day when we picked him and for this?

For those staunch Vesalainen supporters out there, please tell me why the Jets give him so much rope when Gus, Reichel, and Suess deserve fair shots in the bottom 6.

Hard to impress with 5 minutes a game with the line mates he's been given.

 

[Heldig]

I would like to see a line with Vesalainen - Lowry - Wheeler. All big, heavy guys. Maybe some of Wheeler's sweet passes to Veslainen can get the guy unleashing his powerful shot in good positions to score, get some confidence going.

 

[BoneDocUK]

Hard to impress with 5 minutes a game with the line mates he's been given.

This.

Also working like crazy to pretty much remold his game to suit the checker/ grinder playstyle his coach demands, which directly determines his opportunities under that coach.

There is no world in which Ves is Patrik Laine, but he has done what Laine refused or was unable to do, and gutted his game as a scoring winger who cashed in on the PP to become a version of Joel Armia that doesn't PK. He may not read at the play at an elite level but he still has formidable tools and is clearly willing to put in the time and effort to play a team game, and I do think that he'll develop into a useful piece who is hell to play against and can put up some points.

I really think we start to see that once Gus makes it up, and he gets more than a few minutes per game and has a slightly looser leash. Then again, Gus doesn't come up unless Was is waived or Ves goes down, so who the hell knows?

As posters have said here for years, trying to gauge upside for a prospect on PoMo's 4th Line Island of Misfit Toys is an exercise in futility. Maybe a PLD can make a go of it, or an Ehlers, but would today's version of 55 be pounding them in from there?

 

[LowLefty]

Hard to impress with 5 minutes a game with the line mates he's been given.

That's exactly what his line mates say

 

[BigHulkingThickV]

I think we as fans should be happy with Vesalainen so far. Granted, he has not yet lived up to our expectations, but I don't believe that's entirely his fault. What he *has* done is fundamentally change how he plays the game. He is young and very much still developing, he has certainly not hit his ceiling. *If* he can put it all together in a more offensive role, and that is a big if, we are all in for a big treat.

He needs a steady opportunity in an offensive role, in my opinion. Sure, it'd be lovely if every player knocked down the door and scored 30 goals right away. Unfortunately, we have to operate in reality, sometimes we have to give players the opportunity required to achieve success. Vesalainen has been asked to do a lot so far, he has been moved around the organization like a handsome, Finnish puppet. He isn't setting the world on fire but he is certainly not hurting this team, which can't be said for everyone.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I think we as fans should be happy with Vesalainen so far. Granted, he has not yet lived up to our expectations, but I don't believe that's entirely his fault. What he *has* done is fundamentally change how he plays the game. He is young and very much still developing, he has certainly not hit his ceiling. *If* he can put it all together in a more offensive role, and that is a big if, we are all in for a big treat.

He needs a steady opportunity in an offensive role, in my opinion. Sure, it'd be lovely if every player knocked down the door and scored 30 goals right away. Unfortunately, we have to operate in reality, sometimes we have to give players the opportunity required to achieve success. Vesalainen has been asked to do a lot so far, he has been moved around the organization like a handsome, Finnish puppet. He isn't setting the world on fire but he is certainly not hurting this team, which can't be said for everyone.

Unfortunately I can't see a space where he can get a steady opportunity. I mean not on the first 2 lines and probably not on the 3rd line either. In the minutes the 4th line has been on Harkins has looked better, more effective and dangerous than Ves. I think if he doesn't prove something this year he gets leapfrogged by Perfetti for a top 6 role. We are losing Stas and Copp so there might be a role for him on that 3rd line.

 

[FonRiesen]

Unfortunately I can't see a space where he can get a steady opportunity. I mean not on the first 2 lines and probably not on the 3rd line either. In the minutes the 4th line has been on Harkins has looked better, more effective and dangerous than Ves. I think if he doesn't prove something this year he gets leapfrogged by Perfetti for a top 6 role. We are losing Stas and Copp so there might be a role for him on that 3rd line.

I don't think he needs to play top 6 to help our team/make an impact. We have the personnel to run 3 scoring lines and an energy line, or even run 4 good lines and never let up (and our stars wouldn't have to 'conserve energy' and play casual as much as they do now to conserve energy).

 

[Adam da bomb]

I don't think he needs to play top 6 to help our team/make an impact. We have the personnel to run 3 scoring lines and an energy line, or even run 4 good lines and never let up (and our stars wouldn't have to 'conserve energy' and play casual as much as they do now to conserve energy).

Maurice has to just get used to playing different guys on the pk. Ves Gus and Toninato would be a good line.

 

[BigZ65]

I think we as fans should be happy with Vesalainen so far. Granted, he has not yet lived up to our expectations, but I don't believe that's entirely his fault. What he *has* done is fundamentally change how he plays the game. He is young and very much still developing, he has certainly not hit his ceiling. *If* he can put it all together in a more offensive role, and that is a big if, we are all in for a big treat.

He needs a steady opportunity in an offensive role, in my opinion. Sure, it'd be lovely if every player knocked down the door and scored 30 goals right away. Unfortunately, we have to operate in reality, sometimes we have to give players the opportunity required to achieve success. Vesalainen has been asked to do a lot so far, he has been moved around the organization like a handsome, Finnish puppet. He isn't setting the world on fire but he is certainly not hurting this team, which can't be said for everyone.

I think he should show that he can get a shot on net before we pull someone and put him with the guys who create offense. He’ll get a chance eventually with injuries but he needs to do something or he’ll get passed here pretty quickly.

 

[BoneDocUK]

So…. Is the kid gonna be okay?

 

[Gabe Kupari]

He looks like he just needs opportunity

 

[BigHulkingThickV]

Take that haters, KVes is goal per game if you only count the most recent game.

 

[thai jet]

There are 23 players in league history that have played in exactly 35 games for their entire career, same number that KV has played to date in his career.

Of those 23 players he is 21st in points with a grand total of 3.

He has 1 goal and 2 assists for a total of 3 points in 35 games played.

He has never taken so much as a minor penalty in those 35 games and is good for about .6 shots per game which would extrapolate to 44 shots in 82 games.

What does he do out there exactly?

He was so cocky on draft day when we picked him and for this?

For those staunch Vesalainen supporters out there, please tell me why the Jets give him so much rope when Gus, Reichel, and Suess deserve fair shots in the bottom 6.

Vesa has been asked to play a sound defensive game. His 5on5 goals against/60 is the best on the team at 1.1. Last game he was asked to get more offence in his game and he had 5 shots and a beautiful goal. /

 

[surixon]

Vesa has been asked to play a sound defensive game. His 5on5 goals against/60 is the best on the team at 1.1. Last game he was asked to get more offence in his game and he had 5 shots and a beautiful goal. /

Yup he's slowly putting it all together.

 

[Duke749]

Yup he's slowly putting it all together.

I feel like this is a guy who would benefit very well finding openings in the low slot. He seems to have done a lot of what the coaching staff has asked of him and exceeded as opposed to perhaps other players. I think he still has a pro future in this league. Patience is warranted I think.

 

[surixon]

I feel like this is a guy who would benefit very well finding openings in the low slot. He seems to have done a lot of what the coaching staff has asked of him and exceeded as opposed to perhaps other players. I think he still has a pro future in this league. Patience is warranted I think.

Yup, now that he has that safe defensive game that Moe likes he can start to add in his puck skills and shot to his repertoire. He just needs to get some more confidence finishing and I think he gets on track. He has a pro shot that can beat goalies if he continues to figure out where and when to use it.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Yup, now that he has that safe defensive game that Moe likes he can start to add in his puck skills and shot to his repertoire. He just needs to get some more confidence finishing and I think he gets on track. He has a pro shot that can beat goalies if he continues to figure out where and when to use it.

I wonder if they should try and give him some pp time over Copp or even go 4 forwards on the second unit.