Unpopular Wrestling Opinions

[BruinDust]

Not sure if this qualifies as unpopular but the Attitude Era kicked off officially at KOTR 1996. The response to the NWO angle with a more edgy WWF product that pushed the envelope was immediate. Like within weeks immediate. Nash and Hall were on Nitro in late May breaking ground in reality and carnage in a way never seen before. And by the end of June WWF was already experimenting with what would become a more permanent formula.

I'd even take it a step further to say that there is a 50 day stretch in 1996 that forever changed the professional wrestling business in such ways that here we are almost 25 years to the day the shift all started IMO.....

May 19 - MSG Curtain Call

May 27 - Hall appears on Nitro

June 10 - Nash appears on Nitro

June 16 - Hall and Nash powerbomb Bischoff threw a table at the Great American Bash

June 23 - Steve Austin wins King of the Ring and drops his "Austin 3:16" promo

July 7 - Hulk Hogan is revealed as the 3rd man, turns heel and joins the nWo

7 weeks after the curtain call and the business was never the same again.

 

[Megahab]

I think the curtain call us overrated in terms of impact. I mean, how did that actually impact anything? And was it even big news at the time? Because the first time I ever heard of it was in late 1997 (a year and a half after the actual incident) in a DX promo.

 

[BruinDust]

I think the curtain call us overrated in terms of impact. I mean, how did that actually impact anything? And was it even big news at the time? Because the first time I ever heard of it was in late 1997 (a year and a half after the actual incident) in a DX promo.

From what I remember, the internet as far as wrestling news was still in it's infancy. For most fans, it wasn't until that DX promo that we got wind of it. I think it was much more impactful with those in the business than it was for the fans.

It's biggest impact IMO when you really look at it was it set-up Austin to win KoTR and not Triple H.

 

[Machinehead]

From what I remember, the internet as far as wrestling news was still in it's infancy. For most fans, it wasn't until that DX promo that we got wind of it. I think it was much more impactful with those in the business than it was for the fans.

It's biggest impact IMO when you really look at it was it set-up Austin to win KoTR and not Triple H.

I agree it was more important on the inside because it was the funeral of kayfabe for those who had protected it for so many generations. But from our perspective it was dying and dead for years.

 

[BruinDust]

I agree it was more important on the inside because it was the funeral of kayfabe for those who had protected it for so many generations. But from our perspective it was dying and dead for years.

I'd say the same about the Montreal Screwjob. I was in my mid-to-late teens at the time, and was well aware that pro wrestling was scripted, the screwjob didn't pull back the curtain for me or many others. Kayfabe was already gone. The creation of the Mr. McMahon character is to me the longest lasting legacy of the infamous screwjob.

 

[Megahab]

From what I remember, the internet as far as wrestling news was still in it's infancy. For most fans, it wasn't until that DX promo that we got wind of it. I think it was much more impactful with those in the business than it was for the fans.

It's biggest impact IMO when you really look at it was it set-up Austin to win KoTR and not Triple H.

I think another thing that's impact is overrated is Austin's KOTR win. I'm talking about the win itself, not the promo after. I like to believe that that promo was going to happen at some point anyway. But the actual win didn't lead to much of a push. They didn't start pushing Austin until after Summerslam thay year when he threw out the challenge to Bret Hart.

 

[BruinDust]

I think another thing that's impact is overrated is Austin's KOTR win. I'm talking about the win itself, not the promo after. I like to believe that that promo was going to happen at some point anyway. But the actual win didn't lead to much of a push. They didn't start pushing Austin until after Summerslam thay year when he threw out the challenge to Bret Hart.

I think that's fair, it was the promo that was the impactful part, the win not so much. Like you said, it's not like he received a massive push as KotR, matter of fact he was I think the first one since 1993 that didn't incorporate the "King" stuff into his gimmick (thankfully). Although he did face the Undertaker on Raw the very next night.

 

[Ozz]

The early internet version of web forums, Usenet newsgroups, were awesome. Pretty much zero wannabe know-nothing dumbasses crowding up the place. Just "smarks" sharing and discussing.

 

[Kaner9]

I say the curtain call only gets talked about so much cause it almost makes HHH and underdog and he wants that story out there.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

I think the curtain call us overrated in terms of impact. I mean, how did that actually impact anything? And was it even big news at the time? Because the first time I ever heard of it was in late 1997 (a year and a half after the actual incident) in a DX promo.

The curtain call was the business getting fully exposed in the middle of MSG.

Don't forget that kayfabe was still mostly alive back then

 

[Megahab]

The curtain call was the business getting fully exposed in the middle of MSG.

Don't forget that kayfabe was still mostly alive back then

But I mean, if the curtain call hadn't happened, how would that have changed anything? I don't think it would have changed anything at all.

 

[koyvoo]

It changed the entire way the industry was perceived and more importantly, the way the industry presented itself.

I want really aware, or don’t remember being aware of the curtain call at the time, or at least don’t remember that it specifically took me aback, but I do remember a few weeks/months later, during the whole fake Razor/Diesel angle, Jim Ross saying on a WWF broadcast “...and Vince McMahon fired my ass..”

It was the first time the show acknowledged Vince as anything other than a commentator. The curtain call opened the door for that by killing kayfabe. I was indeed taken aback by that moment, knew it signified something big, unprecedented, and that things wouldn’t, couldn’t be the same again.

 

[Megahab]

It changed the entire way the industry was perceived and more importantly, the way the industry presented itself.

I want really aware, or don’t remember being aware of the curtain call at the time, or at least don’t remember that it specifically took me aback, but I do remember a few weeks/months later, during the whole fake Razor/Diesel angle, Jim Ross saying on a WWF broadcast “...and Vince McMahon fired my ass..”

It was the first time the show acknowledged Vince as anything other than a commentator. The curtain call opened the door for that by killing kayfabe. I was indeed taken aback by that moment, knew it signified something big, unprecedented, and that things wouldn’t, couldn’t be the same again.

I don't think the curtain call had any connection to JR saying that. The reason I day this is that not many people knew about the curtain call until it was acknowledged on TV more than a year later. If WWE didn't publicily acknowledge it on TV, I'm not sure how many people would even have found out about it until several years later.

 

[HandsomeHollywood]

But I mean, if the curtain call hadn't happened, how would that have changed anything? I don't think it would have changed anything at all.

I think the curtain call was a piece that made breaking kayfabe and allowing insider info out there easier to swallow. It was just a step towards "normalization", especially for Vince. Without the curtain call, dropping some of the phonier aspects would have taken longer. That's the way I see it anyway. It's impact was more symbolic and subtle than blatant.

Now for my unpopular opinion; I think the Attitude Era mostly holds up fine today if you judge it for what it was at the time. The best part of it was the flow of the shows. If there was something bad (and there was plenty), it was brisk. A far cry from today where they either stubbornly stick to their plans or frivolously change their plans on a whim, in between people having 15-minute matches with nothing on the line and no momentum swing or maintainment.

 

[kingsholygrail]

Looking back at some old matches and really the Royal Rumble just sucks. lol Mostly because there's nothing they can really do with a bunch of guys in the ring. So it starts pretty strong, then just becomes crappy and you just want it to end. Watching Undertaker jab guys for 30 minutes and basically do nothing else was pretty boring.

 

[CDJ]

I think the stuff ROH did with Steen in the early 2010’s was the best stuff done in wrestling the entire decade

 

[MVP of West Hollywd]

The WWE misses face Reigns more than they're benefitting from heel Reigns. He is great at both but the show being built around a babyface is easier storytelling wise.

 

[boredmale]

Looking back at some old matches and really the Royal Rumble just sucks. lol Mostly because there's nothing they can really do with a bunch of guys in the ring. So it starts pretty strong, then just becomes crappy and you just want it to end. Watching Undertaker jab guys for 30 minutes and basically do nothing else was pretty boring.

I know I am getting old but I much rather watch a bunch of people "jabbing" each other then what I see in AEW battle royals were everybody goes to their corner, sits and just watch 2 guys do a spotfest only to have them finish and 2 more people do a spotfest as everybody sits in the corner and watches. A Royal Rumble/Battle Royal can really get storylines and people over if they book it right(although most battle royals are just thrown together and don't really go all out in terms of building storylines or pushing characters beyond the winner).

I will say the biggest problem for me with the Royal Rumble is when they started to make the winner get a title shot. The novelty was great for a couple years but after that it made the Rumble to predictable that you basically knew that only 2-4 guys had any legit chance. I think they would almost be better served to give the winner a title shot the next night on raw or Smackdown, that way it's much harder to predict who will win because you expand you potential list from like 4 guys to 10 or so.

 

[CDJ]

Watching Lockdown 2005 on YouTube because why not

Don West is a king, I love wrestling Billy Mays


Also Candido + Lance Archer vs Apollo + Sonny Siaki is the first match. This is the match that led to Candido dying days later

 

[These Are The Days]

Opinion 1. I doubt many will agree with me but the Rock had more heat than Austin. We can debate who had bigger pops coming out. But Rock's character allowed for more audience participation than Austin's. Especially when cutting promos before matches and it had them eating out of his hand.



Opinion 2. Whoever said Austin's booking trumped Roman's and "Cena Wins" and gave it an unflattering remark (beats me what they said) was absolutely right. By the end of any given PPV he could just stun a guy during a title match and walk away without a pinfall, submission etc and it somehow means he won.

 

[Kaner9]

Lance T. Storm was not a very good in ring wrestler people just believe it cause he was boring. Charmin soft

BUT his boringness made him a talker than I enjoyed. If that makes any sense.

 

[JackSlater]

Opinion 1. I doubt many will agree with me but the Rock had more heat than Austin. We can debate who had bigger pops coming out. But Rock's character allowed for more audience participation than Austin's. Especially when cutting promos before matches and it had them eating out of his hand.



Opinion 2. Whoever said Austin's booking trumped Roman's and "Cena Wins" and gave it an unflattering remark (beats me what they said) was absolutely right. By the end of any given PPV he could just stun a guy during a title match and walk away without a pinfall, submission etc and it somehow means he won.

Seems difficult to go with that first option. My memory, despite liking Rock a lot more than I did Austin, was that Austin consistently had bigger reactions, and usually it wasn't close. Rock had uneven reactions despite how charismatic he was.

 

[These Are The Days]

Seems difficult to go with that first option. My memory, despite liking Rock a lot more than I did Austin, was that Austin consistently had bigger reactions, and usually it wasn't close. Rock had uneven reactions despite how charismatic he was.

I actually feel like your comment sums the observation nicely. I think Austin would get better pops but at about the time Rock had 18,000 people chanting his name on command. I think Austin's heat was starting to fade off a little bit. Or I'm very much wrong and to the credit of anyone here who saw the AE in its entirety, they can tell me it's very possible I'm just picking up on a brief period of time when The Rock was running hotter and Austin picked it up later.

This would not surprise me. Reason being I'm realizing now that my time in the AE as a kid was isolated to almost exclusively to about 3 weeks in May 1999, the KOTR and the brief run with the Corporate Ministry. And later on, some time around "Right To Censor" which hasn't happened yet in my current timeline seeing much of the product for the first time. I otherwise picked it up again on a nightly basis in Spring 2002 and it immediately occurs to me somehow missed the entire invasion, Mania X7 and X8 and my only memory of that time was an episode of Smackdown where Austin beat the holy shit out of Chris Benoit and got booed out of the building and Vince bringing back the NWO

 

[les Habs]

Lance T. Storm was not a very good in ring wrestler people just believe it cause he was boring. Charmin soft

BUT his boringness made him a talker than I enjoyed. If that makes any sense.

I disagree. He was good in the ring, especially for his time. He’s most memorable for his mic work though.

 

[JackSlater]

I actually feel like your comment sums the observation nicely. I think Austin would get better pops but at about the time Rock had 18,000 people chanting his name on command. I think Austin's heat was starting to fade off a little bit. Or I'm very much wrong and to the credit of anyone here who saw the AE in its entirety, they can tell me it's very possible I'm just picking up on a brief period of time when The Rock was running hotter and Austin picked it up later.

This would not surprise me. Reason being I'm realizing now that my time in the AE as a kid was isolated to almost exclusively to about 3 weeks in May 1999, the KOTR and the brief run with the Corporate Ministry. And later on, some time around "Right To Censor" which hasn't happened yet in my current timeline seeing much of the product for the first time. I otherwise picked it up again on a nightly basis in Spring 2002 and it immediately occurs to me somehow missed the entire invasion, Mania X7 and X8 and my only memory of that time was an episode of Smackdown where Austin beat the holy shit out of Chris Benoit and got booed out of the building and Vince bringing back the NWO

Rock had very hot periods and I could see him being more "interactive" with the crowd. I recall him having reactions that were sort of a precursor to Cena's reactions, though the very rich man's version. It seemed like there was pretty much always a segment of the crowd that was ready to turn on face Rock, then he would go heel and win everyone back right away so that the process could begin again. 1999 was a really good period for Rock, but understandably his reactions would suffer later on once he started missing time for Hollywood commitments.

The thing with Austin is that even when his stuff was stale and full of repetitiveness, he still had massive popularity as a face. His heel turn makes perfect sense in terms of freshening up his gimmick and giving him some new angles, but people didn't like it because he was still so popular. Something like Rock-Hogan where the crowd dropped Rock for Hogan wouldn't have happened to Austin any time during his prime, even with Toronto being a Hogan hotbed.