Blue Jays Discussion: Turn out the lights, the season's over.

[phillipmike]

Without looking at it in detail, I would have put 5/100 as the lowest he would get.

Really? I would find that quite shocking. Back to back sub 3 fWAR seasons.

There were rumors that he might accept the qualifying offer with 50-70 million being the best he can get, others suggesting that Cain’s 80M might be his ceiling;

Free Agent Outlook: Marcell Ozuna

Outside his breakout year in 2017 and his first full season which was 5 years ago, he has either been underwhelming or mediocre. He has “youth” on his side as he will be 29 years old but free agency hasn’t been kind to players over the last few years unless you are a truly top end guy. I have a 85M ceiling on him and even that, I think I’m being generous.

A better Brantley at 31 with his injury history got 32M with no QO. Cain with better recent years at 31 got 80M. I see a 80-90M deal tops.

It is free agency after all and teams do overpay but 100M would shock me for what he has done these last 2 years.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I don’t mind Ozuna but this was from the article;



No way Ozuna gets more than 100M not more than 5 years.

Give me Corey Dickerson on a one year/$4MM deal instead.

 

[Discoverer]

Really? I would find that quite shocking. Back to back sub 3 fWAR seasons.

There were rumors that he might accept the qualifying offer with 50-70 million being the best he can get, others suggesting that Cain’s 80M might be his ceiling;

Free Agent Outlook: Marcell Ozuna

Outside his breakout year in 2017 and his first full season which was 5 years ago, he has either been underwhelming or mediocre. He has “youth” on his side as he will be 29 years old but free agency hasn’t been kind to players over the last few years unless you are a truly top end guy. I have a 85M ceiling on him and even that, I think I’m being generous.

A better Brantley at 31 with his injury history got 32M with no QO. Cain with better recent years at 31 got 80M. I see a 80-90M deal tops.

It is free agency after all and teams do overpay but 100M would shock me for what he has done these last 2 years.

Yeah, it's certainly possible that I'm thinking of him too highly based on his 2017 season.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[The Nemesis]

I think the Astros talk has gone on long enough. It's starting to get into a political/social issue and that's outside the scope of the board (and not conducive to people having constructive, respectful discussion, as evidenced by some of the posts that were made here on the issue. Which are no longer visible because that discussion has been excised.)

 

[Suntouchable13]

Craig Biggio actually works for the Astros? What if Jays and Astros play each other in a playoff series sometime soon while Cavan still plays for Toronto, what will Craig do? Lol. He is going to be so conflicted.

 

[hoc123]

Danny Jansen and Justin Smoak are nominated for a Gold Glove award this year for the Jays. Just goes to show that projecting catcher defence in the minors can be a real shot in the dark.

 

[jetsforever]

Danny Jansen and Justin Smoak are nominated for a Gold Glove award this year for the Jays. Just goes to show that projecting catcher defence in the minors can be a real shot in the dark.

Somewhat surprising but nice to see them nominated

 

[Jozay]

 

[The Nemesis]

"Hey guys, let's not get into the whole Astros thing. It's getting outside the scope of what HF considers acceptable"

*multiple continued posts talking about the nature of the Taubman/Astros drama.*



Look, I don't mean to get angry or frustrated, or shake my finger at everyone while I chastise you for breaking some rules that I'm sure a lot of people feel are arbitrary or unnecessary or whatever. Nor am I asking people to keep it above board just to see myself type. What I am trying to do is make sure that none of you actually get into trouble over this, because it can happen. And for something that's only tangentially related to the Jays or actual baseball discussion, it's not worth it.

HF management has said they don't want political talk on the open boards. And having seen what a cesspool the "unmoderated" politics board used to be before it got nuked from orbit (setting aside that the "unmoderated" descriptor was probably not the best way to explain its existence) and knowing how much work would have to go into keeping such discussions in bounds if they were allowed on the main public boards, I understand why. So we're not getting into the social or cultural or moral/ethical issues about Taubman's comments or his firing or Osuna or anything else. Just plain not going there. And I would hope and expect that knowing that most of you are generally solid and reasonable people, you could please respect that boundary and make sure to keep the mods' work at a minimum by playing along. It just makes everything go smoother.

Ditto for the talk about the umpire and his now dormant twitter account. That's a firestorm we don't want any part of, please.

Thanks everyone.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Danny Jansen and Justin Smoak are nominated for a Gold Glove award this year for the Jays. Just goes to show that projecting catcher defence in the minors can be a real shot in the dark.

Do either actually have a shot? I would think Jansen would be much closer than Smoak.

 

[dredeye]

"Hey guys, let's not get into the whole Astros thing. It's getting outside the scope of what HF considers acceptable"

*multiple continued posts talking about the nature of the Taubman/Astros drama.*



Look, I don't mean to get angry or frustrated, or shake my finger at everyone while I chastise you for breaking some rules that I'm sure a lot of people feel are arbitrary or unnecessary or whatever. Nor am I asking people to keep it above board just to see myself type. What I am trying to do is make sure that none of you actually get into trouble over this, because it can happen. And for something that's only tangentially related to the Jays or actual baseball discussion, it's not worth it.

HF management has said they don't want political talk on the open boards. And having seen what a cesspool the "unmoderated" politics board used to be before it got nuked from orbit (setting aside that the "unmoderated" descriptor was probably not the best way to explain its existence) and knowing how much work would have to go into keeping such discussions in bounds if they were allowed on the main public boards, I understand why. So we're not getting into the social or cultural or moral/ethical issues about Taubman's comments or his firing or Osuna or anything else. Just plain not going there. And I would hope and expect that knowing that most of you are generally solid and reasonable people, you could please respect that boundary and make sure to keep the mods' work at a minimum by playing along. It just makes everything go smoother.

Ditto for the talk about the umpire and his now dormant twitter account. That's a firestorm we don't want any part of, please.

Thanks everyone.

buzzkill

 

[phillipmike]

Stroman says he’s reuniting with former Blue Jays head trainer Nikki Huffman - Sportsnet.ca

Stroman has a hard time being an adult and moving on. Love the guy when he was here but I’m glad this arrogance and “toxicity” is gone from our young clubhouse.

An addition by subtraction AND we got a great return.

 

[The Nemesis]

Stroman says he’s reuniting with former Blue Jays head trainer Nikki Huffman - Sportsnet.ca

View attachment 268987

Stroman has a hard time being an adult and moving on. Love the guy when he was here but I’m glad this arrogance and “toxicity” is gone from our young clubhouse.

An addition by subtraction AND we got a great return.

He's going to be a guy that burns a lot of bridges before his career is over. He thrives on creating that drama and animosity to fuel him, but it seems to also mean that he just can't help himself but take shots at people for no good reason. And I'll bet too if someone asks him specifically about it he'll play it off and refuse to name names and stand behind his statements, trying to deflect with claims that he's talking in general and not about anyone in specific (which is almost worse because, to quote Herm Edwards: put your name on it. If you want to say those things, then stand up and say them to everyone's faces. Don't hide behind social media bravado and indirectness as a shield).

I liked Stroman's enthusiasm at the best of times, but the minute things started to sour for him it became harder and harder to cheer for him as he systematically alienated anyone and everyone that didn't fall in line and worship him.

 

[Kurtz]

Stroman says he’s reuniting with former Blue Jays head trainer Nikki Huffman - Sportsnet.ca

View attachment 268987

Stroman has a hard time being an adult and moving on. Love the guy when he was here but I’m glad this arrogance and “toxicity” is gone from our young clubhouse.

An addition by subtraction AND we got a great return.

Yeah, I've generally defended Stroshow, but these tweets are just cruel and petty. And he just burned a few of Nikki's bridges for her.

 

[The Nemesis]

The Fukuoka SoftBank Hawks have won the 2019 NPB championship.

Somewhere Buck is smiling. And saying "Fukuoka" over and over and over again.

 

[Cor]

I said for quiet a while that we’d be happier when Stroman was gone, and always got crap for believing that.

It’s not surprising he consistently proves me right.

 

[Ronald Ocean]

I feel bad for any woman thats broken up with stroman...jesus hes incapable of moving on.

 

[as Pure as Evil]

people gave me flack over the idea i thought he should have been moved a year ago or 2 for these outbursts. he acts like that mouthy kid in school that just beaks off then gets smacked in the face then goes and taddles like he didn't know what was gonna happen

he has zero accountability when it comes to himself its always someone else's fault

I for one am glad we traded him, I think over the next year or 2 his mouth is going to get him in to a lot of trouble with the league, mets and new York media

on a side note we are a week or 2 away till we see what this front office has planned this winter.

 

[Deebo]

What Stroman tweets still doesn't bother me and I believe trading him for that reason would have been a bad decision.

I do think it was the right time to trade though him because signing him didn't make sense given his age, the stage in the rebuild that the Jays are in and what it would have likely cost and the return appears to be pretty good.

He pitched well and loved the city, I'll miss him.

 

[ShaneFalco]

5 free agent pitchers the Blue Jays should target this offseason

Jake Odorizzi (Minnesota Twins)

• Age: 30
• 2019 stats: 3.51 ERA, 131 ERA+, 159 IP, 178 SO
• 2019 salary: $9.5 million

Ivan Nova (Chicago White Sox)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 4.72 ERA, 97 ERA+, 187 IP, 114 SO
• 2019 salary: $9.16 million

Wade Miley (Houston Astros)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 3.98 ERA, 116 ERA+, 167,1 IP, 140 SO
• 2019 salary: $5 million

Dallas Keuchel (Atlanta Braves)

• Age: 32
• 2019 stats: 3.75 ERA, 121 ERA+, 112.2 IP, 91 SO
• 2019 salary: $21.2 million

Tanner Roark (Oakland Athletics)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 4.35 ERA, 103 ERA+, 165,1 IP, 158 SO
• 2019 salary: $10 million

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

5 free agent pitchers the Blue Jays should target this offseason

Jake Odorizzi (Minnesota Twins)

• Age: 30
• 2019 stats: 3.51 ERA, 131 ERA+, 159 IP, 178 SO
• 2019 salary: $9.5 million

Ivan Nova (Chicago White Sox)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 4.72 ERA, 97 ERA+, 187 IP, 114 SO
• 2019 salary: $9.16 million

Wade Miley (Houston Astros)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 3.98 ERA, 116 ERA+, 167,1 IP, 140 SO
• 2019 salary: $5 million

Dallas Keuchel (Atlanta Braves)

• Age: 32
• 2019 stats: 3.75 ERA, 121 ERA+, 112.2 IP, 91 SO
• 2019 salary: $21.2 million

Tanner Roark (Oakland Athletics)

• Age: 33
• 2019 stats: 4.35 ERA, 103 ERA+, 165,1 IP, 158 SO
• 2019 salary: $10 million

Feel like there's several pitchers you target prior to getting to the Keuchel, Miley, Roark, Nova tier. Odorizzi is a priority for sure given the velo increase, strikeout increase, peripherals, etc.

Wheeler is about to go Super Saiyan. Teheran is young and has a fairly fixable issue (slider stopped getting major leaguers out) that can be fixed by a pitch mix shakeup. Kyle Gibson is the opposite with his slider being one of the best in baseball.

 

[BlueForever75]

Wouldn't be surprised to see the Jays acquire a top 2 type pitcher through trade and then sign another middle of the rotation #3 starter as a FA. None of the pitchers mentioned above fit a top 2 starter role. But definitely can be a #3.