Player Discussion Trevor Zegras : Part III

[Boo Boo]

Even if he is traded, we need to start being competitive at some point in the near future. This is year six of not sniffing the playoffs with no end in sight. How many times can Verbeek "reset the rebuild" before we're acknowledged as a perpetual joke of a franchise?

And in this scenario we trade Zegras for... what exactly? Someone who might be as good as him in 2-3 years? We just traded a valuable asset in Drysdale to get more "potential" forward talent in a 19 year old kid, and then we... get rid of actual NHL forward talent? None of this make sense unless he's actually demanding to be moved, which I have heard literally nothing about.

I agree - not that I buy that there are any insiders with their fingers on the pulse of our management and that these rumours are probably nothing but at some point there needs to be problem solving done beyond just acquiring futures and trying to tank for a high pick.

 

[lwvs84]

I feel like Zegras is the most likely of the "big 5" forwards (Z, Gauthier, McTavish, Carlsson, Terry) to be dealt at this point. Not saying he will be, but if there is a move to improve the team he's the most likely one. Carlsson is obvious why he won't be moved, McTavish is bigger than Z and fits more of the mold that Verbeek wants (and can/will shoot), Gauthier is Verbeek's first big trade, and Terry is signed long term (Terry could be the one moved if Z's next contract is a long term one).

If Zegras is moved, I don't think it'll be a futures trade. It'll probably be a 1 for 1 or Z+ for an upgrade. Currently, Terry is the only high end forward that is a RH shot, so Z being moved for a righty is possible down the road. The other option is if we end up with another high end forward in this draft, when they are ready for the NHL Z could be moved for a RHD. Either way, I don't think he is moved in the next 2 years unless we magically land Celebrini in the draft. Then I can see him moved for a young RHD that fits the mold of what PV wants.

 

[FiveHoleTickler]

I feel like Zegras is the most likely of the "big 5" forwards (Z, Gauthier, McTavish, Carlsson, Terry) to be dealt at this point. Not saying he will be, but if there is a move to improve the team he's the most likely one. Carlsson is obvious why he won't be moved, McTavish is bigger than Z and fits more of the mold that Verbeek wants (and can/will shoot), Gauthier is Verbeek's first big trade, and Terry is signed long term (Terry could be the one moved if Z's next contract is a long term one).

If Zegras is moved, I don't think it'll be a futures trade. It'll probably be a 1 for 1 or Z+ for an upgrade. Currently, Terry is the only high end forward that is a RH shot, so Z being moved for a righty is possible down the road. The other option is if we end up with another high end forward in this draft, when they are ready for the NHL Z could be moved for a RHD. Either way, I don't think he is moved in the next 2 years unless we magically land Celebrini in the draft. Then I can see him moved for a young RHD that fits the mold of what PV wants.

Why does anyone think they know what type of player Verbeek wants and why do people assume Zegras isn't it?

 

[lwvs84]

Why does anyone think they know what type of player Verbeek wants and why do people assume Zegras isn't it?

I guess better language would be the type of players Verbeek has been targeting. At this point, Ducks need offense and Zegras brings that.

 

[DavidBL]

Why does anyone think they know what type of player Verbeek wants and why do people assume Zegras isn't it?

Generally, I'd assume a lot of these people have worked with him in some capacity and they're going to talk about hockey and players and get a sense of his own personality during those interactions. It's likely mostly conjecture but there is likely some basis for it.

 

[FiveHoleTickler]

Generally, I'd assume a lot of these people have worked with him in some capacity and they're going to talk about hockey and players and get a sense of his own personality during those interactions. It's likely mostly conjecture but there is likely some basis for it.

To me, the logic some are applying seems a lot like "Verbeek was a tough player so he doesn't like anyone who isn't." I've never once had the inclination that he doesn't like skill players or doesn't value them, which is what I think a lot of people are inferring when they reference "his type."

Just seems like nonsense.

 

[DavidBL]

To me, the logic some are applying seems a lot like "Verbeek was a tough player so he doesn't like anyone who isn't." I've never once had the inclination that he doesn't like skill players or doesn't value them, which is what I think a lot of people are inferring when they reference "his type."

Just seems like nonsense.

I think that comes across from the fan perspectives on these boards more than anything.

 

[ohcomeonref]

I'd love to see Gauthier tried with both Z, Mac, and Carlsson as well. Stylistically it seems Gauthier and Z could be an excellent match.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Z is an extremely talented player. It's up to the team to take that talent and mold it to get the most out of him (or any player). That seemed to be the path Z and the Ducks were on this year until things just went south due to injuries. The idea that because his game has flaws (who's doesn't?) we should move him for something that isn't even as good, but maybe will be, is dumb. I don't see PV rushing to move Z.

These morons that call themselves insiders are a f***ing joke. And I don't mean just Seravelli. The Canadians ones only care about teams north of the 48th parallel. Social media drives them to try and collect hits so when they want to talk shit they get creative with that which won't bring the wrath of Canada down upon them. I'm getting quite tired of all of them. Wake me when they start saying the Leafs are "listening" on any of their top players (even though they've been a playoff disaster for years) or the Oil are "listening" on Leon because they can't afford to resign him and McDavid. Was there ever a peep that the Leafs were "listening" on Nylander before he recently signed? Funny how that works.

 

[Rasp]

Even if he is traded, we need to start being competitive at some point in the near future. This is year six of not sniffing the playoffs with no end in sight. How many times can Verbeek "reset the rebuild" before we're acknowledged as a perpetual joke of a franchise?

And in this scenario we trade Zegras for... what exactly? Someone who might be as good as him in 2-3 years? We just traded a valuable asset in Drysdale to get more "potential" forward talent in a 19 year old kid, and then we... get rid of actual NHL forward talent? None of this make sense unless he's actually demanding to be moved, which I have heard literally nothing about.

We are year 3 into the Verbeek rebuild. Its not his fault it was reset its Murray for not committing to it in the first place.

The way we are rebuilding is through the draft because we dont attract big names like Toronto NY etc. Nothing can be done about that. What rebuilding through the draft means is that you are left with kids who need to grow and gain experience before they are able to carry the team.

Lacombe 23
Zegras 22
McTavish 21
Gauthier 20
Zellweger 20
Minty 20
Luneau 20
Carlsson 19

This is our core. They will hit their peaks around mid 20s which is when we will be pushing hard for a cup. We could supplement them with older players to help the team but as we have seen they arent very good because the core is still young. The only solution to this problem is for the core to get older. Once that happens we can compete.

Rushing a rebuild is how you kill a team. If we start trading out young assets/picks for older players to "win now" we will get a bump in wins but not enough to push us over the line. It will then mean we get worse draft picks leading to drafting lower tier players. This will hurt our cup run which will start in a few years.

The reality is we need to be patient and wait for the core to age and complaining about it will do nothing to change that fact.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

We are year 3 into the Verbeek rebuild. Its not his fault it was reset its Murray for not committing to it in the first place.

The way we are rebuilding is through the draft because we dont attract big names like Toronto NY etc. Nothing can be done about that. What rebuilding through the draft means is that you are left with kids who need to grow and gain experience before they are able to carry the team.

Lacombe 23
Zegras 22
McTavish 21
Gauthier 20
Zellweger 20
Minty 20
Luneau 20
Carlsson 19

This is our core. They will hit their peaks around mid 20s which is when we will be pushing hard for a cup. We could supplement them with older players to help the team but as we have seen they arent very good because the core is still young. The only solution to this problem is for the core to get older. Once that happens we can compete.

Rushing a rebuild is how you kill a team. If we start trading out young assets/picks for older players to "win now" we will get a bump in wins but not enough to push us over the line. It will then mean we get worse draft picks leading to drafting lower tier players. This will hurt our cup run which will start in a few years.

The reality is we need to be patient and wait for the core to age and complaining about it will do nothing to change that fact.

+ as they get better and the team gets more competitive, we become a more enticing destination for UFAs and we can take bigger steps faster

 

[MMC]

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

That can't be true. I keep reading on HF he is only a showboat, overrated, poor teammate. Surely, my HF brethren aren't misleading me, are they????

 

[duckaroosky]

https://x.com/BR_OpenIce/status/1754954864717611457?s=20

Dude needs to get off social media.. lol. PV hates this kind of crap

I have no idea what's going on in this picture or what be real is but the funniest thing was someone replied on twitter that his girlfriend looks like Jamie Drysdale and I can't get it out of my head how accurate that is.

 

[Hamilton Bulldogs]

https://x.com/BR_OpenIce/status/1754954864717611457?s=20

Dude needs to get off social media.. lol. PV hates this kind of crap

Players having significant others?

I get that a few guys missed some games because they had kids but damn

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

I have no idea what's going on in this picture or what be real is but the funniest thing was someone replied on twitter that his girlfriend looks like Jamie Drysdale and I can't get it out of my head how accurate that is.

Yah lmaoo saw that too

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

That can't be true. I keep reading on HF he is only a showboat, overrated, poor teammate. Surely, my HF brethren aren't misleading me, are they????

 

[FiveHoleTickler]

We are year 3 into the Verbeek rebuild. Its not his fault it was reset its Murray for not committing to it in the first place.

The way we are rebuilding is through the draft because we dont attract big names like Toronto NY etc. Nothing can be done about that. What rebuilding through the draft means is that you are left with kids who need to grow and gain experience before they are able to carry the team.

Lacombe 23
Zegras 22
McTavish 21
Gauthier 20
Zellweger 20
Minty 20
Luneau 20
Carlsson 19

This is our core. They will hit their peaks around mid 20s which is when we will be pushing hard for a cup. We could supplement them with older players to help the team but as we have seen they arent very good because the core is still young. The only solution to this problem is for the core to get older. Once that happens we can compete.

Rushing a rebuild is how you kill a team. If we start trading out young assets/picks for older players to "win now" we will get a bump in wins but not enough to push us over the line. It will then mean we get worse draft picks leading to drafting lower tier players. This will hurt our cup run which will start in a few years.

The reality is we need to be patient and wait for the core to age and complaining about it will do nothing to change that fact.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as saying LaCombe, Luneau, Zellweger, and Gauthier are part of our core right now. To me, core players spend most of their careers here. It remains to be seen what we have in each of them.

Some might be made expendable in the coming years by other players we bring in down the line or others we draft that eventually supersede them in the lineup. There's a lot we don't know about those players and how their futures will align with this team.

The rest I agree with.

 

[FiveHoleTickler]

 

[Ducks]

Wait but according to "hockey insiders" Z isn't a Cronin type of player...? Were we lied to???

View attachment 816988

Trash article. He speculates it would take something like MTL 2024 1st (protected), Winnipeg 1st + Dach or Caufield to get it done, but doesn't have the cajones to actually come out and say it because he knows MTL fans will come at him with pitchforks.

MTL would not make that deal and The Ducks probably wouldn't make that deal unless the 2024 1st was unprotected and even if the value is fair there's no indication they want to move on from Z.

 

[Kalv]

BREAKING: An "insider" speculates that a popular player is going to a "insert top 5 fanbase per size". More at news at 8

 

[Reveille1984]

We are year 3 into the Verbeek rebuild. Its not his fault it was reset its Murray for not committing to it in the first place.

The way we are rebuilding is through the draft because we dont attract big names like Toronto NY etc. Nothing can be done about that. What rebuilding through the draft means is that you are left with kids who need to grow and gain experience before they are able to carry the team.

Lacombe 23
Zegras 22
McTavish 21
Gauthier 20
Zellweger 20
Minty 20
Luneau 20
Carlsson 19

This is our core. They will hit their peaks around mid 20s which is when we will be pushing hard for a cup. We could supplement them with older players to help the team but as we have seen they arent very good because the core is still young. The only solution to this problem is for the core to get older. Once that happens we can compete.

Rushing a rebuild is how you kill a team. If we start trading out young assets/picks for older players to "win now" we will get a bump in wins but not enough to push us over the line. It will then mean we get worse draft picks leading to drafting lower tier players. This will hurt our cup run which will start in a few years.

The reality is we need to be patient and wait for the core to age and complaining about it will do nothing to change that fact.

I mean, I basically agree with everything you said.

The rebuild was needed, and Zegras is only 22 and a promising young player. He should be part of what is happening, especially given our lack of forward depth. This is why it makes no sense to move him.

 

[branmuffin17]

So I didn't see this article being mentioned, it was from Derek on The Hockey News, posted on Feb 3rd after the Sharks game. While it was mainly about Leo, this quote is really interesting:

“I guarantee you Leo knew Troy was there before he even touched the puck,” said head coach Greg Cronin after the game. “And I don’t think any other player on our team would have seen that except for one. That would have been Zegras. Because he sees the game in a very similar way. It’s hard to describe. You try to draft (these kinds of players) because I don’t think it’s something that you can coach into people.”

Cronin's flipped a switch on his comments on Z, not that he was talking poorly about him before, but seems to be putting in an effort to compliment Z more specifically (even though the guy's barely played this year lol). IMO Cronin at least is all-in on him and is hoping he sticks on the team rather than be traded.

Honestly, the noise of potential trades is pretty awful. I don't personally think Z is on the trading block. And while Henrique seems to know the writing's on the wall (and I'd like to see him get a chance to play some meaningful games), I don't think we should move Vatrano...the guy signed here, he's stated he wants to be here, and we need players of his type on the team, now and in the future. We don't have that much O depth to move out players like him, no matter that we have Terry, McT, Z, Leo, etc.

Someone please figure out how to stop the stupids from continuing to talk about trading Z!!!

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

So I didn't see this article being mentioned, it was from Derek on The Hockey News, posted on Feb 3rd after the Sharks game. While it was mainly about Leo, this quote is really interesting:

“I guarantee you Leo knew Troy was there before he even touched the puck,” said head coach Greg Cronin after the game. “And I don’t think any other player on our team would have seen that except for one. That would have been Zegras. Because he sees the game in a very similar way. It’s hard to describe. You try to draft (these kinds of players) because I don’t think it’s something that you can coach into people.”

Cronin's flipped a switch on his comments on Z, not that he was talking poorly about him before, but seems to be putting in an effort to compliment Z more specifically (even though the guy's barely played this year lol). IMO Cronin at least is all-in on him and is hoping he sticks on the team rather than be traded.

Honestly, the noise of potential trades is pretty awful. I don't personally think Z is on the trading block. And while Henrique seems to know the writing's on the wall (and I'd like to see him get a chance to play some meaningful games), I don't think we should move Vatrano...the guy signed here, he's stated he wants to be here, and we need players of his type on the team, now and in the future. We don't have that much O depth to move out players like him, no matter that we have Terry, McT, Z, Leo, etc.

Someone please figure out how to stop the stupids from continuing to talk about trading Z!!!

I don't remember any negative comments from Cronin on Zegras, other than occasional post-game comments about specific plays. Like everyone else, he characterizes Z as coachable and willing to do whatever he's told. The reality of this player is completely different from the perception.

 

[branmuffin17]

I don't remember any negative comments from Cronin on Zegras, other than occasional post-game comments about specific plays. Like everyone else, he characterizes Z as coachable and willing to do whatever he's told. The reality of this player is completely different from the perception.

Yeah I wasn't talking about negative comments from Cronin, more just that the couple comments lately have been very complimentary. My recollection on Cronin comments was more at the start of the season, and that he wanted Z to focus on his play away from the puck and develop that defensive portion of his game.