GDT: Training Camp

[Anton Babchuk]

My point wasn't to say that you were wrong about Gerbe, but that scoring goals in preseason does not make you an impact player. Gerbe is not an impact player and until Nichushkin actually does something in meaningful games I think it's quite easy to ignore the "fact" that he's an impact player now. It's preseason, you should have seen the ridiculous hype for Zac Dalpe in training camp here two seasons ago and yet here we are, two years and two NHL goals later.

 

[Ole Gil]

I will concede that I was wrong about Gerbe. But you cannot ignore the fact that an impact now power forward was available at #5 and we did not pick him.

What if Nichushkin doesn't score in his first REAL nhl game. Then will you admit that he's not an impact player yet, and should probably go back to the KHL for more seasoning?

 

[spockBokk]

I will concede that I was wrong about Gerbe. But you cannot ignore the fact that an impact now power forward was available at #5 and we did not pick him.

I see more concessions in the future...

Anyways, it should get interesting over the weekend with cap situations and players hitting waivers, would love to see tge canes pick up another experienced dman somehow ...

 

[the halleJOKEL]

i see more concessions in the future...

It's just a massacre out there, folks.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

This whole "impact now" thing is moronic. We drafted a kid whose desire to play in the NHL is NOT in question, who's been lauded as a great pick, and who may STILL make an impact this season. I've seen Backstrom comparisons for this kid, and you're pissed we have him because he may not play for us until he's 19 (*gasp*) years old?

Yzerman was just quoted as saying that it "wouldn't be the end of the world" if Drouin goes back to juniors. Do you think THEY should've taken Nich, too?

You pick the guy that will become the best NHL player. That's what the draft is for. Expecting our Top 5 pick to come in and become an impact player only works when you've got a generational talent. Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin. We get lucky one time with Skinner and everyone freaks out and forgets how the NHL draft works. It's remarkable.

 

[golfpro827]

I will concede that I was wrong about Gerbe. But you cannot ignore the fact that an impact now power forward was available at #5 and we did not pick him.

And wrong about the def. signing of Jagr.

The fact that anyone is judging 18 year old players - yet alone anyone - based on their preason makes me LOL.

 

[rocky7]

it's too early to be critical of players, Muller's techniques or JR's draft and offseason. it's fair to say that JR had pretty high hopes for Lindholm this season IIRC based on his comments. everyone has been penciling him in as the 3rd line center.

it's also normal for some of the optimism that the offseason hype tends to bring to start to wane as it all comes down to the nitty gritty.

 

[GhostofS16*]

Looks like Lindholm is Ruutu 2.0. We should have drafted Nich.

I was Nurse all the way, myself. However, I still think Lindholm was a good choice and will star for this team. I just would have went with Nurse.

 

[golfpro827]

I was Nurse all the way, myself. However, I still think Lindholm was a good choice and will star for this team. I just would have went with Nurse.

Tough to pick a guy when he's been picked before your pick.

 

[DaveG]

wait... what?


and FWIW I was firmly on the Nichushkin train, but unless we went bat**** insane off the board at #5 (Horvat, Domi, etc) the fact of the matter is we were getting a good prospect. Lindholm has the ability to be a franchise caliber centerman down the road, we're in good shape with drafting him even if his impact on the NHL level this year is all of a cup of coffee for 9 games before heading back to Brynas.

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

Tough to pick a guy when he's been picked before your pick.

Am I reading this right? Unless dementia has set in, we picked #5 and Nurse went at 7.

 

[bleedgreen]

Since the discussion has turned back to who we should have drafted, I was wondering if anyone else saw NHL 2013 Draft: The South Is On The Clock on the NHL Network? If you didn't, try to - it goes behind the scenes with Colorado, Florida, Tampa, Nashville AND Carolina. Not only do you get sound bites from JR and Ron Francis, but you see JR trying to make a move. You see JR on the phone with a team (?) - he then says they've changed their mind and will only move down to #4, not #5. He's also seen talking on the phone with the teams at #7 and #23. Then you see JR at the draft table - he says it looks like we're picking, looks in his notebook, and turns to Tony MacDonald and says it looks like you're going to get your wish - then Ron Francis announces the selection of Lindholm.

A little earlier they also had one of our scouts say drouin wasn't as versatile lindholm, and that we had Elias higher than drouin on our list. Interesting. Jack of all trades wins out over high skill. We've had that attitude before in player moves, like how we always enjoy guys who can play multiple positions. Regardless I agree everyone should watch this if they can find it.

As far as a "rough" training camp.....all I can do is laugh. We had a rough training camp? Did anybody participating or watching say so? Or did we just have an energetic first couple days of camp? Aren't all camps supposed to be like that? Maybe we just have had a country club atmosphere before? Two or three kinda scraps makes this a tough camp? Or because tlusty got injured? No one has seen the hit yet. Was it a tough hit, or did tlusty just fall down and hurt himself after being bumped into? No one knows, just a lot of assuming. Just point a finger in any direction you can

The imaginations some people have around here. If we suck this year with injuries playing a role it's because we don't have very good depth, and are generally a weak team with a number of injury prone players. Did anyone other than tlusty's imaginary predatory hit have an injury that anything to do with the style of camp? Tlusty has been back for awhile with no effects. I saw ruutu play one game, he threw himself with reckless abandon into vulnerable positions over and over again and Montreal hammered him at least five times. Reminded me of cole trying to play like he normally would when coming back from injuries too soon. Is that muller and his tough camp?

 

[bleedgreen]

wait... what?


and FWIW I was firmly on the Nichushkin train, but unless we went bat**** insane off the board at #5 (Horvat, Domi, etc) the fact of the matter is we were getting a good prospect. Lindholm has the ability to be a franchise caliber centerman down the road, we're in good shape with drafting him even if his impact on the NHL level this year is all of a cup of coffee for 9 games before heading back to Brynas.

No kidding, no one was going to take him that high. We wouldn't have taken him even if we didn't take lindholm, IMO. I think both monahan and nurse were likely above nich on our list. I admit though, in our fantasy draft I'm having a hard time not taking nich at 4, I think he's more likely than others to be a point producer.

After watching nurse, I don't think we would've done bad by moving down and taking him. Nich should've went higher than dallas after watching some footage as well. We never were gonna take him though, IMO.

 

[Buenos Necas]

A little earlier they also had one of our scouts say drouin wasn't as versatile lindholm, and that we had Elias higher than drouin on our list. Interesting. Jack of all trades wins out over high skill. We've had that attitude before in player moves, like how we always enjoy guys who can play multiple positions. Regardless I agree everyone should watch this if they can find it.

Anyone have a link? Tried searching for a one earlier, but couldn't find anything.

 

[The Sweetness]

So does it look like Lindholm will get his 9 games?

 

[bleedgreen]

No I only saw it actually on the nhl Network. Couldn't find it on YouTube. If I can catch that episode again I'll try to grab verbatim what they said.

Nichushkin is a non topic. We weren't going to take him even if we didn't take lindholm is my guess.

@sweetness they haven't said anything but id be shocked If he didn't get his games. Injury that will take months to heal from would be the only reason they would send him home without his games that I can think of.

 

[GhostofS16*]

Tough to pick a guy when he's been picked before your pick.

You are thinking Jones, slick.

 

[Mr America]

A .500 preseason?

How do we know whether or not to be nervous or optimistic about the upcoming preseason?

 

[The Sweetness]

No I only saw it actually on the nhl Network. Couldn't find it on YouTube. If I can catch that episode again I'll try to grab verbatim what they said.

Nichushkin is a non topic. We weren't going to take him even if we didn't take lindholm is my guess.

@sweetness they haven't said anything but id be shocked If he didn't get his games. Injury that will take months to heal from would be the only reason they would send him home without his games that I can think of.

Thanks for the info. How has he looked so far?

 

[bleedgreen]

The only game action he saw wasn't televised or streamed so I didn't see it, a couple others did so maybe they'll respond. Sounds like he fit in speed wise, kept up with the play but didn't really stand out very much either. I'm not sure.

 

[DaveG]

He was better then expected defensively and active on the forecheck. He didn't do much in the way of generating offense but really only one line did any kind of job at that in that game: Semin-Staal-Bowman, and Bowman was just kindof "there", not nearly as active on that line as Tlusty usually is. Lindholm certainly didn't stand out in a negative light offensively, he just didn't get the opportunity to assert himself there.

Definitely not enough to judge him off of, then again I don't think anything smaller then a 10 game sample size is enough most of the time. I've only made 2 exceptions to that in recent years: Samsonov (on the positive side) and Kaberle (on the negative side), both exceptions proved to be the right call at the time.

 

[DaveG]

So anyone hear anything about a contract for Devo yet? There's no way in hell we don't sign him after how he did this pre-season but I just haven't heard anything, usually something starts leaking by now.

 

[Surrounded By Ahos]

JR still hasn't waked up from his afternoon nap.

 

[My Special Purpose]

I'll weigh in on what seems to be the topic of the day, if only because I really hate college football and I'm actually watching Tangled (and my kids aren't with me).

Now that we're three whole months post-draft, I still feel exactly the same way I did on draft day. I still think we should have sold out (not just attempted, SOLD OUT) to move up into the first four to grab Jones. And if you held a gun to my head and demanded I pick a guy at No. 5, I'd have said Lindholm -- and I still do.

I respect Nichushkin and what he's doing for the Stars, but even with all that, the local stories in Dallas are all tinged with the specter of the KHL. It just does not go away, whether a player is currently experiencing success or not. It seems that if a guy is very successful, the KHL pushes even harder to get a young star. And if he's unsuccessful, the KHL swoops in to cure him of his need to push through it. It simply does not go away.

I'm not crazy about Lindholm, but the way we talk about him sounds a lot like Brandon Sutter. I'm hoping he's a better playmaker at No. 5 overall, but I think we'd be happy with that type of guy in his age 19 season.

Also, I've heard that the Canes may try to get him to accept a demotion to the AHL for a few weeks to use as a sort of training camp, since he basically missed ours. He's eligible since he doesn't have junior eligibility, and as long as he knows he's coming back as soon as he's ready, he won't go home to Sweden.

In short, I still think we failed with our first-rounder, but not because we didn't take Nich, because we didn't get bold for Jones.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Well thought out post, totalkev. I still think without knowing what "selling out" would have entailed I can't completely agree (I would NOT have done Skinner and the 5th overall for the 4th), but I understand the POV.

Tangled is a great movie.