Training Camp '16-17 Thread II | Down to the Nitty Gritty

[oilersrule14]

Not surprised to see Reinhart sent down, he's been terrible this training camp.

He needs to dramatically improve his skating if he wants to be an NHL player, he simply doesn't have the hockey sense to compensate for such a slow acceleration gear at this level. His main plus as a player(his size) doesn't even hold up all that much at this level either, as 6'4 is just above average for defensive defensemen in the NHL.



It's impressive how the Oilers roster depth at center goes from decent to absolutely terrible with a single roster move to put Drai on the wing. If Mclellan breaks camp with a fixation on moving his second best center to the right wing spot for any extended time, then the Oilers are in for another long season of 4th liners like Letestsu/Lander getting overwhelmed on the 3rd line while dragging their wingers down.

You're forgetting Caiggula. His good play is the whole reason why they think they can get away with Drai on the wing. In other words, moving Drai to the wing has absolutely no effect on increased ice time for Letestu/Lander

 

[LaGu]

Pitlick = Hendricks
Lander = Caggiula
Yakupov = Versteeg
3rd line = 4th line

That would be my healthy lineup, with Pitlick as 13th and Lander in the PB. Given that we hardly ever see a healthy lineup I have no problem what-so-ever with Pitlick or Lander in-and-out of the bottom 6. Lander is what he is, and imo he can still be useful in the bottom 6. Pitlick, he just seems to be good in every pre-season, I don't know if it will translate to reg season... but he has earned a looked, that seems to be evident.

 

[Draiskull]

based on his play Pitlick is someone who we might lost to waivers. I think he will up with the big club all year because of it.

 

[soothsayer]

Lucic just may be the perfect line-mate for McDavid.

I remember last year McLellan split Hall and McDavid up because they both like to carry the puck through the neutral zone. Reading between the lines, McLellan was saying, i think, that Hall was inhibiting McDavid from doing his thing. That's not to say anything negative about Hall, just that his style of game naturally took away from what McDavid does so well.

Lucic isn't a neutral zone burner. He is a grind-em down-low kind of player. There probably isn't a dman in the league who really wants to battle on the boards with Lucic. He'll also bowl people over to get to the net, which is great because that's where McDavid likes to put the puck. (But Lucic needs to bear down on those passes. That's on him.)

So Lucic doesn't need to take away from McDavid's brilliance by trying to make magic with the puck. He just needs be in the right place at the right time and make good on those passes, and he needs to grind out the puck on the boards when he needs to.

I think we need to bear in mind that Lucic isn't here to razzle-dazzle. He's here to help McDavid change the way the game is played.

 

[awesomo]

Oil are big boys this year. Shortest guys are 5'10 right now lol. Drake Letestu and Versteeg

 

[Oilception]

Oil are big boys this year. Shortest guys are 5'10 right now lol. Drake Letestu and Versteeg

And Verseteeg might not be on the team and Drake plays big

 

[LaGu]

why? Why not go with what works instead of forcing Lucic on that line?


because Pouliot in 55seconds of icetime with McDavid this preseason has shown more chemistry than Lucic all preseason.

What is the harm in separating the 2? Is Lucic going to become a scrub if he isnt on McDavid's line? will his ego be hurt? I dont get why we have to force chemistry.. if it happens in 10 game then so be it. They can be put together in practices and on PP til then

I think that is because Lucic in a bad year scores more than either Pouliot or Maroon do in a good year.

 

[Tarus]

I see Stauffer is doing a full court press to mitigate any backlash against Reinhart's demotion

You're forgetting Caiggula. His good play is the whole reason why they think they can get away with Drai on the wing. In other words, moving Drai to the wing has absolutely no effect on increased ice time for Letestu/Lander

I didn't forget him, I don't think he should be in the NHL this year on a full time basis. He's had a good camp, and some good exhibition games against AHL level rosters, but he hasn't looked good enough to the point that he looks like he'll make an impact over 82 games as a rookie against real NHL rosters.

 

[LaGu]

I see Stauffer is doing a full court press to mitigate any backlash against Reinhart's demotion



I didn't forget him, I don't think he should be in the NHL this year on a full time basis. He's had a good camp, and some good exhibition games against AHL level rosters, but he hasn't looked good enough to the point that he looks like he'll make an impact over 82 games as a rookie against real NHL rosters.

Probably not, but I think he has earned to start as 3C. That will be the most sheltered line and he may surprise and hang on to that place imo. Probably not, but stranger things has happened.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

based on his play Pitlick is someone who we might lost to waivers. I think he will up with the big club all year because of it.

Based on his play and the injuries, Pitlick has mad this team.

 

[Aceboogie]

CamBot got ranked as 4th best goalie in NHL according to the numbers!

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/ranking-top-20-goaltenders-nhl-numbers/

 

[Young Lions*]

Reinhart got buried a bit by Stauffer on Oilers Now, basically saying he's not doing enough in the offseason to improve his conditioning and skating to make the NHL full time. Said he needs to look at Brandon Davidson to see an example of what dedicating yourself full time in the offseason will do...said that Davidson is in very good shape, "ripped" was the word he used I think.

It's like I stated before...this kid just doesn't want it bad enough.

Or he's just not very good. Frankly this stuff about it being a matter of desire smacks of spin from the organization so they can say "Hey look it's not our fault this kid is a lazy turd, we couldn't have known when we traded for him! He was fine when Bob was with the Oil Kings!" Lot better to blame the 22 year old than the GM or FOBC who is your director of player personnel.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Reinhart got buried a bit by Stauffer on Oilers Now, basically saying he's not doing enough in the offseason to improve his conditioning and skating to make the NHL full time. Said he needs to look at Brandon Davidson to see an example of what dedicating yourself full time in the offseason will do...said that Davidson is in very good shape, "ripped" was the word he used I think.

It's like I stated before...this kid just doesn't want it bad enough.

nailed it

Reinhart has been gifted everything in his life due to many factors including size, natural talent and his last name...the game came easy for him in junior and got by on talent alone

now that he actually has to work hard to EARN a spot, he has no clue how to do it because he's never had to

Davidson, on the other hand, overcame cancer and was a 6th round pick that fought and clawed for everything he has

 

[doulos]

Or he's just not very good. Frankly this stuff about it being a matter of desire smacks of spin from the organization so they can say "Hey look it's not our fault this kid is a lazy turd, we couldn't have known when we traded for him! He was fine when Bob was with the Oil Kings!" Lot better to blame the 22 year old than the GM or FOBC who is your director of player personnel.

Skill and hard work go hand in hand.

 

[Frank the Tank]

Or he's just not very good. Frankly this stuff about it being a matter of desire smacks of spin from the organization so they can say "Hey look it's not our fault this kid is a lazy turd, we couldn't have known when we traded for him! He was fine when Bob was with the Oil Kings!" Lot better to blame the 22 year old than the GM or FOBC who is your director of player personnel.

It can be a combination of both parties being at fault for Reinhart's current situation. The Oilers organization was still reeling from MacT's demotion and Chiarelli replacing him when the trade was made. Chiarelli had fired much of his scouting staff and clearly went into the draft not trusting the information provided to him by the now ex-Oilers scouts. He was therefore motivated to make a trade with those picks and I think he was caught in a bad situation when Neely's personal grudge prevented those picks being used to acquire Hamilton. So what does Chiarelli do? Use flawed scouting reports to pick players at 16 and 33? Or use them to acquire Reinhart, who represented the next best defensive asset that was available and one that was being promoted by the remaining Oilers staff? He trusted Bob Green (and perhaps MacT, Howson, etc...) and made the trade. It was a difficult call and probably a valuable lesson for Chiarelli.

All that being said, Reinhart has also displayed a continued lack of awareness about what it takes in terms of commitment to make the step into the NHL and be successful. For me, the first red flag that had question Reinhart's motivation and/or self-awareness was when he described himself last year as a "deceptive skater" like his father was. Maybe he truly believed that or it was just a way to dismiss a tough question from a hockey reporters. Who knows? Nonetheless, it was a definite sign that he perhaps did not understand how important improving his skating would be towards him having an NHL career.

 

[Digger12]

Or he's just not very good. Frankly this stuff about it being a matter of desire smacks of spin from the organization so they can say "Hey look it's not our fault this kid is a lazy turd, we couldn't have known when we traded for him! He was fine when Bob was with the Oil Kings!" Lot better to blame the 22 year old than the GM or FOBC who is your director of player personnel.

If you think I'm just blindly parroting what the Oilers organization is spoonfeeding a timid fanbase, you're welcome to that opinion but it's nowhere indicative of why I have that opinion.

 

[Draiskull]

I think that is because Lucic in a bad year scores more than either Pouliot or Maroon do in a good year.

so how is that related to being a linemate of McDavid?
Are RNH or Draisaitl scrubs ?

 

[Del Preston]

For me, the first red flag that had question Reinhart's motivation and/or self-awareness was when he described himself last year as a "deceptive skater" like his father was.

He really said that?

Allegedly Reinhart worked on his foot speed this summer. Can anyone honestly say he looked quicker than a season ago?

 

[Draiskull]

Based on his play and the injuries, Pitlick has mad this team.

Pitlick's play has been awesom no doubt but Slepy has been just as good .. his waivers status puts Pitlick up in the Kassian territory and Slepychev down into Khaira catergory.

 

[Draiskull]

He really said that?

Allegedly Reinhart worked on his foot speed this summer. Can anyone honestly say he looked quicker than a season ago?

as per Oilers media Reinhart looked quicker his first couple practices this preseason. Cant really tell in the game situation.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Pitlick's play has been awesom no doubt but Slepy has been just as good .. his waivers status puts Pitlick up in the Kassian territory and Slepychev down into Khaira catergory.

Well Hendricks is out, and Pakarinen is out of the conversation because of injuries. So there are spots at the 12th and 13th forward spots. Frankly, I don't see why both guys can't make it out of Camp.

Pitlick - Letestu - Kassian
Slepyshev

Makes the most sense given what I've seen in camp thus far.

 

[Zaddy]

So much for Reinhart helping this team within two seasons. Maybe I should've taken that bet with IATL.

I had very low expectations on Reinhart but despite that he has been even less useful than I anticipated.

What is he now, the Oilers 11th best defenseman? I have Oesterle and Benning ahead of him, possibly Simpson too...

 

[oilersrule14]

It can be a combination of both parties being at fault for Reinhart's current situation. The Oilers organization was still reeling from MacT's demotion and Chiarelli replacing him when the trade was made. Chiarelli had fired much of his scouting staff and clearly went into the draft not trusting the information provided to him by the now ex-Oilers scouts. He was therefore motivated to make a trade with those picks and I think he was caught in a bad situation when Neely's personal grudge prevented those picks being used to acquire Hamilton. So what does Chiarelli do? Use flawed scouting reports to pick players at 16 and 33? Or use them to acquire Reinhart, who represented the next best defensive asset that was available and one that was being promoted by the remaining Oilers staff? He trusted Bob Green (and perhaps MacT, Howson, etc...) and made the trade. It was a difficult call and probably a valuable lesson for Chiarelli.

That's an interesting take. I'd point out that after the trade Chiarelli said he was very familiar with Reinhart having scouted NYI players often from his time in Boston. In terms of prospects available at 16 and 33, I'd expect any NHL front office type worth their salt to have familiarity with first round prospects. This is based on a huge amount of fans, let alone someone looking for a job in the business, have a decent familiarity with first round prospects.

 

[Frank the Tank]

That's an interesting take. I'd point out that after the trade Chiarelli said he was very familiar with Reinhart having scouted NYI players often from his time in Boston. In terms of prospects available at 16 and 33, I'd expect any NHL front office type worth their salt to have familiarity with first round prospects. This is based on a huge amount of fans, let alone someone looking for a job in the business, have a decent familiarity with first round prospects.

After reading this article written by Jim Rutherford, I would say that Chiarelli had not yet assembled all the information a GM usually has when making major moves like trades or early round draft picks. I think both making the picks or the Reinhart trade were equally risky propositions at that point in time.

 

[Aceboogie]

The last thing Ill say on Reinhart. Why are people assuming Barzal is going to be a stud. If there is any team we should not have hope for their 1st round picks its the Islanders

Lets take a gander:
O'Marra (15th)- Bust
Okoposo (7th)- good NHLer, took 5 years to get there
Bailey (9th)-somewhat NHLer
Tavares- this was a gimme
Nino(5th)-Not on team, was a near bust at the time. Ok depth player now
Strome (5th)- 5 years later and hes still struggling to make NHL. Bust label should be printed for him
Reinhart (4th)- Bust
Pulock(15th)- Wait and see
MDC(5th)- Most disappointing forward in 2014 top 10 thus far. cant crack NHL

So put me in the camp that thinks Islanders have a beyond brutal draft record in 1st round and have for a while. Ill be super skeptical of any of their picks until proven otherwsie