Trades & Free Agency Thread: Off-season Edition

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Is it consistent that:

Liljegren has topped out and has no future growth possible at 25 years of age and 200 games.
Bertuzzi and Domi are going to get better at 29 years of age and 406 and 660 games respectively.

They weren't good enough.

Took some time for Montour, Forsling and a lot of defensemen to figure it out

I worry we haven't seen the best of Lilly yet and we've invested a lot of time and resources in his development. We developed guys like Marchment to see him go right before he figured it out

 

[Evilhomer]

He scores goals man. That is literally what this team has needed in the playoffs for multiple years now.

Seriously, you look at the way Skinner plays, and you think this is a guy who is going to score a lot of goals in the playoffs, especially since he has never played a playoff game?

 

[Fogelhund]

He is a natural goal scorer. We need goals. 1+1=2 unless he is softer than 16.

He is softer than 16.

He also doesn't even show up in the regular season at times... just a wildly inconsistent player.

7 goals in 2020-21... The year before that, 14 goals and a -21. -27 the year before.

Doesn't play D, isn't physical.... he just scores goals... sometimes, some years.

This isn't a guy you place much of a bet on.

""

For Skinner, the buyout ends a tenure in Buffalo marked by inconsistent offensive production and poor defensive play.

However, after signing a massive extension in June 2019, the relationship began to sour. Skinner struggled to maintain his impressive 14.9 percent shooting percentage from the 2018-19 season and faced difficulties over the next two seasons, recording just 21 goals and 16 assists in 112 games.

 

[TheDoldrums]

He is softer than 16.

He also doesn't even show up in the regular season at times... just a wildly inconsistent player.

7 goals in 2020-21... The year before that, 14 goals and a -21. -27 the year before.

Doesn't play D, isn't physical.... he just scores goals... sometimes, some years.

This isn't a guy you place much of a bet on.

""

For Skinner, the buyout ends a tenure in Buffalo marked by inconsistent offensive production and poor defensive play.

However, after signing a massive extension in June 2019, the relationship began to sour. Skinner struggled to maintain his impressive 14.9 percent shooting percentage from the 2018-19 season and faced difficulties over the next two seasons, recording just 21 goals and 16 assists in 112 games.

I mean you say he scores goals sometimes than post a 3 year chart with him in the 96th percentile for goal production lol

He's an elite goal scorer no matter how you spin it, which is one of the toughest things to acquire

You put him on a line with Marner or Nylander and no one should be surprised if he hit 40.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Given the composition of the roster Skinner isn’t a real fit. Depth scoring, yes but other facets of his game are the same weaknesses as others. And he’s never been playoff tested.

 

[Magic Man]

I would entertain these options going into the draft.

Robertson + #23 for McGroarty
Robertson + #23 for #10-15
Robertson for #32-40

 

[Fogelhund]

I mean you say he scores goals sometimes than post a 3 year chart with him in the 96th percentile for goal production lol

He's an elite goal scorer no matter how you spin it, which is one of the toughest things to acquire

You put him on a line with Marner or Nylander and no one should be surprised if he hit 40.

I wouldn't be surprised if he hit 40. I wouldn't be surprised if he only got 10. I wouldn't be surprised if he was a -30.

Ya.. three years, he's had good production.. and a history before that of not producing at all some years.

Think about that.... he's an elite goal scorer being bought out... ask yourself why that is...

He's just not worth signing for a very large contract, and it will be regretted if he did.

 

[Evilhomer]

I mean you say he scores goals sometimes than post a 3 year chart with him in the 96th percentile for goal production lol

He's an elite goal scorer no matter how you spin it, which is one of the toughest things to acquire

You put him on a line with Marner or Nylander and no one should be surprised if he hit 40.

And even with one of those two on his line he would still be the softest, most defensively irresponsible player on the line.

 

[rumman]

Domi can ask other teams for his 6 million, doubt he gets it.
If/when that is the case, he can speak to the Leafs again.

He hung around with the core last season, his greed is more powerful than his desire to play in Toronto, just another lip service Leaf……..

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

And even with one of those two on his line he would still be the softest, most defensively irresponsible player on the line.

Yeah...unless Skinner is extremely cheap, we likely don't need another finesse winger. Have very little cap to spend on a goalie to play 40 games and 3 defensemen. Haven't even gotten to the holes at forward yet.

 

[rumman]

His sponsorship money will dry up. Most of the fanbase no longer consider him a God.

I do, only spelled backwards……….

 

[TheDoldrums]

I wouldn't be surprised if he hit 40. I wouldn't be surprised if he only got 10. I wouldn't be surprised if he was a -30.

Ya.. three years, he's had good production.. and a history before that of not producing at all some years.

Think about that.... he's an elite goal scorer being bought out... ask yourself why that is...

He's just not worth signing for a very large contract, and it will be regretted if he did.

No one is saying sign him to a very large contract. He's being bought out because he makes $9M against the cap. As a reclamation project for say ~$3M he would be well worth it in my eyes. A lot of speculation that he'd love to be close to home and sign here so I don't think they'd need to outbid other teams.

I'd also be very surprised if he were a -30. He won't be playing on the Buffalo Sabres anymore.

 

[rumman]

It would indeed be sad to see him go.

Domi finally found his perfect spot and its his childhood favorite team. And he's going to screw it up by asking for way too much money.

He actually made Matthews change his game a bit and for the better and can eat some time at center for Tavares sometimes. He's a great fit.

Only at the right price…….

 

[1specter]

He hung around with the core last season, his greed is more powerful than his desire to play in Toronto, just another lip service Leaf……..

Just a year ago:

"He wants this to be his NHL home for a long time. He wants to be a Leaf, he's got the bloodline to be a Leaf. He'll do anything to stay a Leaf. He never wants to leave here." - Friedman on Max Domi landing in Toronto

These guys are always all talk when it comes down to it, what a joke of a culture.

 

[TheDoldrums]

I still think there's a solid chance Domi re-signs, but we have more pressing needs. No need to commit to him now. Let him go to July 1st and see what's out there, he might still come back home if he doesn't like what it looks like

The team needs to be ruthless with these Toronto kids that obviously want to be here. Same way Florida is with players they know want to be there.

 

[weems]

They aren’t getting a 1st rounder, a good prospect and a young D with top 4 upside for a player drafted one year ago who doesn’t appear to want to sign with them.

That would be a crazy amount to pay.
If he was a no doubt centerman, with zero skating issues, I would definitely pay alot to acquire this type of player.
If I'm going to pay a price like that, I'd want to be getting a young defecemen like a Jiricek, which I would even think about upping the offer.

 

[rumman]

I will give Dubas some credit. Despite the fact he overpaid our guns, he found cheap gems too. We need more cheap gems.

Who are these cheap gems you speak about………

 

[Amadeus]

Who are these cheap gems you speak about………

Mikheyev when he was brought in first. Bunting was another astute signing. Kase was great if it wasn't for health.

 

[TheDoldrums]

That would be a crazy amount to pay.
If he was a no doubt centerman, with zero skating issues, I would definitely pay alot to acquire this type of player.
If I'm going to pay a price like that, I'd want to be getting a young defecemen like a Jiricek, which I would even think about upping the offer.

other teams see the package and see

- Minten, the bust of Team Canada who doesn't produce much in junior
- Liljegren, the guy who can't make top 4 on a team begging for RHD who is on the verge of healthy scratches every postseason
- late 1st

it's more like spare parts than anything hefty

Would you rather have that package or the 11th overall pick? I'd take the 11th and Buffalo fans seem to be fine with offering it.

 

[1specter]

I will give Dubas some credit. Despite the fact he overpaid our guns, he found cheap gems too. We need more cheap gems.

Eh I dunno about that, he also gave away some really useful depth and 'cheap gems' in some horrible moves. He traded Joshua for 'future considerations' to St.Louis because I guess we didn't want to sign him?, Trevor Moore was traded in a package for Jack Campbell who is rotting away on the Oilers farm team while Moore has turned into a 30 goal scorer and sub-60 pt player, Marchment was infamously traded for Malgin, Barabanov was traded away quickly after not really getting an extended look here, he brought in Michael Amadio only to waive him and then Amadio turned into a valuable depth piece for Vegas in their Cup run, he traded for future 40-goal scorer McCann which seemed like a suave move only to expose him in the expansion draft to protect his boy Justin Holl, he couldn't come to terms with local boy Evan Rodrigues awho is another valuable depth player that just won a Cup and just let him walk after acquiring him in the Kapanen trade. Even Stefan Noesen who was acquired in the awful Foligno trade got to play 1 game, then he went to Carolina and turned into exactly the kind of player we would've wanted, a heavy winger who is a threat in the blue paint - I will cut Dubas a bit more slack on this one though as Noesen was near 30 when we got him and had bounced around the league a bunch after failing to crack an NHL roster.

Still, let all of these guys go just so we could keep around chodes like Alex Kerfoot, Engvall, and Justin Holl. It's like the anti-Midas touch.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Skinner is whatever, but it's mind-boggling that there are still people turning down the idea of a cap-efficient depth goal-scorer solely on the basis of his size or style of play. Are we still doing this nonsense where we pretend that only one type of player is good in the playoffs, and we need all big bulking brutes? I had hoped some lessons were learned this past year, but it appears otherwise.

 

[weems]

other teams see the package and see

- Minten, the bust of Team Canada who doesn't produce much in junior
- Liljegren, the guy who can't make top 4 on a team begging for RHD who is on the verge of healthy scratches every postseason
- late 1st

it's more like spare parts than anything hefty

We don't have a ton of assets right now and I'd rather spend it on filling other areas of need.
McGroaty is a good to very good prospect but he's not some cant miss player and the fact it sounds like he's more of a winger at the NHL than a center along with his medicore skating concerns me.

I would like to see us balance out our squad more going forward. If he was a natural center that has been playing center this whole time, I would pay alot for that player because he would fill a massive hole in our lineup.

 

[Torontonian]

Given the composition of the roster Skinner isn’t a real fit. Depth scoring, yes but other facets of his game are the same weaknesses as others. And he’s never been playoff tested.

Some wise words from Kyle Okposo, who is one win away from a Stanley Cup after going seven years without playing in the post-season: "There's so many guys that haven't played in the playoffs that would be absolute dogs in the playoffs."

Albeit, that might not be Jeff Skinner, but something like that is the least of my concerns when looking at a player.

 

[weems]

Regarding Minten being seen as the bust from team Canada.
That is a very fan based take and I would bet many teams that have scouted these players for many seasons, don't jump to conclusions based on a 5 to 6 game sample.
Many teams would value this player. He's someone that projects to be strong defensively, is a good team leader, has a nice skillset and good size for a centermen. He's not going to be a huge point producer but strong #3 C's that can do a bunch of everything are very valuable in the minds of coaches.

 

[1specter]

Regarding Minten being seen as the bust from team Canada.
That is a very fan based take and I would bet many teams that have scouted these players for many seasons, don't jump to conclusions based on a 5 to 6 game sample.
Many teams would value this player. He's someone that projects to be strong defensively, is a good team leader, has a nice skillset and good size for a centermen. He's not going to be a huge point producer but strong #3 C's that can do a bunch of everything are very valuable in the minds of coaches.

I also trust that Wes Clark knows what he is doing, he seems to be a very sharp hockey mind.