GDT: Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

[Jozay]

Then we may as well turn the core over and try again because I doubt the other two are getting better at there age

Flawed logic.

 

[DougGilmour93]

My 2024 Toronto Maple Leaf offseason

Trade 1
Marner + Gregor + Liljegren
For
Saros + Evangelista + Tomasino + Fabbro

Trade 2
Rielly + Jarnkrok
For
Garland (950,000 retained) + rights to Hronek

Trade 3
Kampf + Robertson + Timmins
For
McMichael

UFA signings

Domi 6 x 3.5m
Montour 6 x 6m
Zadorov 5 x 5m
Trenin 4 x 2.5m
Joshua 4 x 3m

RFA

Dewar 2 x 1,350,000
McMichael 4 x 3,000,000
Tomasino 2 x 1,350,000
Hronek 7 x 6,000,000


Lineup

Knies - Matthews - Domi
Garland- Tavares - Nylander
McMann - McMichael - Evangelista
Trenin - Dewar - Joshua

Extra - Holmberg, Tomasino

McCabe - Montour
Zadorov - Hronek
Benoit - Fabbro

Extra - Webber

Saros
Woll

Cap remaining $185,883

The following year we free up Tavares 11m and we can divy that between the following …
McCabe’s (2m to 5m)
Knies raise (to 5m)
Saros raise (5m to 8m)
With 1m to spare.

 

[ULF_55]

Man won a cup ULF and it was more we got jack **** for him that grates on me

Nothing for a 60 point 2nd line center, Buffalo got Byram for that player

Oh, yeah, he got suspended again for the Avs in the playoffs.
Maybe his immaturity through age 29 means he'll play until age 40 as an adult.

He got his retirement contract from Treliving.

Kadri and Andersson for marner.

Kadri will be 34 this upcoming season, and his contract runs through age 38.

Leafs could be geriatric at center, Kadri and Tavares, behind Matthews.

 

[Torontonian]

20mil might look like a lot this off season but they need another starter, three Dmen(at least one of them should be top pairing), and three forwards of which at least two of them plays in the top 6.
That’s an average of under 3 mil per player.

When it comes to JT and his 11mil. Knies, McCabe and Woll will need new deals. Plus if MM stays, then his cap hit will increase.

Look at the Panthers and how they are built, you can’t have a balanced and talented team with three 11mil plus forwards.

Ah yes, the panthers model of having 37m tied up into 4 players. (Barkov = 10m / Tkachcuk = 9.5m / Bob = 10m / Ekblad = 7.5m). The panthers model of success isn't easy to copy due to the fact they are getting insane value on the current players:

Forsling = 2.6m cap hit
Reinhart = 6.5m cap hit
Bennett = 4.2m cap hit
Verhaeghe = 4.1m cap hit
Montour = 3.5m cap hit

There two top 4 d-man make a total of 6.1m while 3 of their top 6 players make a total of 14.8m. Find me a team in the league right now that can say 2 top 4 d-man and 3 top 6 forwards are combined 21m and cup contenders. A year later and the Panthers not winning the cup, they would be just as screwed.

 

[ULF_55]

Ah yes, the panthers model of having 37m tied up into 4 players. (Barkov = 10m / Tkachcuk = 9.5m / Bob = 10m / Ekblad = 7.5m). The panthers model of success isn't easy to copy due to the fact they are getting insane value on the current players:

Forsling = 2.6m cap hit
Reinhart = 6.5m cap hit
Bennett = 4.2m cap hit
Verhaeghe = 4.1m cap hit
Montour = 3.5m cap hit

There two top 4 d-man make a total of 6.1m while 3 of their top 6 players make a total of 14.8m. Find me a team in the league right now that can say 2 top 4 d-man and 3 top 6 forwards are combined 21m and cup contenders. A year later and the Panthers not winning the cup, they would be just as screwed.

Key player has been Bobrovsky, and then Barkov.

If Bobrovsky isn't lights out they go nowhere, like what happened last year when he left his peak streak, and got steamrolled by the VGK.

Tkachuk has 1 point last 5 games.
Verhaeghe 1 point last 5 games.

Bobrovsky is their MVP 2 years running.

 

[ULF_55]

Stauffer said during the conversation, “I will tell you this: It’s my belief that the Draisaitl camp will want the maximum. They’re not looking for the Auston Matthews four-year deal here. They’re looking at a long-term deal.” Seravalli noted that talks have already begun with Draisaitl and the hockey insider believes McDavid will follow and sign, as will Bouchard. Seravalli’s projections have McDavid at around $16 million, $14 million for Draisaitl, and $10 million for Bouchard.

NHL Rumors: Oilers, Maple Leafs, Senators - The Hockey Writers NHL Rumors Latest News, Analysis & More

NHL rumors: Oilers work on Draisaitl extension, McDavid and Bouchard not far behind. Maple Leafs not sure about Marner trade, Senators busy.

thehockeywriters.com

 

[Antropovsky]

Tampa paid it, but he was never worth it. And he’s been lousy for them in Tampa. Just a brutal trade on their part.

Jeannot has only had 1 season in his career where he has looked like an NHL player.

Schenn called Jeannot irrelevant.. maybe Schenn has a pro scout career ahead of him.

 

[Dreakmur]

Ah yes, the panthers model of having 37m tied up into 4 players. (Barkov = 10m / Tkachcuk = 9.5m / Bob = 10m / Ekblad = 7.5m). The panthers model of success isn't easy to copy due to the fact they are getting insane value on the current players:

Forsling = 2.6m cap hit
Reinhart = 6.5m cap hit
Bennett = 4.2m cap hit
Verhaeghe = 4.1m cap hit
Montour = 3.5m cap hit

There two top 4 d-man make a total of 6.1m while 3 of their top 6 players make a total of 14.8m. Find me a team in the league right now that can say 2 top 4 d-man and 3 top 6 forwards are combined 21m and cup contenders. A year later and the Panthers not winning the cup, they would be just as screwed.

Didn’t the leafs fit into that group this year?

Nylander, Bertuzzi, and Domi add up to 15.5 and McCabe and Liljegren add up to 3.4.

3 of their top 6 forwards and 2 of their top 4 defenders for 18.9 million.

 

[Kiwi]

Oh, yeah, he got suspended again for the Avs in the playoffs.
Maybe his immaturity through age 29 means he'll play until age 40 as an adult.

He got his retirement contract from Treliving.

Kadri and Andersson for marner.

Kadri will be 34 this upcoming season, and his contract runs through age 38.

Leafs could be geriatric at center, Kadri and Tavares, behind Matthews.

Ì don't want Kadri back either I'm just pointing out this trade has the potential to make us worse if it gets ****** up and I don't really trust the guy that's going to be doing it

Much like the last guy that was intimating trading Marner

 

[Kiwi]

Using the money to make sure our prospects and defence is paid so the scoring is spread out better is using the money wisely. Paying 23 mil on 2 wingers isn't.

We don't know how much we'll have the year after next season yet. We'll probably have a better idea on that after this years Free Agency and we give out all those new contracts that will be on the books 2 seasons from now since we only have 8 players on the current roster signed after next season. We'll probably have around the same amount of cap as we do this offseason and Knies and Woll will probably be the bigger cap hits among most of the guys coming off their ELCs the next few years

Depends on how good the wingers are and a 100 point selke vote winner would be pretty bloody close

You seem to be living in fear of Knies and Woll needing new deals, as of now they aren't going to be costing that much
One isn't a starter and the other had 35 points, that's not breaking the bank just like Holmberg, Robertson, Liljegren or any of those guys

 

[Kiwi]

Easier said than done. As just having players on the team is a lot different than having good players on the team.

A C, 2Dmen and a Goalie will be just about 18mil. C will be 5-6mil, 2Dmen will be 4mil each and a goalie is 4mil. Robbie makes league minimum, so there is no saving in terms of cap. Calle, Kampf and Reeves make a combine of 5.7mil, replacing them with bargin or ELCs at 950k player will only save 2.7mil. Then you have to resign RFA like Lilly, but lets assume he takes the same cap.

Lets say we keep everyone and bring the band back without any signings in the forward but the 2C you mentioned and the Dmen.

Knies-AM-MM
McMann-2C(6mil)-Willie
Cowan-JT-3.7mil Winger(using the 2.7mil plus Robbie 950k)
Dewar-Holmberg-950k Winger

Reilly-4mil Dman
McCabe-4mil Dman
Beniot-Lilly
Timmins

Goalie(4mil)
Woll

Thats not a pretty bad lineup and if Cowan struggles, next man up will be Steeves.

IF they trade MM for just pure picks. They can add that 11mil to the lineup above like Marchessault and Domi. With left over money to add to D or the 3.7mil winger.

The lineup would be

Domi-AM-Marchessault
Knies-2C(5-6mil)-Willie
McMann-JT-Toffoli
Cowan-Holmberg-950k winger

Same D and same goalie.

Thats a much better Forward group than sticking with MM.

Marchessault is mid 30's are we a retirement home now? Domi can't stick with one team for more than a couple of seasons
Toffoli is over 30 to

So significant expense for significantly older

This is so short sighted it beggars belief, hasn't JT taught you anything? At least Marner is 27

Also a tandem goaltender won't cost 4M, unless you're buying the best available a center won't cost 6M and who's the idiot paying 2.7M for a 3rd line winger? Jankrok makes less than that. Also you have Grebyonkin and Minten if Cowan isn't ready and where is Robertson who will still be cheap?

This is incomprehensible, cap friendly wouldn't be amiss

Flawed logic.

Logic, pick a path and stick to it

 

[LaPlante94]

Depends on how good the wingers are and a 100 point selke vote winner would be pretty bloody close

You seem to be living in fear of Knies and Woll needing new deals, as of now they aren't going to be costing that much
One isn't a starter and the other had 35 points, that's not breaking the bank just like Holmberg, Robertson, Liljegren or any of those guys

Well damn, you'd think our PK would be better in the playoffs with all these pretty good defensive forwards on the team and Selke vote getters. Marner and Kampf getting Selke votes and Jarnkrok as a very good defensive player. Teams should be lining up to give us all their prospects or top line C for a 100 point Selke Vote winner. Even better for us then.

Knies scored 15 goals and 35 points in his rookie year playing all over the lineup and 13 mins a game and barely any PP time. So yes, I think in a bigger role he's gonna get a nice little pay raise and if we're smart we'd give him a long term deal so when he does breakout we'll have him on a steal of a contract. The same with Woll and Lili. Woll has been our best goalie in a long time when he's healthy and his play in the playoffs has been even better, so yes, I think they will cost more than most think because I don't think these short term deals benefit us at all. All these guys are 25 and younger and I think it's time we start locking up some guys who show potential to longer term deals during their 20s so when they hit 30 other teams can overpay for them as FA.

 

[Gabriel426]

Ah yes, the panthers model of having 37m tied up into 4 players. (Barkov = 10m / Tkachcuk = 9.5m / Bob = 10m / Ekblad = 7.5m). The panthers model of success isn't easy to copy due to the fact they are getting insane value on the current players:

Forsling = 2.6m cap hit
Reinhart = 6.5m cap hit
Bennett = 4.2m cap hit
Verhaeghe = 4.1m cap hit
Montour = 3.5m cap hit

There two top 4 d-man make a total of 6.1m while 3 of their top 6 players make a total of 14.8m. Find me a team in the league right now that can say 2 top 4 d-man and 3 top 6 forwards are combined 21m and cup contenders. A year later and the Panthers not winning the cup, they would be just as screwed.

37mil is still 10mil less than the Leafs tied up with 4 players. Plus Panthers combination is 2 forwards, 1D and 1 G instead of 4 Forwards.

We can discuss Panthers model is not sustainable all days but the fact that their top four players cost 10mil less than ours and not just on forwards is miles better than how we spend with the Cap.

Those 10mil diff can be spend on 2 Dmen or 2 forwards or a goalie and a forward… that’s two 5 million players. Plus the 1.7mil saving can add toward the 3rd player with cap hit of 850k. That’s a 2.5mil player.

That’s 3 players instead of three 850k players on the Leafs.

 

[Gabriel426]

Marchessault is mid 30's are we a retirement home now? Domi can't stick with one team for more than a couple of seasons
Toffoli is over 30 to

So significant expense for significantly older

This is so short sighted it beggars belief, hasn't JT taught you anything? At least Marner is 27

Also a tandem goaltender won't cost 4M, unless you're buying the best available a center won't cost 6M and who's the idiot paying 2.7M for a 3rd line winger? Jankrok makes less than that. Also you have Grebyonkin and Minten if Cowan isn't ready and where is Robertson who will still be cheap?

This is incomprehensible, cap friendly wouldn't be amiss


Logic, pick a path and stick to it

Marchessault just scored 40goals and Toffoli scored 30 goals. Both are better players than MM and JT. And I have not even start talking about their playoffs stats.
Do you know how many guys on the Panthers that couldn’t stick with one or two teams? I don’t understand why that is a negative on a player who actually played well with the Leafs last year.

let’s run a tandem goalie instead of someone who is good enough to win in playoffs. Or just bet on Woll being available.

Let’s continue to cheap out on goalie and supporting players than complain about goaltending and depth scoring next May when the problem has been our top guys not producing in playoffs.

There are only 6 common denominators over the past 6 yrs, Shanny, AM, MM, Willie, JT and Reilly.
If they are not the problem, I really don’t know what else I can say.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Marchessault just scored 40goals and Toffoli scored 30 goals. Both are better players than MM and JT. And I have not even start talking about their playoffs stats.
Do you know how many guys on the Panthers that couldn’t stick with one or two teams? I don’t understand why that is a negative on a player who actually played well with the Leafs last year.

let’s run a tandem goalie instead of someone who is good enough to win in playoffs. Or just bet on Woll being available.

Let’s continue to cheap out on goalie and supporting players than complain about goaltending and depth scoring next May when the problem has been our top guys not producing in playoffs.

There are only 6 common denominators over the past 6 yrs, Shanny, AM, MM, Willie, JT and Reilly.
If they are not the problem, I really don’t know what else I can say.

On the bold... just no.

Since coming into the league Marner is 10th in points, Tavares is 19th. Marchessault is 38th, Toffoli is 81st.

If you want to go even strength Marner is 11th, Tavares is 18th. Marchessault 26th, and Toffoli is well back of them.

I like both players and would be happy to sign either, but they are not better than Marner or Tavares, especially in the regular season.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I think with us not being linked to Roy by pretty much anyone tells me that we probably tried to tamper and he's not interested in playing in Canada.

The Marner stuff honestly reminds me of the Kessel situation, a lot of the "The Leafs are happy to let this play out" / come back next year. I think he does get dealt, I could be wrong but it's just what I think.

 

[rumman]

Ì don't want Kadri back either I'm just pointing out this trade has the potential to make us worse if it gets ****** up and I don't really trust the guy that's going to be doing it

Much like the last guy that was intimating trading Marner

We know the recipe doesn’t work, why are you so hesitant to try and fix the recipe? Let’s win a cup and not worry about who wins the trade, if said trade makes the Leafs better I could care less about “winning” the trade. Running it back is beyond stupid at this point, it was stupid 4 years ago, but some a slow learners……….

 

[Gaberd2608]

Didn’t the leafs fit into that group this year?

Nylander, Bertuzzi, and Domi add up to 15.5 and McCabe and Liljegren add up to 3.4.

3 of their top 6 forwards and 2 of their top 4 defenders for 18.9 million.

Your top 4 are slighltly off - Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares then 3 top forwards = Domi,Bertuzzi, Knies, and 2 top defense = Rielly and McCabe.


Domi = 3
Bertuzi = 5.5
Knies. = 0.925
Rielly = 7
McCabe = 2

At the end of the day, the leafs were one bad goal away from who knows. The difference between Florida and Toronto is it appears on of their top 4 at a min is carrying the team and the secondary players are contributing.

We all saw when Nylander or Matthews went into god mode good things happened for us. The problem is none of them could do it for 16 games.

 

[ULF_55]

Your top 4 are slighltly off - Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares then 3 top forwards = Domi,Bertuzzi, Knies, and 2 top defense = Rielly and McCabe.


Domi = 3
Bertuzi = 5.5
Knies. = 0.925
Rielly = 7
McCabe = 2

At the end of the day, the leafs were one bad goal away from who knows. The difference between Florida and Toronto is it appears on of their top 4 at a min is carrying the team and the secondary players are contributing.

We all saw when Nylander or Matthews went into god mode good things happened for us. The problem is none of them could do it for 16 games.

Panthers top 5 haven't exactly been doing much this final series.
Combined they have 3 goals.

Bobrovsky has been the difference.

 

[hamzarocks]

We need a center, 2 Dmen and a goaltender and we can trade out the likes of Robertson, Jarnkrok, Kampf and reeves to create more cap room

It's easier doable

There projecting us for about 55M on the books season after next with another cap rise

It isn't 11M it's more like 35M with those RFA'S to sign



Is it? Are Matthews and Nylander going to be better somehow?

I remember Kadri being traded as addition by subtraction, not great if we're being honest

It isnt possible its almost a guarantee we are a better team with 2 or 3 of the core moved out for different core pieces (trade, draft, ufa)

Marner --> 72 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11M

Matthews --> 71 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 13.25M

Nylander --> 65 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11.5M

Tavares --> 52 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11M

They are 20M overpaid collectively as a group

We play with 20M negative anchors routinely in the playoffs because our core are support guys or low end 1st liners being paid like top 10-15 players in the league come playoff time

Its impossible to get worse value than what the core 4 has given us

They are overpaid, overhyped and overrated at the same time

 

[ToneDog]

It isnt possible its almost a guarantee we are a better team with 2 or 3 of the core moved out for different core pieces (trade, draft, ufa)

Marner --> 72 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11M

Matthews --> 71 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 13.25M

Nylander --> 65 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11.5M

Tavares --> 52 pts per 82 in the playoffs at 11M

They are 20M overpaid collectively as a group

We play with 20M negative anchors routinely in the playoffs because our core are support guys or low end 1st liners being paid like top 10-15 players in the league come playoff time

Its impossible to get worse value than what the core 4 has given us

They are overpaid, overhyped and overrated at the same time

The problem is our cheap goaltenders are not shutting out teams in games 7s so we can win 1-0. If only Tre could find us the next Domenic Haskek for $775K. We'd be GOLDEN.

 

[Brobust]

Dreger reporting on FirstUp that Leafs would like to extend Marner rather than trade him.

This is actually good news.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

I can't wait to see how badly they screw this offseason up.

The anticipation is killing me. Every day I wake up expecting to read Marner has been traded for Crouse. Or some other cruddy player like him.

I don't have any faith in this team making a predatory trade of Marner for a basket of young budding stars.

In fact I expect just the opposite. Some other GM will bend Treliving over the barrel. Take advantage of a situation not entirely one of Treliving's own making.

And I can't wait to see it happen.

 

[ER89]

Dreger reporting on FirstUp that Leafs would like to extend Marner rather than trade him.

This is actually good news.

Better be extend him with no NTC and then as soon as he signs ..

BAM you outta here.

Then I wake up.

Incoming 5 years x 28m cus he's better than MCD and drai. He only has one less goal scored in the SCF than those two combined!!!!

 

[Dion TheFluff]

Dreger reporting on FirstUp that Leafs would like to extend Marner rather than trade him.

This is actually good news.

yup. lets just keep running it back