Rumor: Trade Rumor Thread IV - "What's all the roar over RoR?"
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NikC
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- Oct 7, 2008
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well after watching MDZ on the PP late in the third, it's clear to me at least, that I'd like to see him moved for ROR. He can't handle a pass, passes when he should shoot, and passes to imaginary players out of the zone.
NYR Viper
Registered User
No!!!!!!! Borderline 4th liner with some toughness. Skates alright.
I try not to use knee-jerk reactions too much but I haven't thought that highly of MDZ for a little while now.
NikC
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- Oct 7, 2008
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like you i'm sure, i watch every game, and every game MDZ played in. I realize he's young and developing, but he makes costly mistakes at crucial times in games, over and over. I see his value, and I like what he brings, but since his back to back blunders in last year's playoffs against NJ that cost us both games, i haven't felt the same about him... not a big fan.
ROR makes too much sense esp with the potential buyout next July with BR...
haveandare
Registered User
Can someone fill me in on why exactly ROR is valued so highly? He has 39 career goals over 3 years and is currently holding out on a team that just last year he was in the conversation for captain of. I didn't follow the Avs closely last year. I just don't get why people are so high on this guy. Can someone fill me in?
NYR Viper
Registered User
I am thinking about nothing other than value for value. ROR > MDZ
That is my opinion from watching them both play and where the needs of this organization are both now and in the future. Even if Richards isn't bought out, they will need a center like ROR. Every team in the league would want a center like him.
NYR Viper
Registered User
21 year old with 55 points as one of the only offensive forces on his team. Plays a VERY good 2-way game. Led the league in takeaways. Plays consistently against the other teams best players. Good vision, good work ethic, high hockey IQ.
He reminds me of Patrice Bergeron.
haveandare
Registered User
Did he show that type of play before last season? And is there reason to believe he's capable of taking another step offensively?
Boyler, you keep saying how great ROR is and keep saying how MDZ does nothing well. So why would the Avs trade ROR AND Barrie for MDZ and a guy that should be a 4th center? Doesn't make sense. Unless they're desperate and we're the only suitors. At least the second half of that doesn't sound like it's the case.
NYR Viper
Registered User
He was put in a defenseive role his first (2) years in the league. He was their shut-down center, still played against the other teams best players which is impressive for an 18 and 19 year old in the NHL.
It's not that MDZ does nothing well. It's that I don't see him doing things THAT much better than the other players I see around him in McDonagh, Staal and Girardi. He is a good player. On this team he is the #3 LD. Staal, McDonagh and MDZ don't look good on their off-side. Staal and McDonagh are better than MDZ.
Maximize the asset. Puck-movers are at a premium in todays NHL. Whether that is right or wrong that is for another discussion.
haveandare
Registered User
Interesting. Thanks for the info.
I'm still not really sold on the idea though honestly. He hasn't established himself as an offensive threat, which we should be looking for in any C coming in with speculation about Richards' future, he's showing a tremendous lack of character in his dealings with the Avs, we don't have anyone to take MDZ's spot off the bat if he were to go for him and the guy hasn't played a minute of NHL hockey all year while our team is still struggling to find their legs and heads after the late start.
Is the quote that you posted a secret that just you and maybe other Rangers fans know?
NYR Viper
Registered User
Maybe. All I can comment on is I like the player. I have no idea what's going on behind the scenes between he, his agent and the Avs.
There are trades like this all the time. Teams look and see 40+ points from a 22 year old defenseman with a ton of hits. Playoff experience. top-4 minutes.
We have the ability to watch him every game.
I'd sure be disappointed if Rangers scouts new less about ROR than Avs fans on a message board. It's their job to look beyond the numbers.
NYR Viper
Registered User
You're missing my point.
MDZ fits more of a need for Colorado than he does for the NYR. Hence he holds more value to them than he does to NY. ROR would get a bigger role in the long-run than MDZ would. Hence the deal makes sense.
Don't think about it in terms of this season. Think of it in the long-term.
Del Zotto will get paid his next contract. 5+ easily. For a guy who will always be behind McDonagh, Staal, and Girardi.
Tyson Barrie has just as much potential. Except he plays the right side, and is a better skater. Younger, and cheaper.
O'Reilly is comparable to Patrice Bergeron.
Colorado may not have a choice but to trade O'Reilly soon, and get value for him. Del Zotto and O'Reilly are fair value. But the Rangers would need a defenseman in return. That's where Barrie comes in. But to get him we have to up our package. Colorado would need a defensive center after losing O'Reilly. Boyle is young enough, and fits the role. We would have to add a bit more, 2nd tier prospect and pick. We have 3 3rds. Probably a 4th 3rd if we don't reach the Cup Finals, which is the condition of that pick from the Nash deal.
It's a deal that makes sense for both clubs.
BBKers
Registered User
I am lightening up to this. If there is a deal, it should be exactly as you speculate
Yeah but part of your reasoning was to say how much value puck moving D-men have while a few posts before you said he wasn't a puck moving D-man. Unless the Avs have ****** scouts, then that seems like a contradiction.
NYR Viper
Registered User
From the Avs board. They had someone who knows O'Reill say they were close over the summer but something happened that threw them off and both parties dug their heels in. Not sure what it was though.
NYR Viper
Registered User
I don't consider him a puck-moving d-man as compared to others I have seen in my lifetime. In today's NHL where the term is used more loosely, yes, he is.
Also, Scott Gomez was a playmaking center as a UFA. He got to the Rangers and didn't look much like one to me.
Watching a player everyday shows a lot. Scouting a player is great, but most scouts can't watch every game of every league of every year. Not enough time and people.
I hope so, too.
And with Richards' situation. 34 yrs old after the 13-14 season, with 6 years remaining at 6.6 per.
Buy him out.
At that point Miller will have had two years NHL experience. Lindberg will most likely be here.
O'Reilly
Stepan
Miller
Lindberg
Finally growing a young group of two way centers.
Nieves soon after.
And on defense, Skjei, McIlrath, Barrie added to McDonagh, Girardi, and Staal. Maybe Stralman sticks around?
Long-term, losing Del Zotto doesn't hurt us. This season maybe.
I like Del Zotto. But something has to give, given the financials long-term and depth in one area and lack of it in others.
It makes a lot of sense when you put the puzzle pieces together.
If we could get ROR and Barrie for MDZ, Boyle and a pick I would do that in a heartbeat. I think Michael can still be a very good player but the best player in the deal would be ROR. Count me in.
I have seen that quote around this thread quite a bit, can somebody expand on it.
I disagree with the premise. But I can be convinced.
I don't consider Del Zotto a puck moving defenseman, either. He has offensive skills, no doubt. But he lacks the foot speed and ability to control the tempo of the game to be a consistent threat.
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