Rumor: Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXVI: G Staying Put.

[SnowblindNYR]

Ok, all of you guys *****ing about centers, what's your solution? Sell off any and all of our assets until (if) we got one for prospects and picks? Rebuild and hope we get a #1 center in the draft? What's the solution?

 

[aufheben]

That's the point. The playoffs are a small sample, so career playoff record are small samples that tend to regress to the player's regular performance levels as they get larger.

Well when that happens I'll have a bit more faith in the kid.

 

[AHB*]

Neither Krejci nor Bergeron is a "#1 C" as defined by this thread. Come on.

Lol. They are both closer to #1C's then we have. Patrice Bergeron is a near elite C, if not elite. Anyone saying otherwise hasn't got a clue. That's absurd.

Guy was on the 1st line for team canada.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

I wouldn't say we are "weak" at C. More that we lack dynamic offensive skill. All four of our centers are good players.

 

[GregSirico]

That's all I have been saying. People take it like I hate Boyle or that I want to rebuild or that this team sucks apparently.

No not one bit I am with you ... I just think my preferred pecking order is this

# 1 trade UFA's who won't come back for impact young talent (highly unlikely)
# 2 trade UFA's for players for veterans talent who can make an impact (less likely)
# 3 trade UFA's for picks (most likely)

 

[Ghost of jas]

Was at about PPG for the Ducks through 05-06. Not 100% sure if he was their center though. Krejci is an absolute beast in the playoffs.

So did Scott Gomez. 2005-6 was a notoriously high scoring year, as the rules had been loosened up coming off the strike.

 

[haohmaru]

You just went back nearly 20 years to find this example. That was a different game. Since the lockout, not one single team has one without an elite #1 center.

Fact is, it is highly highly highly unlikely for a team to win a cup without an elite #1 C, let alone a 1B (Non-Elite), which we arguably don't even have.

Is it impossible, no. Is it impossible to win the lottery, no. Is it likely that it won't happen, yup. I'm a realist and anytime you're going back to 1995 to prove a point, that's pretty telling.

Who's the Kings prototypical 1C? Kopitar with 76 points in 82 games? Or Richards with 44 in 74 games? Beating a Devils team with no business being there.

How about Boston's cup run? Krejci with a whopping 62 points in 75 games or Bergeron with 57 pts. in 80 games?

Our own Brad Richards is on pace for both of those Boston guys, FYI.

Sure, Bergeron is a great, GREAT two way player. But let's keep this "elite 1C to win" crap in perspective. You don't need Sydney Crosby to win (he's won once). You need a TEAM to win. Like every other sport.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Center is more important than goaltending. You can win a cup with a mediocre goalie. You can't win a cup with mediocre centers. Pretty simple

Fleury is not elite. Crawford is not elite. Much easier to overcome a non-elite goalie by having a second tier one, then overcoming a lack of center depth.

I think multiple examples of teams winning Cups without elite centers has been posted in this thread already.

That's your opinion. I think goaltending is the most important. A hot goaltender can carry a non-elite team to a championship.

 

[Kakko]

Yeah, I'm real confident in this team's Cup hopes if Derick Brassard is gonna have to be our best center again.

If he plays like last year, I'm all for it

 

[NYR Viper]

I just dont see the reasoning behind "We need to trade Cally for future assets". Most of you are saying we would get a roster player (most likely a 3rd liner) + B level prospect + a 1st ( which would be low from a playoff contender).

So we get a decent NHLer. Then we get a B level prospect who probably only has 2nd line potential, which we have plenty of. And lastly we get a pick in the 20's, in a decent draft who probably would end up with a 2nd line ceiling, unless we hit a home run. I just dont see it.

As opposed to 30 games of Callahan? Sold.

 

[GregSirico]

I wouldn't say we are "weak" at C. More that we lack dynamic offensive skill. All four of our centers are good players.

This!!!

 

[aufheben]

Ok, all of you guys *****ing about centers, what's your solution? Sell off any and all of our assets until (if) we got one for prospects and picks? Rebuild and hope we get a #1 center in the draft? What's the solution?

It's not easy, and winning the Cup is even less so. I not gonna force myself to believe in something because the solution isn't easy.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Blackhawks second line is Kane and a combination of Handzus, Regin, Versteeg, Shaw, Saad, and Bickell. They are not that deep at forward. They have four incredible players and a great fourth line, but they have a weak 2nd and 3rd line. And a terrible PK.

Three of that Blackhawks defense, won two Stanley Cups...has a Norris winner...and coincidently, that team's core of forwards are also two time Cup winners...

I'd say yes, they are much better than our team.

They also have RIDICULOUS organizational depth. They have the top offensive defenseman prospect tearing up the AHL, they have a handful of high-end prospects.

We do not have their depth, not at the NHL level, not below it.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yeah, I'm real confident in this team's Cup hopes if Derick Brassard is gonna have to be our best center again.

Ok, were you confident Broten? Seriously. For one bring up stats and for the other skill. If you brought up skill for Broten, you'd have a poor argument. If you brought up points for Brassard, you'd have a poor argument. So you managed to rig this argument so you can win.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Lol. They are both closer to #1C's then we have. Patrice Bergeron is a near elite C, if not elite. Anyone saying otherwise hasn't got a clue. That's absurd.

Guy was on the 1st line for team canada.

Patrice Bergeron is elite?

So like, what's your definition of elite then? Cause mine is like Sidney Crosby John Tavares Jonathan Toews Ryan Getzlaf.

I guess yours is "really good player."

 

[Ghost of jas]

I wouldn't say we are "weak" at C. More that we lack dynamic elite offensive skill. All four of our centers are good players.

That is the correct answer. Balance your scoring up front, play strong defense as this team does, and let Henke do his job. Again, I'll take my chances with this lineup, with MSL added at the right price.

 

[aufheben]

If he plays like last year, I'm all for it

Cool, I'm not. I'm probably the biggest Brassard fanboy around. I would love for Stepan to step up, I hope he can, but he's given me no reason to think it will all of the sudden happen, especially with the regular season he's having.

 

[Pugs35]

Again, picking an outlier. The kings made history that year. You're right, anything is possible, but we shouldn't be semi-handicapping our future, once again, for something that is so unlikely to net us a win.

Can anything happen, yup. Is it probable, absolutely not. An 8 seed had never won the cup before. The odds of that happening are slim.

Just to note, that team also had 3 centers that were better then any ONE that we have currently. Pretty massive difference.

And the Kings added a YOUNG asset in Jeff Carter, they didn't trade for a 38 year old. They developed Jack Johnson for 6 years and traded him for a player that will continue to be around for another 10. No one is saying to decline our playoff bid or anything, but the Kings made a smart long term move that paid off in the short term as well. It doesn't have to be an either or decision.

 

[SupersonicMonkey*]

I am not saying get him at all cost ... if the price is right (obviously) if you can grab him for say Callahan and low pick or a middle road player, you do it. You don't mortgage your whole future for a run.

But that's my point, that package won't get it done. If it would, it would've happened when Boomer tweeted it.

Yzerman already said he won't do it for Callahan, certainly not for Callahan and spare parts. Why would they? Would you if you were Yzerman? They are in the playoff race as well, why wouldn't they give themselves their best chance? To make Rangers fans happy?

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Who's the Kings prototypical 1C? Kopitar with 76 points in 82 games? Or Richards with 44 in 74 games? Beating a Devils team with no business being there.

How about Boston's cup run? Krejci with a whopping 62 points in 75 games or Bergeron with 57 pts. in 80 games?

Our own Brad Richards is on pace for both of those Boston guys, FYI.

Sure, Bergeron is a great, GREAT two way player. But let's keep this "elite 1C to win" crap in perspective. You don't need Sydney Crosby to win (he's won once). You need a TEAM to win. Like every other sport.

Thank God, I read a post I agree with.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Ok, were you confident Broten? Seriously. For one bring up stats and for the other skill. If you brought up skill for Broten, you'd have a poor argument. If you brought up points for Brassard, you'd have a poor argument. So you managed to rig this argument so you can win.

I brought up Broten as an example of a team that won without the classic elite #1 center.

 

[GregSirico]

I just dont see the reasoning behind "We need to trade Cally for future assets". Most of you are saying we would get a roster player (most likely a 3rd liner) + B level prospect + a 1st ( which would be low from a playoff contender).

So we get a decent NHLer. Then we get a B level prospect who probably only has 2nd line potential, which we have plenty of. And lastly we get a pick in the 20's, in a decent draft who probably would end up with a 2nd line ceiling, unless we hit a home run. I just dont see it.

Depends on the alternative ... letting him walk? Yeah I take anything I can get. Ideally I want something I can use right now.

 

[Kakko]

Cool, I'm not. I'm probably the biggest Brassard fanboy around. I would love for Stepan to step up, I hope he can, but he's given me no reason to think it will all of the sudden happen, especially with the regular season he's having.

If our best center in the playoffs goes PPG you wouldn't be okay with it?

 

[Thirty One]

Stepan is a career .647 Pts/GP in the regular season and a 0.378 Pts/GP in the playoffs

Brassard is a career .564 Pts/GP in the regular season and a 1.000 Pts/GP in the playoffs
Boyle is a career 0.257 Pts/GP in the regular season and a 0.333 Pts/GP in the playoffs

So I think our center production should even out in the playoffs.

 

[haohmaru]

Three of that Blackhawks defense, won two Stanley Cups...has a Norris winner...and coincidently, that team's core of forwards are also two time Cup winners...

I'd say yes, they are much better than our team.

They also have RIDICULOUS organizational depth. They have the top offensive defenseman prospect tearing up the AHL, they have a handful of high-end prospects.

We do not have their depth, not at the NHL level, not below it.

If they were "much better" they would've won at least a game against us, no? Is there another measuring stick?

The D between the two clubs is comparable. McD stacks up against anyone in their lineup. Do you trade McD for anyone on their D straight up when factoring age? I don't.