Speculation: Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXIII: Getcha' pitchforks ready.

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Rangers have a team practice today?

I think it happened already. Staal skated. Only Olympian to skate for us was Step.

 

[Gardner McKay]

The gross inability from this board to move off from Chris Stewart as a return makes me wonder if the people advocating for him actually want the Rangers to get "fair value" in their eyes, or they've enchanted themselves with the player and keep bringing him up because of personal desire now, more so than actual relevance.

Bingo. We don't even know if he is still on the table. We don't know who is on the table in a trade for Callahan. Yet people will bash Sather if he doesn't get Stewart + 1st/prospect in a trade (even though something like that may have never been an option).

It is tough for some to differentiate between reality and their own perception of things.

 

[mas0764]

In my mind, doesnt have to be Chris Stewart, but I think the realistic return will feature a centerpiece NHL player like him.

I'd rather skip the centerpiece NHL player (if it's a guy like Stewart) and get higher level prospects instead.

We've got plenty of third line wingers in our system. We don't really need to replace Callahan's production this year. Frankly.... I'm not even sure it would hurt our Cup chances that much if someone else can fill his leadership void.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

In my mind, doesnt have to be Chris Stewart, but I think the realistic return will feature a centerpiece NHL player like him.

I'm wondering why he's constantly being brought up, still, without any indication that he a) was ever actually in play for us for Ryan Callahan and b) is still being sought after by the Rangers.

No reporter ever confirmed that Callahan and Stewart were products of the same trade proposal. The report was that the Blues were interested in Callahan and that the Rangers had been scouting Stewart. No clarification was given if it indeed was for each other, or the Rangers were interested in Stewart independently of Callahan. Then speculation arose as Dreger tweeted that he believed that Stewart for Callahan would be a fair deal. Zippay tweeted back at him saying that the Rangers would certainly need more. Dreger tweeted back saying he didn't believe the Blues would offer more because Cally is a rental. All speculation. Dreger has a TSN label associated with his name and suddenly speculation for him becomes fact for people on this board.

So again the entire rumor on him was derived from educated speculation. And there has been no such follow up in over a month between the Rangers and the Blues in the media. No new rumors. No new reaffirmations that a package would actually still consist Stewart for Callahan.

 

[Kovalev27]

Where's yzerman or msl squashing this?

 

[RangerBoy]

Craig Custance trade deadline list. Top 25 players. Frank Provenzano is a former AGM of the Dallas Stars. He placed the value on the player.

3. Dan Girardi, D, New York Rangers

The focus has been on Ryan Callahan among Rangers trade candidates, but the belief is that GM Glen Sather will move Girardi if he can’t be signed before the deadline. More teams are in the market for defensemen at the deadline, and rarely does a top-pair defenseman from a contending team shake loose at mid-season. This would be a huge addition for a team that needs helps on defense and plays a style suited for and needed in the postseason. The Capitals and Bruins both would benefit greatly from addition of Girardi if Sather is willing to deal within the conference.

Provenzano’s price tag: First-round pick and a mid-level roster player.

5. Ryan Callahan, F, Rangers

It’s amazing that a team expected to be among the Eastern Conference contenders has two players in the top five but the Rangers aren’t willing to lose two valuable pieces in the off-season without getting a return for Callahan and Girardi. Callahan showed his value during the Olympics when he was one of the few Americans to show up from start to finish. A selfless leader who would immediately improve any playoff contender is also a challenge to deal for because the Rangers will need a player or two in return they can plug into their lineup to continue pushing their way up the Eastern Conference standings.

Provenzano’s price tag: First-round pick plus NHL roster player.

8. Chris Stewart, F, St. Louis Blues

If GM Doug Armstrong is going to be aggressive at the trade deadline, he’s going to need more salary cap flexibility than he currently has. Moving Stewart makes sense, especially since there’s appetite among his fellow GMs to add player with some term (and in this case, not too much). Stewart has one year remaining on a contract that comes with a $4.15 million cap hit. It’s not a bad number for a guy capable of scoring 25 to 30 goals, but it’s a lot to pay a guy playing only 14:39 per night for Ken Hitchcock in St. Louis.

Provenzano’s price tag: Roster player for roster player.

http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/craig-custance/post/_/id/1442/top-25-trade-targets

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Bingo. We don't even know if he is still on the table. We don't know who is on the table in a trade for Callahan. Yet people will bash Sather if he doesn't get Stewart + 1st/prospect in a trade (even though something like that may have never been an option).

It is tough for some to differentiate between reality and their own perception of things.

I think some criticize others for playing favorites in trade packages, then go ahead and do the same under the pretense that their package is more tangible, realistic, and helpful. Then those same people only include the same players over and over again in their trade proposals. Hypocritical.

 

[DudMan28]

Most players in the NHL are streaky. If they weren't, they'd be Sidney Crosby.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I'd rather skip the centerpiece NHL player (if it's a guy like Stewart) and get higher level prospects instead.

We've got plenty of third line wingers in our system. We don't really need to replace Callahan's production this year. Frankly.... I'm not even sure it would hurt our Cup chances that much if someone else can fill his leadership void.

Don't speak logically. When you say something like that, 10 others will quote you claiming that Callahan's worth can't even get us an upper level prospect, let alone an elite one and that you should "take what you can get".

 

[Thirty One]

If it was 4 in 20 once that's one thing, 2 in 22 and 4 in 23 or whatever it was over the last 45 games is another thing.

OMG, get on my math level bro. (it's 59 games)

He's certainly inconsistent. But since 2010-11 he has 76 goals in 246 games. Would certainly help.

 

[Todd Harvey]

Where's yzerman or msl squashing this?

There's your first clue LOL.

Instead you've got a guy who knows MSL, or was once close to him, speaking nationally in Canada and his first words are "I think he'd like to get traded" LOL.

I must say, I'm missing BoomerMania ahaha.

Anyone listen to that awful excuse for a show today?

 

[GAGLine]

Callahan > Stewart all around and it's not close. You're criticizing someone who thinks Stewart isn't a good fit for their use of stats and your way of debunking their opinion is by comparing Stewart to Jamie Benn, Mike Richards, and Claude Giroux. I understand you were hitting one specific point but c'mon - a bit of exaggeration here. Stewart is streaky and he can score goals. Being comparable to Callahan offensively does not exactly make him an offensive stud.

Barb said:

A solid NHLer wouldn't go stretches of 20+ games only scoring 4 goals.

I merely used those players to show that he was wrong. At no point did I say, or even infer, that Stewart is on a level with those players.

My argument isn't with his conclusions, just with the "evidence" he is using to back it up. Far too often people pull numbers out of their butts or resort to hyperbole to strengthen their point. Argue the facts.

Offensively, Callahan and Stewart are comparable, but overall, we are talking about a player in a different stratosphere.

Strange, I could have sworn I said this in this post you quoted:

Stewart doesn't bring the rest of the stuff that Cally brings on a consistent basis, but offensively, he's very comparable.

Sounds to me like we are saying the same thing.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I'm wondering why he's constantly being brought up, still, without any indication that he a) was ever actually in play for us for Ryan Callahan and b) is still being sought after by the Rangers.

No reporter ever confirmed that Callahan and Stewart were products of the same trade proposal. The report was that the Blues were interested in Callahan and that the Rangers had been scouting Stewart. No clarification was given if it indeed was for each other, or the Rangers were interested in Stewart independently of Callahan. Then speculation arose as Dreger tweeted that he believed that Stewart for Callahan would be a fair deal. Zippay tweeted back at him saying that the Rangers would certainly need more. Dreger tweeted back saying he didn't believe the Blues would offer more because Cally is a rental. All speculation. Dreger has a TSN label associated with his name and suddenly speculation for him becomes fact for people on this board.

So again the entire rumor on him was derived from educated speculation. And there has been no such follow up in over a month between the Rangers and the Blues in the media. No new rumors. No new reaffirmations that a package would actually still consist Stewart for Callahan.

So....it was a rumor, which is why it is discussed.

I dont think anyone here is infatuated with Stewart in any way, but to many it is a type of deal that is feasible.

For others, its far from adequate. These people better get familiar with the market for rentals quickly if they dont want to be disappointed.

 

[Trxjw]

The gross inability from this board to move off from Chris Stewart as a return makes me wonder if the people advocating for him actually want the Rangers to get "fair value" in their eyes, or they've enchanted themselves with the player and keep bringing him up because of personal desire now, more so than actual relevance.

The only real inability around here seems to be people being unable to understand that some have differing opinions about what is "fair value" for a rental UFA. That, and your inability to stop complaining every time someone talks about Chris Stewart.

 

[Thirty One]

Where's yzerman or msl squashing this?

Exactly.

https://twitter.com/Herman_NYRBlog/status/438351441145913344

If there legitimately is no chance of a MSL trade, then Tampa would issue a press release or statement. Not leak it anon through McKenzie.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

OMG, get on my math level bro. (it's 59 games)

He's certainly inconsistent. But since 2010-11 he has 76 goals in 246 games. Would certainly help.

He would help... if we got him independently for Callahan.

Would he be a good addition to this team? There's a higher probability that he would be a good addition than a bad addition.

But at the expense of Callahan.

Terrible move. And if it happens, many on this board will be disappointed with what they wished for.

Trading our most consistent player who leads by that example in place for a guy whose picture might as well be in the dictionary next to the word inconsistent.

 

[RGY]

Where's yzerman or msl squashing this?

That is what I am waiting for as well. It has been a couple days now. The rumor has gotten out there. Other reporters/analysts have commented on it. If the rumors were so far from the truth MSL and/or Yzerman would have said something by now, no? How long and hard is it to post a brief statement to the media? You haven't heard anything from the rangers side either. Boomer has not backed off his stance, even mentioning how there is still time before the deadline, as if to say 'be patient.'

MSL is a free agent after next season. I can see the move being made if the relationship has soured. MSL has a NMC. Callahan does not. There is not much out there in the market for Stevie Y to replace MSL with for a contending TBL team. It is not like Yzerman can dangle MSL out there and get this top tier roster player that can help his team continue to contend for the rest of the year. MSL is 38 years old with an expiring contract after next season. Callahan + would be a good get to replace him in this market.

 

[aufheben]

Yes all players go through cold streaks, but some are notorious for it.

 

[Ail]

Where's yzerman or msl squashing this?

Any minute now...

right?


RIGHT!?

 

[Clown Fiesta]

OMG, get on my math level bro. (it's 59 games)

He's certainly inconsistent. But since 2010-11 he has 76 goals in 246 games. Would certainly help.

People are worried about MSL's next 105 games if he joins the Rangers, looking back at his previous 246 games I'd feel pretty safe.

If Stewart hadn't had two 20 game stretches basically back to back, end of last season and start of this season where his production fell off a cliff I'd feel much better. I'm pretty sure there is a way to put numbers together where he only goes 10 or so games without scoring and still end at the same results as when he went 20+ games without scoring. His recent history is worrying. Go back a little farther and it's not so damning, but what are you going to get? That's my concern.

 

[Chief]

It'd be a massive mistake to give Callahan the stupid contract he wants.

Not to get back into this discussion but...

Why?

Because we will be unlike every other team that has handed out a "too-rich and too-long" contract and been able to get put from under it?

In all seriousness, if I'm blanking on all the lousy contracts teams have been stuck with, please list them because it looks to me that all of the contracts people complain about do NOT come back and haunt the teams that entered into them. And now that teams can eat some salary in deals, it'll be easier to get rid of "bad contracts".

And I understand there are cap ramifications but with the cap guaranteed to be increasing, Callahan's cap hit is going to be of less and less consequence as each season passes. In the end the Rangers might be overpaying $1 or 2M for a few years. It's hardly a hit that can't be made up elsewhere.

 

[Ail]

Exactly.

https://twitter.com/Herman_NYRBlog/status/438351441145913344

Yeah but...

I thought teams didn't respond to rumors?

Source: RangerBoy

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Any minute now...

right?


RIGHT!?

LOL.

I dont think anyone has denied that MSL might get moved. The BS part is Boomer's additional information.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

So....it was a rumor, which is why it is discussed.

I dont think anyone here is infatuated with Stewart in any way, but to many it is a type of deal that is feasible.

For others, its far from adequate. These people better get familiar with the market for rentals quickly if they dont want to be disappointed.

You're speaking with a tone that you're in the former group of people and that your package is, with certainty, what we should be expecting.

I'm not arguing his value with you anymore. We have different opinions and we can discuss when he in fact gets traded.

I'll take my optimism in place of self proclaimed realism (which is actually cynicism) any day of the week.

 

[RGY]

I think fans too often forget these guys are human. If MSL is affected by being snubbed twice by stevie yzerman, then it very much could affect his play on the ice for the Lightning. It's one thing to go out and perform for your country for 6 games in a 2 week tournament but for the next 20 games over 2 months for Yzerman? It makes a difference. I know MSL has been a professional his entire career, but he is still a human being. This could've been the breaking point.