Speculation: Trade / Roster Speculation Thread XXXIII: Clever Title Pending

[Inferno]

id give stralman 3-4 years at 3.5mil per season.

he's worth it.

if it takes more, trade his rights at the draft...i'm not sure if it will or wont...but thats a pretty decent raise on his current contract.

 

[azrok22]

id give stralman 3-4 years at 3.5mil per season.

he's worth it.

if it takes more, trade his rights at the draft...i'm not sure if it will or wont...but thats a pretty decent raise on his current contract.

Agreed. If you can get him around ~$3.5m per for 3-4 years that is good value, and if McIlrath or someone else forces his way onto the team, you can trade Klein/Stralman later on to accommodate him.

 

[Bluenote13]

id give stralman 3-4 years at 3.5mil per season.

he's worth it.

if it takes more, trade his rights at the draft...i'm not sure if it will or wont...but thats a pretty decent raise on his current contract.

Also agree.

This is a case where the organization had a big hand in bringing him to where he is now, he should give us a good deal as gratitude.

 

[TheTakedown]

Yes, you can. And you should.

And if Miller was strictly a RW, he would be trade bait or he would be moved to LW

Guys earn spots in pre-season. They maintain those spots by continuing to provide what the incumbent provided on a cheaper deal with the hope and expectation that the kid gets better.

Handing spots over to kids because they are kids is no way to run a franchise.

Unless you are Craig McTavish.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Also agree.

This is a case where the organization had a big hand in bringing him to where he is now, he should give us a good deal as gratitude.

I've been likening his situation to Nylander's. Take less and keep a good thing going.

 

[TheTakedown]

Also agree.

This is a case where the organization had a big hand in bringing him to where he is now, he should give us a good deal as gratitude.

that's a great point. Stralman is only good because Slats and Torts collectively pulled him out of the basement and gave him an opportunity to start over.

Hopefully there is a smaller discount. If he prefers you can front load his contract and pay him the bulk of the salary up front:

Year 1: 5M
Year 2: 3M
Year 3: 2.5M
Year 4: 2.5M

Total 13M / 4 years
Total AAV: 3.25

If he wants more, you can retort with:

Year 1: 5M
Year 2: 4M
Year 3: 3M
Year 4: 2.5M

Total 14.5M / 4 years
Total AAV: 3.625


That's a very fair contract for a 2nd pairing defenseman who has peaked at this point. Not that he won't get better, because Stralman in particular has excelled in this system as a defensive defenseman, but because Stralman will never handle 1st pair minutes. His toolbox does not have enough in it to become a 1st pairing guy, and he can't take he place of anyone's "Dan Girardi" for more than a game or two. Hell, if G is out for a game, Klein probably gets the bump to the 1st pairing, while Stralman goes down to the 3rd

 

[Bluenote13]

I've been likening his situation to Nylander's. Take less and keep a good thing going.

Even better, Stralman's like 10 years younger

 

[Cassano]

5 is a lot. the cap isn't going up more than 5-7M this off season, and its no guarantee we have that much money for stralman without moving some other pieces away.

That's ridiculous. I like Stralman but you can't give 5 million a year to a defenseman that contributes nothing offensively.

Stralman as a player shouldn't be judged on his offensive ability. His clear strength is his ability to break out and provide room for his defense partner. Is it merely coincidental that both MDZ and Staal have their best seasons paired alongside him? Why even consider breaking up the core 4 on defense (McDonagh, Girardi, Staal, Stralman) when they've proven for the past 3 years that they're the best grouping in the league?

Let's compare the AAV on caphit for top 4 defenders: (Assuming Stralman makes 5m)

NYR top 4: $19.2M
PHI top 4: $19.35M
PIT top 4: $19.35M
LAK top: $17.7M
STL top 4: $19.35M
CHI top 4: $18.175M

 

[TheTakedown]

Stralman as a player shouldn't be judged on his offensive ability. His clear strength is his ability to break out and provide room for his defense partner. Is it merely coincidental that both MDZ and Staal have their best seasons paired alongside him? Why even consider breaking up the core 4 on defense (McDonagh, Girardi, Staal, Stralman) when they've proven for the past 3 years that they're the best grouping in the league?

which is why a front loaded contract of 3.5AAV is absolutely acceptable for him. He's probably worth 4-5M on the open market, but he'll also have a chance to set himself up to fail because as said prior, he is not a 1st pairing guy. Someone that sinks 4-5M into a defenseman is going to expect that guy to take 1st pairing duties when called upon, something Stralman cannot do consistently

 

[LeetchisGod]

Stralman as a player shouldn't be judged on his offensive ability. His clear strength is his ability to break out and provide room for his defense partner. Is it merely coincidental that both MDZ and Staal have their best seasons paired alongside him? Why even consider breaking up the core 4 on defense (McDonagh, Girardi, Staal, Stralman) when they've proven for the past 3 years that they're the best grouping in the league?

Let's compare the AAV on caphit for top 4 defenders: (Assuming Stralman makes 5m)

NYR top 4: $19.2M
PHI top 4: $19.35M
PIT top 4: $19.35M
LAK top: $17.7M
STL top 4: $19.35M
CHI top 4: $18.175M

What other teams pay their top four has no bearing on stralman's value. There is no way Stralman should have a higher cap hit than McD. Stralman had 1 goal and 13 points this season. Staal had more goals and points than him. Think about that for a moment.

 

[OverTheCap]

I wouldn't mind giving Stralman a multi-year deal for around $3.5M per, but I do wonder where else the offense is coming from on the blueline other than McDonagh, especially in the top 4. Girardi, Staal, and Stralman combined for 51 points this year, that's pretty lousy.

 

[eco's bones]

Stralman is easily the most underrated player on the rangers IMO.

This year, Staal has struggled away from him. MDZ the last two years as well.

He's a thoroughbred and can adequately perform in a top pair role, but he won't get that here.

I don't mind giving Stralman five mil if they move Klein somehow.

Generally I think it's accepted by most Rangers fans that Stralman is an underrated player. You're kind of the exception. You overrate him. Most of us here can see him doubling his salary in his next contract--and deservedly so. You'd rather overpay and triple it and get rid of Klein who is on a great contract and who is pretty close to if not as good as Stralman. I wonder if it's fanatical love for Stralman or fanatical hatred of Klein or some combination thereof.

Stralman's not really a shutdown guy (Klein is closer to that) and he doesn't bring all that much offense. He is a good, steady, smart player who can be counted on to consistently give good minutes. Not a guy you really want on your first pair though keeping the elite players in the league quiet. Maybe if he was 2 inches taller and 25 lbs. heavier he could handle guys like Ovechkin and Malkin better. He's not and I'd rather not see the Rangers experimenting with that.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Generally I think it's accepted by most Rangers fans that Stralman is an underrated player. You're kind of the exception. You overrate him. Most of us here can see him doubling his salary in his next contract--and deservedly so. You'd rather overpay and triple it and get rid of Klein who is on a great contract and who is pretty close to if not as good as Stralman. I wonder if it's fanatical love for Stralman or fanatical hatred of Klein or some combination thereof.

Stralman's not really a shutdown guy (Klein is closer to that) and he doesn't bring all that much offense. He is a good, steady, smart player who can be counted on to consistently give good minutes. Not a guy you really want on your first pair though keeping the elite players in the league quiet. Maybe if he was 2 inches taller and 25 lbs. heavier he could handle guys like Ovechkin and Malkin better. He's not and I'd rather not see the Rangers experimenting with that.

It is this.

Klein makes $2.9M for another four years. That's a steal of a contract. I really like Stralman, and he has played very well here, but I just think there's room to upgrade on offensive contributions from the blueline, and that the most realistic player to upgrade on would be Stralman. Our bottom-pairing is pretty well set for awhile, as is our top pairing.

I feel as though re-signing Stralman could signal Staal potentially being moved - and I'd MUCH rather keep Staal, and give him an offensive guy to work with, than vice versa.

 

[TheTakedown]

It is this.

Klein makes $2.9M for another four years. That's a steal of a contract. I really like Stralman, and he has played very well here, but I just think there's room to upgrade on offensive contributions from the blueline, and that the most realistic player to upgrade on would be Stralman. Our bottom-pairing is pretty well set for awhile, as is our top pairing.

I feel as though re-signing Stralman could signal Staal potentially being moved - and I'd MUCH rather keep Staal, and give him an offensive guy to work with, than vice versa.

Does Staal have any offensive ability? I wonder if it'd be worth trying to push him into that... He's got a killer shot and a huge reach

 

[Blue Blooded]

It is this.

Klein makes $2.9M for another four years. That's a steal of a contract. I really like Stralman, and he has played very well here, but I just think there's room to upgrade on offensive contributions from the blueline, and that the most realistic player to upgrade on would be Stralman. Our bottom-pairing is pretty well set for awhile, as is our top pairing.

I feel as though re-signing Stralman could signal Staal potentially being moved - and I'd MUCH rather keep Staal, and give him an offensive guy to work with, than vice versa.

Klein's contract is good from an objective perspective, under a rising cap $2.9M is good for a #4/5 defenceman. I mean he is basically the same player as Andrew MacDonald, and he just got a ridiculous extension. Good player in the D-zone, but tends to get stuck there more often than not.

But I just don't think he has what it takes to play 20+ minutes on the Rangers without seriously hampering our possession game. I really hope the front office realizes that before they let Strålman go thinking Klein can do his job just as well for a cheaper price and get caught with their pants down as our possession game takes a major hit. I'm fine with him in a depth role, but I seriously think that replacing Strålman with Klein in our top-4 could solely downgrade us from contender to "decent playoff team".

I think AV realizes that Strålman is a lot better suited to his system than Klein, and I hope he has clearly communicated this to the FO. Contrary to what many people here think, I do believe he is capable of playing on a top pairing with the right partner. He did very well with McDonagh for almost half the season last year on the top pairing. I consider him roughly equal to Girardi, although their strengths are vastly different, and he is definitely more of a #2/3 than a #4.

I don't WANT to give Strålman $5M/year, but I might consider it if that is what it took. Hopefully he signs for considerably less.

 

[Tawnos]

Stralman is awesome. But roughly equal to Girardi? Laughable statement.

Again, Stralman is awesome, but I do think he's somewhat overrated around here, while being underrated around the league. He's a solid 4/5 defenseman who fits into our system.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Klein's contract is good from an objective perspective, under a rising cap $2.9M is good for a #4/5 defenceman. I mean he is basically the same player as Andrew MacDonald, and he just got a ridiculous extension. Good player in the D-zone, but tends to get stuck there more often than not.

But I just don't think he has what it takes to play 20+ minutes on the Rangers without seriously hampering our possession game. I really hope the front office realizes that before they let Strålman go thinking Klein can do his job just as well for a cheaper price and get caught with their pants down as our possession game takes a major hit. I'm fine with him in a depth role, but I seriously think that replacing Strålman with Klein in our top-4 could solely downgrade us from contender to "decent playoff team".

I think AV realizes that Strålman is a lot better suited to his system than Klein, and I hope he has clearly communicated this to the FO. Contrary to what many people here think, I do believe he is capable of playing on a top pairing with the right partner. He did very well with McDonagh for almost half the season last year on the top pairing. I consider him roughly equal to Girardi, although their strengths are vastly different, and he is definitely more of a #2/3 than a #4.

I don't WANT to give Strålman $5M/year, but I might consider it if that is what it took. Hopefully he signs for considerably less.

Oh, I completely agree with you on Klein. I really like what he's brought to the team - a steady, vet presence on the third pairing. He shouldn't be asked to do any more than that, though, IMO. He should get between 14-18 minutes a night at most. I would be OK with bringing Stralman back in principle, but the only reason I wouldn't want to is so we could upgrade the #2 RD spot offensively, which would keep Klein on pairing three where belongs.

Question is, who could we bring in?

 

[Tawnos]

People tend to forget that Klein has already been a very capable top-4 defender in the NHL on a team with less defensive depth overall, but better defensive depth on the right side. Given a full training camp on this team, I have no doubts that he can be that next year.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

People tend to forget that Klein has already been a very capable top-4 defender in the NHL on a team with less defensive depth overall, but better defensive depth on the right side. Given a full training camp on this team, I have no doubts that he can be that next year.

I don't think he'd be a detriment in a #4 role, but I don't think it's his ideal role. With his cap hit, we can afford to have him on the third pairing.

Would also be a downgrade to go from Stralman to Klein, and that's not what this team needs.

 

[Cassano]

Generally I think it's accepted by most Rangers fans that Stralman is an underrated player. You're kind of the exception. You overrate him. Most of us here can see him doubling his salary in his next contract--and deservedly so. You'd rather overpay and triple it and get rid of Klein who is on a great contract and who is pretty close to if not as good as Stralman. I wonder if it's fanatical love for Stralman or fanatical hatred of Klein or some combination thereof.

Stralman is underrated because he constantly gets pieced off as a spare part or a redundant asset because the Rangers also have Kevin Klein, who is not nearly as good as Stralman, but is lauded as an interchangeable part.

That's where the Klein 'hatred' sterns from. He's not nearly as good as Stralman, but gets treated as if he is.

Stralman's not really a shutdown guy (Klein is closer to that) and he doesn't bring all that much offense. He is a good, steady, smart player who can be counted on to consistently give good minutes. Not a guy you really want on your first pair though keeping the elite players in the league quiet. Maybe if he was 2 inches taller and 25 lbs. heavier he could handle guys like Ovechkin and Malkin better. He's not and I'd rather not see the Rangers experimenting with that.

Stralman's been playing shutdown caliber minutes for a while now. He doesn't have the prototypical NA cliche of a gritty tough defender, but solidly gets the job done at a high level.

 

[Trxjw]

The Rangers need someone who can replace Richards' minutes on the point on the PP. Who is that going to be? Certainly nobody on the current roster. McDonagh, Girardi and Klein are all locked up. Moore is cost controlled. Staal is a top-pairing defender playing 2nd pairing minutes and absolutely needs to be re-signed. Stralman is the odd-man out.

Wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see Cody Franson or Dan Boyle in a Rangers jersey in the fall.

 

[Blue Blooded]

Oh, I completely agree with you on Klein. I really like what he's brought to the team - a steady, vet presence on the third pairing. He shouldn't be asked to do any more than that, though, IMO. He should get between 14-18 minutes a night at most. I would be OK with bringing Stralman back in principle, but the only reason I wouldn't want to is so we could upgrade the #2 RD spot offensively, which would keep Klein on pairing three where belongs.

Question is, who could we bring in?

That's the thing, Strålman may lack offensive punch (which is weird considering he is very skilled) but I think he will give very good bang for the buck even on his new contract. His lack of offensive production is probably a good thing here as it should make him a lot cheaper to re-sign.

The dream option is Byfuglien, but can we afford him and do we have the assets to acquire him.

Niskanen is probably the best UFA option, but I'm not sold that he is that big of an improvement over Strålman even offensively. I think his offensive numbers are massively inflated by playing on the Penguins and becoming the go-to guy offensive D in Letang's absence. Not to mention he is going to get PAID.

 

[Tawnos]

The Rangers need someone who can replace Richards' minutes on the point on the PP. Who is that going to be? Certainly nobody on the current roster. McDonagh, Girardi and Klein are all locked up. Moore is cost controlled. Staal is a top-pairing defender playing 2nd pairing minutes and absolutely needs to be re-signed. Stralman is the odd-man out.

Wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see Cody Franson or Dan Boyle in a Rangers jersey in the fall.

St Louis has a ton of experience on the point, no?

 

[Tawnos]

I don't think he'd be a detriment in a #4 role, but I don't think it's his ideal role. With his cap hit, we can afford to have him on the third pairing.

Would also be a downgrade to go from Stralman to Klein, and that's not what this team needs.

I disagree on the downgrade. I've probably watched around 50-60% of the games Kevin Klein has played over the last 5 years and ton in person for the two years I lived in Nashville (I have an "Honorary Member of Smashville" certificate to prove that I went to a ton of games ). The player he's been with the Rangers is not the most he's capable of.

 

[Cassano]

It just seems more logical to keep your dominant top 4 together and sell off a bottom pair piece like Klein for a cheaper replacement for the short term. (A guy like Mike Weaver, Scott Hannan, Nikitin, Sarich for example)