HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #89: 2024-2025 season part II

[EXPOS123]

It's not always about picks. You have to balance what that player means to you now. In Savard's case specifically, he may be an upcoming UFA, but as I mentioned, he's been good for the young players that he can still contribute. Now if they end up getting an offer that's too irresistible, then you move him. But in my opinion, I don't think a 3rd round pick is enough of an incentive to let go of him.



For once? All they've been doing for years now is build up a stock pile of picks and prospects. In the last 3 drafts (the HuGo/Bobrov/Lapointe era), they've drafted 30 players. And they used a bunch of picks for trades and even move up.

Even under MB, they selected 38 players in the 4 drafts before HuGo came on board.

For oncv


If you remember that year, Habs were very much in the mix until the end. They missed the playoffs by 2 points. In fact, they got eliminated in the last game of the year. So Benn was their own rental. It would have been a terrible move to be a seller and trade any UFA.

This is what I am saying - when I say for once, I meant since this new regime has been in charge.

Please don’t mention Bozovin - the guy was a complete idiot. The reason we had so many picks with that moron was that he would trade higher round picks for multiple lower ones. Stockpiling 5th 6th, 7th round picks is not not the same as stockpiling 2nds, 3rds and even 4ths.

How do you think we got Hage ?

We traded a second rounder along with our first because we had multiple thirds.

I don’t think people truly appreciate enough how having multiple high round picks is a a very good thing. It gives you so many more options which I already mentioned ( move up in the draft, trades, or even developing depth by using them.)

There is no such thing as having too many, although I should qualify this by saying having too many picks rounds 1 to 4, as accumulating anything lower like Bozovin did Is not worth it

You make a good point about Benn, but if I recall correctly, weren’t there rumors of a late first rounder or second rounder for him ? If that was the case i still maintain it was a mistake to keep him as even if they made the playoffs they were going nowhere.

Savard is not Bourque near his end. He is a mediocre stay at home dman on his last legs who can barely keep up.

I really don’t think he moves the needle with regards to helping the young guys.

If teams value his playoff experience then all the better

I will give you this though, if it’s an offer of anything lower than a fourth rounder then yes I would keep him as well

 

[sampollock]

No trades from KH
Good
Ketp the 1st picks

 

[BLONG7]

The cap this year is $88.5M and our actual salaries are $87.8M. This is an indication that Molson will spend.

I'll make a bet with you that we will spend to the max cap or close to it? Salary cap AAV's will be very close to the max cap and actual salaries can vary. That is hard to track year/year. I just showed you the actual salaries for this season as an example.

To be clear, Molson will spend max cap but it's connected to our rise up the standings. We are not going to spend our cap space just for the sake of it.

Spending to the cap........and dealing with the weak dollar is going to be tough moving forward.
Glad the cap is moving up, but the poor Cdn franchises having to deal with that, and the players getting taxed to the nines, and the stability of the Cdn franchises is going to be under some scrutiny, and tough times ahead.
The revenue created by the Cdn franchises is going to have to be creative, or ask Mr Bettman for some kind of a level playing field??

 

[Scriptor]

This is what I am saying - when I say for once, I meant since this new regime has been in charge.

Please don’t mention Bozovin - the guy was a complete idiot. The reason we had so many picks with that moron was that he would trade higher round picks for multiple lower ones. Stockpiling 5th 6th, 7th round picks is not not the same as stockpiling 2nds, 3rds and even 4ths.

How do you think we got Hage ?

We traded a second rounder along with our first because we had multiple thirds.

I don’t think people truly appreciate enough how having multiple high round picks is a a very good thing. It gives you so many more options which I already mentioned ( move up in the draft, trades, or even developing depth by using them.)

There is no such thing as having too many, although I should qualify this by saying having too many picks rounds 1 to 4, as accumulating anything lower like Bozovin did Is not worth it

You make a good point about Benn, but if I recall correctly, weren’t there rumors of a late first rounder or second rounder for him ? If that was the case i still maintain it was a mistake to keep him as even if they made the playoffs they were going nowhere.

Savard is not Bourque near his end. He is a mediocre stay at home dman on his last legs who can barely keep up.

I really don’t think he moves the needle with regards to helping the young guys.

If teams value his playoff experience then all the better

I will give you this though, if it’s an offer of anything lower than a fourth rounder then yes I would keep him as well

Anything lower than a 2nd rounder, especially with the leadership on the ice of Guhle out for the remainder of the season, I keep Savard and let him go for nothing at the end of the season.

We already have 3 third rounders and 2 fourth rounders in 2025. How many more darts, that are likely to miss the board entirely, do you need?

At some point, it just becomes hate towards a player that isn't based in fact or logic...

 

[sampollock]

Low dollar will hurt Canadian teams

 

[Scriptor]

Spending to the cap........and dealing with the weak dollar is going to be tough moving forward.
Glad the cap is moving up, but the poor Cdn franchises having to deal with that, and the players getting taxed to the nines, and the stability of the Cdn franchises is going to be under some scrutiny, and tough times ahead.
The revenue created by the Cdn franchises is going to have to be creative, or ask Mr Bettman for some kind of a level playing field??

There will need to be a fund designed to level the playing field when it comes to some Canadian franchises, but, for some of them, they still will make more revenue than a majority of US franchises after taking into account the exchange rate for the Canadian dollar VS the US dollar.

Low dollar will hurt Canadian teams

It will, as always, affect the profits of Canadian teams, but not all Canadian teams will risk getting crippled by it.

Nonetheless, there should be a fund for that, to help level the playing field between US and Canadian franchises.

 

[sampollock]

There will need to be a fund designed to level the playing field when it comes to some Canadian franchises, but, for some of them, they still will make more revenue than a majority of US franchises after taking into account the exchange rate for the Canadian dollar VS the US dollar.


It will, as always, affect the profits of Canadian teams, but not all Canadian teams will risk getting crippled by it.

Nonetheless, there should be a fund for that, to help level the playing field between US and Canadian franchises.

And from what I understand the Quebec tax also hurts the Canadians

 

[sampollock]

Josh Anderson is going to have a huge value on the market.

You know, a team that wants to go far in the playoffs... We saw the Panthers how they won, we saw Vegas how they won, it takes a lot out of you!

I've rarely seen Josh Anderson skate as well as that, since he arrived with the Canadiens.

At 4 against 5, on the penalty kill, he's still very good, he goes to the net, he doesn't have the great touch of a scorer but he's capable of scoring goals, and then he's capable of punishing the opponent.

He's still signed for 2 years at $5.5 million, maybe the Canadiens should swallow a million or two, but that would add to Josh Anderson's value."

- Bob Hartley

 

[electron58]

What do you think of getting Seth Jones?

Bad attitude.
Weak passes.
Constantly caught out of position.
Now, is it because he's on a horrible team?
oh, & $9,500,000 per season. No Thanks. Even with retention!

 

[electron58]

Gainey did the same thing for years, that walking turd couldn't sign a top 6 player for all of Koivus career. After Kovalev he just disconnected the phone

Gainey’s inability to negotiate during the season “to avoid distractions” was an incredible sign of his ineptness and lack of ambition.

These points I agree on. Although when in Gainey's term, did he lose his daughter? That was a sad time.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Gainey’s inability to negotiate during the season “to avoid distractions” was an incredible sign of his ineptness and lack of ambition.

Everything else makes sense when you consider that we acquired a tottering old man as a GM.

He just wanted to make everybody feel good and return the spirit (artificial) and make current fans feel connected to the old dynasty days. Ended up being charming PR, but a bad GM.

What is this garbage????

 

[DAChampion]

What is this garbage????

Gainey was mediocre.

 

[tazsub3]

Low dollar will hurt Canadian teams

Which will reduce league revenue which will lower the cap . So they will have to deal with it at some moment in time

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Gainey was mediocre.

Was he? I wasn't really following the team then but posters have said the bad moves were after he lost his daughter.

 

[Sorinth]

Gainey was mediocre.

He took a team that missed the playoffs in 4 of the past 5 seasons and turned them into a team that made the playoffs in 4 of the next 5 seasons. It's not some amazing feat but it's something a lot of GMs in similar situations try and fail to do.

And in terms of the GMs before and after he's clearly one of the better ones.

 

[EXPOS123]

Anything lower than a 2nd rounder, especially with the leadership on the ice of Guhle out for the remainder of the season, I keep Savard and let him go for nothing at the end of the season.

We already have 3 third rounders and 2 fourth rounders in 2025. How many more darts, that are likely to miss the board entirely, do you need?

At some point, it just becomes hate towards a player that isn't based in fact or logic...

Answer me this and be completely honest. How exactly is keeping 3 more months of Savard going to help this team? What leadership on the ice can he possibly bring - he can barely keep up with the play.

Xhekaj and Guhle have been with the team 3 years already. Matheson has been in the league 8 years. Carrier 7......who exactly needs to learn from him - Hutson? Struble?

The guy is done and is not part of the future - might as well let the young guys play so can see what you got and properly evaluate

I don’t hate the guy but I hate this overvaluation of him. He’s just not that good anymore and his leadership is overrated - but if some team is dumb enough to value his playoff experience and overpay then great.

 

[OneSharpMarble]

Gainey was mediocre.

Failing for his entire tenure is not mediocre, it's failure.

 

[Sorinth]

Answer me this and be completely honest. How exactly is keeping 3 more months of Savard going to help this team? What leadership on the ice can he possibly bring - he can barely keep up with the play.

Xhekaj and Guhle have been with the team 3 years already. Matheson has been in the league 8 years. Carrier 7......who exactly needs to learn from him - Hutson? Struble?

The guy is done and is not part of the future - might as well let the young guys play so can see what you got and properly evaluate

I don’t hate the guy but I hate this overvaluation of him. He’s just not that good anymore and his leadership is overrated - but if some team is dumb enough to value his playoff experience and overpay then great.

Here's a quote from Xhekaj from a recent French article
« Il [David Savard] est à mes côtés. C'est le numéro 1 à mes côtés à chaque match. Chaque match, chaque entraînement. Je vais toujours vers lui pour des conseils. Il me dit toujours de garder le sourire quoi qu'il arrive. C'est le meilleur gars à avoir dans ton équipe. Il m'a beaucoup aidé. » - Arber Xhekaj

The gist is Xhekaj is that Savard is vocally in Xhekaj's corner and he's the guy Xhekaj goes to for advice and has and continues to help him tremendously.

And from a management/development POV, it doesn't matter if Savard can only barely keep up with the play it's better then giving those minutes to a young guy who would also struggle, because a young guy who is struggling will lose confidence which hurts development.

 

[tazsub3]

Here's a quote from Xhekaj from a recent French article
« Il [David Savard] est à mes côtés. C'est le numéro 1 à mes côtés à chaque match. Chaque match, chaque entraînement. Je vais toujours vers lui pour des conseils. Il me dit toujours de garder le sourire quoi qu'il arrive. C'est le meilleur gars à avoir dans ton équipe. Il m'a beaucoup aidé. » - Arber Xhekaj

The gist is Xhekaj is that Savard is vocally in Xhekaj's corner and he's the guy Xhekaj goes to for advice and has and continues to help him tremendously.

And from a management/development POV, it doesn't matter if Savard can only barely keep up with the play it's better then giving those minutes to a young guy who would also struggle, because a young guy who is struggling will lose confidence which hurts development.

If you ask me , I would like reinbacher to also benifit from that , even if it means savard plays a game in 5 next year and practically a player coach

 

[Scriptor]

Answer me this and be completely honest. How exactly is keeping 3 more months of Savard going to help this team? What leadership on the ice can he possibly bring - he can barely keep up with the play.

Xhekaj and Guhle have been with the team 3 years already. Matheson has been in the league 8 years. Carrier 7......who exactly needs to learn from him - Hutson? Struble?

The guy is done and is not part of the future - might as well let the young guys play so can see what you got and properly evaluate

I don’t hate the guy but I hate this overvaluation of him. He’s just not that good anymore and his leadership is overrated - but if some team is dumb enough to value his playoff experience and overpay then great.

I'm not over-valuing Savard. I'd keep him because he has a calming effect beyond just the D-squad and because, that, compared to getting nothing back in a deal, is more valuable.

The only value I see in calling up youngsters to play D on a team in disarray because they lost Guhle for the rest of the season is if you're looking to tank.

I don't think that tanking is useful for this team that is still trying to progress and Mailloux has already been recalled, along with Beck.

Once Mailloux has been re-evaluated, I think that calling Engstrom up to see what he has in him at the NHL level would also be a good thing.

I expect to see Carrier on the right side alongside Hutson and Matheson back on his natural side, with Mailloux alongside Xhekaj, perhaps.

Hutson - Carrier
Matheson - Savard
Xhekaj - Mailloux

Everyone is over their heads with Guhle out, but I don't see anything or anyone else improving things, really, as a response to Guhle being out with an injury.

 

[Habssince89]

He took a team that missed the playoffs in 4 of the past 5 seasons and turned them into a team that made the playoffs in 4 of the next 5 seasons. It's not some amazing feat but it's something a lot of GMs in similar situations try and fail to do.

And in terms of the GMs before and after he's clearly one of the better ones.

exactly right. He wasn't amazing but he got them from bottom barrel back to being a playoff team. He should have been promoted so a better GM could take them from playoff team to contender. Sigh.

 

[Egresch]

If you ask me , I would like reinbacher to also benifit from that , even if it means savard plays a game in 5 next year and practically a player coach

He can be a development coach, if he wants. He is the worst D in the team and his partner needs to heqvily compensate for his lack of mobility. On the ice, we need players who can perform.

 

[ReHabs]

He took a team that missed the playoffs in 4 of the past 5 seasons and turned them into a team that made the playoffs in 4 of the next 5 seasons. It's not some amazing feat but it's something a lot of GMs in similar situations try and fail to do.

And in terms of the GMs before and after he's clearly one of the better ones.

If the ambition was to get 8th of 16th, Gainey was the man. He had no ambition for anything above and beyond "mediocre". As the other guy stated, sustained mediocrity is failure.

 

[Egresch]

For those that want to trade Evans, who is his replacement? And don’t mention Beck because we all know he is 2-3 years away from being an impact, if he ever is at all.

We will have one centre on our roster, Suzuki, and a borderline centre at best in Dach. Dvorak will be gone so we will need to find at least two, maybe three natural centres this offseason.

Both Kapanen and Beck are very similar profiles to Evans. Their steady developments shows they should be ready next year for NHL role. I would focus to get improvements on Savard and Dvorak. Might be just 2 year stop gap solution or permanent one. Getting LHC would move Dach and Newhook to 3rd line role.
Cc-Suzuki-Slaf
Laine- LHC-Demidov
Newhook- Beck-Dach
Anderson-Kapanen-Heineman
Gallagher
LHC could be someone like Duchene, Gourde, Mittelstadt, Frost, Namestnikov...