HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #85 - Offseason Editon

[Weltschmerz]

And it will be 13 straight years for Buffalo after this year because their dumb gm is just like Bergevin refuses to trade 1st round picks and go for it.

Should have traded that first instead of drafting that bum Benson.

 

[MolleSon]

“I'm not sure we have enough advanced talent in all aspects: attack, defense or goalkeeping. We will always want to add more. Will it be through the draft, will it be through trades, or both? That remains to be determined. »“It happens [to find an impact player through a trade]. When you have a lot of assets, ammunition in the draft, we could trade a 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th round pick in 2025 to get a player and at the same time still have a 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th pick round. Do I expect us to draft with all our picks available? No. How we are going to use them, we cannot give an exact plan. That's not how it works. But we know that we have assets to look for players. »

- Kent Hughes

This is music to my ears... 2025-2026 is my limit... This is when I expect this club to make a big push towards respectability and true competitiveness. It is in 2025-2026, 5 years after their nominations - that we will be able to judge if HuGo's management has been successful or not. Up until then, yes it is loooooong, yes it is tiring but yes it is necessary. 5 years isn't that long to turn around what was left after Bargain's 10 years stunts.

Up until now, I'm satisfied. I have some doubts about drafting but, in general, I like whats going on.

 

[Miller Time]

For sure, there are holes.

I've often said we need 11 strong players (7F, 3D and 1G). Maybe 10 if one is a true superstar.

At the moment, we have 3F, 1D and 0G.

I'm prepared to bet on Guhle and Slaf to become #s 5 and 6.

Newhook is a total question mark, and Reinbacher might actually be great but is too far away right now. I'm not sold on Hutson or Mailloux becoming rounded players we can count on for the top half of our team.

Not to nitpick, but do you not consider Monahan a "strong player" right now?

I'm assuming you put Suzuki, CC & Dach in that category.

I can see not including Anderson or Dvorak, but I feel like Monahan's play is easily "strong top 6" caliber, as fragile as his health may be.

4F, 1D, 0G...

With Slaf, Newhook, Anderson as lineup candidates to bump up there... and Roy, Heineman, Farrell, Mesar, Beck, Rohrer, Kidney, Tuch et. as realistically to give us 1-3 more. 7 may well be attainable within the current org depth, but I suspect management will add 1-2 more via trade/UFA over the next 2 seasons.

Guhle I agree brings us to 2... I think it's likely that at least 1 (probably more) of RB, Hutson, Mailloux, Barron, Engstrom, Norlinder, Harris, Trudeau, Konyushkov or Strubble push into top 3-4 NHL dmen before Matheson's contract is up.

G.... well that's a tougher one. If Monty doesn't seize this golden opportunity, we are likely years away from solving that unless it's via trade/UFA

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

I feel like this is such an over simplification. Drafting players isn't the decision of one person. It is by committee. No one scout can see it all. They likely get reports from multiple employees tasked with scouting players. We do not know what the context was like in those other orgs. I just feel this is such a lazy narrative.

Bobrov is literally the Director of Amateur Scouting and was notoriously bad for the Rangers. Why we saw him as the answer for a guaranteed tanking team I will never understand. The only explanation for why we hired him is Gorton's familiarity with him. They did a terrible job drafting in New York together, but they are good freinds, so of course it was a given that we would bring him in.

His hiring was also announced the same day as Lecavalier.

What does this even mean? They've been around two drafts and have been saddled with a host of bad contracts. What did you reasonable expect them to accomplish in two drafts? Slaf is the only player in the last two drafts to play more than 8 nhl games.

This section of your reply just reinforces my point that you are being unreasonable impatient.

We are only privy to the actions they took and not the actions that were available. Could they have added a #1 goalie or a prospect like Levi or Askarov? Probably if they really wanted. Could they have added PLD this summer or last? Probably, if they really wanted. I don't have all the answers but I know they have not taken any steps to address the #1 goalie and #1 center of this team.

Who is giving a standing ovation? Please point to these people.

Have you never seen a Kent Hughes masterclass post?

Again, what does this even mean "we are stuck with him forever". We aren't stuck with anything. Matheson is a good player who for now is on the team. We do not know what his future holds. Also, he has played ONE season with the habs and you are somehow turning this into an issue. I am not even sure what the complaint is here.

It was a question: are we stuck with him forever? I like him and he is our best defender, but I also don't like when GMs are clearly emotionally attached to players, like Bergevin crying over Gallagher. Hughes talks about Matheson like he is the best person in the world and I'm sure he would love to reward him with a fat pay day.

Last year was St.Louis's first full season as coach on a team with a lot of holes. In what world should a coach who has 4-5 rookies on D and little talent outside three forwards be held accountable after ONE full season? Again, you sound unreasonable impatient.

I'm not saying we should have fired St. Louis, I'm saying he could've at least tried to implement a system last year. He gives emotional speeches and let's Caufield do whatever he wants but how is that going to benefit for the other 23 players on the team? We've never had a checking line, our transition is atrocious.

Seriously, what kind of system does the team play under MSL? Not forechecking, not speed, not defense, what is it? Of course if we get better players he will look like a better coach, but that goes for anyone

No where in your post have you done a good job at showing why "nepotism" is a problem. The league is littered with teams hiring people based on personal relationships. It happens in every field.

Are you forgetting the Bergevin days, when we hired whoever was friends with MB to coach the AHL teams? We had the worst AHL development of all time.

Of course we should hire people who work well together. Bobrov and Gorton clearly did not work well together even if they got along better.

How about Hughes trading for no-name ECHL player Jakov Novak because Novak played on a line with his son at Northeastern? These are the moves we are wasting time on.

How about Hughes calling Petry up and promising him that he would trade him to Detroit even after Petry completely bailed on us?

All Hughes says is that he wants to build a respectable organization that does right by their players, and I admire that, but it doesn't mean anything with regards to competitiveness -- especially with Vegas winning the cup running things like a business

 

[BaseballCoach]

Not to nitpick, but do you not consider Monahan a "strong player" right now?

I'm assuming you put Suzuki, CC & Dach in that category.

I can see not including Anderson or Dvorak, but I feel like Monahan's play is easily "strong top 6" caliber, as fragile as his health may be.

4F, 1D, 0G...

I included Monahan of course.

I forgot to include Dach with Guhle and Slaf as good bets. Thanks for the catch.

With Slaf, Newhook, Anderson as lineup candidates to bump up there... and Roy, Heineman, Farrell, Mesar, Beck, Rohrer, Kidney, Tuch et. as realistically to give us 1-3 more. 7 may well be attainable within the current org depth, but I suspect management will add 1-2 more via trade/UFA over the next 2 seasons.

My top 7 forwards would normally include a strong third center. Roy and Farrell and Heineman are more likely good complementary wingers. Anderson too. Newhook is a "maybe" and I think I said that.

Guhle I agree brings us to 2... I think it's likely that at least 1 (probably more) of RB, Hutson, Mailloux, Barron, Engstrom, Norlinder, Harris, Trudeau, Konyushkov or Strubble push into top 3-4 NHL dmen before Matheson's contract is up.

Good chance either Reinbacher or Engstrom makes it into the worthy top-3D list.

I don't have much faith in Mailloux or Hutson to be complete defencemen. Maybe I'm being contrary right now, but I think Struble is a better candidate as a rounded player, but probably tops out as a 4D.

G.... well that's a tougher one. If Monty doesn't seize this golden opportunity, we are likely years away from solving that unless it's via trade/UFA

Dobes, Fowler, Miller ...... yeah at least 2 years.

 

[HABitual Fan]

I think some of the criticism directed at management is rooted in the fact that people are getting antsy about the state of the club as there are still a number of holes to fill.

The question is, do people really think 2 seasons (2 drafts) is a reasonable timeframe to expect significant improvements?

I truly believe people are really being impatient. This is what rebuilds look like. Overnight success just doesn't happen unless you had core pieces in hiding that suddenly hit their primes, but this is not the case here.

In terms of nhl ready talent, current management was left with a pretty barren field. There are good prospects they inherited, but there is still a ways to go.

Add to that, he is basically prevented from using 25% of the cap the way he wants since he inherited the dead cap of Price,Gallagher and Armia from Bergevin.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

Add to that, he is basically prevented from using 25% of the cap the way he wants since he inherited the dead cap of Price,Gallagher and Armia from Bergevin.

For many years also...

Hughes does not have a bad contract although some could argue Jake Allen is one.

 

[HuGo Sham]

I didn't know where to put this so I thought maybe in here. anyone catch gord miller on TSN 690? I don't always agree with him, but he made a good point he's made in the past and it got me thinking. He talked about how teams need at least 250 to get into the playoffs.
I did some albeit conservative calculations and I only come in at 215 with Cole and suzuki having 70 between them and everyone else hovering in the 15-20 range.
It's obvious they either need to draft another elite scoring forward, sign or trade for one.
When we have that player, we're close to a playoff team

-captain obvious

 

[sampollock]

We know we have a National League player (with Norlinder). Does that mean we'll make room for him or will we trade him for something? » - Kent Hughes talking about Mattias Norlinder

 

[Sorinth]

I didn't know where to put this so I thought maybe in here. anyone catch gord miller on TSN 690? I don't always agree with him, but he made a good point he's made in the past and it got me thinking. He talked about how teams need at least 250 to get into the playoffs.
I did some albeit conservative calculations and I only come in at 215 with Cole and suzuki having 70 between them and everyone else hovering in the 15-20 range.
It's obvious they either need to draft another elite scoring forward, sign or trade for one.
When we have that player, we're close to a playoff team

-captain obvious

On paper we are certainly lacking in scoring, we could really use that 30 goal scorer on the 2nd line to give our offence some proper scoring depth. That said one thing to note is that if healthy we should see much more goal scoring from our D. Matheson, Guhle, Xhekaj combined for 17 goals but only 2 of those came on the PP. If healthy we should see that number go up quite a bit.

And looking longer term, we are likely going to be a team where a lot of the offence will come from the D.

 

[HuGo Sham]

On paper we are certainly lacking in scoring, we could really use that 30 goal scorer on the 2nd line to give our offence some proper scoring depth. That said one thing to note is that if healthy we should see much more goal scoring from our D. Matheson, Guhle, Xhekaj combined for 17 goals but only 2 of those came on the PP. If healthy we should see that number go up quite a bit.

And looking longer term, we are likely going to be a team where a lot of the offence will come from the D.

I agree, but best case scenario they score 30 combined? (still 215 GF)
We need that winger badly

 

[Vachon23]

https://x.com/taj1944/status/1712162416807858439?s=46&t=Yjxo0RIqI662la2UAwqEaw

 

[HABitual Fan]

Would not surprise me if Lindstrom is dealt now that he cleared waivers in an AHL transaction for either an AHL goalie or a career AHL scorer, too many defense and currently only Dobes as a goalie with an NHL contract in the minors and he is a rookie so not ideal. Some team looking for a RD insurance policy might bite.

 

[Sorinth]

I agree, but best case scenario they score 30 combined? (still 215 GF)
We need that winger badly

Longer term I would imagine the hope/expectation is that one of Slaf/Newhook/Roy/Heineman becomes that guy.

 

[HuGo Sham]

Longer term I would imagine the hope/expectation is that one of Slaf/Newhook/Roy/Heineman becomes that guy.

I forgot about slafkovsky! lol
I still think they need that forward.
Hughes had a fascinating interview with MA Going today
and was clear they're accumulating all these picks (and prospects)
for a potential big trade in the next year or so.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

I didn't know where to put this so I thought maybe in here. anyone catch gord miller on TSN 690? I don't always agree with him, but he made a good point he's made in the past and it got me thinking. He talked about how teams need at least 250 to get into the playoffs.
I did some albeit conservative calculations and I only come in at 215 with Cole and suzuki having 70 between them and everyone else hovering in the 15-20 range.
It's obvious they either need to draft another elite scoring forward, sign or trade for one.
When we have that player, we're close to a playoff team

-captain obvious

If only an elite scoring forward was available to us with our most recent 1st round pick

 

[HuGo Sham]

If only an elite scoring forward was available to us with our most recent 1st round pick

let the fighting begin!

 

[Miller Time]

Would not surprise me if Lindstrom is dealt now that he cleared waivers in an AHL transaction for either an AHL goalie or a career AHL scorer, too many defense and currently only Dobes as a goalie with an NHL contract in the minors and he is a rookie so not ideal. Some team looking for a RD insurance policy might bite.

How funny would it be to trade him to Vancouver for one of their AHL goalies lol

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

If only an elite scoring forward was available to us with our most recent 1st round pick

There was a midget available. But HuGo opted to add a player who fills the Habs biggest weakness - a big d who can actually defend.

Do Oilers have any 1sts left. Maybe Habs can trade Monty to them for a 1st. How about 2025 2nd and Monty for a 2025 1st.

 

[calder candidate]

Now that we have cap space we should be first in line to try to get Joseph, the guy could be a serviceable bottom 6 and if we are able to add a pick and prospect.

 

[ReHabs]

I didn't know where to put this so I thought maybe in here. anyone catch gord miller on TSN 690? I don't always agree with him, but he made a good point he's made in the past and it got me thinking. He talked about how teams need at least 250 to get into the playoffs.
I did some albeit conservative calculations and I only come in at 215 with Cole and suzuki having 70 between them and everyone else hovering in the 15-20 range.
It's obvious they either need to draft another elite scoring forward, sign or trade for one.
When we have that player, we're close to a playoff team

-captain obvious

After Pierre McGuire left the Sens organization he mentioned something about a magic number of Goals For which seems to be a good target as a proxy for playoff worthiness. It was 245 or something like that, let's call it 250.

Earlier in this thread I made a (very rough, generalized) review and saw that you need at least three 65pt players (in addition to sufficiently good D and G) to be a playoff team.

I'm sure there are other proxies which would work well as rules of thumb.

I agree with your perspective that the Habs will fall short of this number and it was for this reason I was seriously high on the acquisition of PLD -- not that I want to re-litigate it now. But I think there is a big asterisk to this premature evaluation: the NHL is opening up and MSL plays a seriously loose, run-and-gun game. We just saw the Habs put up 5 goals last night. Maybe the magic number will change or maybe the Habs will score more than we figure. We'll have a better idea by game 10-15.

My ideal acquisition would be a player who'd force Newhook to the third line. Then we'd have proper signs of depth.

 

[Garry Valk]

Does anyone think Boqvist would be a good addition?

 

[Kwikwi]

After Pierre McGuire left the Sens organization he mentioned something about a magic number of Goals For which seems to be a good target as a proxy for playoff worthiness. It was 245 or something like that, let's call it 250.

Earlier in this thread I made a (very rough, generalized) review and saw that you need at least three 65pt players (in addition to sufficiently good D and G) to be a playoff team.

I'm sure there are other proxies which would work well as rules of thumb.

I agree with your perspective that the Habs will fall short of this number and it was for this reason I was seriously high on the acquisition of PLD -- not that I want to re-litigate it now. But I think there is a big asterisk to this premature evaluation: the NHL is opening up and MSL plays a seriously loose, run-and-gun game. We just saw the Habs put up 5 goals last night. Maybe the magic number will change or maybe the Habs will score more than we figure. We'll have a better idea by game 10-15.

My ideal acquisition would be a player who'd force Newhook to the third line. Then we'd have proper signs of depth.

The player that need to be on the 3rd line is Anderson not Newhook

 

[DAChampion]

To Chicago:
Kirby Dach + David Reinbacher

To Montreal:
Frank Nazar + Connor Bedard

;-)

 

[EveryDay]

Now that we have cap space we should be first in line to try to get Joseph, the guy could be a serviceable bottom 6 and if we are able to add a pick and prospect.

I would do it for Armia(50%) for Joseph.

Push Pearson on waivers to Laval and add some speed to MTL 3rd line with Monahan.

Joseph-Monahan-Gallagher