Trade Deadline Thread (March 3)

[Jim Bob]

So Adams is lying? I can hit you in the face with it but its up to you to decide.

In the 10 months since making that statement, here are the trades that Adams has made:

I will let you decide if he was lying, telling the truth, or saying something without saying much at all.

 

[toddkaz]

In the 10 months since making that statement, here are the trades that Adams has made:

View attachment 643908

I will let you decide if he was lying, telling the truth, or saying something without saying much at all.

So you are saying he isn't willing to make a trade to improve the team. You are also implying his philosophy has changed from 10 months ago? Can you provide something that shows why other than you have a feeling?

So you now feel that even though there is a trade out there that will improve the team Adams won't do it? That his feelings this trade deadline are different than last?

I guess we disagree there. I don't think Adams is a liar or a bad GM. What I write isn't based off of my feelings rather what Adams has said. Until he says otherwise why would I think different?

Just because he hasn't made trades doesn't go against what he said about proving the team. You say he won't improve the team even though his own words say otherwise.

 

[Chainshot]

So Adams is lying? I can hit you in the face with it but its up to you to decide.

So Adams is lying? I can hit you in the face with it but its up to you to decide.


I believe Adams is willing to improve the team if a trade comes along.

I don't think its limited to grinders and 5/6 defenders.

I think its whatever he feels will improve the team.

Didn't say he isn't or won't. I don't think JB is saying that he is or is not. We know that Adams has made comments about staying the course and building from within AND that he's made comments about exploring how to improve the team. Either can be painted as the whole picture depending on the day and personal outlook on the job Adams is doing.

Deadline pricing is normally the most expensive time to add a player. It's been reported that he's investigated what the ask is for Chychrun and for Meier and we know that it is more than he's willing to spend right now, simply because neither trade has happened. So at the moment, he's not willing to move up to the ask and that fits with his statements about how he wants to build. It's also wouldn't be unheard of for them to be trying to plant the seed for something in the summer.

 

[toddkaz]

Didn't say he isn't or won't. I don't think JB is saying that he is or is not. We know that Adams has made comments about staying the course and building from within AND that he's made comments about exploring how to improve the team. Either can be painted as the whole picture depending on the day and personal outlook on the job Adams is doing.

Deadline pricing is normally the most expensive time to add a player. It's been reported that he's investigated what the ask is for Chychrun and for Meier and we know that it is more than he's willing to spend right now, simply because neither trade has happened. So at the moment, he's not willing to move up to the ask and that fits with his statements about how he wants to build. It's also wouldn't be unheard of for them to be trying to plant the seed for something in the summer.

I am not saying a trade will happen or that he has to make a trade I said he is actively trying to improve the team.

If someone quotes me like Zman or JB and says I am wrong then they are going against what Adams said not what I said.

I am only quoting Adams. Both Zman and JB have said or implied Adams wont. Why else are they quoting my posts and saying otherwise? I even supplied Adams own words of him saying so but JB said it was 10 months ago which is implying something has changed. Ok, provide a link otherwise then.

 

[Zman5778]

So Adams is lying?

About what? Adams isn't going to come out and say that he's had conversations with Grier about Meier or with Armstrong about Chychrun. All we have are reporters who claim to have inside information that these phone calls have happened. While it's reasonable to assume that Adams has at least called about their prices, there's no hard proof unless Adams, Grier or Armstrong themselves say something.

Adams has said that he'll look at every avenue to improve the team if it makes sense within what they're trying to do as an organization, and I absolutely believe him about that. That doesn't mean he'll actually make trades....it just means he'll look into it.

 

[Ace]

Rivet and Peters and Gio debated messing with chemistry last week and all I could think was…isn’t that what Jost was? You added a guy to the precious room and it upgraded something that needed upgrading. You can’t do that to the third pair on D?

I don’t think there is anything in this world that I’m going to be worried less about than upsetting the chemistry of Bryson going away.

 

[toddkaz]

About what? Adams isn't going to come out and say that he's had conversations with Grier about Meier or with Armstrong about Chychrun. All we have are reporters who claim to have inside information that these phone calls have happened. While it's reasonable to assume that Adams has at least called about their prices, there's no hard proof unless Adams, Grier or Armstrong themselves say something.

Adams has said that he'll look at every avenue to improve the team if it makes sense within what they're trying to do as an organization, and I absolutely believe him about that. That doesn't mean he'll actually make trades....it just means he'll look into it.

Who here said he is going to make trades? You are the only one here that was specific about Adams what Adams was going to do.

You need to read what I wrote more closely and also the evidence of what Adams said.

I said that he is actively trying to improve the team and isn't limited to just grinders and 5/6 defenders.

Why are you even quoting me and saying otherwise then?

 

[Zman5778]

I don’t think there is anything in this world that I’m going to be worried less about than upsetting the chemistry of Bryson going away.

Unless he's getting traded away (which I doubt)......Bryson would still be with the team as the 7th Dman. It'd be Clague going to Rochester. Which I agree -- that's a move I am unconcerned about chemistry-wise.

As long as we don't bring in a noted locker room question mark.

 

[toddkaz]

Rivet and Peters and Gio debated messing with chemistry last week and all I could think was…isn’t that what Jost was? You added a guy to the precious room and it upgraded something that needed upgrading. You can’t do that to the third pair on D?

I don’t think there is anything in this world that I’m going to be worried less about than upsetting the chemistry of Bryson going away.

I agree, its strange people think Adams wouldn't do his due dilligence to see what kind of guy he is in the locker room before he traded for him. Its outright bizarre that posters don't have confidence in Adams ability to build cohesion.

 

[Zman5778]

Who here said he is going to make trades? You are the only one here that was specific about Adams what Adams was going to do.

You need to read what I wrote more closely and also the evidence of what Adams said.

I said that he is actively trying to improve the team and isn't limited to just grinders and 5/6 defenders.

Why are you even quoting me and saying otherwise then?

I'm being very clear about what I THINK Adams is going to do and not do.....it's kind of what we do here. We speculate what we THINK is going to happen. None of us here have any proof or a crystal ball or foresight into what will ACTUALLY happen. We also debate here on the board -- hence the quoting. None of us attack each other, we debate what others think. Done correctly, it's healthy.

I think he's doing due diligence. I think he's not going to make a big move before the deadline. I think if he does anything at the deadline, it'll be a smaller depth move. I'm not sure he makes a big move period in the calendar year 2023 beyond extending guys and getting some depth.

 

[Chainshot]

I agree, its strange people think Adams would do his due dilligence to see what kind of locker room the guy is before he traded for him. Its outright bizarre that posters don't have confidence in Adams ability to build cohesion.

Has someone questioned Adams ability to build cohesion? Not seeing it here in this thread.

And to your earlier point, the point as I read it was we don't know what Adams is up to and his past commentary would err on the side of the cautionary in terms of expectation of larger deals. Heck, JB even says he EXPECTS a move, but he's thinking it'll be smaller. I tend to think that way as well because of the economy of the purchase in summer is different than deadline pricing. Would I like to see them make a bigger move and have it work out? Damn straight, been hoping for that for months. Do I expect them to make one though? No, I do not.

 

[LetsGoBuffalo1126]

I believe Adams is willing to improve the team if a trade comes along.

I don't think its limited to grinders and 5/6 defenders.

I think its whatever he feels will improve the team.

I do agree with this line of thinking. If there's a move to be made, where everything fits what they're trying to do, I'm sure he would make the trade. However, the anecdotal "due diligence" is what every GM does across every sport on Earth. It's not really an indication that he's going to make a move or wants to make a move. He's gathering information. That's what has made him successful to this point. Listening to others and having as much information as possible. How many times do GMs talk about a trade that came to fruition because of talks that opened months before? Just knowing what other GMs are thinking is valuable though not necessarily a sign of anything imminent.

 

[Ace]

Has someone questioned Adams ability to build cohesion? Not seeing it here in this thread.

And to your earlier point, the point as I read it was we don't know what Adams is up to and his past commentary would err on the side of the cautionary in terms of expectation of larger deals. Heck, JB even says he EXPECTS a move, but he's thinking it'll be smaller. I tend to think that way as well because of the economy of the purchase in summer is different than deadline pricing. Would I like to see them make a bigger move and have it work out? Damn straight, been hoping for that for months. Do I expect them to make one though? No, I do not.

There is an added aspect to it that is going unsaid. Make a little move in season to strengthen D depth and get a physical bottom 6 guy or something…sure.

The problem isn’t that they don’t make a big move now. The problem is the lack of belief they will do it in the off-season either.

It is a very uncomfortable place to have the number of assets we do, the amount of cap space we do…and not believe in the ownership/front offices willingness to use it

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Didn't say he isn't or won't. I don't think JB is saying that he is or is not. We know that Adams has made comments about staying the course and building from within AND that he's made comments about exploring how to improve the team. Either can be painted as the whole picture depending on the day and personal outlook on the job Adams is doing.

Deadline pricing is normally the most expensive time to add a player. It's been reported that he's investigated what the ask is for Chychrun and for Meier and we know that it is more than he's willing to spend right now, simply because neither trade has happened. So at the moment, he's not willing to move up to the ask and that fits with his statements about how he wants to build. It's also wouldn't be unheard of for them to be trying to plant the seed for something in the summer.

So you're saying that KA doesn't want to win?!?!?!?!

 

[Zman5778]

It is a very uncomfortable place to have the number of assets we do, the amount of cap space we do…and not believe in the ownership/front offices willingness to use it

I think it's a wonderful place that we're in. We've got a ton of assets and a ton of cap space. We're going to use a bunch of that cap space re-signing our own guys, which is every organization's dream -- re-sign your own and have a core you can keep long-term.

I think KA is very willing to use the cap space we have if it makes sense. I think there's a large difference between what you think makes sense, what I think makes sense and what KA thinks makes sense.

 

[Chainshot]

So you're saying that KA doesn't want to win?!?!?!?!

Okay, that made me snort. Well played.

 

[old kummelweck]

I have a feeling that Adams disagrees.

He could easily view Meier as being a hinderance to the development of Quinn and/or Peterka as his presence would push one of them down in the lineup.

And with players like Kulich coming, I could see Adams continuing along his patient path and not really being that interested in Meier.


The players could also view no moves as confidence that Adams has in them and that could be viewed as a positive by players, as well.

They have talked about confidence in what they have going on and the guys they have in the room. So, I could see them viewing either direction positively.

I think Adams is preparing for near-term departures of MIttlestadt, VO, and a decline in Skinner. It is likelier he'd like to send out someone in the system as opposed to Quinn/Peterka, sure, that would be his first choice. But I also think that if it came to Quinn or Peterka for the deal, he knows he has those other assets coming up and with the addition of Meier, they'd be OK.

 

[Chainshot]

There is an added aspect to it that is going unsaid. Make a little move in season to strengthen D depth and get a physical bottom 6 guy or something…sure.

The problem isn’t that they don’t make a big move now. The problem is the lack of belief they will do it in the off-season either.

It is a very uncomfortable place to have the number of assets we do, the amount of cap space we do…and not believe in the ownership/front offices willingness to use it

It seems unlikely that anyone here is going to change someone else's belief structure.

Edit - If he does make a move, there is the built in trap of thinking he did it too late, or paid too much, or got the wrong player. If he doesn't make a move there is the built in trap of the team is cheap or indecisive or woah-is-us people don't like WNY. Anything could happen. Or nothing.

 

[Ace]

It seems unlikely that anyone here is going to change someone else's belief structure.

Edit - If he does make a move, there is the built in trap of thinking he did it too late, or paid too much, or got the wrong player. If he doesn't make a move there is the build in trap of the team is cheap or indecisive or woah-is-us people don't like WNY. Anything could happen. Or nothing.

There are actually a very finite number of things that can happen…and in the NHL the number of players that move is very small.

What he can do for starters….would be something

 

[Jim Bob]

#Untouchable

 

[Jim Bob]

So you are saying he isn't willing to make a trade to improve the team. You are also implying his philosophy has changed from 10 months ago? Can you provide something that shows why other than you have a feeling?

So you now feel that even though there is a trade out there that will improve the team Adams won't do it? That his feelings this trade deadline are different than last?

I guess we disagree there. I don't think Adams is a liar or a bad GM. What I write isn't based off of my feelings rather what Adams has said. Until he says otherwise why would I think different?

Just because he hasn't made trades doesn't go against what he said about proving the team. You say he won't improve the team even though his own words say otherwise.

I am saying that since making the statement you posted 10 months ago, Adams has not made a single impactful trade for the Sabres roster.

His biggest trade acquisition was Ben Bishop's contract to get above the cap floor.

Actions speak louder than words. Adams has been patient with his build so far. I expect that patience to continue beyond this year's trade deadline with how well his team is playing.

 

[Jim Bob]

I think Adams is preparing for near-term departures of MIttlestadt, VO, and a decline in Skinner. It is likelier he'd like to send out someone in the system as opposed to Quinn/Peterka, sure, that would be his first choice. But I also think that if it came to Quinn or Peterka for the deal, he knows he has those other assets coming up and with the addition of Meier, they'd be OK.

I tend to think that if Grier said it has to be '23 1st and Quinn in the deal that Adams passes.

Who knows if it will even get to that point. But, I would be surprised if he were willing to move either of those guys.

 

[Chainshot]

#Untouchable

f*** that.

 

[Irie]

There is an added aspect to it that is going unsaid. Make a little move in season to strengthen D depth and get a physical bottom 6 guy or something…sure.

The problem isn’t that they don’t make a big move now. The problem is the lack of belief they will do it in the off-season either.

It is a very uncomfortable place to have the number of assets we do, the amount of cap space we do…and not believe in the ownership/front offices willingness to use it

The concept that Adams will never make an off-season move because he isn't spending big while in a rebuild is ridiculous. He did assess the teams weakness as needing a goalie and a physical presence depth D, and he probably realistically went out and got the best available options that would be likely to sign in Buffalo last off-season.

Neither have worked out great, as they were both injured in the first month of the season, but they are starting to get healthy and playing much better as of late.

It is rare you can plug a new player into a new team and get their best games right away. It often takes months or longer to develop the necessary chemistry.

But you seem to be pretending that those moves didn't happen when claiming there is no faith that the GM will ever address team needs.

It's a disingenuous position to take.

 

[Jim Bob]

f*** that.

There is a song for that.

It has become a running joke between my wife and I.

Question!!!