Trade Deadline Thread (March 3)

[Djp]

What is so aggravating about this situation is that the prospect pool is filled with high end prospects but it's virtually nothing but skilled forwards. If you have a glut at one position and virtually nothing in the other you should be actively looking to use some of your super surplus to fix this. The irony of course is the one trade made was one of the only forward prospects who wasn't a soft skilled guy for a defenseman widely regarded as among the worst in the league. Adams can talk about the long game all he wants but if everything after Dahlin, Power and Cobra is complete garbage it will sink his grand plan faster than the Titanic.

we don’t know how the prospects develop. Last time I checkedStillman has size.

I doubt that Adams had any interest in moving his 2023 1st with only top 5 protection (or less).

I also doubt he was willing to move Rosen, Savoie, Ostlund, or Kulich.

And the interest the Sabres had in Chychrun could have been really overblown.

Adams is saying that he is way more patient than many fans and people in the media. That is not the same as saying F You. It is merely a different approach to what to do given that the likely best case scenario for this season is getting bounced in the 1st round by the Bruins in 5 or 6 games.

1st in 2023 is off the table. The only exception is something like PHL 2nd becomes a 1st if they make conf finals. He was not trading a top 20 pick.

hes not trading a recent 1st for a short term player.

It's been ages since the board was this lively. At bare minimum we're heading in the right direction.

this board is bordering on nuts/ insanity.

last year they traded Eichel, Reinhart, and Risto
this year they add youth in Power, Quinn, and Peterka with a team still needing too learn how to win.

this season, even if they make the playoffs, is unlikely to get passed the 1st round. Teams like that don’t trade their 1sts.

Or, hear me out - he is actually taking the timing into account? I have never been a huge Adams fan, but I will defend his patient build approach whenever it is questioned. It's a good strategy.

Good GMs don't make a lot of big moves early in rebuilds. Build the farm, build the depth, develop your young talent to the point where they can hang in the playoffs without actively hurting the team, then go big and bring in the pieces to seriously upgrade your biggest needs.

I felt like it was pretty clear that Adams was not trading his '23 1st, and unless the team is playing like a contender and not just a bubble team, he won't move his '24 first next year either.

I also think his generic GM talks have emphasized that he is not giving up major assets for any players that can go UFA in one or two years.

It's not sexy. It is killing the impatient fans, but it is a fairly common and sound rebuild strategy.

This team is not competing until Cozens, Peterka, Quinn and Power are mucb better, more consistent contributors. The team also needs a coaching adjustment in a major way, but that is a discussion for another thread.

this off-season the team likely makes some trades with some of these secondary players.

View attachment 660988

Most teams have added a NHL player in the last 3 weeks via trade.

A few did that in the summer.

Several times sold NHL Players for 1st round picks, because they're rebuilding.

That 3 leaves on the bench. PHI and ANA are both in the seller category, and will likely make sales before Friday.

Which leaves Buffalo. The land of missed opportunity.

WaTF is this crap…wasnt Power, Quinn, and Peterka added this off-season count?

I wonder why Adams is sitting on his picks.

He hasn’t finished the rebuilding. He’s not burning his first for a short term rental

Im not saying do nothing. I’m saying do it in the offseason. I think we’ll learn a lot about what we have currently during this wildcard chase. We’re still definitely evaluating this roster top to bottom.

They aren’t at the win now stage. I think that begins next year.

Off season is more likely we see moves

 

[Bendium]

I think half the roster needing to be replaced is an overstatement.

And they are not replacing guys like Girgensons and Okposo right now.

Assuming a continued rebuild through draft and development. Realize that means we are 3-5 years out of any kind of window that way. But here it is.

22 players.

Part of the future?

Tuch, Tage, Cozens, Peterka, Quinn, Krebs, Dahlin, Sammy, Power, UPL, Skinner

Thats 11 players divided by 22 players = 50%

None of the rest of the players on the team have shown reason to be core or kept longer than it takes to replace them with better. They are all either going to age out, or are below replacement value.

Building a team needs to be a continuous process using draft and development, free agency, and trades. It is not all or none on any of those paths.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

But, people expected New Jersey to be good. Buffalo can't be making moves to improve the team ahead of schedule. They need to stick with their cost-controlled timeline of when Adams THINKS they are ready to compete. Not when they are actually showing signs of competing. It throws the whole organization out of whack if they have to micromanage the unexpected success of the team.

And what happens if it doesn't work out...

But in all seriousness, I agree.

But from what i notice i think adams believe next season is the season we is ready , so all in all we are some points from playoffs so have we been closer in 11 years ? No so we are improving these are signs That Adams plan is working and we are superclose allready . Next season or the one after he Will make trades because then we are icing the team we build. This season we have many players that will not be back next season

 

[Jim Bob]

I know you like the PDOCast - go back and listen to their episode on Chychrun and his defensive impacts.

I get that he isn't a tire fire defensively. I just know that we don't know what Adams and company actually think of Chychrun, how they viewed his fit on the roster, and what they were willing to offer for him, if they were indeed really interested.

All we know if that they didn't land him. It could have been placing a high value on their picks or it could be a lack of interest. It wouldn't be the first time that the Sabres being interested in a player getting overblown by the media.

 

[Irie]

The only deal Adams has made that has improved his long-term supporting cast or core was when the face of the franchise wanted out. He's made no other deals that have found a way to fix what is clearly missing from the roster.

And I don't think he should have. Early in the rebuild the new prospects should be marinating in the minors, and intentional tanking for your Quinn's, Powers, and Savois is a big part of the process. Bringing in solid complementary pieces might bump your picks out of 1-7 and into the 12-16 range, and it is much harder to build a contender without the potential star pieces as your core.

But now he picked up those pieces, and the team is good enough that they should be drafting out of the top ten, so adding the pieces now is not nearly as altering when you are drafting 18th instead of 14th.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

Why rushing if we have improved? U wanna have it now so that all comes Down to patience. We will just be better next season just with experience and bringing in drafted players.

 

[Bendium]

Im not saying do nothing. I’m saying do it in the offseason. I think we’ll learn a lot about what we have currently during this wildcard chase. We’re still definitely evaluating this roster top to bottom.

They aren’t at the win now stage. I think that begins next year.

See, I don't think we are still needing to evaluate the roster. I think the roster has shown itself pretty well. The roster contenders and pretenders are pretty apparent. Certainly, there are enough known pretenders to start making those moves. If this management team needs more time to evaluate more than 2-3 guys, then they are not a NHL calibre group, and that the first place we need to upgrade. I am actually starting to wonder.

 

[Genny Screamer]

It’s interesting that Adams has traded Portillo, but not Ryan Johnson. Perhaps he knows that Johnson has a strong desire to sign with the Sabres.

If that’s the case then how would Chychrun fill into the long term? Chychrun is an UFA in two years after this one. That means he might command over $9M plus. I’m not sure I would pay that kind of scratch for an injury prone top 3/4 defenseman. Once he hits free agency I can see him sign with Florida or Tampa since he’s a Florida kid.

Chychrun is good, but he is a left handed defenseman whose primary asset is his shot on the point. At this point he’s not taking Dahlin’s or Power’s place on the power play. This past offseason he had surgery to remove bone spurs and wrist surgery. Chychrun is not known for his hockey IQ.

I’m not saying that Johnson is the answer, but he’s a late 1st rd pick with some talent. I can see him fitting in well with the team. Plus, we’re not giving up a 1st and (2) 2nds.

Many are upset that we traded a 3rd rd drafted prospect, Bloom, for a serviceable, replacement level defenseman. Ottawa traded a 1st and (2) 2nds for a 3/4 defenseman. Yes, Chychrun is good, but he’s not a top line defenseman on our team.

If you look at the Tampa Bay Lightning, they drafted Stamkos in 2008 and didn’t win the cup until 2020. Tage Thompson was drafted in 2016. Hopefully we have more immediate success, but it’s quite possible we may not win a Cup until 2028. Right now we are making a playoff push with rookies inserted into the lineup like Power, Quinn and Peterka. That’s amazing when you think about it. We’ve seen them make strides this season.

Who knows? Over the next couple years we might see guys like Kulich, Levi, Johnson, Rosen, Ostlund and Savoie making contributions to the success of the team. We really don’t know what we have in them. Perhaps we have an overflow of prospects that show that they can contribute to an NHL roster. Then we can trade these prospects for immediate help to make a Stanley Cup push.

In 3 years, Chychrun will be an UFA. In 3 years Dahlin will be making $9M plus and Power will be on his 2nd contract making similar type money. It might be great to have a guy like Johnson on his entry level deal.

We don’t know how far Adams got into the bidding process, but it’s possible AZ felt like Ottawa’s picks could be higher in the draft order.

Maybe Pegula knows that Chychrun will sign with Buffalo as an UFA. There’s a lot of unknowns.

 

[DustyZ]

Adams may have something in store for us yet. Deadline is tomorrow!

 

[Chainshot]

You have a cap to think about you dont trade for meir and then in 3 seasons you need to let quinn peterka Kulich Savoie Ostlund go because you didnt afford them. This is why adams doing 1 year contract because then he sign these drafted players like Thompson cozens to 7 years deal instead of having Kevin hayes players

It Will take some more time bit better having a team that will Winn the cup instead of a team that cant winn and just makes the playoffs every season

It's backwards to think that someday a player might need a payday and forestall making a move today because of it. The teams at the top of the league, look at how they operate. The perennial contenders in the East don't operate from fear of losing core pieces because new players emerge. They either find a way to make players fit or they adjust their core.

Getting to the playoffs is a step on the way toward a Cup, even if there is no guarantee of victory. We always joke about "that's why they play the games". Play 'em. See what happens. See if there might be growth forged in the crucible of playoff fire. Waiting accomplishes nothing but putting that off for another day.

 

[Jim Bob]

Assuming a continued rebuild through draft and development. Realize that means we are 3-5 years out of any kind of window that way. But here it is.

22 players.

Part of the future?

Tuch, Tage, Cozens, Peterka, Quinn, Krebs, Dahlin, Sammy, Power, UPL, Skinner

Thats 11 players divided by 22 players = 50%

None of the rest of the players on the team have shown reason to be core or kept longer than it takes to replace them with better. They are all either going to age out, or are below replacement value.

Building a team needs to be a continuous process using draft and development, free agency, and trades. It is not all or none on any of those paths.

The Sabres likely include players like Savoie, Kulich, and more of the prospects in that "part of the future".

This team is getting immensely better on ice results this season than the totality of last season. I am not surprised that Adams is less active than you would like.

 

[oldgoalie]

It's backwards to think that someday a player might need a payday and forestall making a move today because of it. The teams at the top of the league, look at how they operate. The perennial contenders in the East don't operate from fear of losing core pieces because new players emerge. They either find a way to make players fit or they adjust their core.

Getting to the playoffs is a step on the way toward a Cup, even if there is no guarantee of victory. We always joke about "that's why they play the games". Play 'em. See what happens. See if there might be growth forged in the crucible of playoff fire. Waiting accomplishes nothing but putting that off for another day.

or in this team's instance, another year.

 

[Mattilaus]

But, people expected New Jersey to be good.

This is a bit revisionist. Their pre-season power rankings for multiple sources had them floating between 24 and 26 out of 32. Them being good was so unexpected it spawned multiple main boards threads of people asking when they will inevitably collapse. People definitely didn't expect them to be good before the season started.

 

[Jim Bob]

Adams may have something in store for us yet. Deadline is tomorrow!

I doubt he makes a big enough move to satisfy the masses.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

Just think the mindset is wrong because i think Savoie Kulich can be like cozens so no big need bringing in overpaid players. Quinn and Peterka Will just be better also. We could end up in a situation That quinn peterka have a season like cozens next season . Then we need to pay them and then Kulich Savoie comes in and need big contract

COULD end up in that situation, but when has that ever happened to a team? When has a team had every one of their 1st round prospects in their system hit their potential? As much as I love Savoie, JJ, Quinn, Kulich, Ostlund and Rosen there is still a very good chance some of them never reach what fans or scouts feel their potential is.

Let's say they do indeed all hit their potential, if that happens there is no way they could keep and afford all of them. You can bridge some and give long term deals to some but eventually you'd have to make trades for cap purposes. If you start projecting your cap 3 years out, 5 years out and use the best case for the players (worst case for your cap) you're never going to add anyone because because what if Savoie becomes the next Point, or what if Kulich becomes the next Draisaitl.

You also only mentioned forwards, which has no bearing on the pressing need for the team other than potential cap implications in 4 years.... Defensive players and consistent goaltending.

 

[Sabre Dance]

You're kidding right, do you think Jokiharu, Bryson, Clague or any other defenseman other than Power or Dahlin is more impactful than Chychrun? For a mid tier 1st and other lesser picks that is a price that I am more than comfortable paying. We are not even giving up one of our top prospects.

Chychrun helps us the next 2 years for sure. I’m just not sure he’s the defensive defenseman we need. I wasnt overly excited about the idea of him in Buffalo. He would’ve improved the overall defense definitely. I think there will be opportunities to add defense. I actually want someone with a little more experience also. Someone to calm down the youngsters.

 

[Sabre the Win]

As of right now I don't expect Kulich, Savoie or Ostlund to make the team. If they do that's amazing but planning them into the future cap as a reason for not making moves to better the roster now while reinforcing the idea to the current team that management believes in them is a failure at the highest level.

I also think it's a massive failure that people think Stillman is serviceable when he has been a black hole for 2 years now.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

It's backwards to think that someday a player might need a payday and forestall making a move today because of it. The teams at the top of the league, look at how they operate. The perennial contenders in the East don't operate from fear of losing core pieces because new players emerge. They either find a way to make players fit or they adjust their core.

Getting to the playoffs is a step on the way toward a Cup, even if there is no guarantee of victory. We always joke about "that's why they play the games". Play 'em. See what happens. See if there might be growth forged in the crucible of playoff fire. Waiting accomplishes nothing but putting that off for another day.

No you need to predict, Thompson and cozens was easy to know they would be good Dahlin and power is also , quinn and Peterka is also easy ti know. Do you cant go out trade for meir when you know someone else needs that cash in 2 years, that is bad gm

 

[BFLO]

But, people expected New Jersey to be good. Buffalo can't be making moves to improve the team ahead of schedule. They need to stick with their cost-controlled timeline of when Adams THINKS they are ready to compete. Not when they are actually showing signs of competing. It throws the whole organization out of whack if they have to micromanage the unexpected success of the team.

And what happens if it doesn't work out...

But in all seriousness, I agree.

People expected NJ to be good because they've been adding their core through UFA and trades for 2-3 years, not sitting on their hands like Adams. Our drafted players are basically equal to NJ. But if you look at our UFA and trade acquisitions the past 3 years it's NJ by a landslide.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

COULD end up in that situation, but when has that ever happened to a team? When has a team had every one of their 1st round prospects in their system hit their potential? As much as I love Savoie, JJ, Quinn, Kulich, Ostlund and Rosen there is still a very good chance some of them never reach what fans or scouts feel their potential is.

Let's say they do indeed all hit their potential, if that happens there is no way they could keep and afford all of them. You can bridge some and give long term deals to some but eventually you'd have to make trades for cap purposes. If you start projecting your cap 3 years out, 5 years out and use the best case for the players (worst case for your cap) you're never going to add anyone because because what if Savoie becomes the next Point, or what if Kulich becomes the next Draisaitl.

You also only mentioned forwards, which has no bearing on the pressing need for the team other than potential cap implications in 4 years.... Defensive players and consistent goaltending.

everyone Will not hit But you have rosen Ostlund Savoie Kulich Johnson maybe 2 Will hit and 3 be like Mittlestadt. So ju maybe need to have 14 mil for the players That hit and 5 mil for rest so you cant just trade for players

 

[Irie]

It’s interesting that Adams has traded Portillo, but not Ryan Johnson. Perhaps he knows that Johnson has a strong desire to sign with the Sabres.

I think at this point, while the organization would like to sign Johnson, they are also viewing him as that compensatory 2nd round pick that they will get if he walks. The pick may honestly have more value than Johnson.

It is very doubtful anyone is offering anything near a second for him, so trading him is out of the question, (unless he is a throw, representing a 2nd in value in another deal).

 

[Chainshot]

It’s interesting that Adams has traded Portillo, but not Ryan Johnson. Perhaps he knows that Johnson has a strong desire to sign with the Sabres.

Even if Johnson is not signing, the value of the compensatory pick in 2024 is pick 64-ish at this point (the Flyers are not signing O'Brien and will also get a compensatory pick, pushing another pick into the 2024 2nd round)

If that’s the case then how would Chychrun fill into the long term? Chychrun is an UFA in two years after this one. That means he might command over $9M plus. I’m not sure I would pay that kind of scratch for an injury prone top 3/4 defenseman. Once he hits free agency I can see him sign with Florida or Tampa since he’s a Florida kid.

Then use him for this year, next and up to the deadline following, then flip him as a pending UFA for the rental haul at the deadline at that time.

Chychrun is good, but he is a left handed defenseman whose primary asset is his shot on the point. At this point he’s not taking Dahlin’s or Power’s place on the power play. This past offseason he had surgery to remove bone spurs and wrist surgery. Chychrun is not known for his hockey IQ.

He's also a very good defender in his own zone beyond just his offensive contributions. With both Dahlin and Samuelsson having shown they can play their offhand side, there is certainly the room to have another LD in the top 4 or even spread the LD out over different tasks. That's also where the Ekholm idea works since he has shown an ability to play the defensive side of the game well.

I’m not saying that Johnson is the answer, but he’s a late 1st rd pick with some talent. I can see him fitting in well with the team. Plus, we’re not giving up a 1st and (2) 2nds.

Many are upset that we traded a 3rd rd drafted prospect, Bloom, for a serviceable, replacement level defenseman. Ottawa traded a 1st and (2) 2nds for a 3/4 defenseman. Yes, Chychrun is good, but he’s not a top line defenseman on our team.

We will find out if Stillman is replacement level here. There is very much reason to doubt he is any improvement over what they already have.

If you look at the Tampa Bay Lightning, they drafted Stamkos in 2008 and didn’t win the cup until 2020. Tage Thompson was drafted in 2016. Hopefully we have more immediate success, but it’s quite possible we may not win a Cup until 2028. Right now we are making a playoff push with rookies inserted into the lineup like Power, Quinn and Peterka. That’s amazing when you think about it. We’ve seen them make strides this season.

Tampa went to a conference final in Stamkos' third season and cup final in his 7th, conference finals his 8th and 10th before the Cup win in his 11th. This is Tage's seventh season since being drafted.

Hedman helped get Tampa to that conference final in his second season and his first final in his 6th. Dahlin hasn't made it to round 1 yet and he's in year five.

Who knows? Over the next couple years we might see guys like Kulich, Levi, Johnson, Rosen, Ostlund and Savoie making contributions to the success of the team. We really don’t know what we have in them. Perhaps we have an overflow of prospects that show that they can contribute to an NHL roster. Then we can trade these prospects for immediate help to make a Stanley Cup push.

If they don't improve on the blueline or in terms of forwards committed to a 200' game, they aren't going to have a Cup push.

In 3 years, Chychrun will be an UFA. In 3 years Dahlin will be making $9M plus and Power will be on his 2nd contract making similar type money. It might be great to have a guy like Johnson on his entry level deal.

We don’t know how far Adams got into the bidding process, but it’s possible AZ felt like Ottawa’s picks could be higher in the draft order.

Maybe Pegula knows that Chychrun will sign with Buffalo as an UFA. There’s a lot of unknowns.

Yes, and in 3 years if Chychrun doesn't want to be part of Vibetown, deal him for UFA rental pricing, recoup futures and use those to make other deals to fill the hole removing him would make. Use his talents from now until then - think of him as a high-level contractor. That doesn't preclude use of Johnson on his ELC between now and then either. It's not like they don't need better from 4-7 if they want to be a playoff team.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

Then you maybe notice you progress faster then you trade 1 pick 2024 and rosen for something . Then you trade Ostlund Asplund 2 pick for something else . But you cant just go out make trades when you have so many prospect risking loosing all of them because you trade for bogosian and kanes and have these on the roster instead of cozens and Thompson

 

[Chainshot]

This is a bit revisionist. Their pre-season power rankings for multiple sources had them floating between 24 and 26 out of 32. Them being good was so unexpected it spawned multiple main boards threads of people asking when they will inevitably collapse. People definitely didn't expect them to be good before the season started.

One thing for the statistas - they had said NJ had really good indicators of success last year and were undone by goaltending. They got goaltending and continue, even improved upon, their possession metrics and they are where they are because of it.

The people who thought they wouldn't good didn't pay attention to that.

 

[BuffaloGooner]

Apologies are in order from the usual suspects