Trade Deadline 23/24

[dirty12]

Even Sudbury may be a stretch to be honest. They need to improve their special teams. In particular, their PP. Mayer is probably a much better fit. Maybe a goaltender?

Sault and Guelph may be better destinations for Beck.

It would be a huge mistake if the wolves have a real chance to acquire Beck but choose not to imo. There is not a player available that could positively impact the wolves like Beck could, probably not even close.
The wolves would still have enough assets to acquire Punnet or Mayer or Donovan if available.

 

[Voice from the North]

Even Sudbury may be a stretch to be honest. They need to improve their special teams. In particular, their PP. Mayer is probably a much better fit. Maybe a goaltender?

Sault and Guelph may be better destinations for Beck.

Sudbury's power play has been much improved over the past few weeks, but the PK could use more help. 2nd line center is a bit of a question mark as well and you can never be string enough at center. Beck and Mayer would be the ideal pickups for Sudbury

 

[OMG67]

Sudbury's power play has been much improved over the past few weeks, but the PK could use more help. 2nd line center is a bit of a question mark as well and you can never be string enough at center. Beck and Mayer would be the ideal pickups for Sudbury

Would you consider centre to be their greatest need? From an outsider’s perspective, both Goyette and Dvorski have strong offensive production, win a ton of faceoffs and seems pretty strong 5 on 5. Villeneuve as a 3rd centre also seems fine. I love that kid a lot. He’s over 60% in the dot as well. As an outsider that doesn’t get to watch Sudbury enough to truly formulate an argument one way or the other, I would say centre isn’t a “problem” area. I would point to goaltending and/or team defence.

To me, goal suppression should be the main focus. I’m not sure Beck should be the main target for goal suppression. He would help because he is probably better defensively than he is offensively. @dirty12 has pointed to Punnett. To me, he should be the #1 target coupled with a goalie if they can find one. THEN maybe look at someone like Beck. If you cannot get the first two, so be it. Go to #3.

That is my take on the situation, again, as an outsider looking in.

 

[dirty12]

Would you consider centre to be their greatest need? From an outsider’s perspective, both Goyette and Dvorski have strong offensive production, win a ton of faceoffs and seems pretty strong 5 on 5. Villeneuve as a 3rd centre also seems fine. I love that kid a lot. He’s over 60% in the dot as well. As an outsider that doesn’t get to watch Sudbury enough to truly formulate an argument one way or the other, I would say centre isn’t a “problem” area. I would point to goaltending and/or team defence.

To me, goal suppression should be the main focus. I’m not sure Beck should be the main target for goal suppression. He would help because he is probably better defensively than he is offensively. @dirty12 has pointed to Punnett. To me, he should be the #1 target coupled with a goalie if they can find one. THEN maybe look at someone like Beck. If you cannot get the first two, so be it. Go to #3.

That is my take on the situation, again, as an outsider looking in.

Goyette is not a centre period.
I agree with both of your statements about Villeneuve and that goal suppression is the greatest need. O.Beck fills the #2 C spot, suppresses goals, and mentors Villeneuve.
Villeneuve imo, has the upside to be the next O.Beck.

 

[howlman]

Dvorsky, Beck and Villeneuve down the middle is absolutely fantastic for the Wolves

 

[OMG67]

Goyette is not a centre period.
I agree with both of your statements about Villeneuve and that goal suppression is the greatest need. O.Beck fills the #2 C spot, suppresses goals, and mentors Villeneuve.
Villeneuve imo, has the upside to be the next O.Beck.

So Beck would replace McCallum?

 

[dirty12]

So Beck would replace McCallum?

Delic-Beck-McCallum
Though it would ok if McCallum was replaced with Punnet or Mayer

 

[Petes]

Goyette is not a centre period.
I agree with both of your statements about Villeneuve and that goal suppression is the greatest need. O.Beck fills the #2 C spot, suppresses goals, and mentors Villeneuve.
Villeneuve imo, has the upside to be the next O.Beck.

You sure? Owen Beck is a signed 2nd round NHL draft pick. Nathan Villeneuve wasn’t even invited to the CHL top prospects game

 

[dirty12]

You sure? Owen Beck is a signed 2nd round NHL draft pick. Nathan Villeneuve wasn’t even invited to the CHL top prospects game

Villeneuve does not have the speed to be the next Beck truthfully; otherwise yes, I am absolutely sure.

 

[DeletedAccountt]

Villeneuve does not have the speed to be the next Beck truthfully; otherwise yes, I am absolutely sure.

Petes would much rather Matthew Virgilio ..

I’m comfortable with the Soo overpaying for Beck, as we’ve aligned ourself very good for the future with prospects down the line. I would love to see SSM land Beck and Smith in a deal similar to when the Soo added Taylor Raddysh & Jordan Sambrook. Something @SSMHoundsFan and I spoke about. That deal involved Fowler and 9 draft picks. I think with Virgilio involved his value is higher than Hayden Fowler was, maybe add in Christopher Brown and make it happened.

Going to be a fun deadline and one thing that’s true is most teams are holding their cards closer than ever to their chest this year. Lips are super glued shut, lol

 

[OMG67]

You sure? Owen Beck is a signed 2nd round NHL draft pick. Nathan Villeneuve wasn’t even invited to the CHL top prospects game

I think the concept of NHL PROSPECT is lost on many. It should not matter what the NHL contract status of a player is. NHL prospects are just that, prospects. We may be able to point to the contract and it bears some weight but the reality is there are loads of non-NHL Prospect type players that excel at a very high level in the OHL.

Players need to demonstrate their performance. They may be slightly deficient in one aspect that holds them back from being a bonafide pro but at the OHL level, that deficient attribute is still above league average in many cases. It can be much less impactful at this level.

 

[MeafAttack]

Agree, Jelsma not getting much traction in the trade discussion but he is likely available for the right price and would be an excellent upgrade for most teams.

Really hope Barrie holds on to Jelsma for next season where he will lead the youth. The price would have to be steep for my liking.
I think Sale should be shopped as well as Punnet. What do you think the value of Punnet is ?

 

[DeletedAccountt]

Really hope Barrie holds on to Jelsma for next season where he will lead the youth. The price would have to be steep for my liking.
I think Sale should be shopped as well as Punnet. What do you think the value of Punnet is ?

Punnett in the Soo seeking revenge against Saginaw would be fun, not sure we upgrade OAs though haha

 

[Voice from the North]

So Beck would replace McCallum?

Not quite. Delic is the current second line center, a trade for Beck would push Delic to the wing. Ideally McCallum would be upgraded on with a better scoring more disciplined OA forward and Punnett or Mayer would be an upgrade on Toure.

 

[Voice from the North]

Would you consider centre to be their greatest need? From an outsider’s perspective, both Goyette and Dvorski have strong offensive production, win a ton of faceoffs and seems pretty strong 5 on 5. Villeneuve as a 3rd centre also seems fine. I love that kid a lot. He’s over 60% in the dot as well. As an outsider that doesn’t get to watch Sudbury enough to truly formulate an argument one way or the other, I would say centre isn’t a “problem” area. I would point to goaltending and/or team defence.

To me, goal suppression should be the main focus. I’m not sure Beck should be the main target for goal suppression. He would help because he is probably better defensively than he is offensively. @dirty12 has pointed to Punnett. To me, he should be the #1 target coupled with a goalie if they can find one. THEN maybe look at someone like Beck. If you cannot get the first two, so be it. Go to #3.

That is my take on the situation, again, as an outsider looking in.

The Wolves could use a better, more physical defenseman in their own zone. Mayer, Punnett or Smith would fit that description and then all other other pieces on the blueline will fall into place. The would be the number 1 need. Beck would be a 1A. Where Beck comes in is that he would help out a great deal in the neutral zone and our own zone where the Wolves have had a few too many breakdowns from the forwards. It would be hard for teams to match up against Dvorsky and Beck with Villeneuve at third line center. Goaltending is set (whether we agree or don't agree) and will look a lot better with more structure which ideally takes care of goal suppression.

 

[OMG67]

The Wolves could use a better, more physical defenseman in their own zone. Mayer, Punnett or Smith would fit that description and then all other other pieces on the blueline will fall into place. The would be the number 1 need. Beck would be a 1A. Where Beck comes in is that he would help out a great deal in the neutral zone and our own zone where the Wolves have had a few too many breakdowns from the forwards. It would be hard for teams to match up against Dvorsky and Beck with Villeneuve at third line center. Goaltending is set (whether we agree or don't agree) and will look a lot better with more structure which ideally takes care of goal suppression.

I’m not a big fan of adding a centre and expecting goal suppression to be improved. That comes from a proper structure and the five man unit being able to consistently defend. Barring that, it is more on the net front defence overage allowing the goalie to make the first save with the defence effectively clearing the puck. You need one or the other or both. The centre only has so much responsibility with respect to goal prevention. That net front presence and limiting second chances is the most vital component IMO.

If Sudbury is having goal suppression issues and they don’t have a sound structure, they can’t trade their way into it. IT has to happen by sheer force at the net. Adding a player like Punnet that can play 30 minutes, defend and move the puck would be far more important than Beck (from goal suppression perspective).

Sudbury scores a lot of goals. They don’t need the forwards as much as a net front presence and/or a goaltender that can win games on his own.

IMO, having a goalie that is great at making the first save combined with solid net front presence is more than good enough provided you can score. I would focus on the 10 feet radius in front of the net.

 

[Kingpin794]

Punnett in the Soo seeking revenge against Saginaw would be fun, not sure we upgrade OAs though haha

Lmao. Revenge for what? Did we kick his dog or something?

 

[I Loveallsports]

I’m not a big fan of adding a centre and expecting goal suppression to be improved. That comes from a proper structure and the five man unit being able to consistently defend. Barring that, it is more on the net front defence overage allowing the goalie to make the first save with the defence effectively clearing the puck. You need one or the other or both. The centre only has so much responsibility with respect to goal prevention. That net front presence and limiting second chances is the most vital component IMO.

If Sudbury is having goal suppression issues and they don’t have a sound structure, they can’t trade their way into it. IT has to happen by sheer force at the net. Adding a player like Punnet that can play 30 minutes, defend and move the puck would be far more important than Beck (from goal suppression perspective).

Sudbury scores a lot of goals. They don’t need the forwards as much as a net front presence and/or a goaltender that can win games on his own.

IMO, having a goalie that is great at making the first save combined with solid net front presence is more than good enough provided you can score. I would focus on the 10 feet radius in front of the net.

You're right about the needs for Sudbury. Add to the defence and a top goaltender. Still have enough pucks to add to the forward group. It's a shame the state their in with goaltending.

 

[OMG67]

You're right about the needs for Sudbury. Add to the defence and a top goaltender. Still have enough pucks to add to the forward group. It's a shame the state their in with goaltending.

The issue right now is whether Vandenburg can stop the first shot with no silly whiffs? I don’t watch Sudbury enough to suggest either way. Same with Niagara before that.

If Sudbury were open to an OA goalie, Donoso in Ottawa would likely be available and he will stop all the first shots. You’d still need the defence clearing the net though. That is where Ottawa excels. Clearing the net and net front presence is strong meaning not a lot of second chances but for the 67’s, that is more of a team structure thing, not solely the defencemen.

 

[DeletedAccountt]

Lmao. Revenge for what? Did we kick his dog or something?

Hahaha, I was totally joking , but for not being part of the spirit still and having a chance in the final dance hahaha

 

[I Loveallsports]

The issue right now is whether Vandenburg can stop the first shot with no silly whiffs? I don’t watch Sudbury enough to suggest either way. Same with Niagara before that.

If Sudbury were open to an OA goalie, Donoso in Ottawa would likely be available and he will stop all the first shots. You’d still need the defence clearing the net though. That is where Ottawa excels. Clearing the net and net front presence is strong meaning not a lot of second chances but for the 67’s, that is more of a team structure thing, not solely the defencemen.

I agree defense is important as well. Sudbury would do themselves well with an upgrade for sure in that area. Their some guys who play to much imo and get exposed.

 

[dirty12]

The issue right now is whether Vandenburg can stop the first shot with no silly whiffs? I don’t watch Sudbury enough to suggest either way. Same with Niagara before that.

If Sudbury were open to an OA goalie, Donoso in Ottawa would likely be available and he will stop all the first shots. You’d still need the defence clearing the net though. That is where Ottawa excels. Clearing the net and net front presence is strong meaning not a lot of second chances but for the 67’s, that is more of a team structure thing, not solely the defencemen.

Beast?
Punnet or Mayer in place of Goure is one thing, but replacing long serving wolves draft picks McCallum or Anania with maybe the third best OA goalie is no way to build a (team). A hot/cold OA goalie that has never back stopped a team beyond round two, really?
And Beck would suppress goals. It would start with a 65% success rate at the drop of the puck, continue with pro-ready defensive play, and often end with punishing hits that would set an example that a big veteran team would feel obligated to follow.

 

[OMG67]

Beast?
Punnet or Mayer in place of Goure is one thing, but replacing long serving wolves draft picks McCallum or Anania with maybe the third best OA goalie is no way to build a (team).
And Beck would suppress goals. It would start with a 65% success rate at the drop of the puck, continue with pro-ready defensive play, and often end with punishing hits that would set an example that a big veteran team would feel obligated to follow.

I really don’t see Beck making as big a difference as a goalie and a D-Man. Sudbury seems to be mostly the sum of their individual parts because they don’t seem to play a defensive minded system. Throw Beck into that system and they still get hemmed down low and scrambled in front of the net.

Donoso may be the third best OA goalie but he isn‘t the third best AVAILABLE OA Goalie. Wolves are late to the trough. Late to the trough, you get the scraps. I don’t think there is a strong non-OA goalie available. That market seems thin. They needed to hop on Simpson at the start of the season. Unless they maybe want to roll the dice on DiVin, I am not seeing any other options than rolling with Vandenburg. Wolves need to hope he is the answer because throwing a ton of assets away only to watch a goalie let in a bad one every game may be very tough to stomach.

 

[dirty12]

I really don’t see Beck making as big a difference as a goalie and a D-Man. Sudbury seems to be mostly the sum of their individual parts because they don’t seem to play a defensive minded system. Throw Beck into that system and they still get hemmed down low and scrambled in front of the net.

Donoso may be the third best OA goalie but he isn‘t the third best AVAILABLE OA Goalie. Wolves are late to the trough. Late to the trough, you get the scraps. I don’t think there is a strong non-OA goalie available. That market seems thin. They needed to hop on Simpson at the start of the season. Unless they maybe want to roll the dice on DiVin, I am not seeing any other options than rolling with Vandenburg. Wolves need to hope he is the answer because throwing a ton of assets away only to watch a goalie let in a bad one every game may be very tough to stomach.

A fourth card used on an ok goalie, I hope not; especially not an OA one that takes the spot of a useful skater

 

[OMG67]

A fourth card used on an ok goalie, I hope not; especially not an OA one that takes the spot of a useful skater

Again, it comes down to what is deemed most important. I struggle with Ottawa wasting an OA spot on Donoso with MacKenzie (a better goalie) on the bench. So, I get what you are saying and I agree. However, the right mix needs to be deployed. If the goaltending holds them back from being successful or at least as successful as they can be, it is possible they would need (or any other team for that matter) to make a sacrifice.

In theory, what team would “want to” use an OA spot on a goalie that sits on the bench every third game? None of them want to. They are either forced to because there is no other viable option or that goalie is so damned good they can’t afford not to.

So, the Sudbury situation is interesting. They traded two 3rds for Vandenburg. That is a hefty price for a goalie that doesn’t have attributes that jump out at you. He isn’t big. He wasn’t highly touted during his draft year. He hasn’t put up stellar statistics. He is now playing for his third OHL team. He hasn’t proven to be any better than what they already have. Small sample size though.

Most Championship calibre teams at the Major Junior level need a goalie that is a difference maker because of the mistakes typically made at the Major Junior level. The goalie bails the team out. Unfortunately, it doesn’t look like one of those is or will be available. But, if you are looking for goal prevention and an OA goalie wipes one Goal Against off the table every game compared to what you already have, is it worth the sacrifice?