Speculation: Toughness and Brad Treliving

[Stephen]

I'd say redoing everyone around the core every fricken year also has been detrimental to the teams idenity, they're made up of a entitled few and the remainder are misfit toys to be replaced with other misfit toys...........

The previous regime treated the core group as a precious collection of talented big names with kind of a poor understanding of how the Big 4 even go together. We basically seemed to have a function pairing and a left over pairing and their style of play wasn’t necessarily complimentary.

Outside of that we had a lot of window dressing toughness and veterans but not really integrated.

The success of the latest deadline pointed to a more integrated middle class. But remains to be seen how many of ROR, Schenn, Lafferty, McCabe and Acciari will be retained in the future.

 

[therealkoho]

Kadri was suspended again after being traded by Toronto and barely missed in the Colorado Cup run when he dove into the keeper.

And then he signs in Calgary and reverts back to the 60 point player he always was.
With a good cap increase his contract might be okay as he ages through his 30's.
Leafs GM signed him until age 38 at 7mm per.
Be like extending PPG Tavares next year for 4 years at 7mm.

I think when that user said a 30/30 2C is kind of the same thing as a 60 point player, but hey ULF what the f does ol koho know anywho?

just kidding my friend, but 60 point guys are 7m dollar players, Will twice hit the 60 point mark and turned it into a 7AAV as an RFA

Kadri as a UFA coming off a SC in which he was an acknowledged team leader coupled with an 87 point season on an injury depleted team was probably underpaid on AAV and so made it up on the longer term. Will the contract be pretty in it's last few years, probably not. I would expect JT to sign for approx the same money but a shorter term, it seems like the thing to do in Toronto

 

[Leafblooded]

Kadri was suspended again after being traded by Toronto and barely missed in the Colorado Cup run when he dove into the keeper.

And then he signs in Calgary and reverts back to the 60 point player he always was.
With a good cap increase his contract might be okay as he ages through his 30's.
Leafs GM signed him until age 38 at 7mm per.
Be like extending PPG Tavares next year for 4 years at 7mm.

Even if the Leafs signed Kadri for 7 mil, that would've meant no Tavares for 11, and we would've been miles ahead.

 

[therealkoho]

wtf is going on with this weird narrative of Shanny did it, Shanny did that, it's all Shanny's fault nonsense

He is the President which makes him the General Managers boss, would he have final word, on the big things yes, would he have supported his GM's vision, yep of course he would. Dubas probably did a good job selling him on that contract, but what I don't believe is that he told Dubas to offer Matthews a 5 year deal for 11.6 with a NMC in year 5.

Lets not forget that Shanny was hoping to see home town discounts and longer terms, what he didn't want to see is another Nylander situation with the embarrassment caused by all the negative press it created. I doubt Shanahan was happy about the Matthews contract, but what was he going to do, push Dubas aside and take over negotiations? It's not how it's done, and furthermore if he had done that, it would have gotten out and Dubas would have had to resign.

As it was I think the fallout really cooled the relationship between the two of them. It also created the messy and very public Marner negotiation which was probably what led to Shanny no longer watching games from the GM's box and no automatic contract renewal going into the final year.

Dubas made a mess of things, he locked the Leafs into cap hell, he listened to the fans gripe about Kadri and moved him for magic beans that turned into weeds. He fumbled the Foligno deal and acquired a player who needed a lot of rehab not a lot of playing time. Dennis Malgin, I'll leave it at that!

 

[57 Years No Cup]

It's a two-way street. Kadri got himself suspended twice in TOR and once in COL before he grew up. I didn't like what TOR ended up getting for him in a trade, but there was a good reason to trade him. It has nothing to do with PC.

Edit - actually Kadri got suspended a whole lot more than I reported.

Kadri's suspensions in both Boston series were BS.

 

[leafsfan5]

Milan Lucic? Jesus Christ. We don't need toughness as much as we need functional grit. Guys who can play but have that extra element to their game that makes them pests or physical. A "tough guy forward" in the bottom 6 is a waste of time, we've been there and done that

The issue is that you need functional grit in your core players, look at the recent cup champions:

COL: Mackinnon, Rantanen, Landeskog, Kadri
TB: Kucherov, Hedman
STL: Pietrangelo, Schenn, Parayko
WSH: Ovechkin, Wilson

This doesn't mean you have to have all physical players. Toews on COL isn't overly physical and he played top pair minutes, neither is Stamkos or Backstrom or Kuznetsov. But, the other foundational pieces on those teams are and it adds a different element to the small collection of the team who play by far the most minutes

 

[slozo]

Gavrikov extended in LA.

Ah, didn't realise . . . fair enough.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Kadri's suspensions in both Boston series were BS.

No they weren't, and he got a reputation with the league long before his lengthy suspensions in the playoffs. I liked Kadri a little, but he had a knack for letting his team down when they most needed him.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Kadri is a sad example of toughness. He’s not grinding and putting in maximum effort every game like Hyman, he makes a big/borderline hit once every 4-5 games or so but he’s physically invisible most games. He’s physical the same way Schremp was talented, it happens once in a while with the intention of ending up on a highlight reel not contributing to winning the game. Getting suspended for taking out Wingels or making DeBrusk pretend to be injured for a single shift doesn’t really do anything, if you’re going to play that game target opponents that matter.

That being said if he plays a less stupid game in the playoffs I think we win a few rounds just off his PP contributions in the bumper position, that’s the one part of his game that actually stands out in a good way.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

No they weren't, and he got a reputation with the league long before his lengthy suspensions in the playoffs. I liked Kadri a little, but he had a knack for letting his team down when they most needed him.

Yes they were. Politically correct hockey.

 

[AvroArrow]

Kadri's suspensions in both Boston series were BS.

Yup, still pisses me off to this day. Not even a penalty was called on them, the second we retaliate, 5 games and a series suspension like lol

Milan Lucic? Jesus Christ. We don't need toughness as much as we need functional grit. Guys who can play but have that extra element to their game that makes them pests or physical. A "tough guy forward" in the bottom 6 is a waste of time, we've been there and done that

The issue is that you need functional grit in your core players, look at the recent cup champions:

COL: Mackinnon, Rantanen, Landeskog, Kadri
TB: Kucherov, Hedman
STL: Pietrangelo, Schenn, Parayko
WSH: Ovechkin, Wilson

This doesn't mean you have to have all physical players. Toews on COL isn't overly physical and he played top pair minutes, neither is Stamkos or Backstrom or Kuznetsov. But, the other foundational pieces on those teams are and it adds a different element to the small collection of the team who play by far the most minutes

Wish I had my like button, I like this post.

 

[Sypher04]

From what I recall, Kadri’s hits were both textbook retaliatory hits from behind. He deserved both suspensions and we all know it

 

[slozo]

Milan Lucic? Jesus Christ. We don't need toughness as much as we need functional grit. Guys who can play but have that extra element to their game that makes them pests or physical. A "tough guy forward" in the bottom 6 is a waste of time, we've been there and done that

The issue is that you need functional grit in your core players, look at the recent cup champions:

COL: Mackinnon, Rantanen, Landeskog, Kadri
TB: Kucherov, Hedman
STL: Pietrangelo, Schenn, Parayko
WSH: Ovechkin, Wilson

This doesn't mean you have to have all physical players. Toews on COL isn't overly physical and he played top pair minutes, neither is Stamkos or Backstrom or Kuznetsov. But, the other foundational pieces on those teams are and it adds a different element to the small collection of the team who play by far the most minutes

Totally agreed.

You need rough / tough / physical players sprinkled into your lineup that play top 6, top 9 minutes.

Good news is, I think we have a new kid that fits that description in Knies, and he's going to be a huge part of our "comeback".
But we'll likely need to get rid of one of Matthews, Marner, Nylander or Tavares to get another top 6 forward who is both productive and HARD.

We need HARD warriors willing to go to battle. Willing to be FIRST into the FRAY.

Who's with me?

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Yes they were. Politically correct hockey.

Polically correct (played hooky from education). You're using concerpts and phrases that make no sense at all. Perhaps this is a burner account. Good one! Cool internet hobby you got there.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

I think when that user said a 30/30 2C is kind of the same thing as a 60 point player, but hey ULF what the f does ol koho know anywho?

just kidding my friend, but 60 point guys are 7m dollar players, Will twice hit the 60 point mark and turned it into a 7AAV as an RFA

Kadri as a UFA coming off a SC in which he was an acknowledged team leader coupled with an 87 point season on an injury depleted team was probably underpaid on AAV and so made it up on the longer term. Will the contract be pretty in it's last few years, probably not. I would expect JT to sign for approx the same money but a shorter term, it seems like the thing to do in Toronto

I would tell him to get out of town if he wants anything more than a $3.5M....he will be needing someone to wheel him around in his chair by the time his deal is up. I never understood my friend laughing at me when the Leafs signed him. He kept saying "You haven't seen him skate yet have you?" ....man...that first time watching him was so depressing.

Milan Lucic? Jesus Christ. We don't need toughness as much as we need functional grit. Guys who can play but have that extra element to their game that makes them pests or physical. A "tough guy forward" in the bottom 6 is a waste of time, we've been there and done that

The issue is that you need functional grit in your core players, look at the recent cup champions:

COL: Mackinnon, Rantanen, Landeskog, Kadri
TB: Kucherov, Hedman
STL: Pietrangelo, Schenn, Parayko
WSH: Ovechkin, Wilson

This doesn't mean you have to have all physical players. Toews on COL isn't overly physical and he played top pair minutes, neither is Stamkos or Backstrom or Kuznetsov. But, the other foundational pieces on those teams are and it adds a different element to the small collection of the team who play by far the most minutes

Compared to our stars all those guys are pretty much goons in that they don't shy away from stuff.

 

[mikeyz]

Lucic has 3 goals in his last 40 playoff games played.

He'd fit right in.

Milan Lucic! COME ON DOWN!!!

Well, at least he has more grit and dog in him then Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander combined do.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Polically correct (played hooky from education). You're using concerpts and phrases that make no sense at all. Perhaps this is a burner account. Good one! Cool internet hobby you got there.

It's beneath you to pretend you don't know what POLITICALLY correct means. Try harder next time.

 

[Martin Skoula]

From what I recall, Kadri’s hits were both textbook retaliatory hits from behind. He deserved both suspensions and we all know it

It’s one thing if he’s headhunting guys that matter on their team as deterrence, but every time he targeted some no-name 3rd or 4th liner because they knew how to bait his temper. Playing over the edge and doing suspendable things can fit the team culture if it’s a measured choice not a hot head getting his ego hurt and lashing out at whoever is closest. It’s a textbook “name on the back over the crest on the front” thing.

If he blows up McAvoy as clean as he can for revenge/deterrence, Boston’s own leadership will make Wingels/DeBrusk sit down faster than the refs or some 4th line goon can.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

While we're on the topic of toughness...someone teach Matthews how to fight/defend himself. He doesn't need to win a fight, but he's got to stand up for himself a little. Just a little...

 

[mikeyz]

Please get Gudas and Perry this off season.

 

[darrylsittler27]

He has no choice. The playoffs showed Dubad is a complete idiot. No more pink Pansies. They lose too much. Toughen up or go home girls.

 

[ToneDog]

While we're on the topic of toughness...someone teach Matthews how to fight/defend himself. He doesn't need to win a fight, but he's got to stand up for himself a little. Just a little...

Perhaps they can get Wendel to teach a mandatory class for 16, 34, 88 and 91.

 

[The Iceman]

From what I recall, Kadri’s hits were both textbook retaliatory hits from behind. He deserved both suspensions and we all know it

Do you remember Kadri getting his knees taken out by Debrusk on a missed open ice hit?
Same game
Do you remember the Debrusk hit on Marleau? Moments later Kadri took matters into his own hands.

 

[rumman]

Well, at least he has more grit and dog in him then Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander combined do.

True that, but I’d pass on Lucic none the less………

 

[rumman]

While we're on the topic of toughness...someone teach Matthews how to fight/defend himself. He doesn't need to win a fight, but he's got to stand up for himself a little. Just a little...

That was embarrassing to witness as a Leaf fan……..