Confirmed with Link: [TOR/CHI] G Petr Mrazek & 25th Overall Pick to CHI for 38th Overall Pick

[ToneDog]

I don't know how many times I have to say it, but here I go again.......

I am not debating the merits of the JT signing, I am simply stating that Dubas knew with 3 star ELC's expiring, and with Marleau and Zaitsev on the books, the cap would be exceeded if he signed Tavares.

He decided it was worth it even though it would cost him something. That something ended up being a 1st to get rid of Marleau.

In summary, Lou signed a bad contract, but it was Dubas' decisions that dictated how it ended regardless on the merits of the actual decisions.

Sorry, can you say it again but slower ?? Thanks in advance.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I'll be interested to see whether we end up with Murray and spend a 1st to move on from him the following draft.

 

[Leaf Fans]

I'll be interested to see whether we end up with Murray and spend a 1st to move on from him the following draft.

I doubt that would happen. You think Murry will be bought out soon. There was a rumour that the Leafs were poking around. Waiting for a buy out?

 

[Jmo89]

Dubas did not need to give up a 1st to unload Marleau. He could have done what he did the very next summer/fall and trade Kapanen and Johnsson while keeping his 1st and letting Marleau's contract run out.

Even if he gets a lesser return for Kapanen the assets from that along with the Leafs 1st beat out the Pittsburgh 1st which was the only decent thing they got from both Kapanen and Johnsson. He probably also gets more for Johnsson as well, as Andreas tanked his value the season prior to being traded.

Lou's bad moves don't somehow make Dubas' any better. Lou messed up in signing Marleau for 3 years and not signing Nylander the summer he was eligible for an extension.

Dubas messed up by screwing up the entirety of the Nylander negotiations which set the plate for Marner and Matthews knowing he would give in, and then betting against both Matthews and Marner the summers they could have gotten an extension. He's bled picks since, most notably the Marleau and Foligno 1sts.

He's gutted the depth, namely Kadri, Kapanen, and Johnsson and is left with a middle 1st prospect and Kerfoot.

Shanahan isn't without fault either. He messed up in allowing a GM succession plan to take place during a franchise altering year (3 of the best young players in decades needing new contracts and JT being a free agent.)

Dubas has been extremely underwhelming in his tenure and considering the talent he started with and the lack of success in the playoffs, his tenure so far has been a complete and utter failure. Fans would be more forgiving of Dubas just moving back 13 spots if he hadn't already punted so many trades and picks.

I want the Leafs to win I couldn't care less if it's under Lou, Dubas, Babcock, JFJ, or Ron Wilson. Just win.

I hope for all Leafs fans he makes the right call with whatever goalie he chooses this summer.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Marleau is also another case. I was almost sure that we have wasted year with that immovable contract. He was 6 mill of dead cap. I don't think anyone here would have approved us wasting year after losing Boston in that game seven. Just to wait out that Marleau contract. That would have been atriocous.

Yep. It's mind-boggling that people are actually attempting to argue that because Dubas didn't throw away competitive years and refuse to replace departing players with the space those departing players opened up, he is to blame for somebody else's mistake. All because he had to clean it up.

Of course, if Dubas had done that, they would be blaming Dubas for our team getting worse. It's the perfect catch 22 they've created. If Dubas does nothing, allows the team to get worse, players to depart without replacement, and throws away competitive years, he's to blame. If Dubas does what's necessary and gets rid of Marleau, he is to blame.

Lou is undeniably the one that is responsible for the horrible Marleau contract. He literally signed it. Just as Dubas is responsible here for the 13 draft slots lost due to Mrazek, Lou is similarly responsible for the consequences of the Marleau contract. There is no argument otherwise.

 

[Racer88]

Hayes nailed it on TSN, Dubas did a great job getting rid of Mrazek, but the macro reality is you bet 1000 to get 750 back in the end.

Like to many of his deals

 

[kb]

Dubas did not need to give up a 1st to unload Marleau. He could have done what he did the very next summer/fall and trade Kapanen and Johnsson while keeping his 1st and letting Marleau's contract run out.

Even if he gets a lesser return for Kapanen the assets from that along with the Leafs 1st beat out the Pittsburgh 1st which was the only decent thing they got from both Kapanen and Johnsson. He probably also gets more for Johnsson as well, as Andreas tanked his value the season prior to being traded.

Lou's bad moves don't somehow make Dubas' any better. Lou messed up in signing Marleau for 3 years and not signing Nylander the summer he was eligible for an extension.

Dubas messed up by screwing up the entirety of the Nylander negotiations which set the plate for Marner and Matthews knowing he would give in, and then betting against both Matthews and Marner the summers they could have gotten an extension. He's bled picks since, most notably the Marleau and Foligno 1sts.

He's gutted the depth, namely Kadri, Kapanen, and Johnsson and is left with a middle 1st prospect and Kerfoot.

Shanahan isn't without fault either. He messed up in allowing a GM succession plan to take place during a franchise altering year (3 of the best young players in decades needing new contracts and JT being a free agent.)

Dubas has been extremely underwhelming in his tenure and considering the talent he started with and the lack of success in the playoffs, his tenure so far has been a complete and utter failure. Fans would be more forgiving of Dubas just moving back 13 spots if he hadn't already punted so many trades and picks.

I want the Leafs to win I couldn't care less if it's under Lou, Dubas, Babcock, JFJ, or Ron Wilson. Just win.

I hope for all Leafs fans he makes the right call with whatever goalie he chooses this summer.

 

[Jmo89]

View attachment 566555

Thanks for the gif, I'll go ahead and save it.

 

[Felix the Cat Potvin]

Yep. It's mind-boggling that people are actually attempting to argue that because Dubas didn't throw away competitive years

Cool post but unfortunately had to stop here since all Dubas has done is throw away competitive years.

Most GM's sacrifice the future for the present, or the present for the future, but Dubas has figured out how to sacrifice both at the same time.

Innovation!

 

[SnizzNasty88]

My God, the replies in here are amazing. You people’s obsession with Dubass, a GM who was handed a 105 point team and has done NOTHING since, will never ever cease to amaze me. Think about how impressive it is to be able to not win a single playoff round with the team he inherited. It’s so pathetic that it’s impressive. What an absolutely awful, awful GM. Imagine how low the bar must be to celebrate correcting mistakes that none of us even would have made if we were the GM. Dubasites (and you all know who you are) are the definition of insane and brilliant (not in a good way) at the same time.

 

[2 Slick]

So looks like we're going after a garbo goaltender in Murray that no one with any logical sense would want on their team, or the Leafs are going to try and overpay Campbell who couldn't stop a beach ball 80% of last season?

Hey, the status quo kings may get their wish after all. Mr. 897% in 7 games in the first round against a Tampa Bay team that was pretty much dead in the water for much of the series and posed little threat. That's who they want back between the pipes next season? Lmfao!!!!!! What a shit show.

At least they got rid of Mrazek.

 

[deprw]

I don't know how many times I have to say it, but here I go again.......

I am not debating the merits of the JT signing, I am simply stating that Dubas knew with 3 star ELC's expiring, and with Marleau and Zaitsev on the books, the cap would be exceeded if he signed Tavares.

He decided it was worth it even though it would cost him something. That something ended up being a 1st to get rid of Marleau.

In summary, Lou signed a bad contract, but it was Dubas' decisions that dictated how it ended regardless of the merits of the actual decisions.

And like I said in the end. Even without those players we should have got rid of that third year anyway. It was about competing in any case without Marleau, since it was burden.

Burden that should have in your mind slow us down even before that. Always to be sure to have extra space for that. What a Mess by Lou.

That contract wouldn't have stopped even Lou to sign Tavares.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Cool post but unfortunately had to stop here since all Dubas has done is throw away competitive years.

That's not true at all. Not winning the cup =/= throwing away competitive years.

Being unable to admit when one is wrong just screams of insecurity which you're are correct is unhealthy.

Yeah, you should really just admit that you're wrong.

 

[Mike1]

I’m just baffled by Leaf fans attitude towards this move. Our GM signs a goalie who struggles massively, spends future assets to bail out his own bad move & that somehow is a great move? How? What creativity has been displayed here to proclaim this to be great?

What would have been great is spending money on a goalie who was good & could stop the puck. This would have helped the team when Campbell’s play nose dived & given us more leverage in contract talks. Dubas prioritized goaltending last year, spent precious cap dollars on it & still ended up with questionable goaltending. He failed to properly address a need.

I’m just tired of seeing people heap praise for moves that are uncreative & pedestrian at best. Kyle Dubas doesn’t deserve anywhere near the credit I’ve seen being given here. He is a GM that has been given more talent/time than any of his predecessors & has done nothing but squander it. Leaf fans need to stop drinking the Dubi-koolaid!

 

[Lemontree]

That's not true at all. Not winning the cup =/= throwing away competitive years.

How about not coming anywhere close to playing for a conference title, does that qualify?

 

[hotpaws]

And like I said in the end. Even without those players we should have got rid of that third year anyway. It was about competing in any case without Marleau, since it was burden.

Burden that should have in your mind slow us down even before that. Always to be sure to have extra space for that. What a Mess by Lou.

That contract wouldn't have stopped even Lou to sign Tavares.

yup what an unbelievable mess that Lou left , lol

1 yr to long for Marleau and 1m to much for Z

but on the flip side he left a boat load of team friendly deals which for some reason Dubies guys can't remember

Rielly
Kadri
Andersen
Brown
Hyman

I guess however i should still be praising Dubie who had to pay to dump horrific contracts he signed less than a yr ago in Mzerak and Rithcie

also i'm left to wonder how much it'll take to dump Tavares and Muzzin who are both declining and overpaid

 

[Dekes For Days]

How about not coming anywhere close to playing for a conference title, does that qualify?

Our matchup basically was the conference final, but no. "Throwing away competitive years" has nothing to do with how far you get. It means giving up before you even start - like actively choosing to carry 6.25m in dead weight/on-ice liability, doing absolutely nothing to replace departing players during competitive years, and standing around twiddling your thumbs as your team deteriorates. Keeping Marleau was not an option. Lou is responsible for the consequences of his horrible decision.

 

[Nineteen67]

What about the year they didn’t qualify for the round of 16? Was that best of five equivalent to a conference final?
Of course the year they made the Canadian division semi-final wasn’t wasted either

 

[Gary Nylund]

Dubas did not need to give up a 1st to unload Marleau. He could have done what he did the very next summer/fall and trade Kapanen and Johnsson while keeping his 1st and letting Marleau's contract run out.

Even if he gets a lesser return for Kapanen the assets from that along with the Leafs 1st beat out the Pittsburgh 1st which was the only decent thing they got from both Kapanen and Johnsson. He probably also gets more for Johnsson as well, as Andreas tanked his value the season prior to being traded.

Lou's bad moves don't somehow make Dubas' any better. Lou messed up in signing Marleau for 3 years and not signing Nylander the summer he was eligible for an extension.

Dubas messed up by screwing up the entirety of the Nylander negotiations which set the plate for Marner and Matthews knowing he would give in, and then betting against both Matthews and Marner the summers they could have gotten an extension. He's bled picks since, most notably the Marleau and Foligno 1sts.

He's gutted the depth, namely Kadri, Kapanen, and Johnsson and is left with a middle 1st prospect and Kerfoot.

Shanahan isn't without fault either. He messed up in allowing a GM succession plan to take place during a franchise altering year (3 of the best young players in decades needing new contracts and JT being a free agent.)

Dubas has been extremely underwhelming in his tenure and considering the talent he started with and the lack of success in the playoffs, his tenure so far has been a complete and utter failure. Fans would be more forgiving of Dubas just moving back 13 spots if he hadn't already punted so many trades and picks.

I want the Leafs to win I couldn't care less if it's under Lou, Dubas, Babcock, JFJ, or Ron Wilson. Just win.

I hope for all Leafs fans he makes the right call with whatever goalie he chooses this summer.

Trading Kapanen and Johnsson would have made the team weaker, pretty sure nobody would have been happy with that at the time.

 

[DarkKnight]

yup what an unbelievable mess that Lou left , lol

1 yr to long for Marleau and 1m to much for Z

but on the flip side he left a boat load of team friendly deals which for some reason Dubies guys can't remember

Rielly
Kadri
Andersen
Brown
Hyman

I guess however i should still be praising Dubie who had to pay to dump horrific contracts he signed less than a yr ago in Mzerak and Rithcie

also i'm left to wonder how much it'll take to dump Tavares and Muzzin who are both declining and overpaid

He also got rid of the unmoveable contract of all time I was told, Phaneuf.

 

[ACC1224]

I’m just baffled by Leaf fans attitude towards this move. Our GM signs a goalie who struggles massively, spends future assets to bail out his own bad move & that somehow is a great move? How? What creativity has been displayed here to proclaim this to be great?

What would have been great is spending money on a goalie who was good & could stop the puck. This would have helped the team when Campbell’s play nose dived & given us more leverage in contract talks. Dubas prioritized goaltending last year, spent precious cap dollars on it & still ended up with questionable goaltending. He failed to properly address a need.

I’m just tired of seeing people heap praise for moves that are uncreative & pedestrian at best. Kyle Dubas doesn’t deserve anywhere near the credit I’ve seen being given here. He is a GM that has been given more talent/time than any of his predecessors & has done nothing but squander it. Leaf fans need to stop drinking the Dubi-koolaid!

It's only a few fans that are celebrating, mostly those who are dishonest for the most part.
Great Mrazek is gone but hardly something worth celebrating.

 

[rocketman588]

Our matchup basically was the conference final, but no. "Throwing away competitive years" has nothing to do with how far you get. It means giving up before you even start - like actively choosing to carry 6.25m in dead weight/on-ice liability, doing absolutely nothing to replace departing players during competitive years, and standing around twiddling your thumbs as your team deteriorates. Keeping Marleau was not an option. Lou is responsible for the consequences of his horrible decision.

Lol holy f***

"Our first round matchup was basically the conference finals"

Next level drinking of Kool aid

What's next. If we didn't lose to the Jackets in the bubble we would have won the cup?

 

[DarkKnight]

I’m just baffled by Leaf fans attitude towards this move. Our GM signs a goalie who struggles massively, spends future assets to bail out his own bad move & that somehow is a great move? How? What creativity has been displayed here to proclaim this to be great?

What would have been great is spending money on a goalie who was good & could stop the puck. This would have helped the team when Campbell’s play nose dived & given us more leverage in contract talks. Dubas prioritized goaltending last year, spent precious cap dollars on it & still ended up with questionable goaltending. He failed to properly address a need.

I’m just tired of seeing people heap praise for moves that are uncreative & pedestrian at best. Kyle Dubas doesn’t deserve anywhere near the credit I’ve seen being given here. He is a GM that has been given more talent/time than any of his predecessors & has done nothing but squander it. Leaf fans need to stop drinking the Dubi-koolaid!

It’s the same mentality that thinks a firm handshake and friendly advanced stats compute to a satisfactory result. Other fan bases laugh at us for a reason, the mental pretzels we engage in to spin heartbreak is unique to this organization.

 

[rocketman588]

What about the year they didn’t qualify for the round of 16? Was that best of five equivalent to a conference final?
Of course the year they made the Canadian division semi-final wasn’t wasted either

Those matchups were all basically the Stanley cup finals according to him

 

[DarkKnight]

Lol holy f***

"Our first round matchup was basically the conference finals"

Next level drinking of Kool aid

What's next. If we didn't lose to the Jackets in the bubble we would have won the cup?

Come for the discussion, stay for the comedy.