Top 100 Forwards in the NHL

[Stewie Griffin]

It's going to be fun watching the Bruins ancient core fade away.

You mean Marchand (31), Pastranak (23), McAvoy (21), and Desbrusk (22)? That doesn't include a bunch of guys but other than Chara and maybe Bergeron/Krecji they aren't ancient at all.

 

[Lays]

I think Zibanejad needs to be a bit higher. 74 points with very little talent around him and a good all around game

 

[CallArnoldSlick]

There's no justification for Kucherov under Crosby at this point.

I mean, there's an argument for Kucherov to be ranked above Crosby at this point, but saying there is "no justification" for a 100-point, Selke-caliber center who has been widely considered a top 2 player in the league for the past dozen years to be ranked over an offensive winger coming off a career year on a stacked team is simply not true.

 

[joe dirte]

You mean Marchand (31), Pastranak (23), McAvoy (21), and Desbrusk (22)? That doesn't include a bunch of guys but other than Chara and maybe Bergeron/Krecji they aren't ancient at all.

More specifically I'm talking about their number 1 centre Bergeron (34), their number 1 winger (31 - which is on the decline int he NHL), their number 2 centre Krejci (33), and their number 3 Dman in terms of ATOI (barely behind 2nd), Chara (42).

Essentially, 4 KEY positions being occupied by players past 30, including 2/3 of their first line, and their first and second line centre (obviously not mutually exclusive).

 

[Madap]

He may not be a “defensive god” but he is arguably one of the best all time and quite easily better than Matthews defensively while also having a better PPG the last two seasons as well.

There’s really no reason to have Matthews ranked above Bergeron if you’re excluding potential.

No reason? Matthews is a far superior offensive player already, and while Bergeron is better on defence, it's not enough to make up the difference. Bergeron has had what, one ppg season? Last year. While the only time Matthews hasn't is in his rookie season. No one can even hold injuries against Matthews here since Bergeron is far more injury prone. Matthews is also the second best goalscorer in the league behind Ovechkin, who gets ranked so high because of his goal scoring ability.

That's not even counting linemates. A couple years ago Bergeron wasn't talked about as one of the best players in the world at all. A solid two way player, sure, but whatever offence he has now is a result of Pastrnak and Marchand flanking him. Overall still a great player, but he's quickly become one of the most overrated players on these boards the past couple years.

 

[Yackiberg8]

He may not be a “defensive god” but he is arguably one of the best all time and quite easily better than Matthews defensively while also having a better PPG the last two seasons as well.

There’s really no reason to have Matthews ranked above Bergeron if you’re excluding potential.

I was referring to the series that was being discussed. Matthews was the better player in the head to head matchup that was brought up.

Their PPG are close the last 2 years, if you include Matthews rookie season (last 3 years) then Matthews has the edge. Matthews is also a much better goal scorer. Bergeron didn’t become a PPG player until his age 32 season, this is because he joined an elite line at that time which has clearly heavily boosted his offensive capabilities. Matthews is a much better offensive player and a better player overall imo.

 

[Saltcreek]

Real hockey? What is it basketball? I mean it's laughable. I guess there is no proof they have chemistry if we ignore any proof because it doesn't fit a narrative. I know for a fact the day Matthews leaves the Leafs he will suddenly get respect on here, just like Kessel did.

It is not proof, it is the bloody All Star game. Those games are for show, there is no hitting or real competition as the players are just having a laugh. Take your little narrative victim card and shove it.

 

[joe dirte]

It is not proof, it is the bloody All Star game. Those games are for show, there is no hitting or real competition as the players are just having a laugh. Take your little narrative victim card and shove it.

It's a moot point anyway. Any good coach probably wouldn't play Matthews and McDavid together. If Matthews were an Oiler, they'd surely split them up, and finally have a capable second line. The Oilers haven't had anyone good enough to run a second line in so long, having Matthews on their second line would be a huge bonus. Being a one line team kills them.

 

[JaegerDice]

Good list.

Everybody is going to have nitpicks, but there's nothing egregious here.

 

[nbwingsfan]

No reason? Matthews is a far superior offensive player already, and while Bergeron is better on defence, it's not enough to make up the difference. Bergeron has had what, one ppg season? Last year. While the only time Matthews hasn't is in his rookie season. No one can even hold injuries against Matthews here since Bergeron is far more injury prone. Matthews is also the second best goalscorer in the league behind Ovechkin, who gets ranked so high because of his goal scoring ability.

That's not even counting linemates. A couple years ago Bergeron wasn't talked about as one of the best players in the world at all. A solid two way player, sure, but whatever offence he has now is a result of Pastrnak and Marchand flanking him. Overall still a great player, but he's quickly become one of the most overrated players on these boards the past couple years.

Last two season:

Bergeron: 129GP/ 63G / 142pts

Matthews: 130GP: 71G / 136pts

Little more goals for Matthews, little more points for Bergeron.

Weird that the “far more superior” offensive player only has a few more goals and also a few less points, no?

Now add in that it’s not an argument who’s the better defensive player. Bergeron is one of the best all time, Leaf fans themselves said Matthews wasn’t great defensively last year.

Now also add in that the biggest excuse for Matthews poor playoff showing in 17/18 was that he was playing head to head against Bergeron, and please explain to me again on who’s the better player excluding potential?

 

[Asymmetric Solution]

Ovechkin: Scores 89 points in 81 games, point per game of 1.10, while playing almost exclusively with Evgeny Kuznetsov who is widely considered one of the best playmakers in the league, is placed 4th on this list.
Matthews: Scores 73 points in 68 games, point per game of 1.07, while playing primarily with a handful of middle six calibre wingers, is placed 10th on this list.

Ovechkin also played 3 more minutes a night and they both had around 57% o-zone starts so don't feed me that bull**** narrative that Matthews isn't as trusted defensively.

If Matthews is too high on this list, then so is Ovechkin. At this point I wouldn't even place Ovechkin ahead of Matthews.

Now I’ve seen it all from the Leafs. They now think AM is better than Ovi.

 

[Kamiccolo]

It is not proof, it is the bloody All Star game. Those games are for show, there is no hitting or real competition as the players are just having a laugh. Take your little narrative victim card and shove it.

lmfao all star game? Man you didn't even bother to watch the clips, goes to show how open your mind is about the topic.

 

[Kamiccolo]

Now I’ve seen it all from the Leafs. They now think AM is better than Ovi.

1. One poster said that, not millions of fans.

2. If you look at the numbers, Ovi and Matthews are neck / neck in goal scoring production since he entered the league.

 

[sufferer]

Stop putting wingers who get outscored by their linemates above centers who have slightly lower point totals but do all the heavy lifting.

 

[Asymmetric Solution]

1. One poster said that, not millions of fans.

2. If you look at the numbers, Ovi and Matthews are neck / neck in goal scoring production since he entered the league.

And there’s likely not a single GM in the league that would trade a 33 year old 8 for 2 AMs.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

1. One poster said that, not millions of fans.

2. If you look at the numbers, Ovi and Matthews are neck / neck in goal scoring production since he entered the league.

Neck and neck if you focus on rates per 60 and certain 5on5 stats, but not if you look at actual production and trophy wins for said goal scoring prowess.

 

[Kamiccolo]

And there’s likely not a single GM in the league that would trade a 33 year old 8 for 2 AMs.

What? I've been here a long time.. I've read some things.. This is certainly one of them.

Neck and neck if you focus on rates per 60 and certain 5on5 stats, but not if you look at actual production and trophy wins for said goal scoring prowess.

No /60 BS. It's just straight goals / game. Only part of Matthews not being as good of a scorer as Ovi has been health.

 

[TheOtherOne]

I have a hard time believing Larkin and Athanasiou aren't higher, but then again, I am massively biased.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

More specifically I'm talking about their number 1 centre Bergeron (34), their number 1 winger (31 - which is on the decline int he NHL), their number 2 centre Krejci (33), and their number 3 Dman in terms of ATOI (barely behind 2nd), Chara (42).

Essentially, 4 KEY positions being occupied by players past 30, including 2/3 of their first line, and their first and second line centre (obviously not mutually exclusive).

Number 1 winger on the decline? Just because someone is over the age of 30 doesn't mean they are declining just yet. That "winger on the decline" just had 100 points in 79 games lmao. The only one ancient on the Bruins roster is Chara, and they have some young defenseman to take the guard from him.

I can tell you don't like the Bruins, but their team is in a good position. This is coming from a San Jose fan who doesn't like the Bruins.

 

[Atas2000]

So why would oveckin be top 10 basically same player but Matthews is a center.

Not saying your wrong about Matthews but I feel Ovie is overrated a lot.

Yeah, right, the guy who is virtually in the HHOF long before his career is concluded. Stop hating.

 

[Atas2000]

I've read McDavid and Crosby at 1 and 2 and thought - oh well another, just another NA biased list of whaterver, but then I saw Stamkos and I had to laugh. Thank you.

 

[nbwingsfan]

More specifically I'm talking about their number 1 centre Bergeron (34), their number 1 winger (31 - which is on the decline int he NHL), their number 2 centre Krejci (33), and their number 3 Dman in terms of ATOI (barely behind 2nd), Chara (42).

Essentially, 4 KEY positions being occupied by players past 30, including 2/3 of their first line, and their first and second line centre (obviously not mutually exclusive).

You do know that every one of Krejci/Bergeron/Marchand just had the best seasons of their career, no?

 

[Asymmetric Solution]

What? I've been here a long time.. I've read some things.. This is certainly one of them.



No /60 BS. It's just straight goals / game. Only part of Matthews not being as good of a scorer as Ovi has been health.

A bit of hyperbole and joking aside, but honestly do you think the Caps trade 8 to Toronto for AM? Dubas is driving AM to the airport within minutes of that call. It would likely take Marner and Mathews to get that trade done. This list is more than scoring metrics. Defensive capability and intangibles matter in this league as well.

 

[Kamiccolo]

A bit of hyperbole and joking aside, but honestly do you think the Caps trade 8 to Toronto for AM? Dubas is driving AM to the airport within minutes of that call. It would likely take Marner and Mathews to get that trade done. This list is more than scoring metrics. Defensive capability and intangibles matter in this league as well.

You think that a 33 year old with his best days behind him is worth more than a 21 year old C who hasn't hit his prime yet? What about Dubas' body of work tells you he would do this? Honestly, it;s such an obscene opinion I am not even sure how to answer you.

Make a poll about it if you think it's such an easy choice. Just make sure to specify their current ages.

 

[biotk]

Last two season:

Bergeron: 129GP/ 63G / 142pts

Matthews: 130GP: 71G / 136pts

Little more goals for Matthews, little more points for Bergeron.

Weird that the “far more superior” offensive player only has a few more goals and also a few less points, no?

Now add in that it’s not an argument who’s the better defensive player. Bergeron is one of the best all time, Leaf fans themselves said Matthews wasn’t great defensively last year.

Now also add in that the biggest excuse for Matthews poor playoff showing in 17/18 was that he was playing head to head against Bergeron, and please explain to me again on who’s the better player excluding potential?

Matthews had no problem with Bergeron in the 2018 playoffs. He had issues with Chara (as did Marner, Kucherov, Stamkos etc). Bergeron produces well, but his production falls off a cliff when not playing with both Pastrnak and Marchand.