Confirmed with Link: Tomas Hertl 17% retained, 2025 3rd, 2027 3rd to Vegas for C David Edstrom, 2025 1st

[Jargon]

One thing I find irritating is this line I’ve heard from several fans, and like a random fan podcast (I didn’t listen to it, it was the description on Twitter) that, “Sharks don’t have a plan.”

I understand not liking the plan, but I think Grier has literally, honestly and bluntly explained the plan like every few months. And if you don’t listen to Grier talk, you can still figure out the plan plainly by what he’s been doing since the day he got in as GM. It’s honestly a very straightforward and obvious one.

 

[LadyStanley]

 

[timorous me]

One thing I find irritating is this line I’ve heard from several fans, and like a random fan podcast (I didn’t listen to it, it was the description on Twitter) that, “Sharks don’t have a plan.”

I understand not liking the plan, but I think Grier has literally, honestly and bluntly explained the plan like every few months. And if you don’t listen to Grier talk, you can still figure out the plan plainly by what he’s been doing since the day he got in as GM. It’s honestly a very straightforward and obvious one.

And by all accounts, Grier not only has had this plan--from the start, as he said yesterday, even when interviewing for the job--but he's had to work hard to convince Plattner that this is the right approach.

That's good in the sense that it shows his conviction in the plan, that it's the right approach, and he hasn't backed off even when faced with obstacles--like trading the fans' favorite player to their bitter rival.

This isn't to say it'll all work out well in the end, but yeah, saying there's no plan is actually pretty insulting to Grier.

 

[karltonian]

And by all accounts, Grier not only has had this plan--from the start, as he said yesterday, even when interviewing for the job--but he's had to work hard to convince Plattner that this is the right approach.

That's good in the sense that it shows his conviction in the plan, that it's the right approach, and he hasn't backed off even when faced with obstacles--like trading the fans' favorite player to their bitter rival.

This isn't to say it'll all work out well in the end, but yeah, saying there's no plan is actually pretty insulting to Grier.

The Sharks as an organization aren't very forthcoming with information and don't really level with fans. Other organizations don't sugarcoat things or hide them, they come right out and say it.

Look, I'm playing it up to a degree; I don't actually feel like my girlfriend just left me. It's an analogy and sometimes exaggeration just helps put things into perspective or explain how it feels in a way that's otherwise hard to do.

Hockey is still escapism to me, but there is a level of emotion that goes into that, or else why would I even bother? There are still stories and loyalties and characters and all of these things that go into rooting for a team or a player that matter.

This, as a non-SJ resident there's literally nothing keeping me a fan of this team right now so I sure hope something emerges quickly. I became a fan around 2000-2001 with a gritty, scrappy team punching above its weight and looking like it was on the rise. It evolved into an iconic juggernaut for better or worse with stars rotating through for 2 decades.

The cast of characters has had strong links from that time up until right now, where we no longer have anyone with clear lineage playing regularly for us. This team is just foreign, and I don't consider Grier himself a part of that lineage enough to count. I might as well become a Vegas fan at this point, I spend more time visiting that city than any other. But ugh.

 

[DG93]

The Sharks as an organization aren't very forthcoming with information and don't really level with fans. Other organizations don't sugarcoat things or hide them, they come right out and say it.


This, as a non-SJ resident there's literally nothing keeping me a fan of this team right now so I sure hope something emerges quickly. I became a fan around 2000-2001 with a gritty, scrappy team punching above its weight and looking like it was on the rise. It evolved into an iconic juggernaut for better or worse with stars rotating through for 2 decades.

The cast of characters has had strong links from that time up until right now, where we no longer have anyone with clear lineage playing regularly for us. This team is just foreign, and I don't consider Grier himself a part of that lineage enough to count. I might as well become a Vegas fan at this point, I spend more time visiting that city than any other. But ugh.

Well, after all that winning, as Grier (and Quinn honestly) have said comes a price and that involves a rebuild. If you want to jump off the wagon and wait for the team to be good again, that's fine. But that brings up the point that has been mentioned a few times already...fans are attracted by winning. Doing this rebuild the right way is the way to get back to winning, and Grier has stuck by that plan for almost 2 years now. Curious to see how he builds the team back up after this painful part is done.

 

[karltonian]

Well, after all that winning, as Grier (and Quinn honestly) have said comes a price and that involves a rebuild. If you want to jump off the wagon and wait for the team to be good again, that's fine. But that brings up the point that has been mentioned a few times already...fans are attracted by winning. Doing this rebuild the right way is the way to get back to winning, and Grier has stuck by that plan for almost 2 years now. Curious to see how he builds the team back up after this painful part is done.

there's paying a price and there's losing *everything*
this team might as well have folded and moved to another city

 

[sharks_dynasty]

there's paying a price and there's losing *everything*
this team might as well have folded and moved to another city

I remember when Toronto hadn’t been to the playoffs for over 10 years. And how bleak things were in Chicago before they got Toews and Kane. And how badly Edmonton sucked for so long before McDavid. And the futility of Colorado before their current renaissance.

Many teams go through hard times and reach rock bottom. The Sharks are going through a similar period now. It’s not the end of the world. It’s the beginning of a new era. One that hopefully leads to a bright future. Im excited and optimistic for what’s to come.

 

[OffSydes]

there's paying a price and there's losing *everything*
this team might as well have folded and moved to another city

To reference a respected American institution "Flip or Flop" this was not a lipstick flip, the roster and prospect pool was so bad that it needed to be taken down to the studs.

MG handled the demo really well and the Shorks have good prospects for the first time in a long time. There are still some major phases but he is doing well

 

[karltonian]

I remember when Toronto hadn’t been to the playoffs for over 10 years. And how bleak things were in Chicago before they got Toews and Kane. And how badly Edmonton sucked for so long before McDavid. And the futility of Colorado before their current renaissance.

Many teams go through hard times and reach rock bottom. The Sharks are going through a similar period now. It’s not the end of the world. It’s the beginning of a new era. One that hopefully leads to a bright future. Im excited and optimistic for what’s to come.

Both of those teams were objectively terrible before tearing it down and "doing it right," because they were objectively terrible and had to. The Sharks were not in that position, they were a good team with assets. They have squandered everything and are essentially an expansion team right now. An old-style expansion team.

To reference a respected American institution "Flip or Flop" this was not a lipstick flip, the roster and prospect pool was so bad that it needed to be taken down to the studs.

MG handled the demo really well and the Shorks have good prospects for the first time in a long time. There are still some major phases but he is doing well

Do we have good prospects? Not really, not yet. And we aren't really in position to get them for sure because of the way the draft lottery works. Celebrini would be a start but we all know how likely that is.

We have 0 clear first line players on the team or in the system, and it's not clear we have any decent 2nd liners either. Then we haven't even started building the defense. There's tearing it down to the studs and there's destroying the studs as well.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

Do we have good prospects? Not really, not yet. And we aren't really in position to get them for sure because of the way the draft lottery works. Celebrini would be a start but we all know how likely that is.

We have 0 clear first line players on the team or in the system, and it's not clear we have any decent 2nd liners either. Then we haven't even started building the defense. There's tearing it down to the studs and there's destroying the studs as well.

Yes. We have the leading point scorer in the NCAA, the highest point/game player in the OHL, and other decent prospects that could become something. And yes we are in position to get good prospects because we have the 2nd best chance at winning the lottery right now, and could end up with another high pick this year or next thanks to Pittsburgh.

The sharks are not the first time to do this.

 

[coooldude]

Both of those teams were objectively terrible before tearing it down and "doing it right," because they were objectively terrible and had to. The Sharks were not in that position, they were a good team with assets. They have squandered everything and are essentially an expansion team right now. An old-style expansion team.


Do we have good prospects? Not really, not yet. And we aren't really in position to get them for sure because of the way the draft lottery works. Celebrini would be a start but we all know how likely that is.

We have 0 clear first line players on the team or in the system, and it's not clear we have any decent 2nd liners either. Then we haven't even started building the defense. There's tearing it down to the studs and there's destroying the studs as well.

I mean, we have a top 5 prospect pool before this coming draft. If what you say is true, then very few teams in the league have top line prospects or second line prospects. Eklund alone is holding his own in top 6 minutes as a 21 year old and looks like he belongs. He's not going to drag this team to victory but we are starting to have the pieces. We definitely need world class players and the way to get those is through the draft, and that takes years.

The fundamental difference is you said along the lines of "we were a good team with assets." But I and others don't agree. We were a dying team with close to negative value assets. One of the assets went from huge value to extremely hard to move because he(rtl) was signed to a contract when he clearly should not have been.

If you're looking for reasons to care: this team has played with incredible drive and heart apart from a small handful of games this year. They've been scrappy and forced teams and frustrated teams. That's not a losing culture. As we add Grier's desired speed, size, and skill, we will continue to be a hard team to play against. It probably won't be flashy but it very possibly may work.

 

[OffSydes]

Prospects from 20-21, the pool is way different

SJ Sharks 2020-21 Top 15 Prospects: 1-5 - Teal Town USA

Part three the of the Sharks top prospects list features the most impressive top 5 the Sharks have had in some time. This exciting group includes a couple of first round picks, a couple of sixth round picks and a player who is immediately dominating the college ranks. Look out for several of...

tealtownusa.com

SJ Sharks 2020-21 Top 15 Prospects: 6-10 - Teal Town USA

Part two the of the Sharks top prospects list features a heavy European theme including the only goaltender to appear in the top 15. We also have a couple of players nearly NHL-ready and another 2020 draft pick with sky high potential. If you missed part 1, read about prospects 11 through 15...

tealtownusa.com

 

[sharski]

One thing I find irritating is this line I’ve heard from several fans, and like a random fan podcast (I didn’t listen to it, it was the description on Twitter) that, “Sharks don’t have a plan.”

I understand not liking the plan, but I think Grier has literally, honestly and bluntly explained the plan like every few months. And if you don’t listen to Grier talk, you can still figure out the plan plainly by what he’s been doing since the day he got in as GM. It’s honestly a very straightforward and obvious one.

I'm 100% convinced that after DW was out, Hasso, JB and JW had absolutely zero idea wtf the team should do and definitely interviewed everyone to mine for ideas

Once every candidate started describing their plan how to rebuild the org, in the post-interview sync they were probably like "O f***, I think we should probably go with a rebuild if that's what they're all saying"

 

[YUPPY 2 7 10 11]

Grier has a plan since day 1, just some fans don't agree with his plan. However, I sense that GMMG is here to do the dirty work "REBUILD" but won't have a chance to complete the REBUILD because of these fair weather sharks fans are complaining. Looking at EDM, they have several GM since selected Conor Mcdavid by GM Peter Chiarelli in 2015, since then they have hired 2 other GMs and still have not won the Stanley Cup. I honestly think Grier is the right person to guide the Sharks but will the impatience Sharks fans and the Owner allow him to finish?

 

[coooldude]

Grier has a plan since day 1, just some fans don't agree with his plan. However, I sense that GMMG is here to do the dirty work "REBUILD" but won't have a chance to complete the REBUILD because of these fair weather sharks fans are complaining. Looking at EDM, they have several GM since selected Conor Mcdavid by GM Peter Chiarelli in 2015, since then they have hired 2 other GMs and still have not won the Stanley Cup. I honestly think Grier is the right person to guide the Sharks but will the impatience Sharks fans and the Owner allow him to finish?

Same happened in Chicago with Pulford, Tallon, and Bowman. To a lesser extent, Sherman and Sakic in Colorado.

 

[Barrie22]

Grier has a plan since day 1, just some fans don't agree with his plan. However, I sense that GMMG is here to do the dirty work "REBUILD" but won't have a chance to complete the REBUILD because of these fair weather sharks fans are complaining. Looking at EDM, they have several GM since selected Conor Mcdavid by GM Peter Chiarelli in 2015, since then they have hired 2 other GMs and still have not won the Stanley Cup. I honestly think Grier is the right person to guide the Sharks but will the impatience Sharks fans and the Owner allow him to finish?

The ones that start the rebuild never see the baby succeed. Tampa, Chicago, Colorado, Penguins.

 

[LadyStanley]

 

[Hangemhigh]

When Hertl wanted out, I would hope GMMG would have shopped Hertl to other teams as his due diligence.

 

[OrrNumber4]

The Sharks were not in that position, they were a good team with assets.

When did the definition of the word "good" change to "terrible"?

 

[Lebanezer]

When Hertl wanted out, I would hope GMMG would have shopped Hertl to other teams as his due diligence.

That article makes it sound like he didn't, that he only spoke to Vegas.

 

[Alaskanice]

That article makes it sound like he didn't, that he only spoke to Vegas.

I read that McCrimmon had been discussing this trade with Grier since before the All star break.

 

[Lebanezer]

I read that McCrimmon had been discussing this trade with Grier since before the All star break.

Could be read various ways. Sounds like no one knew the conversations were ongoing.

 

[Alaskanice]

View attachment 833751
Could be read various ways. Sounds like no one knew the conversations were ongoing.

Elsewhere in that conversation, he says it’s been since before the all star break. That’s pretty clear.

 

[sharski]

Considering how long DW was around I'm assuming GMMG will be given many years to get the team back to cup contention, which is why I think he was okay with appending the "YEARS away" to the comment regarding the team not being a cup contender that Hertl wants to play for

I'll set the over/under to his tenure at 8 years

 

[Lebanezer]

Elsewhere in that conversation, he says it’s been since before the all star break. That’s pretty clear.

Right. My point was that it sounds like he only talked to Vegas about trading Hertl.