Tiny Heiny

[Mortimer Snerd]

He played very sheltered games seeing 10 minutes, the more he played the more overwhelmed he became, sorry but too small for the NHL and not quick enough. Another wasted Finnish draft pick

Bottom line though is that Miller, Fleury and even Stan are better!

He may or may not be good enough for the NHL but it isn't because of size. There are plenty of players his size and smaller who are succeeding in the NHL.

 

[Buffdog]

He may or may not be good enough for the NHL but it isn't because of size. There are plenty of players his size and smaller who are succeeding in the NHL.

Those guys are usually exceptional at something though

Ville looks comfortable moving the puck but that's about all he's shown

Maybe he would have shown more with more opportunities, maybe not. Clearly the org doesn't think so

 

[bustamente]

It's too bad he has to clear waivers he really should be with the Moose playing hockey instead of the PB

 

[TS Quint]

Josh Morrissey-sized Heiny should have been traded at the TDL, or given away in the offseason. Clearly not going to give him a run, so move on.

Should be given a shot to see what works on the third pairing incase of injury but the Jets don't do that. Best to move on and sign Stanley for 8 years.

But he’s not Josh Morrissey sized. He’s listed 15lbs lighter and plays like he’s 30 lbs lighter. He is as weak as a kitten. You can see opponents looking to make contact with him and dropping him on his ass. He has zero defense to his game so he doesn’t get to play offense.

Heinola is a case of a player who has a small tool box of good skills. You can get away with that in the AHL. These guys are a dime a dozen. The top of AHL scoring is littered with these kinds of guys. It’s not good enough in the NHL where everyone is far more well rounded.

Heinola has no value. He will hang around the team until training camp. At that point we will see if there is a space in the press box for him. If not he will go on waivers, possibly getting picked up by a team desperately looking for a PP2 options.

 

[King Woodballs]

But I agree. If he hasn’t got himself a full time job yet. He never will.
Trade him for what ever mid range pick you can get and be done with it

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Those guys are usually exceptional at something though

Ville looks comfortable moving the puck but that's about all he's shown

Maybe he would have shown more with more opportunities, maybe not. Clearly the org doesn't think so

Don't disagree, but the problem is not his size.

Another 30-40 lbs might help him compensate for not being exceptional at something else. Or being exceptional at something else might compensate for a lack of size. But his size is no more his problem than lack of outstanding skating ability, or puck handling, or shooting or any other one thing. It is just one of the things on the list of attributes that he doesn't have.

 

[Weezeric]

With Comeau we drafted Schief at #7 then Trouba and Ehlers at #9, it’s not like those were top 4 OA level slots. How much different numerically are Morrissey and #13 Connor at #17 vs Stanley #18, Lucius #18, McGroarty #14, Barlow #18?? All guys taken in the 13 to 18 range. Perfetti is the one successful pick (to date) under Hillier’s leadership and he was taken in the Trouba, Ehlers 9-10 OA area. I am a fan of Cole’s but he has got a ways to go to catch up to Ehlers as far as results go.

I am not a fan of how we have drafted in the first round since Comeau stepped down. I get it, shit happens, its unpredictable, but we are running out of excuses to explain this away. we have not been good enough.

If you are thinking that there’s not much difference between top 10 picks be picks in the second half of the 1st round, I doubt you will have too many agree with you.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I guess my take is different than most here, but we will never know what could have been. He was called the best Dman in camp last season and we were told that he made the team already, then he broke his foot, then we did the Stanley experiment. He was also touted as the best prospect in Canada at one point by a couple of GMs.

I thought when he had a short run of games he was looking really good. I still think with some real reps he could be a very good player. I concede that we will never use him and might as well trade him, but I think if he goes to a team that gives him a real shot, he will flourish and we will be sorry we didn't give him the rope that we instead wasted on Stanley.

 

[Buffdog]

I guess my take is different than most here, but we will never know what could have been. He was called the best Dman in camp last season and we were told that he made the team already, then he broke his foot, then we did the Stanley experiment. He was also touted as the best prospect in Canada at one point by a couple of GMs.

I thought when he had a short run of games he was looking really good. I still think with some real reps he could be a very good player. I concede that we will never use him and might as well trade him, but I think if he goes to a team that gives him a real shot, he will flourish and we will be sorry we didn't give him the rope that we instead wasted on Stanley.

People will roast me for saying this, but there's a reason that Stanley got time over Ville. Since we only see game play, we might not fully know what that reason is

Coaching staff get to watch players a lot more (and a lot more closely) than we do... including off the ice and in practice. We might see Ville go into the corner to battle for a puck a few times over the course of a game... but in small area games in practice, coaches will get to see it thousands of times

And before people say "well, games are what matters".... I'll share a little story.... my daughter was at the U18 Hockey Manitoba POE camp a few summers ago. The camp consisted of practices, off ice fitness, and scrimmages. The games were held at the end of the day and the girls were all gassed and borderline useless. It was very difficult to evaluate anything in my opinion

During one of the on ice sessions, I had a chat with one of the Hockey Manitoba execs that's was there evaluating on the boys side. I asked him about this, and he said that the majority of their evaluations are done in the practice sessions. That's where they got a feel for the things they were looking for due to the high number of reps they were able to put the girls through

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

The Marcel Comeau era 1st round picks:

Scheifele
Trouba
Morrissey
Ehlers
Connor Roslo

Ladies and Gentlemen I bring you the Mark Hillier era first round results:

After Laine lottery luck:

Stanley
KVes
Heinola
Lucius
Perfetti (yea)
McConman
Barlow

The Marcel Comeau era 2nd rd picks
Sutter
Petan Comrie
Harkins

Mark Hillier era 2nd rd picks
Samberg
Gustafsson
Lundmark
Torgersson
Chibrikov
Salomonsson
Freij

Comeau didn't get very many chances at the 2nd rd. Hillier has a couple of duds, but has done pretty well in the 2nd, considering pick placements. Not sure what this proves.

 

[TS Quint]

I guess my take is different than most here, but we will never know what could have been. He was called the best Dman in camp last season and we were told that he made the team already, then he broke his foot, then we did the Stanley experiment. He was also touted as the best prospect in Canada at one point by a couple of GMs.

I thought when he had a short run of games he was looking really good. I still think with some real reps he could be a very good player. I concede that we will never use him and might as well trade him, but I think if he goes to a team that gives him a real shot, he will flourish and we will be sorry we didn't give him the rope that we instead wasted on Stanley.

I guess you have to start from a point where you really want to believe in some of these quotes.

You have to start by believeing Heinola was better that Morrissey in any day of his life. I’m sure Heinola looked good in camp. But good AHL players should look good playing against AHL players.

I can’t believe any GM would have ever said he was the best prospect in Canada. Then I started to look up Canadian team prospects and it’s a pretty sad group. Thats still over the top unbelievable even for as low of a bar as that is. Chevy done screwed up if he didn’t offer up Heinola for Sanderson, Bouchard or Caufield.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

People will roast me for saying this, but there's a reason that Stanley got time over Ville. Since we only see game play, we might not fully know what that reason is

Coaching staff get to watch players a lot more (and a lot more closely) than we do... including off the ice and in practice. We might see Ville go into the corner to battle for a puck a few times over the course of a game... but in small area games in practice, coaches will get to see it thousands of times

And before people say "well, games are what matters".... I'll share a little story.... my daughter was at the U18 Hockey Manitoba POE camp a few summers ago. The camp consisted of practices, off ice fitness, and scrimmages. The games were held at the end of the day and the girls were all gassed and borderline useless. It was very difficult to evaluate anything in my opinion

During one of the on ice sessions, I had a chat with one of the Hockey Manitoba execs that's was there evaluating on the boys side. I asked him about this, and he said that the majority of their evaluations are done in the practice sessions. That's where they got a feel for the things they were looking for due to the high number of reps they were able to put the girls through

I think we are seeing confirmation of the notion that Arniel was playing Stanley because he wanted more size (and maybe truculence too) on the back end. He was willing to accept the downside to get it. Since acquiring Schenn, Stan has not played. Fleury has been just OK at 3LD but he has played 3 straight games.

Not sure how it might change if we had Pionk playing but I can't see the addition of another good Dman bringing Stan in. Logically it should only push him further down. But if Schenn is unable to play, or needs a rest, I'm pretty sure we see Stanley play.

If Pionk was healthy, I'd like to see Heini with Schenn.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I guess you have to start from a point where you really want to believe in some of these quotes.

You have to start by believeing Heinola was better that Morrissey in any day of his life. I’m sure Heinola looked good in camp. But good AHL players should look good playing against AHL players.

I can’t believe any GM would have ever said he was the best prospect in Canada. Then I started to look up Canadian team prospects and it’s a pretty sad group. Thats still over the top unbelievable even for as low of a bar as that is. Chevy done screwed up if he didn’t offer up Heinola for Sanderson, Bouchard or Caufield.

Not too long after Heinola was drafted (next year maybe?) rumour was that we were getting serious trade offers for him. Apparently he was highly regarded. Maybe it was the 8 game, 5 pt trial he had with the Jets right after the draft.

Whatever, we should have accepted one of the offers. Hindsight.

 

[voyageur]

I think we are seeing confirmation of the notion that Arniel was playing Stanley because he wanted more size (and maybe truculence too) on the back end. He was willing to accept the downside to get it. Since acquiring Schenn, Stan has not played. Fleury has been just OK at 3LD but he has played 3 straight games.

Not sure how it might change if we had Pionk playing but I can't see the addition of another good Dman bringing Stan in. Logically it should only push him further down. But if Schenn is unable to play, or needs a rest, I'm pretty sure we see Stanley play.

If Pionk was healthy, I'd like to see Heini with Schenn.

I think PK is really important to Arniel. And he talked about how he didn't want Josh out against teams that shoot the puck well and hard. Fleury can skate and block shots. I think that's a good combination for staying in the lineup once Pionk comes back. Also probably gets him a contract next year.

I'd say there is still a chance that Heinola can achieve a higher ceiling than Stan with his skating.

But I don't see the Jets keeping Heinola and Miller as extra d-men next season with neither particularly effective on the PK. It's possible Heinola gets those reps that he got on the Moose and lets the Jets move on from Stan but I would say it's unlikely.

Especially if Salomonsson is there for depth to take a PP spot with injury.

 

[ps241]

If you are thinking that there’s not much difference between top 10 picks be picks in the second half of the 1st round, I doubt you will have too many agree with you.

Not trying to make that point but I leave open the idea I might be speaking in riddles a bit.

 

[TS Quint]

Not too long after Heinola was drafted (next year maybe?) rumour was that we were getting serious trade offers for him. Apparently he was highly regarded. Maybe it was the 8 game, 5 pt trial he had with the Jets right after the draft.

Whatever, we should have accepted one of the offers. Hindsight.

I can definitely see him being highly regarded at that point. He has some tools, especially as a young player that starts him off a good base. There’s a good reason he was a 1st round pick. He put up some points in Liiga in his draft year, looked decent vs the best of his age group in D+1.

 

[Howard Chuck]

So much has been done excellent with this team, that there are very few things to criticize, so this is probably my only beef this year. I think that Heinola could have been a far better Dman and Stanley with the same usage, and probably still could, but time has run out for tryouts this year. We are into the home stretch now.

 

[Mooche]

So much has been done excellent with this team, that there are very few things to criticize, so this is probably my only beef this year. I think that Heinola could have been a far better Dman and Stanley with the same usage, and probably still could, but time has run out for tryouts this year. We are into the home stretch now.

Well said.

I'm loving the fact that for the majority of the season the "hot button" issue for the Jets has been the 6-8 dman deployment.

Talk about good problems to have.

 

[ps241]

The Marcel Comeau era 2nd rd picks
Sutter
Petan Comrie
Harkins

Mark Hillier era 2nd rd picks
Samberg
Gustafsson
Lundmark
Torgersson
Chibrikov
Salomonsson
Freij

Comeau didn't get very many chances at the 2nd rd. Hillier has a couple of duds, but has done pretty well in the 2nd, considering pick placements. Not sure what this proves.

I think it does prove there is a randomness to the entire thing for sure. Samberg is great but after that I do think we need to hit on one of the other guys that looks promising. If Salomonsson can play top 4 minutes at a decent level at some point then point taken for sure. Gus is an asset that we could get on the waiver wire or in free agency in the summer so I don't count him as a hit (not sure your thoughts).

 

[cbcwpg]

My guess... he has asked for a trade or will be asking for a trade after the season ends.

6 seasons as a Jet and only 52 games played... he must know by now where he fits in to the Jets plans,

 

[robertocarlos]

As long as I'm getting PB popcorn and a per diem, I'd be happy.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think it does prove there is a randomness to the entire thing for sure. Samberg is great but after that I do think we need to hit on one of the other guys that looks promising. If Salomonsson can play top 4 minutes at a decent level at some point then point taken for sure. Gus is an asset that we could get on the waiver wire or in free agency in the summer so I don't count him as a hit (not sure your thoughts).

I have high expectations for Salomonsson.

I like Gus as a 13th man. I think he is just a bit better than waiver material. He would be a regular on a lot of teams not as deep as Jets. Decent skater, solid at 4C, solid defensively, a little physical. He might even have some offence with more TOI. Not a lot, but some.

I think Freij has top 4 potential, but still a long way to go. Better odds at being a good 3LD. Could still bust but I'm optimistic.

 

[Section 325]

My lone criticism of Chevy is that he frequently seems to get stuck with players in the press box instead of either playing in the NHL or with the Moose. That is probably really frustrating for the player and it greatly hinders their ability to grow. It probably makes them resentful of being in Winnipeg.

I don't really think that Heinola has turned out to be what they expected, but I also don't think he has been given enough of a chance to grow yet. He hasn't even played a full season (52 games total) so there is still plenty of runway for him to figure things out, but it is looking less and less likely as time goes on.

They could (should?) easily move him for somebody that fits the roster better.

 

[TS Quint]

My lone criticism of Chevy is that he frequently seems to get stuck with young players in the press box instead of either playing in the NHL or with the Moose. That is probably really frustrating for the player and it greatly hinders their ability to grow. It probably makes them resentful of being in Winnipeg.

I don't really think that Heinola has turned out to be what they expected, but I also don't think he has been given enough of a chance to grow yet. He hasn't even played a full season (52 games total) so there is still plenty of runway for him to figure things out, but it is looking less and less likely as time goes on.

They could (should?) easily move him for somebody that fits the roster better.

Who are your examples of young players stuck in the press box?

 

[sipowicz]

My lone criticism of Chevy is that he frequently seems to get stuck with young players in the press box instead of either playing in the NHL or with the Moose. That is probably really frustrating for the player and it greatly hinders their ability to grow. It probably makes them resentful of being in Winnipeg.

I don't really think that Heinola has turned out to be what they expected, but I also don't think he has been given enough of a chance to grow yet. He hasn't even played a full season (52 games total) so there is still plenty of runway for him to figure things out, but it is looking less and less likely as time goes on.

They could (should?) easily move him for somebody that fits the roster better.

At 24 he has stopped growing, he will remain tiny!