Proposal: Three Way Trade between ANA, WPG, and NYR

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Rangers could probably take stoner for this season, then use him as a 40/70 expansion candidate.

Yeah that's the only way it would work out for the Ducks and Murray.

 

[liquiduck]

Sorry, you got me before I edited. What if the rangers took back stoner? Fowler is playing great hockey, but everyone knows Lindholm is the better defenseman. Gotta give to get (capspace, in this example)

As of right now, I don't feel Lindholm is much better, if at all. The coaching staff last year certainly didn't feel like he was. Even if you want to say he is, it's not by enough to warrant giving Fowler away or including him in a cap dump deal.

 

[Ola]

OK, fine, what do you WPG fans ACTUALLY WANT back for Trouba?

Because all I can gather is you want Ghostisbere... I can't ever see that happening

I don't want to stir things up, but there is something I am missing in regards the "Zero room of improvements of Winnipeg" talk.

Where would people Rank the parts of their team?

Goaltending: T29-30th?

Blueline: 20-25? The left side is downright weak right now and they really have do not have much mobility on the right side.

LW: 15-20? Sure a ton of potential, but while Laine surely will become a stud there are some questionsmarks on how consistent of a scorer Ehlers will become and if Conner makes sense as a 3rd line LW.

Center: 10-15? Scheifele is a beast, and Little and Perrault fits really well in today's game. But offensively Scheifele is behind the best in the league and so forth.

RW: 22-26? Wheeler is spectacular in some situations, but don't cover a ton of ice and so forth. The rest are just serviceable.

And even if they have a lot of interesting kid, a significant part of their core don't have many years left/already is on the downside. Wheelers, Buff and Enstrom are 30-32 y/o and so forth. They lost Ladd.

I am definitely not saying that Winnipeg doesn't have a ton of things going for them and that they have a good shot at having a very exciting future. But -- honestly -- I just don't even remotely get the talk about their being zero room for improvement. Am I really off on some part of their team? What am I missing?

 

[Sojourn]

As of right now, I don't feel Lindholm is much better, if at all. The coaching staff last year certainly didn't feel like he was. Even if you want to say he is, it's not by enough to warrant giving Fowler away or including him in a cap dump deal.

I've always hated that argument anyway.

Player A is better, so move player B. Is there some rule against a team having more than one good defenseman? Isn't that part of what makes a good team? Having multiple good players? Should we move Kesler because we have Getzlaf? Rakell because we have Perry? Of course not. There are 60 minutes of ice time. Lindholm would likely account for, say, 23 or so minutes of it per game(he hasn't shown he can handle more, without wearing down). That leaves 37 minutes that need to be filled, and you would prefer that most of those minutes are filled with quality play.

 

[liquiduck]

I've always hated that argument anyway.

Player A is better, so move player B. Is there some rule against a team having more than one good defenseman? Isn't that part of what makes a good team? Having multiple good players? Should we move Kesler because we have Getzlaf? Rakell because we have Perry? Of course not. There are 60 minutes of ice time. Lindholm would likely account for, say, 23 or so minutes of it per game(he hasn't shown he can handle more, without wearing down). That leaves 37 minutes that need to be filled, and you would prefer that most of those minutes are filled with quality play.

Agreed. Although it wouldn't suprise me if Anaheim felt they couldn't fit both into their long term salary structure. Maybe the calculus changes if Fowler has a great year.

Tis definitely a interesting situation.

 

[Maukkis]

I don't want to stir things up, but there is something I am missing in regards the "Zero room of improvements of Winnipeg" talk.

Where would people Rank the parts of their team?

Goaltending: T29-30th?

Blueline: 20-25? The left side is downright weak right now and they really have do not have much mobility on the right side.

LW: 15-20? Sure a ton of potential, but while Laine surely will become a stud there are some questionsmarks on how consistent of a scorer Ehlers will become and if Conner makes sense as a 3rd line LW.

Center: 10-15? Scheifele is a beast, and Little and Perrault fits really well in today's game. But offensively Scheifele is behind the best in the league and so forth.

RW: 22-26? Wheeler is spectacular in some situations, but don't cover a ton of ice and so forth. The rest are just serviceable.

And even if they have a lot of interesting kid, a significant part of their core don't have many years left/already is on the downside. Wheelers, Buff and Enstrom are 30-32 y/o and so forth. They lost Ladd.

I am definitely not saying that Winnipeg doesn't have a ton of things going for them and that they have a good shot at having a very exciting future. But -- honestly -- I just don't even remotely get the talk about their being zero room for improvement. Am I really off on some part of their team? What am I missing?

You're missing our entire prospect pool. Strong at forward, reasonably strong at goalie, weak at defense. You're missing the expansion draft. No room at additional bodies to protect at forward, no room for another goalie to protect. Defense? Well... there's one spot, if Trouba is traded. You're missing the fact that the team is trying to exit the rebuild. It's kind of helpful to not ice a roster full of rookies to achieve that. You're also missing the fact that Trouba's trade request was left months and months ago. Do you think that defensemen and defensemen only have been offered? I don't. Many have probably tried offering forwards, prospects and picks - with no success.

You'd better look at the team and ask "why hasn't Trouba moved yet?" Well, the simple reason would be that there hasn't been a good enough offer yet. Then, you could think what should be offered - in other words, what the team needs the most. That's where it gets obvious. A proven top 4 defenseman. It's the only piece we can add without screwing up in the expansion draft, while still improving the team.

Is that really so hard to grasp?

 

[Ola]

You're missing our entire prospect pool. Strong at forward, reasonably strong at goalie, weak at defense. You're missing the expansion draft. No room at additional bodies to protect at forward, no room for another goalie to protect. Defense? Well... there's one spot, if Trouba is traded. You're missing the fact that the team is trying to exit the rebuild. It's kind of helpful to not ice a roster full of rookies to achieve that. You're also missing the fact that Trouba's trade request was left months and months ago. Do you think that defensemen and defensemen only have been offered? I don't. Many have probably tried offering forwards, prospects and picks - with no success.

You'd better look at the team and ask "why hasn't Trouba moved yet?" Well, the simple reason would be that there hasn't been a good enough offer yet. Then, you could think what should be offered - in other words, what the team needs the most. That's where it gets obvious. A proven top 4 defenseman. It's the only piece we can add without screwing up in the expansion draft, while still improving the team.

Is that really so hard to grasp?

Sorry, I don't really understand big parts of your post, but I will try to reply to the parts I understand.

The fact that you have to protect players in the expansion draft is completely irrelevant. Many are claiming that there is zero room to upgrade Winnipeg and that they really have no needs. Whereas I see a roster that more or less need help in every single area, albeit I wouldn't start with center. But this roster is not really strong in any area (I would put the centers at 10-15 in the league with a healthy Little), and goaltending and defense is from my POV at the bottom of the league. RW is iffy at best. Significant parts of the core is getting old and starting to enter the downside of their careers, Enstrom, Buff and co.

The expansion draft is probably the least of Winnipegs problems, how many players on the current roster is even worth protecting. Upgrade the players that you currently plan to protect.

From my POV, Trouba has a ton of potential. That is why he hasn't been traded. Very few teams has cap room, the expansion draft makes it hard for teams to take on players, all teams are not in the running to start with. After that, few teams has value that they would consider moving that is equal to what Trouba is worth. I also think a few teams out there are waiting out the situation to see if the price will come down. It's not an easy situation for anyone.

So you will never see me talk about how you should accept this or that offer for Trouba. He has a ton of value and when traded, my bet is that someone will end up paying a ransom for him. BUT I just do not like understand the talk about there being "zero room for improvement" of Winnipeg. I just don't. And no, I am not disregarding your farm. If you want to give me a honest shot, fill out the ranking I did above with where Winnipeg ranks in the league in different areas, and then do it again where you predict where Winnipeg will be when all kids have arrived as well as the vets has regressed. It do t add up.

Winnipeg has a -- ton -- of things going for them, hands down. But I am sorry, I just don't agree with the talk that you have zero needs. I am not trying to stir something up, I just don't agree with it.