Rumor: Things Not Left Unsaid 3 - Flyers Rumors and Media Mentions: Never Ending Circles

[FlyerNutter]

He took out the trash.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Torts a moron.

 

[Lord Defect]

Happy Briere hasn't done anything.
Some GMs aren't happy unless they're constantly making moves, many of which backfire.
I'd rather he'd be patient and wait for the right deal.

Realistically, few deals will be made between now and March.
I mean the biggest deal was San Jose and Colorado swapping essentially backup goalies?

 

[Adam Warlock]

Happy Briere hasn't done anything.
Some GMs aren't happy unless they're constantly making moves, many of which backfire.
I'd rather he'd be patient and wait for the right deal.

Realistically, few deals will be made between now and March.
I mean the biggest deal was San Jose and Colorado swapping essentially backup goalies?

But what exactly is "the plan?".

If its to compete with guys like TK, Couts, and Sanheim as major contributors... then they need to fill hole sooner rather than later. The guys they draft in 2025 are probably 4-5 years at least away from contributing... so he needs to make some kind of a move soon.

If theres no time limit...then why resign TK at all?

Its the lack of a clear plan thats frustrating. It just seems like their only focus is "culture"

 

[deadhead]

But what exactly is "the plan?".

If its to compete with guys like TK, Couts, and Sanheim as major contributors... then they need to fill hole sooner rather than later. The guys they draft in 2025 are probably 4-5 years at least away from contributing... so he needs to make some kind of a move soon.

If theres no time limit...then why resign TK at all?

Its the lack of a clear plan thats frustrating. It just seems like their only focus is "culture"

The 1st rd picks should be 2-3 years away, which is why I think they're still targeting the 2027-28 season. 2nd rd picks might take 4-5 years, but they're mostly bottom six depth anyway.

2025-26: Jett starts, Bonk, Barkey, Sotheran, Bjarnason, maybe Knuble, Bump in AHL to start the season.
2026-27: The guys with a year in the AHL compete for jobs, Gill et al in AHL.
2027-28: First rd picks from 2025 start the season in the AHL if they don't win jobs in camp

As they build up proven depth, the option for a consolidation trade will present itself (a starter, a prospect and a draft pick, for example)..

Key this season is to watch Frost and Cates lines, if they can sustain this play, then next year Jett at center, Couts moves to LW. Draft/trade for more centers. Eventually Poehling leaves, Cates to 4C . . .

 

[renberg]

The 1st rd picks should be 2-3 years away, which is why I think they're still targeting the 2027-28 season. 2nd rd picks might take 4-5 years, but they're mostly bottom six depth anyway.

2025-26: Jett starts, Bonk, Barkey, Sotheran, Bjarnason, maybe Knuble, Bump in AHL to start the season.
2026-27: The guys with a year in the AHL compete for jobs, Gill et al in AHL.
2027-28: First rd picks from 2025 start the season in the AHL if they don't win jobs in camp

As they build up proven depth, the option for a consolidation trade will present itself (a starter, a prospect and a draft pick, for example)..

Key this season is to watch Frost and Cates lines, if they can sustain this play, then next year Jett at center, Couts moves to LW. Draft/trade for more centers. Eventually Poehling leaves, Cates to 4C .

This was the season to push for a low draft position. There are several quality future center ice prospects. As a result of allowing Tortorella to push for the POs, the club will finish middle of the pack and not have the draft position that they need for the future. We saw June's draft that clubs will not trade out of the top five slots or even the top ten. There won't be any quality young centers coming to play for the Flyers in three or four years.

 

[Adam Warlock]

The 1st rd picks should be 2-3 years away, which is why I think they're still targeting the 2027-28 season. 2nd rd picks might take 4-5 years, but they're mostly bottom six depth anyway.

2025-26: Jett starts, Bonk, Barkey, Sotheran, Bjarnason, maybe Knuble, Bump in AHL to start the season.
2026-27: The guys with a year in the AHL compete for jobs, Gill et al in AHL.
2027-28: First rd picks from 2025 start the season in the AHL if they don't win jobs in camp

As they build up proven depth, the option for a consolidation trade will present itself (a starter, a prospect and a draft pick, for example)..

Key this season is to watch Frost and Cates lines, if they can sustain this play, then next year Jett at center, Couts moves to LW. Draft/trade for more centers. Eventually Poehling leaves, Cates to 4C . . .

So by 2028-2029...you have prime Michkov with over the hill old players like TK, Sanheim, and Coots....and a bunch of young kids who are in the league but still a few years away form their prime?

I just dont see how thats building a winning team.

They have obvious holes and if the answer to filling them is through the draft, then they needed to move on from some vets bc this is gonna take a lot longer. Remember just bc a guy is the nhl at 21, doesnt mean hes contributing the way they need him too. Bonk may be a solid top 4 dman on a cup contender, but he may not got there until 25-26 years old.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I think if Torts gave a detailed answer, it would go something like this:

"The Michigan really isn't any different than a wrap around shot, there might be a little more space higher up with some goalies who don't hug the post, but also harder to control the puck with this play. And how often are wrap around shots successful? How often do you lose possession? Whereas if you look for a scoring opportunity you might find a teammate with a better shot angle. Or if Michkov can move a few feet he can open up a "bad" angle shot, which he's shown is only a bad angle for mere mortals."

These plays are really plays of opportunity, once in a while you'll catch a goalie being lazy or slow to get over and take him by surprise, but they won't work on a regular basis. But it's not a bad idea for a player as skilled as Michkov (no Brink, you're not elite) to try it simply b/c it puts it in the back of the mind of the goalie and the nearest D-man, which may open up a passing or skating lane if they try to take it away.

I expect Michkov to eventually make it work, and Torts will probably be rolling with laughter.
Anyone else tries it and they'll probably be benched for good reason.

He told us exactly what he thinks, numerous times. He hasn't been an enigma on this kind of thing. You aren't clarifying you are obfuscating.

 

[deadhead]

2028-29:
Jett (22), Michkov (23), Brink (27), Foerster (27), Farabee (28), Tippett (29), Frost (29), Cates (29), TK (31), Couts (36)
Bonk (23), Andrae (26), Drysdale (26), York (28), Zamula (28), Sanheim (32)
Kolosov (27), Ersson (29)

Longer shots:
Berglund (22), Barkey (23), Knuble (24), Ciernak (24), Tuomaala (25), Bump (25), Rizzo (27)
Gill (22), Sotheran (23), Samson (25), McDonald (26), Grans (26)
Zavragin (23), Bjarnason (23)

 

[Adam Warlock]

2028-29:
Jett (22), Michkov (23), Brink (27), Foerster (27), Farabee (28), Tippett (29), Frost (29), Cates (29), TK (31), Couts (36)
Bonk (23), Andrae (26), Drysdale (26), York (28), Zamula (28), Sanheim (32)
Kolosov (27), Ersson (29)

Longer shots:
Berglund (22), Barkey (23), Knuble (24), Ciernak (24), Tuomaala (25), Bump (25), Rizzo (27)
Gill (22), Sotheran (23), Samson (25), McDonald (26), Grans (26)
Zavragin (23), Bjarnason (23)

You honestly think thats a cup contending roster?????

Its basically what they have now. Itd be running it back for the next 5 years except for the occasional rookie breaking in. That would he completely unacceptable.

 

[Beef Invictus]

2028-29:
Jett (22), Michkov (23), Brink (27), Foerster (27), Farabee (28), Tippett (29), Frost (29), Cates (29), TK (31), Couts (36)
Bonk (23), Andrae (26), Drysdale (26), York (28), Zamula (28), Sanheim (32)
Kolosov (27), Ersson (29)

Longer shots:
Berglund (22), Barkey (23), Knuble (24), Ciernak (24), Tuomaala (25), Bump (25), Rizzo (27)
Gill (22), Sotheran (23), Samson (25), McDonald (26), Grans (26)
Zavragin (23), Bjarnason (23)

Looks pretty awful

 

[deadhead]

We'll see. Point is other than Couts, don't see anyone aging out the next five years, that gives you time to get some additional players and build up depth to eventually replace players next decade.

That's a solid base given (3) 1sts, (3) 2nds in 2025, 1st and 2nd in 2026 and whatever they get in trade for Laughton and Risto.

Which long shots emerge?

But if you have a surplus forward or two, a surplus goalie, etc. you can put together a nice package targeting a top level player.

 

[FlyerNutter]

More exciting lineup at the checkout line for Wal Mart.

 

[Tripod]

If it's one thing the Flyers do, is have long shots emerge.

 

[Beef Invictus]

We'll see. Point is other than Couts, don't see anyone aging out the next five years, that gives you time to get some additional players and build up depth to eventually replace players next decade.

That's a solid base given (3) 1sts, (3) 2nds in 2025, 1st and 2nd in 2026 and whatever they get in trade for Laughton and Risto.

Which long shots emerge?

But if you have a surplus forward or two, a surplus goalie, etc. you can put together a nice package targeting a top level player.

Aging out isn't a problem compared to a fundamental lack of talent

 

[Kelmitchell2]

Happy Briere hasn't done anything.
Some GMs aren't happy unless they're constantly making moves, many of which backfire.
I'd rather he'd be patient and wait for the right deal.

Realistically, few deals will be made between now and March.
I mean the biggest deal was San Jose and Colorado swapping essentially backup goalies?

Blackwood has looked like an elite goalie all season, Georgie boy has looked like micheal Leighton

 

[freakydallas13]

Aging out isn't a problem compared to a fundamental lack of talent

I mean, aging out could become a problem for players like Sanheim or Konecny. Sanheim will be 29 in March, which means in 5 years he'll be 34.

I'm sure he'll age pretty well, but will almost undoubtedly be worse at that point than he is now.

Konecny is more concerning to me, I'm not as confident he'll still be close to as good as he is now when he's 33.

 

[kudymen]

Looks pretty awful

I mean. He did this regularly in the past. Listing a "in 5 years" lineup with "Myers will be 26, Laberge will be 25, JOB will pan out and will be 24 by then" ... eh. Nothing new. Again.

 

[Curufinwe]

Buying out Angelo right away was the right move. The guy was hockey herpes.

 

[ybnvs]

We'll see. Point is other than Couts, don't see anyone aging out the next five years, that gives you time to get some additional players and build up depth to eventually replace players next decade.

More depth? Nah. Why do the Flyers want to acquire more depth? They are up to their necks in depth players.

They need more top-end talent on the roster. You know, to actually be the difference makers and open an actual window for contention with Michkov.

 

[renberg]

Buying out Angelo right away was the right move. The guy was hockey herpes.

Acquiring him to begin with was the original sin. It’s not like it wasn’t known what he was both on and off the ice. Obtaining him was just another symptom of the incompetence in the organization.

 

[deadhead]

More depth? Nah. Why do the Flyers want to acquire more depth? They are up to their necks in depth players.

They need more top-end talent on the roster. You know, to actually be the difference makers and open an actual window for contention with Michkov.

The value of depth is trades.

Major trades tend to be 1 or 2 starters, a solid prospect and a draft pick for a top 6/top 4 guy.
Partially to match salaries, partially because the other team has numerous holes to fill (which is why they're making a trade for volume).

Younger starters (in their 20s) will have more value in trades.

Also, if you want to play a Carolina style of hockey, you want the depth to go 4 lines, 3 pairs and roll them, with players going full speed every shift instead of gliding.

 

[FlyerNutter]

When I think of an organization that’s done well in trades, and pro talent evaluation in the last decade.

I definitely think of the Philadelphia Flyers

We will trade up for Demidov any day now

 

[Beef Invictus]

The value of depth is trades.

Major trades tend to be 1 or 2 starters, a solid prospect and a draft pick for a top 6/top 4 guy.
Partially to match salaries, partially because the other team has numerous holes to fill (which is why they're making a trade for volume).

Younger starters (in their 20s) will have more value in trades.

Also, if you want to play a Carolina style of hockey, you want the depth to go 4 lines, 3 pairs and roll them, with players going full speed every shift instead of gliding.

They lose trades, and certainly don't trade depth away if they can help it.

If you want Carolina style hockey you flood the roster with talent. That's how you build depth. You don't sell out on shitty grinders. You win in the margins with guys like Ghost, instead of attaching yourself first and foremost to the Laughtons and Seelers and Hathaways of the league.


Btw, you and the Flyers both have an inability to assess players like Ghost or Frost, and that's a major reason why both of you are wrong so often

 

[deadhead]

If they can't "win" trades (really, most of the time break even, steals are rare, only so many idiots to go around) or draft well, it doesn't matter what strategy they take.

Look at the Rangers, they missed on #2, #7, #9, if Panarin and Fox didn't force their way to NY, and Shesterkin was the lottery pick 4th rd goalie, they'd be a bottom ten feeder indefinitely.
Or Detroit, or Buffalo, or . . .

The strategy is less important than the implementation.
Briere had a big win in his first major trade, Provorov & 5th and two salary dumps (Peterson, Johansen) for CBJ 1st, Colorado 1st, (2) 2nds and Grans.
Hasn't lost anyone of value

We'll see about the Gauthier deal, if they can turn around Drysdale, it's a solid deal (they also have Anaheim's 2nd, which is looking like a top 40 pick).
Gaither so far is nothing special, 29g 2-6 8 (ES) which prorates to 23 points.
We'll see how he progresses, but right now he's looking like a less physical version of Tippett.
Big fast volume shooter who's an adventure defensively.

Current draft position:
#13 (PHL), #18 (Col), #24 (Edm), #38 (Ana), #40 (CBJ), #45 (PHL)