The Truth about Phil Kessel

[Thebolt*]

.Each one of them contain multiple responses such as "hes overpaid" "his conditioning is horrible" "hes bad defensively" "65 point winger". All of which are incorrect.

He does not have bad condioning, he tales a medication to treat for his cancer that he was diagnosed with in 2006. The side effects of his medication cause him to get fatter but not weigh more. Yes I understand he may not be making an effort to get slimmer but, to be that fast and rarely miss a game and for people to say he has bad conditioning is just insanely stupid. To be called 65 point winger is just stupid

You dont base a player by his worst season. Because the I guess Ovi is a 32 goal scorer and Kane is a 66 point winger, you could do that for everybody and the you compare him to your players best season is just the stupidest thing people on here do. I know he is bad defensively but if the Leafs got him a good center like Staal or Thornton one that could take pressure off Kessel he wouldnt nor would the Leafs be in this position. Kane is just as bad defensively as Kessel but he has the best defensive in the league and has either Hossa,Toews or Richards with him to back him up. There are so many good forwards that arent great defensively. Look at Ovi until Trotz came and guided him he was terrible defensively. Once Babcock works with Kessel he will have the same turnaround as Ovi.

I know its a lot to read but I just want people to stop underrating Kessels abilities. Hes one of the top players in the league and I bet you at least 20GMs are interested in acquiring him,the fans may not want him but they dont run the team. And the price that will be announced will certainly be more than what people are trying to propose. He is definitely worth a top prospect, top 10 draft pick and a good roster player.

I know im going to get ripped apart for this but for His value to acquire him its going to cost Lindholm + 5th overall + Semin + Liles if Carolina tbh. His value is definitely a lot more than 45th overall + Ferland + Poirer maybe if they add Bennett than it cpuld be close but no way

Edit: Thanks oheyithemsky for the advice

Click to read more...

 

[kk87]

Pretty accurate post for the most part, I agree with most of it. Lindholm and 5th OA is brutal for Carolina, but I see where you're coming from... he's not getting the respect he deserves.

 

[Thebolt*]

I also understand you may not want to pay the price required but doesn't mean you send a low ball offer back

 

[johan f]

The thing is, Kessel is not good. I rather have a decent scorer playing well in all months against all teams than a Kessel who disappears against good defense and in important games. He plays like he is alone on ice.

 

[Thebolt*]

The thing is, Kessel is not good. I rather have a decent scorer playing well in all months against all teams than a Kessel who disappears against good defense and in important games. He plays like he is alone on ice.

Not good? He literally carries what line he plays on and manages close to ppg stats. Id like to see what guys like Kane and Benn do on the Leafs instead of Kessel

 

[Swervin81]

The thing is, Kessel is not good. I rather have a decent scorer playing well in all months against all teams than a Kessel who disappears against good defense and in important games. He plays like he is alone on ice.

Kessel has 21 points in 22 career playoff games, well above his regular season averages, so it's not like he disappears. Matter of fact, it's the only time he bothers showing up consistently. His defense and lack of playing anywhere else but the offensive zone is unacceptable, though. His backchecking is so lazy he makes one great backcheck stick lift every 10 or so games and we're all like "wait, he just did that?".

And yeah, I do think Kessel has a lot more value league wide than people seem to think just because of how low scoring is in today's game, let alone how talented he is.

 

[PB37]

Players get labeled not by their worst season, but for a myriad of different reasons; Usually, the main being where fans/media see a player normally produce. Kessel seems to usually be a 30 goal scorer/65ish point offensive winger. While he's great offensively, there's a lot left to be desired about the rest of his game.

Kessel would work best being on a team that had pieces in place to make a solid run. I don't think he's a franchise player and I don't think he's go-to type of guy. He just doesn't have what it takes, both on and off the ice.

 

[hamzarocks]

Not good? He literally carries what line he plays on and manages close to ppg stats. Id like to see what guys like Kane and Benn do on the Leafs instead of Kessel

unfortunately we wont ever know, this is why i want phil to get traded to eithe rthe jackets or panthers, their he will be able to take over offensively with quality center, wingers, and good dmen, if he played for the hawks people would be loving him just like they do with kane.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I agree with everything except the return. Im thinking a heatley like return. It depends how badly they want to move him though

Also explain wtf happened this year where he just went ice cold. Ive never seen a star player get so cold before in my life. Espeically not a guy making like ten mil in real cash


I think people assume he will produce great but he shouldnt be the it guy or best paid player on a team. Problem is his salary makes him the default it guy

 

[snizzbone*]

The thing is, Kessel is not good. I rather have a decent scorer playing well in all months against all teams than a Kessel who disappears against good defense and in important games. He plays like he is alone on ice.

13 goals 21 points in 23 NHL Playoff games
43 points in 26 Team USA Junior tournaments
15 goals, 19 points in 35 Team USA Senior tournaments

Past four seasons (FEB+MAR+APR [MAR/APR only in 2013]):

2011-2012
31 points
32 games

2012-2013
36 points
26 games

2013-2014
23 points
26 games

2014-2015
16 points
30 games

This past year is the only example of him not performing late in the season. And it wasn't entirely him. It was the entire team who just stopped playing. Literally maybe a few guys looked like they were even trying from January on.

Kessel seems to usually be a 30 goal scorer/65ish point offensive winger.

Kessel since joining Toronto

09-10 (21 years old)
30 goals 55 points in 70 games

10-11
32 goals 64 points

11-12
37 goals 82 points

12-13
20 goals 52 points in 48 games

13-14
37 goals 80 points

14-15
25 goals 61 points (was PPG until Carlyle firing, entire team collapsed)

 

[dubey]

The thing is, Kessel is not good.

Not good lol

http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/seasons/last-4-nhl-seasons-players-stats.html

 

[ohheyhemsky]

HFboards pro tip:

Use paragraphs dude. It just makes for an easier read.

 

[Thebolt*]

I agree with everything except the return. Im thinking a heatley like return. It depends how badly they want to move him though

Also explain wtf happened this year where he just went ice cold. Ive never seen a star player get so cold before in my life. Espeically not a guy making like ten mil in real cash

Get a young Hossa would be amazing for them.

 

[Stephen]

He does not have bad condioning, he tales a medication to treat for his cancer that he was diagnosed with in 2006. The side effects of his medication cause him to get fatter but not weigh more.

I don't think you should be speculating on his medications.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

Get a young Hossa would be amazing for them.

heatley to san jose

So a michalek pre tons a injuries(really good prospect/solid young player)
Late to mid first
uncertain piece that might bounce back

I think people also make a fair point when they say he shouldnt return what he was first traded for.

 

[Thebolt*]

I agree with everything except the return. Im thinking a heatley like return. It depends how badly they want to move him though

Also explain wtf happened this year where he just went ice cold. Ive never seen a star player get so cold before in my life. Espeically not a guy making like ten mil in real cash

Tbh the whole team bailed out early, and O think he just lost all his confidence but there were a few game down the stretch where he was amazing and took over like the Ottawa game and there were 3 or 4 more.

 

[Passchendaele]

Kessel is not a "winner" per-se. You won't win with Kessel as the head of your franchise, which is why the Leafs should trade him, because he can't be used in a secondary role at 8 millions per season.

 

[gamer1035]

I tried to read that wall, but I couldn't.

Regardless, Kessel is underrated on these boards immensely, that will instantly change if he is traded.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

I tried to read that wall, but I couldn't.

Regardless, Kessel is underrated on these boards immensely, that will instantly change if he is traded.

You should read it. Speaks the truth

 

[Stephen]

The truth is Kessel wants to play the game his own way, which is an incredibly high skill, high speed, offensive minded game that sadly doesn't always jive with the way successful teams play. I think he's got pride in his game but he's also incredibly stubborn and unable to see the bigger team picture beyond out running and out gunning your troubles, which creates a vicious cycle of sloppy play.

I also think he tends to abuse his abundant natural gifts. He is naturally explosive but he doesn't put in the time or effort to up his conditioning, so he's basically a "deliver the payload" kind of guy who doesn't have the endurance or will to engage physically or win key puck battles.

At the end of the day, I'd rather see him go to another team and score 30 goals and 80 points his way and have the cap space and good future assets back than to risk him spiraling into oblivion and being a complete waste of cap for the next seven years. I don't care for the way he approaches the game.

Times up.

 

[Thebolt*]

heatley to san jose

So a michalek pre tons a injuries(really good prospect/solid young player)
Late to mid first
uncertain piece that might bounce back

I think people also make a fair point when they say he shouldnt return what he was first traded for.

I remember he got cheechoo who had a couple of 50 goal years and Michalek which isnt bad but Heatley barely gave Ottawa anything to work with he blocked a trade to almost everybody, I think Kessel will be more open. He hasnt demanded anything yet and I truly think that hes a good lockeroom guy he might not be the guy that should be leading your team but I gaind tons of respect for him when he stood up for Dion that took guts especially to say that in a market like Toronto. I dont get where this stuff about him being a cancer comes from

 

[Rebuilt]

I tend to judge players not on what his devotional fans are saying about him. Its what they are NOT saying about him. Not one single part of any post on here from his defenders mentions a fairly major part of any players trade value.

His age and his contract.

He is 28 years old and due to be paid 8 million dollars for 7 long years. Did I mention EIGHT million? No star players are better at 34 than they were at 28 . Few are better at 30 than they were at 28.

Even when discussing his past seasons, most ignore this past season, and those who do address it immediately make excuses for it. Blaming it on other players, the coach or whatever.

When you are a GM, you need to look at your team from a 1 year 2 year 5 year and beyond point of view. Kessel is going to end up just like Dany Heatly, Mike Richards , Thomas Vanek and others . Its just of matter of when.

So, realisitically, he will be worth a player making 8 mil for 3 more years. 28,29,30. After that he will have negative value compared to his salary. How does a contending team deal with cap hell?

They trade at a discount or put players on waivers.

Go ask the Kings , Hawks and Bruins how they felt about it.

I want you all to keep this in mind when discussing Kessel trade value and stop hyping past years of glory that have nothing to do with who he is today. Those years were enjoyed by Leaf fans . You cant re sell them to other teams.

 

[Thebolt*]

I made a post about a month ago on the Leafs board about Kessel and it got deleted within two minutes because it might have sounded too offensive.

tldr: Kessel is not a "winner" per-se. You won't win with Kessel as the head of your franchise, which is why the Leafs should trade him, because he can't be used in a secondary role at 8 millions per season.

Why not Malkin,Kane, and many more secondary type playes will be making as much or more than him soon.

 

[Jtown]

kessel is in the wrong era. If this were the 90's he would basically be a version of brett hull , obviously not to that degree. But in this era where you need to be a strong 2 way player to win he really leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[Thebolt*]

I tend to judge players not on what his devotional fans are saying about him. Its what they are NOT saying about him. Not one single part of any post on here from his defenders mentions a fairly major part of any players trade value.

His age and his contract.

He is 28 years old and due to be paid 8 million dollars for 7 long years. Did I mention EIGHT million? No star players are better at 34 than they were at 28 . Few are better at 30 than they were at 28.

Even when discussing his past seasons, most ignore this past season, and those who do address it immediately make excuses for it. Blaming it on other players, the coach or whatever.

When you are a GM, you need to look at your team from a 1 year 2 year 5 year and beyond point of view. Kessel is going to end up just like Dany Heatly, Mike Richards , Thomas Vanek and others . Its just of matter of when.

So, realisitically, he will be worth a player making 8 mil for 3 more years. 28,29,30. After that he will have negative value compared to his salary. How does a contending team deal with cap hell?

They trade at a discount or put players on waivers.

Go ask the Kings , Hawks and Bruins how they felt about it.

I want you all to keep this in mind when discussing Kessel trade value and stop hyping past years of glory that have nothing to do with who he is today. Those years were enjoyed by Leaf fans . You cant re sell them to other teams.

He will have less than 2 years at the most when he declines to the point where hes just a roster spot that cant be swnt down. He has yet to decline unless you look at his stats even though the who leagues stats declined.