TV: The Sopranos Discussion Thread

[tarheelhockey]

Yeah, so if anyone's interested in see the prequel movie, don't. Total piece of shit. Mostly focusses on Dickie Moltisanti, utterly wastes Jon Bernthal as Johnny Boy Soprano, adds nothing to the overall story, and all the characters from the show are basically played by parodies of themselves.

Well that's damned disappointing. Sopranos is definitely one of those franchises that could have a "universe" involving pre-show and post-show events. Guess they weren't going for a world-building sort of production.

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Well that's damned disappointing. Sopranos is definitely one of those franchises that could have a "universe" involving pre-show and post-show events. Guess they weren't going for a world-building sort of production.

It gives the backstory of Dickie Moltisanti in the months before his whacking, not that it amounts to much. Like I said in the movie review thread, I won't spoil the ending but if the character who ultimately killed him was anywhere near as ruthless and touchy in the show as he was in the movie, Tony's entire crew would've been worm food before the end of the first season.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

It gives the backstory of Dickie Moltisanti in the months before his whacking, not that it amounts to much. Like I said in the movie review thread, I won't spoil the ending but if the character who ultimately killed him was anywhere near as ruthless and touchy in the show as he was in the movie, Tony's entire crew would've been worm food before the end of the first season.

Spoiler

 

[Baby Punisher]

Ray Liotta was awesome!

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Spoiler

There's a big difference between that and ordering the hit of a made guy.

And it was just so lame generally. After everything going on in the movie, *that* was what got Moltisanti killed? Lame.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

There's a big difference between that and ordering the hit of a made guy.

And it was just so lame generally. After everything going on in the movie, *that* was what got Moltisanti killed? Lame.

But you said he wasnt touchy or ruthless like that in the show, he clearly was

 

[Phil McKraken]

The Sopranos sometimes had surprisingly low production values for being such a big and prestigious show. The editing in this scene is just terrible once he steps up to the car.



"You come here too?". Cut to Buscemi already aiming his gun and shooting. That's not how you build tension or shoot a quick action scene.

And then the car rolls over his foot and crashes with no sound.

 

[Baby Punisher]

The Sopranos sometimes had surprisingly low production values for being such a big and prestigious show. The editing in this scene is just terrible once he steps up to the car.



"You come here too?". Cut to Buscemi already aiming his gun and shooting. That's not how you build tension or shoot a quick action scene.

And then the car rolls over his foot and crashes with no sound.

I always wondered about that. The only thing I can think of was that they lost the cut they were going to use and had to use outtakes from other takes, or the rehearsal and dubbed in the lines afterward.

 

[kook10]

I always wondered about that. The only thing I can think of was that they lost the cut they were going to use and had to use outtakes from other takes, or the rehearsal and dubbed in the lines afterward.

If I had to guess, they probably didn't have a good shot of the car rolling over his foot on the main shooting day. They would have had to go back and get an insert shot with a b-unit and something with the audio happened on that. Either it didn't match, was lost, or who knows? An insert wouldn't have been Steve Buscemi so maybe he wasn't available for looping?

David Chase oversaw every edit, so I am sure it was "good enough". He loved his soundtracks, so I don't think it was the only time he pulled back audio for a song, but it was definitely off. Since he was so intimately involved with everything there was also a strong possibility that with limited time between writing, shooting, and editing, that he had limited time in the edit was just backed up against the wall for a delivery date to get the episode on air for Sunday night.

I just came across another example of this in Cold Cuts. I don't recall any other wipe transitions, so it seems really weird. Maybe it was again just a temp cut that was forced to air for lack of time?

 

[Richard]

People are severely overlooking the fact that David Chase just liked to do weird shit.

 

[Richard]

People are severely overlooking the fact that David Chase just liked to do weird shit.

 

[tarheelhockey]

The Sopranos sometimes had surprisingly low production values for being such a big and prestigious show.

It's also easy to forget that it existed at a weird intersection in time when cable networks weren't producing high-quality shows. The Sopranos was a lot higher quality of a production than anything else on HBO/Showtime/etc, but not even close to the quality of stuff now on Netflix etc.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

It's also easy to forget that it existed at a weird intersection in time when cable networks weren't producing high-quality shows. The Sopranos was a lot higher quality of a production than anything else on HBO/Showtime/etc, but not even close to the quality of stuff now on Netflix etc.

This, Sopranos (and The Wire) were made when TV budgets were small, even on HBO. TV was seen as a lower form of media to movies then and funded as such

 

[kook10]

It's also easy to forget that it existed at a weird intersection in time when cable networks weren't producing high-quality shows. The Sopranos was a lot higher quality of a production than anything else on HBO/Showtime/etc, but not even close to the quality of stuff now on Netflix etc.

Not necessarily at first. The first season was relatively low budget and production value. That said - the same basic production team had to quickly figure out how to produce higher quality and bigger budget shows as they went along, which wasn't without challenges. It was a NYC show in a time when Law and Order was the only real thing in town so the pool of experienced, big budget production crew was very small.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Not necessarily at first. The first season was relatively low budget and production value. That said - the same basic production team had to quickly figure out how to produce higher quality and bigger budget shows as they went along, which wasn't without challenges. It was a NYC show in a time when Law and Order was the only real thing in town so the pool of experienced, big budget production crew was very small.

When you think about it that way, it was a pretty intelligently produced show. No big set pieces, no crazy special effects. 90% of it is people sitting around in a room, talking and eating. The other 10% is blunt-force murder. That's something you can actually pull off on a low budget. Much like Law & Order, the whole thing is carried by snappy dialogue and memorable characters rather than spectacle.

I may be forgetting something, but IIRC the only scenes that required really getting out into the world and doing big-budget production would have been the boat scenes, Paris, and maybe the carnival. Everything else was just houses, restaurants, sidewalks, interior of car, etc.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

When you think about it that way, it was a pretty intelligently produced show. No big set pieces, no crazy special effects. 90% of it is people sitting around in a room, talking and eating. The other 10% is blunt-force murder. That's something you can actually pull off on a low budget. Much like Law & Order, the whole thing is carried by snappy dialogue and memorable characters rather than spectacle.

I may be forgetting something, but IIRC the only scenes that required really getting out into the world and doing big-budget production would have been the boat scenes, Paris, and maybe the carnival. Everything else was just houses, restaurants, sidewalks, interior of car, etc.

The helicopter scene must have cost a ton. And Italy too, I guess.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

This, Sopranos (and The Wire) were made when TV budgets were small, even on HBO. TV was seen as a lower form of media to movies then and funded as such

I'm not too sure about The Wire, but I'd venture to guess that The Sopranos got a major boost in funding as the series went along. They blew up really, really fast. At any rate, what would be looking at? Mad Men/Boardwalk Empire as the first series to have big budgets? That seems way too recent, but maybe?

 

[kook10]

When you think about it that way, it was a pretty intelligently produced show. No big set pieces, no crazy special effects. 90% of it is people sitting around in a room, talking and eating. The other 10% is blunt-force murder. That's something you can actually pull off on a low budget. Much like Law & Order, the whole thing is carried by snappy dialogue and memorable characters rather than spectacle.

I may be forgetting something, but IIRC the only scenes that required really getting out into the world and doing big-budget production would have been the boat scenes, Paris, and maybe the carnival. Everything else was just houses, restaurants, sidewalks, interior of car, etc.

At the core of it I think you are mostly right. The Bing, the Soprano house and Satriale's interiors were on the stage. Satriale's exterior was in Kearny, so the major sets were all pretty contained and nearby. I think modern "big budget" is thought of more like stunts and FX, but it was more of a practical show.

That said, it was a very expensive show in the end. Obviously most of it is cast salary inflation, but they went to Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Upstate NY, Jersey Shore, Florida and Italy too. They also had more nearby and overnight locations and night shoots in NJ and upstate. That's longer days, more hotels, cranes, balloon lights, etc. Car crashes, big crowd scenes - carnivals, funerals, protests, nightclubs, casinos, huge wedding, public shootouts, etc

 

[kook10]

I'm not too sure about The Wire, but I'd venture to guess that The Sopranos got a major boost in funding as the series went along. They blew up really, really fast. At any rate, what would be looking at? Mad Men/Boardwalk Empire as the first series to have big budgets? That seems way too recent, but maybe?

Boardwalk Empire's pilot was massive. They literally built the Boardwalk in an empty lot in Greenpoint, and surrounded it with shipping containers to make the blue screen and block out the views of the Manhattan skyline (see the spire of the Empire State building on the right behind the billboard). Martin Scorsese directed it. I think it probably was one of the first modern straight-to-series shows that required a huge commitment from the outset.

Mad Men's budget was nowhere near it, especially since it was on AMC.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

I'm not too sure about The Wire, but I'd venture to guess that The Sopranos got a major boost in funding as the series went along. They blew up really, really fast. At any rate, what would be looking at? Mad Men/Boardwalk Empire as the first series to have big budgets? That seems way too recent, but maybe?

The first truly movie style budget? Hmmm, I'd think Game of Thrones.

Although, back in the day Miami Vice had a huge budget for a TV show. Exotic cars, tons of licensed songs, lots of action and stunt scenes.

 

[DaaaaB's]

Rome was probably the first big budget tv show. Its expensive production is part of the reason it was cancelled after two seasons. Band of Brothers had huge budget but was only a miniseries.

 

[CupInSIX]

The Sopranos sometimes had surprisingly low production values for being such a big and prestigious show. The editing in this scene is just terrible once he steps up to the car.



"You come here too?". Cut to Buscemi already aiming his gun and shooting. That's not how you build tension or shoot a quick action scene.

And then the car rolls over his foot and crashes with no sound.

? I thought it was great how they did the POV of him rushing up to the car, and your first clue about who's going to whack him is the reflection, followed by Steve Buscemi's unmistakable voice. The song works great to add tension, and it seems deliberately chosen because of the lyrics about being 'one foot in the grave/ mother don't you recognize me now' as he taps the window with his fist.

The lack of sound effects or his voice is weird, but like someone else said Chase liked to do weird shit. It's goofy and awkward after the hit, just like Tony B.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

I'm not too sure about The Wire, but I'd venture to guess that The Sopranos got a major boost in funding as the series went along. They blew up really, really fast. At any rate, what would be looking at? Mad Men/Boardwalk Empire as the first series to have big budgets? That seems way too recent, but maybe?

The first truly movie style budget? Hmmm, I'd think Game of Thrones.

Although, back in the day Miami Vice had a huge budget for a TV show. Exotic cars, tons of licensed songs, lots of action and stunt scenes.

I believe Rome had the record for most expensive show till GoT 5+ years later

 

[kook10]

I believe Rome had the record for most expensive show till GoT 5+ years later

The last season of the Sopranos topped it, and the Boardwalk pilot cost well more than the Sopranos finale (which was basically double the other eps).

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

The last season of the Sopranos topped it, and the Boardwalk pilot cost well more than the Sopranos finale (which was basically double the other eps).

I dont see this anywhere